Wit Beyond Measure

On 7/21/2025 at 7:37 AM, Oltux72 said:

I would understand the twins to refer to the offspring of Hoid and his amnesiac wife.

That's the intended implication, in my opinion, but the phrasing lends itself to various interpretations - also deliberate. And so whether the twins belong to Wit is not certain.

Because the wife is not even on speaking terms with Wit, she almost surely would not be one of the twins Wit believes to be willing to come to his rescue. 

I love the Shae and Kaise and Daorn theories! I'm not at all sure they're correct, but they seem the most plausible so far.

Jesus spoke of himself as Light and his disciples, especially after being glorified, as sons of light. Some English translations will render this children of light.

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So Jesus said to them, “The light is among you for a little while longer. Walk while you have the light, lest darkness overtake you. The one who walks in the darkness does not know where he is going. While you have the light, believe in the light, that you may become sons of light.” 
--John 12:35–36, ESV

Aes Sedai are similar to witches and even called witches, I believe, by the Children of the Light. Witchcraft, sorcery, divination, and mediums have been forbidden in the Bible (Deut. 18:10-11, Ex. 22:18, Micah 5:12, Is. 3:18-23 and 8:19-20, 2 Chron. 33:6-7, 2 Kings 21:6-7, and Nahum 3:4). Such powers have been associated with the worship of Satan (Baal) and the other fallen angels, where little makes God angrier than worshipping the creature, the created being, instead of the Creator.

As a Christian, I am not keen on Jordan's portrayal of Christianity, obviously. I will admit that many who call themselves Christian have earned a bad name. But Christ himself embodies perfect love, mercy, and justice. He's a God of vengeance, too, but that vengeance will be justified.

My eldest has become the equivalent of a WoT flat-earther. We finished the Rhuidean episode where Rand gets his dragon tattoos, and Anne is still denying that Rand is the Dragon Reborn. She saw Lews Therin as the undisguised same actor as Rand, and still she denies. So funny. What was she hoping for? Mat? Perrin? Egwene? I have no idea.

She'll probably be rooting for the false dragon Lanfear creates in the episode she hasn't watched yet.

This season is epic! Rewatching with the fam is all joy.

Just. So. Kimmalyn! The voice of the car in this video is Quirk, that is, but not all of the features.

https://www.facebook.com/share/v/1AXVwWgdj2/

Thank you, both! I missed the Battar references. I seem to lose track of her and most of the other female heralds.

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Those two only make nine, he thought to the Stormfather. Something told him there should be one more.

--Oathbringer, Pg 1142

Those two are Ash and Taln, heralds, and his previous seven include Windrunner (Kal), Lightweaver (Shallan), Truthwatcher (Renarin), Elsecaller (Jasnah), Skybreaker (Szeth), Edgedancer (Lift), and Bondsmith (Dalinar). Assuming Taln takes Stoneward and either Ash or Shallan moves to Dustbringer, then the only one left is Willshaper, Eshonai/Venli. Venli was there on Thaylen Field with them!

Not only that, but these ten make up the ten books. Sanderson has planned a book about each of these ten.

Not only that, but we see that Kaladin has already ascended to become the Windrunner herald. 

Not only that but we learn in this book that the previous heralds did not necessarily keep their original orders but sometimes switched. And Chana seems to have clearly earmarked her daughter as her successor, even though that is clearly not yet fulfilled. Foreshadowing, though, is Sanderson's thing.

Not only that, but the ten books each focus on a single character that matches these ten exactly.

Ten heralds. Ten orders. Ten books. Ten orders on Thaylen Field.

And Sanderson named his kid Dalinar.

So while I struggle with thinking that we are going to see another Kelsier-like resurrection, I am also seeing how well Dalinar has been setup with an unfulfilled destiny as a herald, a bondsmith, destined to unite not just Roshar and not just the cosmere but the Shards themselves back into Adonalsium.

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How dare Kaladin claim to protect, when he defended the highborn who murdered? He was a pawn. How dare he not admit it? How dare he serve them?

When it was finished, the agony throbbing through Moash, he lay in a sweat, ragged and used, like an old pair of shoes worn on far too long a walk. They’d done something with his empty eye sockets, something that should have killed him. But as he lay there, wondering at the point of it, he …

He saw.

Not as he had. Outlines of light, the people specifically, and … gemstones, infused. Living things. No color, but … spren. He could see spren. All around.

“That should work,” a new voice said, feminine. “Look at his response. It’s functioning. He can see Investiture.”

Sanderson, Brandon. Wind and Truth: Book Five of the Stormlight Archive (The Stormlight Archive, 5) (p. 527). Tor Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 

If you are reading these words, nothing about this scene screams MeLaan except for the tangential fact that we are using hemalurgy and steel inquisitor techniques to create a gem inquisitor. But if you listen to the audiobooks, you will hear Michael Kramer's distinctive MeLaan voice when he says these last lines, as if Odium's assistant in the hemalurgical tranformation of Moash is MeLaan, spy of Harmony sent off-world on a mission where she was last seen in Shadesmar near land with red haired people dressed strangely and presumed to be Horneaters (Lost Metal, Epilogue 6).

Now, Kramer has used a voice similar to MeLaan's before. He seems to use that voice for several sultry women, but there is nothing sultry in this singular appearance of this unnamed character in all of the Wind and Truth interlude, her only appearance.

Chances are, I am wrong. This is nothing. Merely coincidence. Nothing to see here. But if I am right, then Sazed has a spy in Odium's camp. Thoughts?

Ah, yes, your hidden quote confirms the theory I have held for a long, long time. I would give Aharietiem or at least a partial shattering like the Shattered Plains a 50% chance of happening in Book 5. Now that I have seen this quote, that edges things up a notch, especially for a full-blown Aharietiem. They keep talking about the Tranquiline Halls and going back to Ashyn. I'm thinking that could be the 2nd half of the story. That and traveling Shadesmar and the cosmere.

Yeah, I think there is a good chance. All of Renarin's vision pains in Chapter 30 seem to be the same moment, in my opinion, and a moment where the storms are coming, where Dalinar stands on a platform looking over the void below, the never-ending pit, and Mishram screaming to break it all.

I have been obsessing over these panes, but I love that kind of foreshadowing!

On 10/9/2024 at 6:05 AM, BinarySecond said:

Until I figure anything else out they're all in Kharbranth getting married to existing citizens.

Is polygamy a thing in Kharbranth? If so, a Kharbranthian could make a killing by selling marriages.

4 hours ago, eriwancoselyn said:

 tbh, we probably haven't seen much of the dustbringers because he doesn't feel like dealing with the surge of division yet. we've also seen next to none of the sky breakers using division either.

That, or they are the true Voidbringers. We know from Elia Stele that humans are the true Voidbringers, along with their god Odium. And surely the surge of division especially from the Dustbringers will bring the Void. Renarin saw it with Rlain in his panes of glass, after all, and so I think we will be getting a Dustbringer shattering like what they did to the Shattered Plains in this book, at the end, if not a complete Aharietiem (where the last five books would then take us to Ashyn, taking back the Tranqueline Halls, if Aharietiem happens now).

We are not the ones who shattered these plains (lose quote form the Listener Song of Listening).

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“The next depicted some kind of clifftop overlook, with Dalinar standing in front of a glowing golden figure. In the distance, a city was collapsing into a spreading pit. Though the image was static, he felt motion to it somehow. As if that city were constantly crumbling into that pit.”

...

“What is that?” Rlain said, walking closer. It depicted only a face. A simple face with intricate patterns, black and red swirling. A singer, femalen, against a black background, etched in glass. Staring at him.
      Then it moved.
      Rlain jumped. In fits and jumps the image split, multiple versions of the face moving, raging, the eyes going wide, the Rhythm of Agony shaking the frame. Windows around them cracked, but the one in the center kept vibrating. Her face shuddering back and forth, then her hands against the edges of the window, curling, bulging out—as if trying to break free.
      Renarin screamed as the windows to the left and right shattered, exposing a dark wasteland. New windows grew up like vines, crystallizing and exploding, leaving jagged stumps—but before they broke, Rlain could pick out images. Burning cities. Broken bodies.
      Above it all a rising Rhythm of Agony, with the femalen singer’s words echoing to the sound. I will break it. I will break IT ALL.”

Excerpt From
Wind & Truth: Book Five of The Stormlight Archive
Chapter 30: Not Alone

Mishram sounds like she's ready to get the Dustbringers to break it all.

On 6/6/2024 at 11:10 PM, Elder said:

If Odium somehow managed to turn Renarin, that could stay Dalinar’s hand.

Actually, I thought that Renarin would make an amazing champion for Dalinar since he can see futures but Odium cannot see him - the only one Odium cannot see.

25 minutes ago, FollowYourMuse said:

Jasnah is an obvious choice. But she is not unaware of Kaladins mission. 

Jasnah might know that Szeth is on his Skybreaker mission and that Kal is accompanying him to help with his sanity and help Ishar, but his real mission is chasing the Wind, as the Wind has told him. Does Jasnah know about that mission, their mission to chase and find the Wind and be her champions? Because that is the mission referenced in TKoWaT, in my opinion. That is, after all, the focus of the epigraphs.

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“I should have known I was being watched. All my life, the signs were there.”

“I first knew the Wind as a child, during days before I knew dreams. What need has a child of dreams or aspirations? They live, and love, the life that is.”

“The Wind told me, before she vanished, that it was the change in Odium’s vessel that restored her voice. I wonder. Perhaps it is the new storm, making people begin to reconsider that the wind is not their enemy.”

“I have read that in the ancient days, the Wind often spoke to both human and singer. It would then mean that the Wind stopped talking not because of Odium, but because of people who began to fear her…
      
Or to worship the Storm instead.”

“As a historian, I find such nuances relevant. As a philosopher, I find them enticing.”

“Regardless, the events surrounding the cleansing of Shinovar are of specific relevance, and I am doing my best to record what I can discover of the Wind’s own words regarding them. Though, now that the Wind and Heralds have vanished, I have only two sources who can speak of these events.
      
They are my witnesses.”

“However, the Wind did not think like a person does. This should not surprise anyone who has familiarity with a spren, though such things are less common now than they once were.”

“Her memory was keen, but her interpretation and explanation of that memory could be fanciful. Those days, though, I believe that she was deliberate, concerned, and focused.

She did not see the future.
      
But she somehow knew it anyway.”

“All agree the first key moment came when Kaladin Stormblessed listened. Though not an Edgedancer, he did a fine impression of their oaths.”

“The second moment had happened already, when Szeth himself decided to take upon him this quest. The one that would shape all of our futures.”

“For while the contest of champions was to happen in the East, a different contest was to happen in Shinovar. And one that the Wind swore was equally vital. Perhaps more so.”

“I was not with them. I did not know of their quest.”

“Yet I will do my best to recount their story, and that of the Wind. For they were her champions.”
 

  

On 9/10/2024 at 4:54 AM, Friendshipspren said:

Alright I think that the author of Knights of Wind and Truth is none other than the Unmade Sja-Anat or the Unmade Ba-Ado-Mishram . 

My theory is aluminium foil hatty , yes ,  but i believe I have some light , vague evidence in the epigraphs.

I love tinfoil theories. I would counter this one, though, with the fact that the speaker sounds extraordinarily rational, unusually so, which to me precludes the Fused, the Heralds, and the Unmade.

My best guesses include Sigzil, Rlain, or Renarin, who are all quite rational and logical, fitting the voice. I do not know that the Siah Aimians were watching any of these three from their youth, though! And that is what that first epigraph implies.

I do think the author will be a Knight (Radiant) of Wind or Truth (Windrunner, Skybreaker, Truthwatcher, or Lightweaver). And this is the story not just of Kaladin and Szeth (the Knights of Wind) but also of Shallan, Renarin, and Rlain (the Knights of Truth).

Szeth and Kal have been precluded as the authors since the author uses 3rd person for them and says he wasn't on their journey, Day 1. I suspect that one of Days 3 through 10 will contain more epigraphs from the Knights of Wind and Truth telling the journey of the Knights of Truth. Perhaps then we will be able to better discern the author.

Would any of these three aptly be described as historian and philosopher? Or is this written not be a Knight of Wind and Truth but a veristatallian: Jasnah? (99% chance I misspelled that.)

On my reread, I noticed this gem, hidden in Adolin's stabbing scene with Sadeas.

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Sadeas gestured for a few of his soldiers to go down one branch of the tunnel-like corridor. His wife and a few of her scribes went the other way, two soldiers trailing. Adolin watched for a moment as the highprince himself raised a lantern, inspecting a faded painting on the wall. A fanciful picture, with animals from mythology. He recognized a few from children’s stories, like the enormous, minklike creature with the mane of hair that burst out around and behind its head. What was it called again?

Sanderson, Brandon. Words of Radiance (The Stormlight Archive, Book 2) (pp. 1066-1067). Tor Publishing Group. Kindle Edition. 

And so I wonder what the mythology of the minklike creature is, of course, and I am certain that will tell us so much about the Herdazean general. I have a strong suspicion that Rosharan mink mythology is exactly like the mythology I found in the quotes below.

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The mink, with its glossy fur and nimble movements, has a rich history of symbolism that varies across cultures but consistently emphasizes mystery, adaptability, and resourcefulness.

...

In various indigenous cultures, particularly among Native American tribes, the mink is a symbol of transformation and keen awareness.

...

As a totem, the mink offers several powerful traits to those it represents:

• Adaptability: Minks thrive in diverse environments, from dense forests to riverbanks. This adaptability is a guiding force, encouraging those aligned with its spirit to remain flexible and open to change.

• Resourcefulness: Known for their tenacity and ingenuity, minks remind us of the importance of making the most out of limited resources and finding creative solutions in difficult situations.

• Stealth and Secrecy: Preferring to remain out of sight, the mink embodies the value of discretion and the wisdom of choosing when to reveal oneself.

...

--https://animalomens.com/article/what-does-animal-omens-or-totemmink-mean

Does that sound like our guy or what? And the symbol of transformation could be extrapolated in fantasy as a shapeshifter, I am thinking. But that is a guess, of course.

That makes me want to look more closely at the other references to minks in Stormlight... And the top of my RAFO-card questions will be, what exactly do these children's stories about mink mythologies entail, specifically regarding any and all supernatural abilities?

We have two tickets for Saturday at 5 PM that we would like to cancel so that we can go to the two primary Robin Hobb events that conflict with these times. How should we do that? 

And how do we get tickets for the Storytime with Sel and the Sanderson signing? That's probably already gone, but we couldn't find it an hour ago when we first started looking.

Thank you!

23 hours ago, alder24 said:

Fused are gods of Singers too.

I wholeheartedly agree and have always agreed with that statement.

The Coppermind says, "Since the listeners recall this story about throwing off the Fused," citing WoR I-4, where WoR never says "Fused" but instead talks of abandoning the forms their gods gave them. BAM and the Unmade are their gods, as Venli confirms, and so WoR I-4 could easily have been talking about the False Desolation, as Ulim tells Venli. So, yes, "gods" could mean Fused or could mean the Unmade or Odium. The premise on which the Coppermind concludes that the listeners became listeners before the False Desolation is unproven to me until I see a direct quote from WoR that proves the Coppermind's premise to be true, that the Last Legion threw off the Fused when becoming listeners.

11 hours ago, bmcclure7 said:

Wrong I'm afraid, in rythm of war Ralian says specifically that the gods of the listeners are not fused but instead the unmade. 

 

Thanks! I couldn't find the quote you were speaking of, and it may just be that I was searching on the wrong word, "Unmade," to find the quote, but I did find a Venli quote saying much the same thing.

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She knew the name, of course. As a keeper of songs, she knew the names of all nine Unmade—who were among the gods her people swore to never follow again.

--RoW 848

45 minutes ago, Treamayne said:

The 17th Shard (organization) definitely does not want to make a new Shard - that is very far from that group's goals. 

  Reveal hidden contents

Its members have a non-interventionist philosophy,^[3] believing that the Shards were split up for a reason and that people shouldn't dabble in mixing them.^[4] 

Well, since we never confirmed Wayne's Resonance - I wonder if maybe part of the Slider Resonances has to do with Fortune (and the aspect depends on with which second ability it is resonating).

WoBs:

  Hide contents

 

 

Thank you! 

3 hours ago, Treamayne said:

Nice theory I had thought of Fortune in the climax, but hadn't connected to his investments over the whole series. WHich would imply it goes back to SoS at least. . .

Uh - maybe I'm underthinking this but wouldn't it be Harmony / Harmonium?

Yes, I'd already forgotten when Wayne started investing, and it was much further back than I realized. He's had his "lucky hat" since before Alloy of Law, so perhaps Wayne has always had a bit of Fortune. We only really saw the payoff in LM, though.

While I don't think anyone believes Harmony to be a 17th Shard, that would be a 17th godmetal, so I misspoke. Even so, I don't think Wayne's 17 is pointing toward Harmony. If it were, others would be saying 17 and not just Wayne. Marasi tells Wayne he's wrong, even, and everything in Era 2 is still essentially base 16. In fact, I don't think anything was base 16 until Era 2. Era 1 was all base 10 just like our standardized system of counting. So no, I don't believe that Harmony is the 17th. 

2 hours ago, alder24 said:

We know from multiple WoBs that there were originally 16 Shards, so there is no way for some hidden Shard to suddenly appear. 

  Reveal hidden contents

Wetlander

Please explain what you will about Shards and Splintering and Slivers.

Brandon Sanderson

An event happened long ago which destroyed something called Adonalsium into 16 pieces. And 16 people took up that power.

Questioner

People?

Brandon Sanderson

I call all intelligent species people. If someone takes up the power and lets go of it, it has the effect much like a balloon that's been stretched and then the air is let out. I call that a Sliver; based off of the Lord Ruler calling himself the "Sliver of Infinity". The Lord Ruler is someone who held the power and then released it. And so, current Slivers are the Lord Ruler, Kelsier, and there may be others around who at one point held the power and let go of it. A Splinter is a term used by certain people in the cosmere for power of Adonalsium which has no person caring for it, no... no person holding it, which has attained self-awareness.

Wetlander

So is that like the mists and the Well? Are they...

Brandon Sanderson

They are not, because they have not attained self-awareness. But, the Seons are self-aware. So, any piece, for instance there were some spren on Roshar before Honor and Cultivation got there. Those were already Splinters of Adonalsium where he had left power which attained sentience on its own. So, it can be intentional is what I am saying, does that make sense? You have seen other Splinters.

Wetlander

Are the highstorms related to the Splintering of Honor?

Brandon Sanderson

The highstorms are more related to the mist from Mistborn which terminology we have not discussed yet. You have seen Splinters quite a bit on various planets.

Steelheart Seattle signing (Oct. 14, 2013)

 

Yes, I definitely agree that the Shattering created 16 Shards, which is why Era 2 finally discovers all 16 and starts counting in base 16. Wayne's use of 17 seems prophetic because it hasn't happened yet, a new Shard being created like the group and this forum's namesake strive to create, a 17th Shard.

2 hours ago, alder24 said:

I doubt however that Sazed gave Wayne some Fortune or anything like that. Sazed realized only at the very end that the person that he needed wasn't just Wax, but Wayne too, he nearly missed that.

Oh, I had forgotten that quote! You are correct that Sazed didn't realize Wayne was the key until the end, and so Sazed almost surely did not deliberately give Wayne the Fortune. And yet, I still think that Wayne was the epitome of Fortune in LM especially, and I don't believe that to be coincidence.

Here's a WoB that references Stormlight and explains how Fortune works in another character without the user knowing exactly the details but only what he needs to do and where he needs to be. So perhaps Sazed was doing things with Wax because Wayne always tags along, only Sazed didn't realize until later that the reason he sent Wax was to get Wayne there. I could be wrong, of course, but that seems to be how Fortune works. There are a ton of these about this particular non-Wayne character marked #fortune if you want to search, assuming you're up to date on the cosmere.

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“How could you let it get this far, Saze?” Kelsier eventually asked. “This was almost the end.”

“I had it in hand.”

“Like hell you did. You’re lucky that lawman could function after what you put him through six years ago. Lucky that the other one was a Slider. I still can’t figure out how he managed that partial detonation in the ship’s hold.”

“Luck is a different thing for a god who can see futures, I think,” Sazed replied softly.

--LM 486, Kelsier epilogue

From the Coppermind's article on Fortune:

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The precise nature of Fortune and how it functions and is used, is currently unclear. Fortune has been described as "luck" by less cosmere-aware groups, such as the Terris three centuries after the Catacendre. However, it is clear from other individuals that are more cosmere-aware that Fortune is more than simple luck. It's a way of knowing things you would not know otherwise, and a way in which one can see the future. It is implied that Fortune is a thing one can access and draw upon. Someone drawing upon Fortune can lead to events that appear to be coincidences.

Coincidences like making a series of investments that appear to be ridiculously fortunate and like pulling off the impossible with his bendalloy at the end of LM.

With Fortune, Wayne could literally see the future without realizing it, which is why he made such great investments. Hoid trades his precious harmonica to Wayne for a rat. Are there other fortunes Wayne received?

I'm dying to do an Era 2 re-read, now!

My favorite thing was something I had noticed after my first read as sounding particularly prophetic, but that was before I realized that Sazed had essentially granted Wayne the gift of prophecy in LM by giving him so much Fortune. Wayne prophetically uses 17 or 17th a total of four times in this book alone, even though Marasi corrects him and says, dude, it's like supposed to be sixteen! Something is absolutely up with that. I cannot help but think we have a 17th Shard confirmed, and that Shard will mean a 17th godmetal. I'm not sure that's the case, but something is definitely up with seventeen. 

Here are the four quotes and my thoughts on them at the time...

https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/123106-wayne-his-17th-metal-17th-shard/ 

On 8/8/2023 at 9:36 AM, alder24 said:

This happened before or during the Last Desolation, not during the False one. Coppermind:

"Since the listeners recall this story about throwing off the Fused, this event must have occurred prior to or around the time of Aharietiam, the Last Desolation, as the Fused were trapped in Damnation for four and a half millennia after that point."

Thank you! I looked up the source that the Coppermind quoted, and it was I-4 from WoR. WoR does not contain the word "Fused" in the entire book. This interlude does speak of the Last Legion attempting to escape their gods, yes. 

It seems that the Coppermind has assumed that gods = Fused, which is not an unreasonable assumption, but I think that their own definition is broader than that. I believe that the listeners would include Odium and BAM in their definition of gods, as granters of forms of power:

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Forms could not be commanded; every person was free to choose for themselves. Transformations could be cajoled and requested, but they could not be forced. Their gods had not allowed this freedom, so the listeners would have it, no matter what.

--WoR 200

“If this works, it will be an amazing advance. The first of the forms of ancient power, rediscovered.”

“Those forms are tied to the gods,” Eshonai said. “What if, in choosing this form, we invite them to return?”

Venli hummed Irritation. “In the old day, all forms came from the gods. We have found that nimbleform does not harm us. Why would stormform?”

--WoR 204

You were chosen by our god, the true god of all singers. He sent me to explain how wonderful you are.

--Ulim to Venli, most likely referring to Odium, RoW 845

This paired with Ulim's quote that BAM originally Connected with "all singers" on Roshar makes me believe that the Last Legion abandoned their forms during the False Desolation.

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We couldn’t break the last Herald, and the humans found some way to pin the whole Oathpact on him. So we got stuck on Braize. Eventually the Unmade decided to start a war without us. That turned out to be exceedingly stupid. In the past, Odium granted forms of power, but Ba-Ado-Mishram thought she could do it. Ended up handing out forms of power as easily as Fused give each other titles, Connected herself to the entire singer species. Became a little god.

--Ulim to Venli, RoW 847-848

Assuming Ulim is being honest and accurate, all singers Connected to BAM during the False Desolation, including all listeners, which means that the listeners must have still had their forms at the beginning of the False Desolation.

As to your Mistborn spoiler:

On 8/8/2023 at 9:36 AM, alder24 said:

Now for Singers and their spren in a gemstone, this might be interesting. Spren being in a gemstone might remove their connection to Roshar, thus allowing Singers to just leave Roshar with their spren unlike Radiants. No aluminum box needed. Just leave. Normal worldhopping. But Stormlight in a gemstone doesn't lose its connection, so maybe they can't just leave. 

Thank you for the hope that the gemstones may not be necessary! The aluminum is the more necessary part, I believe, and perhaps the only necessary part for the travel itself.

Singers are still Connected to BAM even though they have gemhearts, so the gemhearts if necessary would not be enough to completely negate Connection on their own, without aluminum.

I joke about stuffing Thaidakar in a box, but he could have an entire spaceship or at least a room in a spaceship (like Azure's room) lined completely with aluminum. If a cognitive shadow can negate previous world Connections by establishing a new world Connection, any source of world Connection would do. But something tells me that Thaidakar has a stronger Connection that is not so easily negated, and perhaps that's why it is harder for him to off-world than all the others in Thaidakar's world who are already off-worlding. I mean, the Ghostbloods might as well be called Worldhoppers 'R Us.

This is in the digital version at the very end of Chapter 4, and it might not be a typo. I could just not be understanding the use of the word "saw," here.

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But eventually, the last supplicant bowed and hurried away with his new spirit saw.

Brandon Sanderson . Yumi_and_the_Nightmare_Painter_by_Brandon_Sanderson_for_Kindle (Kindle Locations 503-504). Kindle Edition. 

6 hours ago, Underwater_Worldhopper said:

I am gobsmacked. You kinda lost me at the end, but wow did this make so much sense.

Thank you! My understanding of worldhopping and travel is far from complete, for sure. There are holes in my understanding, but I love taking educated guesses and then tweaking as we learn more information. I'm definitely not fully there, but I hope I'm moving along the right path.

Watching a WoB Shardcast just now, they mentioned two WoBs that appear to confirm the usefulness of BAM-like abilities (Bondsmith spren abilities) when it comes to travel off-world:

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A Bondsmith can access a lot of power, as evidenced by the migration. The migration from Ashyn to Roshar happened with a Bondsmith powering some Elsecalling. And that allowed for some pretty crazy things. Getting an entire population moved through a portal across that much space is a lot of work and a lot of energy.

--Brandon, https://wob.coppermind.net/events/508/#e15849

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Even when you are seeings some things happening in [removed as possible spoiler] itself, you are seeing them manipulate Connection. It is mostly reinforcing Connection, but it is, in a way, manipulation. Rewriting Connection, rewriting Identity are both things that they can do. So with enough power, with enough smartiness, what a Bondsmith can do can be done.

In fact, we have seen short-range Elsecalling done by… Obviously Elsecalling’s not Bondsmithing, but you know that a Bondsmith powered a big Elsecalling [to migrate from Ashyn], one of the big things you’ve seen a Bondsmith do is get people between planets. And you have seen people use [possible spoiler] to Elsecall. You’ve seen them Lightweave, you’ve seen them do a lot of these things. They also could do some of this same stuff.

--Brandon, https://wob.coppermind.net/events/508/#e15860

5 hours ago, Argent said:

This is unique to the Arnist Method of capturing a spren and creating a fabrial. Notably, Dalinar doesn't go through any of that when he captures Nergaoul inside the King's Drop. I would expect that what Melishi did was very similar. 

I believe the Arnist method specifically refers to using larger gemstones to suck out the light from the smaller gemstone prison, but other methods like the Thaylen tuning fork and Odium's use of Raysium metal both still suck in Stormlight to capture the spren. 

Dalinar does specifically mention that the Thrill isn't smart enough to be afraid of him, so the Thrill may not have needed to be sucked and suckered in as smarter Unmade, like the Midnight Mother or BAM, would have. The Bondsmith's bond with the Thrill played an essential role in his capture, yes, and that's surely at least part of what Melishi did with BAM, as well. They are Bondsmiths for a reason.

Warning: This post contains a single Stormlight 5 prologue spoiler, masked, and potentially significant spoilers should these theories prove accurate. Reading the prologue for Stormlight 5 first is recommended.

Just as the Stormfather provides Stormlight and surgebinding powers to all of Honor's children, Ba-Ado-Mishram (BAM) became the Voidmother proving Voidlight and voidbinding powers to all of Odium's children, all of her Singers, during the False Desolation.

One BAM to Connect them all
One BAM aligned them
One BAM to draw them all
And with her Voidlight bind them

One gem severs the whole
One gem divides them
One gem rips away souls
And then the darkness finds them

In the Land of Roshar
Where the Singers die
And Listeners live

We'll explore much relevant history leading up to and beyond BAM's imprisonment (see Coppermind's BAM and False Desolation articles for supporting canon references) and theories explaining the magical science behind what happened with BAM, her Singers, and related events.

BAM-SINGER CONNECTION HISTORY

The lead up to and fall out from BAM's gemstone capture includes: 

• Long, long ago, Odium unmakes 9 spren who fight during many desolations in which BAM serves as highprincess and commander of Odium's forces,
• The last desolation comes where all but Taln survive,
• Taln holds Odium and his Fused on Braize all by himself (spanning a total of 4500 years),
• During the long imprisonment of Odium and the Fused, BAM somehow gains the ability to pull Voidlight into the Physical Realm and to Connect herself with all the Singers of Roshar, a feat previously only managed by Odium, making herself a little god (RoW 847-848),
• Even though Odium and the Fused are still trapped on Braize, BAM's newfound powers give her the ability to provide Singers with forms of power including all the Regal forms plus stormform, which allows BAM to wage war against the Knights Radiant during the False Desolation, with no end in sight,
• The Listeners, tired of endless war and manipulation from both Odium and Honor, "cast off everything - including our very forms - to find freedom," which severs their Connection to BAM (RoW 159),
• Honor's long, slow death begins around this time,
• The Knights Radiant form a special Strike Team to imprison BAM inside a gemstone in order to end the False Desolation,
• Because BAM is a little god and holds strong Connection to the spren and souls of every Singer in Roshar except the Listeners, these tethered souls and spren get sucked along their Connection to BAM, ripping out pieces of their souls, removing both their Identity and Connection, and possible damaging or destroying their gemhearts in the ripping process,
• Somehow even Honor and Cultivation's spren and the Sibling get damaged by BAM's imprisonment, though to a much smaller degree that perhaps signals a much smaller Connection between the Voidmother and "all who belong to Roshar," affecting the Sibling's abilities to make Towerlight and crippling Urithiru (RoW 621),
• Close to dying, Honor cannot help the Sibling, Urithiru, or the Knights Radiant,
• The Battle for Feverstone Keep begins before BAM's imprisonment since the enemy still pushes for that ground and parshmen are anything but pushy (OB 809),
• BAM's imprisonment, if during the Battle for Feverstone Keep, would have caused all fighting Singers to experience excruciating pain and then simultaneously transform into docile, mindless parshmen,
• All Singers Connected to BAM become parshmen through a break in Identity and Connection; only the Listeners escape because of their previously broken Connections to her,
• Hundreds of Windrunners and Stonewards at Feverstone Keep become the first to abandon their oaths en masse as Honor says, "they are the first" (OB 547),
• Two thousand years later, the Everstorm travels to Roshar through the Cognitive Realm and is brought through to the physical realm, and
• The Everstorm restores both Identity and Connection by repairing the Singers’ souls and possibly their gemhearts.

SCIENCE-MAGIC THEORY BEHIND CONNECTION, CAPTURING SPREN, AND THE SINGERS' SOULS

From Newton, we know:

Force = mass * acceleration

From Jasnah (OB 1179), we know that "concentrated Stormlight has a faint mass to it." So the more we accelerate the physical mass of the Stormlight, the stronger the physical force we have acting on the Stormlight and anything Connected to and by the Stormlight.

How do we move or accelerate Stormlight? Navani's lecture on fabrial mechanics includes details on sucking Light into a gemstone in order to trap a spren inside a gemstone. We first lure a spren into close proximity to a gemstone with something it likes (e.g., flames for flamespren) and by using the type of gemstone it prefers (RoW epigraphs, Chapter 1).

Interestingly, we already know the type of gemstones preferred by each Order of Knights Radiant (and each associated herald). Moash's knife had a large sapphire gemstone hilt that gave a subdued glow after capturing Jezrien's spren-soul (OB 1205), which makes me wonder if the gemstone in Leshwi's spear (RoW 80) that drained Kaladin's Stormlight and nearly sucked out his soul (RoW 101) was sapphire, as well.

The first questions we must ask ourselves would be 1) what would BAM be attracted to and 2) what kind of gemstone would she prefer? To answer the second, maybe the Voidmother would prefer a heliodor, as the Stormfather would. As for the first question, she appears to like war and commanding, and she has shown particular interest in Feverstone Keep (OB 809).

One might imagine Melishi, the False Desolation's Bondsmith, and her Strike Team showing up at the Battle for Feverston Keep with a large and perfect (or nearly perfect) heliodor gemstone, knowing that BAM would be nearby commanding her troops and in search of something in the area that interested her.

Navani's next stages in capturing a spren (RoW epigraphs, Chapters 2-5) would be filling the gemstone to around 70% full of Stormlight (Voidlight in BAM's case) and then quickly sucking that Stormlight out to create a vacuum that will suck in a nearby spren.

Suppose you take a brown paper lunch sack and suck the air out. It collapses, right? The same would be true of a Ziploc bag. By collapsing to reduce the volume, the bag equalizes the pressure. But what about something that has a rigid structure like a gemstone, especially a gemstone that doesn't leak? If you suck all the air out of a glass, for example, you'd suction that glass to your face since you've created a vacuum of extremely low pressure.

Because air and Light will always seek the lowest pressure possible, they'll get sucked into a vacuum until the pressure outside of the gem roughly equals the pressure inside the gem. Since volume is inversely proportional to pressure, the larger the gemstone, the lower the pressure (where the lower pressure goes the stronger the vacuum becomes). And finally, the tighter the seal, the less a gemstone will leak and the stronger the vacuum will be. So large, perfect gemstones make the perfect traps for these gods.

Quote

If the Stormlight in a gemstone is withdrawn quickly enough, a nearby spren can be sucked into the gemstone.

--Navani, RoW 77

At this point, you might be asking yourself, how does the spren gets sucked in along with the Stormlight? That's where Connection comes in. When the Stormfather gives Stormlight to his children - his spren and his surgebinders - an invisible cord of Stormlight will Connect that spren or that Radiant to the Stormfather. The same can be said for the Voidmother's children - BAM's spren and her Singers: they're all Connected to their mother by a physical force from the Voidlight she provides.

Let's say you have a massive gemstone and a larkin quickly sucking a ton of Light out of your stone. The gemstone will quest out seeking to replace all or almost all of the light it just lost with a powerful force. Once it captures a nearby Stormlight Connection cord, the spren will be drawn in along with the Stormlight the spren is tethered to. Yes, the Connection is mostly spiritual, but there is a small physical Connection, too (because the Stormlight Connecting them has a small mass, as Jasnah said, and mass * acceleration is force, as Newton said). If we yank hard enough on that tether, the spren cannot help but be pulled in.

We see this with spren pulled into fabrials, yes, but also with human and Singer souls, tethered to their home planet by their Connection to the Investiture there. We saw Jezrien's spren-soul sucked into Moash's sapphire knife and Kaladin's soul nearly sucked into Leshwi's gemstone-capped spear, both of which had metal that specifically draws in Stormlight including the Stormlight cords of Connection.

Let me digress for a smidge to explain that Identity and souls are nearly synonymous. For instance, the Fused (where each Fused is the soul of one ancient Singer fuzed together forever to a surgebinding spren, granting surgebinding powers and immortality) maintain their Identities - and most of their intellect, knowledge, and memories - even though they constantly lose the rest of their bodies because Identity is stored in the soul. Connection for the traditional Singer bond appears to be stored in their gemhearts since that is where their spren and probably their souls reside.

Now I said all that to say this: this, this, this is how Singers' souls were ripped away, how their Identity and Connection were stolen, and how they became mindless parshman slaves, by having parts of their souls that were tethered to their Voidmother ripped free, likely destroying their gemstones in the process, as BAM and all her many Connections were sucked into her gemstone prison. With Singer souls damaged, they were not quite soulless and mindless nothings but nearly so. And with Singer gemhearts damaged or destroyed, the parshmen lost their abilities to bond any other spren or to hear the rhythms of Roshar inside their gemhearts.

The Listeners were spared, maintaining their Identity and their abilities to Connect with other spren because they had previously severed their Connections to BAM before her imprisonment.

TRAVEL & WORLDHOPPING

We'd be remiss if, while we're here with Connection, we didn't speculate on travel and worldhopping. Connection tethers Invested individuals to their home planet, not letting them escape lest they rip out part of their souls, their Identity, and destroy their Connection. But of course there is a way around this problem, a way out, because this is Sanderson, after all.

Quote

“This is proof. The Connection is not severed, and the box allows for travel. Not yet as far as you’d like, but we must start the journey somewhere.”

--Gavilar to Restares/Kelek, RoW 23

The remainder of the post includes a little speculation about how off-world travel may be possible based on what we know of Connection above and a single spoiler from the Knights of Wind and Truth prologue that gives a bit more detail regarding the quote above. Reading the prologue for Stormlight 5 first is recommended. I've kept all non-Stormlight cosmere spoilers out of this post.