PorridgeBrick

Thank you! Those were fascinating sources of information!

 

 

If you want to read my theory that copper and bronze push/pull on Innate Investiture, please feel free!

 

I've wondered about the bendalloy bubbles myself; they say frequently that Bendalloy burners have to be inside their own bubbles, but not that they cannot shape them. They might even be able to size them; Marasi mentions that she can make a bubble the size of a small room, not that it's what she does by default, though the semantics there are weak. I'd suspect it would be incredibly difficult and not intuitive to shape the time bubble.

 

I'm sure I've read somewhere that a Smoked Seeker cannot Seek, period. Being in a cloud completely deadens whatever you sense is, period.

 

Interesting question about Sel... remember, a lot of Aons are constellations.

Actually, that's why I asked about the Copper and Bronze. Both your and Kurkistan's theories sound very plausible, so I asked to hopefully find out if either is right.

And about smoking in copperclouds, the quote for that is paraphrased, so it would be nice to get a more detailed and accurate quote. It's probably correct, but getting another quote would make things a little clearer.

Ooh, so maybe they can use constellations in space. All I remembered was that there were Aons based upon the land of Arelon itself. If they are using constellations too, then my theory seems a lot more likely to be correct.

A more compelling question to me is: If a smoker is burning copper and a seeker is burning bronze while standing to the direct south of the smoker just outside the radius of the coppercloud and a soother is burning brass while standing directly north of the smoker just outside the radius of the coppercloud, can the seeker sense the soother?  If yes, are the pulses harder to sense than if the smoker was not burning copper?

If the pulses act like waves then probably they could be detected still. If not, though, I can't think of any other way they could be detected. Very interesting question.

Porridge the Bricklayer has come to town. His name's not actually Porridge, but he's so utterly bland and forgettable that no one bothers to remember his real name. He'd make the perfect spy, if anyone would pay attention to him enough to think of recruiting him.

Yay, question party! I've got some too.

Mistborn

Are cadmium/bendalloy bubbles distended by objects touching them (flattened by contact with walls or floors, dented inward by poking with a stick, etc)?

What exactly are allomantic copper and bronze pulling and pushing on, respectively? Is it the pulses themselves, Innate Investiture, or something else?

Can an allomancer distort the cloud or bubble created by copper, cadmium or bendalloy? For example, could one make it more ellipsoid to include different things in the bubble/cloud, or make a concave area in front of him/herself so that, in the case of bendalloy, you have more room between the bubble and an oncoming bullet and so have more time to dodge before it enters the bubble?

If a seeker is inside a Coppercloud, and someone outside uses allomancy such that the seeker is directly inbetween the outside allomancer and the Smoker inside, could the seeker detect it?

Warbreaker

You've said previously that someone who returns after being made a lifeless would become a drab god. What, exactly, does being a drab god entail?

Sel

Is the magic of a region affected by the culture that inhabits it, with Dakhor being so brutal due to a violent, conquering-centric culture and Forgery being more concerned with the past due to a cultural focus on the past similar to Chinese culture?

Could an Elantrian on Roshar use symbols based on the shape of the main continent of Roshar? Could space-faring Selians use the symbols of constellations to perform magic in space?

Hmm, that is interesting. Maybe it's related to how the dead can see a vision of the future before they return? What if they see into the past as well?

Oh, sorry, I thought you were talking about the OP. And I definitely think you're right there, especially since

WoR stuff below

How so? I don't remember anything like that.

We already know the Edgedancer's position. They're Order 4, and as for the surge of Growth, it's shared from orders 4-5. Friction is 3-4, and is seperate from Ahesion, also known as Atmospheric Pressure. All of this is already on the Coppermind AFAIK, so you can read up on everything there. Brandon told us all the surges except for one, which is shared by Orders 8-9. We also know all the Order names and placements except for Orders 5, 8, and 10.

Hemalurgy works by cutting off bits of Spiritweb and grafting it onto others. Hemalurgy can steal strength, ergo strength is in some way controlled by one's spiritweb.

And while most things don't seem to have a big effect and are thus not storing your Spiritweb, think of Identity. That is pretty integral to you- and likely determined by your Spiritweb. While we haven't seen it in action, and haven't seen a survivor of hemalurgy, they sound like they'd have similar effects- you're losing part of who you are, though storing Identity would be temporary whereas hemalurgy is not.

That's just Sadeas smoldering over Dalinar being appointed Highprince of War.

Sadeas is a dustbringer?

Edit: forgot to talk about the drawing. It's definitely the best Shallan picture I've seen, though the face is a little off to me.

So, 16 standard, 16 alloyed with Lerasium, 16 alloyed with Atium, Lerasium and atium, and Harmonium makes 51. Is it possible that everybody is a misting, they just don't have access to their metal? With that many allomantic metals, it's a possibility. Though I just remembered that the lerasium alloys make mistings of their alloyed metals - who can burn atium alloys? And where did the name malatium come from, if it doesn't mean "bad atium"?

Actually, it's not just 51- that would be too easy.

17TH SHARD

Are there a limited amount of atium and lerasium alloys for each metal?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Hmm, yes…I suppose there would be but there are…

17TH SHARD

More than sixteen?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Yeah, way more than sixteen.

17TH SHARD

Oh wow. Okay. That's fascinating. More than sixteen and less than infinite.

BRANDON SANDERSON

Yes.

So it's certainly possible everyone is a misting and we just don't know about it. And there is supposedly a different effect for Lerasium if you're an allomancer already, so maybe you actually could be a misting for it or its alloys if you were born that way. No idea on the malatium tho. Maybe some Seer tried burning it and got sick, so he just called it bad.

I guess technically, anything Invested with Shardic power is part of that shard's body. I was comparing it to Atium and Lerasium in that they actually contain Shardic power instead of act as a gateway to it - a glowing gem contains Investiture, but an ounce of copper is just an ounce of copper (as far as we know). On Roshar, of course, Investiture tends to hang around all glowy in between being called in from the Spiritual, so I'm basing the designation on the fact that we call anything containing a Shard's investiture the body of that Shard. I think you're right, however. Infused gems are not the body of a Shard.

 

You could put it this way:

The gemstones have four functions:

1)They are gateways into the spiritual triggered by exposure to highstorms

 2)They are batteries capable of holding raw investiture

 3)They are filters that change the element of the Investiture inside when used for Soulcasting

 4)They hold spren inside them to do a task when given Stormlight

 

In the terminology of "focus, fuel, caster, power" , they are the focus in the first, as defined as a gateway into the spiritual realm. In the second, they are the fuel, though they are not consumed by removal of that power - just rendered inert until the next highstorm - though in that capacity they are closer to a hemalurgic spike, as a vessel holding a bit of raw shardic power. In the third, they are also the focus, and occasionally the fuel when the pressure of the Investiture being changed by them breaks them.

 

(The entire process of the first three uses, in fact, is basically a time-delayed version of what happens when an allomancer burns a non-god-metal. A surgebinder who doesn't need the elemental specification, basically everyone but Soulcasters, simply converts the Investiture to its gaseous form, not losing anything, while a Soulcaster is forcing the raw investiture through the gem to change it, like draining a rather hard cheese forcefully with a weak cheesecloth - it's not going to break every time, but there's definitely a chance. Also, you eat the cheese, it takes you another dimension, and you bribe things with the particular flavour of whey you've pressed, which is determined by the cheesecloth and subtly altered by the way you hold it. The metaphor isn't perfect.)

 

In the fourth usage, the spren/gemstone itself is the caster, focus, and fuel - they can presumably be fed Stormlight, store it, and use it.

Thanks for the clarification. Though I'm not entirely sure if #1 is entirely correct. I don't have a copy of the book, and it's been too long since I last read WoK, so this is probably wrong. But I got the impression that the gems don't actually act as a gateway to the Spiritual in that instance. I thought they just acted as sponges, soaking in all the free-floating Stormlight suffusing the highstorms. In that case, the Stormlight would have already been brought into the Physical, and the gem's function in this would really be the same as #2. Everything else seems spot on here.

Surgebinding is a four-step process. There are three entities involved in the Surgebinding:

-The Surgebinder

-The bondspren/Nahel Bond

-The infused gemstone

 

The three steps are:

1) The surgebinder turns the stormlight into gaseous form with their order's body focus and the Nahel Bond

2) The Nahel Bond acts a spiritual conduit between the gaseous stormlight and the surgebinder's body (similar to the fragment of Preservation on Scadrial that allows Mistborn to absorb power released when burning the metals or the mists) allowing them to take in the gaseous stormlight

3) The stormlight held in the surgebinder's body slowly escapes, making them glow, have light eyes, healing minor injuries, replacing breathing, and exploding outwards in puffs of mist when used to brace against a force

4) The surgebinder surgebinds, instinctually, pushing the Investiture into the Physical realm in a certain form, the possibilities of which are determined by the type of Nahel bond and the exact specification as to which one and where it's going are determined by intent.

 

In this case, the surgebinder is the caster, the nahel bond/spren is the focus, and the gaseous stormlight is both power and fuel. The infused gemstone could also be considered fuel.

Again, #1 seems a bit off. I don't believe they're actually changing it into a different form, but rather moving it from one container to another, even if both events would be probably, as you said, determined through the body focus. From the moment it's called into the Physical Realm until its used up by the magic, the Stormlight seems to stay the same, as spiritual energy manifested in the form of "gas" that doesn't really interact much with physical matter, much like how spren only manifest semi-physically. Still, I'm just really nitpicking at this point.

In tWoK, we see stormlight in three main different ways: a) making gems glow, b ) wisps of gas, and c) within a person turning their eyes light.

We also know that solid shard-matter is the body of a god, capable of very specific things, that the liquid form is pure power, more or less, and that the gaseous form can power a user without the usual foci required - no specifics without spoiler tags on this please. I theorize that the stormlight turns gems into the body of the shard/s spowering the storms, that the wisps of glowyness are the gaseous form, and that Surgebinding (apart from Soulcasting) does not appear to use specific foci, or gateways to the Shardic power, because the power has already been brought into the physical realm via high storms. The spren/Navel bond are the thing that boosts a person's Innate investiture enough to use said pure investiture. Soulcasting is different in that it uses specific investitures from each type of gem directly, similar to mistborn opening the power of Preservation using metals as gateways - but with the gates holding charges of Investiture instead of being directly used.

This all sounds pretty plausible, though I'd like to clarify the bit on the Nahel bond. I think that's that actually changing your spiritweb, or at least grafting onto it it, just like how Hemalurgy works but a lot less violent. Not sure what you meant by "stormlight turns gems into the body of the shard/s". It seems pretty clear the gems are just acting as containers: the gems themselves aren't actually changing into anything.

Edited: I like using dashes too much.

I think they do pupate more than once, but the WoK Chasmfiend is the final adult stage.

The WoR Rysn interlude contains the first or at least early stages of the fiend IMO

EARLY stages? I think that that thing is just a little too big to be a starting stage. Unless you're talking about what she's given.

Some minor confusion, I think. Porridge was talking about how "your ability to start an Investiture" was a part of your spiritweb, and therefore could not be stored in a nicrosilmind. My only point was to say that since your spiritweb itself is possibly similar to Investiture itself, that you could, in fact, "store" this specific part, the way you store a memory, or the way you store the power of your muscles. From what you say, how tags on your web contain things like strength, it seems as though you and I might agree on that basic concept, the idea that it is sometimes possible to store specific aspects of your spiritweb (prolly not the whole thing at once; apart from being a trump, we've seen from Shardblade wounds what happens when your spiritweb is entirely detached from your body) is something we both seem to agree is possible.

 

Hope this clears up any confusion! I should have been more clear as to what parts of the things I was saying referenced which things Porridge said.

I wasn't actually saying it isn't possible to store bits of your Spiritweb- sorry if it sounded like that. I'm sure you can, since that sounds very much like what Feruchemical aluminum is doing with Identity. I was more focusing on the definitions- if you're storing the bits of your sDNA/Spiritweb that give you your magic powers, would you really call that "storing Investiture"? And if the definition of "Investiture" being stored is loose enough to include the Spiritweb, I think it'd certainly be loose enough to store something like Stormlight, which is basically pure power manifested quasi-physically.

From the way Feruchemy works, (multiple metalminds for closely related bits of Spiritweb, e.g. different tinminds for sight and smell), I think Lerasium/Harmonium would be a Feruchemy trump the same way Atium trumps Hemalurgy; you can store anything with it, but not all at once - a lerasium/harmoniummind could essentially act like any metalmind you wanted. I actually think it more likely to be the latter, because Allomantic lerasium allows you to burn any metal, an allomancy trump and hAtium lets you steal anything, a hemalurgy trump - it would fit thematically to have fHarmonium be feruchemy's trump. This is assuming that it exists - I think it could be the alloy of Lerasium and Atium, possibly with slightly more Atium to make up for humanity's Innate investiture, but who knows? Hey, that gives me an idea of what Sazed did with some of the extra Ruin power he had, if a mix of that and Preservation with slightly more Ruin is harmonium - he could dispose of the extra ruin by turning it into something unusable allomantically or hemalurgically, but able to do anything feruchemically. Wow, I digressed a little there.

That does seems to be the most likely possibilty for what Harmonium does. And i'm sure there is Harmonium, or something like it, based on this quote.

FIRE ARCADIA

Are there 50 Allomantic Metals?

BRANDON SANDERSON

Nearly. Does Harmony have a metal?

FIRE ARCADIA

Is that an alloy of Lerasium and Atium?

BRANDON SANDERSON

You're along the right lines.

I'm not so sure that you would need to have more Ruin in the metal than Preservation, though. That seems a little more like something to grant Allomantic atium to me, though maybe the proportion would need to be reversed for that.

I suppose you are right. Though if you do store your capacity to perform Investiture, how would that even work? Would it allow him to be more efficient with his stormlight, or somehow make all his lashings way stronger? I understand that it's totally hypothetical, and only one of many options but it still seems like that would be really... Weird. And would that even be storing Investiture any more, and rather storing bits of your Spiritweb, since that's would allow you to perform Investiture?

I suspect he could: if Feruchemical nicrosil stores untyped, pure Investiture, then that will likely work because that's pretty much what stormlight is, and if it stores typed investiture then it'll definitely work since he can store the stormlight exactly as it is. Though he might not be able to store much, since Scadrial is pretty low on Investiture.

Just read Rithmatist, and I noticed that there are hardly any questions on it, so I think I'll add a few.

1. Can all conics, including parabolas and hyperbolas, be used as lines of warding, or is it just the non-infinite ones?

2. Are all of a circle's bindpoints determined by where it intersects with significant points on a triangle, or is it just the nine-point that behaves this way? Also, do they have to be on the points of greatest curvature (infinitely many for a circle, but only two for ellipses and hyperbolas and only one for parabolas)?

3. Is the strength of a line of revocation determined by its wavelength just like for a line of vigor?

4. Do chalklings interact with just the 2d chalk line of a line of forbiddance, or does the 3d force field generated by it also block chalklings? If a line of forbiddance was drawn on the ceiling such that the force field touched the floor, could chalklings cross that floor?

5. What happens when a line is drawn all the way around the surface of a sphere? Is it a line of forbiddance or of warding?