KnightsOfHonor

A question just occurred to me. Let’s say you are goods divine hatred, separated from all that gave it context and your main goal in life seems to be destroying any entity that could ever rival you in power or influence. So you set out to destroy all the other shards. Which ones would you go after? The ones by themselves? Perhaps. Seems like a safe bet. The ones who pose the greatest challenge to your goals? Perhaps. Depending on if you think you could get the advantage over them. How about where a pair of shards are already at battle with each other? Seems like the place I would want to start. But no, where do you end up going? A system containing 2 shards who appear to be working together, who seem content to stay out of your way.

       The only thing I can figure is that he was tricked into going there or he thought he would have help *squints suspiciously at cultivation* but what ended up happening was exactly what I would have guessed would happen. The two shards in that system were very smart and powerful and trapped him there were he ultimately end up getting killed (at least the vessel). So Why on Adonalsium green earth did Odium think going to the Roshar system would be a good idea? Why not pick off the single shards first or go after the ones already in conflict with one another? What am I missing? What would be worth going up against those odds? A Dawnshard perhaps? I know that he followed the humans there, but why? How did he think things would go? Show up, take out not one, but two shards, and then walk away unscathed? He is the god of hatred, not arrogance. 
 

10 hours ago, KaladinWorldsinger said:

I don't think Lirin will become a Windrunner simply because protection is not a big theme around him. His stubborn insistence on letter of his oaths makes his temperament more like a skybreaker anyway. He was ready to heal people and send them off to their deaths, completely missing the point of healing them in the first place, I feel.

 

1 hour ago, Letryx13 said:

I can see Lirin becoming a radiant, but probably not a WindRunner. He’s too convinced his method of non-confrontation is correct to try anything else. 
I’m not a big fan of Lirin, in a way he was like Taravangian, too proud to admit he was wrong. Seeing that Kaladin inspired hope in people, he called them fools that would be crushed. But he’s starting to change a little, accepting Kaladin at the end of RoW. 

What you both said made me relies something. Lirin and Taravangian are the same, just on opposite ends of the spectrum. Taravangian thinks it is ok to do anything, no matter how horrible, if it is in the name of the “greater good”. Any pain he causes in the here and now is worth it if “in the end” the day is saved. Whereas Lirin is the exact opposite. All his actions are just worrying about what is happening here and now and right in front of him and what he has direct control over. He does not care if Odium enslaves the whole world as long as today, he is safe, and he did what was “right” in the moment. He is constantly making choices that buy him or those he loves a little bit of peace in the moment at the expense of their future. Taravangian sells the present to save the future. Lirin sells the future to save the present. And I can’t decide which is worse.  

I might be remembering wrong or maybe this does not affect what you are talking about, but I thought that the well of ascension was way far north and that the lord ruler moved the final empire around to hide it. All the maps being discussed would have been drawn after this, but surly the language they use is older than the final empire. So maybe this is causing additional confusion. 

Welcome to the shard  And I really like this theory. Not sure if I agree with it, but I like it. I also think that if honor gets a new vessel it will not be Kaladin. I could see it being Dalinar but I think Dalinar will have other roles to play as “just” a bond smith and maybe champion of T-Odium like so many suspect. As all the different stories come together and the whole Cosmere becomes more of the main focus, I definitely think there needs to be a “big baddie”. And what you said about it being T-War …. That makes a lot of sense. So, if Taravangian does pick up Honor, what do you think will happen to Cultivation? I think at first she will appear to be on his side, but have her own agenda for the long run (Like why I think she helped killed Honor and was heartbroken for having to do it).

I don't think Kaladin is going to pick up the Shard of Honor. I think he will either become a background character similar to Zahel like was mentioned or killed or (MB / MB SH spoilers) 

I agree that there must be more to the Recreance than we know. Also, getting to know Syl and seeing how close she and Kaladin were / are becoming after such a relatively short time, it was obvious that the spren were in on it. The Knights and there spren are an inseparable team and one does not decide to do something like that without the other agreeing. Anyway, this makes me wonder why so many knights and spren chose to break the bond while there spren was manifested in the physical world as a sword? Why not just break the oath? Why pull the spren into the physical realm first? They did not know the whole elantrian zombie thing would happen, so maybe they just did if for show? That seems pretty lame to me. I think there is a bigger reason going on and them choosing to pull the spren into the physical realm first and then break the oath might be a hint. 

All very good points, maybe I will bump it up to 74% certain the theory is wrong haha However, I am curious about everyones thoughts on whether a person whose mind is broken past a certain point or who is mentally "gone" could in fact make / break oaths? Like in theory, if the Heralds were all completely crazy and back on Braize like the plan was with the oath pack, would them "giving in" or whatever it is they needed to do to release Odium even count? I personaly don't think so. I think intent is such a big part of the Cosmere that a person who is, in effect (affect?), brain dead, can not make or break oaths. 

They seemed pretty sane in the Way of Kings prelude. 

Just had a crazy thought that I am 73.6% sure is wrong, but it’s just so crazy it might work. We know that there is some sort of “magical” something affecting the Heralds mental state. And we think it has something to do with the capture of BAM (and that somehow the Recurrence was all tied up in there as well) Ok. So what if it was intentional? What I mean by that is maybe Melishi was more aware of what would happen then we give him credit. We see from the interactions between Dalinar and Odium that Oaths must be intentional. The letter of the law vs the spirit of the law, and that it would not really work for Odium to get Dalinar to say something if he did not mean it. Well maybe Melishi knew that by making the Heralds go insane they would be incapable of having the correct intent to release Odium. Like if someone were to club Dalinar over the head, turning his brain to mush and then getting him to say something it would have no effect because Intent is very important in the Cosmear. So once Taln lost his mind it was impossible for him to release Odium (not that he would have anyway). And maybe the spren were aware of the “side effects” but thought it was worth it to permanently (or so they thought) lock Odium away. ( I actually have a completely different theory about the Recurrence and why the Knights and Spren did what they did, but that is for another time). What do you guys think?

I would guess the latitude numbers don't mean anything. I think maybe they are more of an artistic choice and less of a cartographical one. But that is just a hunch. 

That makes total sense. I figured there was a reason for it and I just did not know what it was. I think you manually locking topics makes for a better experience for all the users because you can use your discretion (I can't imagine the amount of time that must take) and I think you have struck a good balance. I also appreciate the leniency on the rules. Like I said before, the culture and moderators of the 17th Shard are the best in any online forum I have seen. Thank you!!! 

Just came by to say boooo to the title of this topic  haha jk jk. But to put it more politely and to echo what others have said, what "sucks" is just personal preference. In the Inheritance Cycle by Christopher Paolini, one of my favorite sections is when Eragon is living in a certain forest training with a certain someone. Others I talked to hated that because it was "boring", but to me it was among my favorite out of the whole series  It was just so peaceful with so much character growth, how could you not love it? 

I know there is a small debate on the internet on how to handle older threads or topics. Some places frown upon “necroing” older threads while other places do the opposite and get mad if you start a new topic when an older one already exists. But for this particular forum, following book series decades in the making, that are currently being written, why do we lock older threads and frown at “necroposting”? Like if a new WoB comes out that gives us a little bit more info on Warbreaker, I can’t just go and add it to an old thread about that topic, I have to start a new one and link the old one which inevitably leads to people not actually reading the linked thread and asking / stating repetitive things. It makes sense if a thread has reached a conclusion or just gotten way to big. But to close a thread due to nothing but time when we have to wait years between books...? To me this causes more confusion and clutter than just updating a 2-year-old thread whenever Brandon is back writing on that world instead of having to re-create threads every time he gets back around to a series. I think the culture of the 17th Shard and its moderators are awesome. I have been a lurker here since the beginning (I finally took the plunge and made an account) and this website is one of the best I have followed, but this is one thing that has always confused me and (in my opinion) makes it more difficult to look things up. Other forums do this same thing, but I only have this account so I thought I would ask here. Thank you  

On 6/27/2021 at 1:58 AM, Bzhydack said:

Of course Kelsier not reached Silverlight nor Yolen by hinself, because he is bounded to Scadrial and need to find how to escape. But maybe he indeed knows the way to those places.

BTW. is possible Ghostbloods predates Kelsier - mean he just took over Ghostbloods, not found them.

This makes me wonder. Do we have any hints or WoB on how old the Ghostblood organization is? In all discussions about them, people tend to use timelines based on Kelsier to figure out what they could plausibly be doing / have done. But he just hijacked the organization. For all we know the organization (and its influence) could predate the Shattering. I know the name "Ghostblood" has roots in a specific event. But do we have any idea what or when that event was? 

Yeah, I am just joking about the "knights on honors team" thing but I do think at this point it will follow the ketek with the acronyms. There are several WoB where he says he was not sure if he would or not  but when RoW was given that title I think it is a sign he is going for it. 

This makes me wonder about how Rosharan worldhoppers would fare on other planets with higher gravity? I feel like they would have very brittle bones growing up in a lowish gravity environment. If they traveled to a planet with, lets say 1.2 cosmere standard for gravity, would they get tired just walking around? Being that tall would really put quite a strain on ones joints, and then add the sudden increase of weight said joints now have to deal with (from being on a different planet) and all i see are knee problems. Maybe Lirin could make it big rehabilitating Rosharan worldhoppers with broken bones and blown out knees  

Good point. Must be "Knight On Honors Team" then

I always thought that Knights of Honor would be a good title seeing as H can be substituted in for other things.