Slappyface

After reading this WOB again I’m leaning toward Nohadon’s abdication being his journey and maybe based on Honor/Cultivation teachings and not related to Tanavasts life as a mortal(If he even did that) 

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Questioner

So, I was actually wondering whether Tanavast constructed the confrontation with Rayse in such a way that *inaudible*

Brandon Sanderson

That nailed his foot to the floor?

Questioner

He's stuck on Braize - at least for now.

Brandon Sanderson

Ah, yes. That was, in effect, that was an intentional -

Questioner

It was deliberate? Okay.

Brandon Sanderson

It was deliberate. Yup.

Questioner

*Inaudible, possibly 'Rayse'* started to win?

Brandon Sanderson

Um, well...

Questioner

I'll keep it secret until it shows up on Facebook.

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, it... so, Odium came at him, and he gave - not as good as he got - but he made it cost.

Questioner

Did he sacrifice himself, or is Odium better at that sort of thing?

Brandon Sanderson

I wouldn't say that he sacrificed himself, I'd say he went out swinging.

Questioner

Is Odium just better at that sort of thing?

Brandon Sanderson

I would say, yes.

Oathbringer San Diego signing (Nov. 14, 2017)

I think he got the mortal blow in that fight and slowly went mad and in his last moments attached his shadow to the Stormfather. This WOB states there is no funny business around Tanavasts death.

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Questioner

Is Honor still alive?

Brandon Sanderson

Honor? Honor's dead.

Questioner

What about Tanavast?

Brandon Sanderson

So, um, you can assume that there is no funny business going on there.

Oathbringer release party (Nov. 13, 2017)

I think Brandon will surprise us with something much more clever but I don’t have any clue to what atm, just had to share some thoughts

9 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

Also, anyone else suspicious of the "wind" that was released by the perpendicularity? I wonder if they just accidentally helped The Wind escape whatever prison it has found itself in. 

I read that as they entered the vision fully, the migration would happen after the destruction of Ashyn so I think the wind and screams are the chaos and panic during the migration.

2 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

Makes me wonder if Syl pulled fully into the Physical realm with a body Ishar-Style would be able to then take up a shard. Is she a spren at that point? Or a physical being? 

Wow, I just read a wob about this.

https://wob.coppermind.net/events/6/#e310

I don’t think this will happen and that’s kinda annoying but, since they are visiting a memory of Hoid’s, Brandon could theoretically show us the Shattering of Adonalsium…

10 minutes ago, The Stick said:

I seen to recall that Nale was also present.

You are absolutely correct. Will edit my post^^

3 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

If the Ghostbloods had a Herald in their employ, it would be very hard to explain why they are chasing Kalak so hard.

I believe they chase Kalak so hard because of his knowledge about Ba-Ado-Mishram, he is the only one who knows what happened according to him.

5 minutes ago, Alcatur said:

This is actually unsupported.  Its something that a lot of people assume have happened, but actually there is no evidence in books that humans started the war or attacked the Singers. And if you look at people who lived at this time - they don't mention any human agression. Raboniel or Leshwi are silent on the matter, even though it would make sense for Raboniel to talk about human agression. Even Eila stele doesn't actually mention humans waging war on Singers first, at best talking about "minds that lust for blood. " which is rather vague. 

 

Instead direct evidence points to humans bonding spren and Singers going to Odium side because of that. Leshwi directly talks about them betraying the spren. Jezrien words seem to imply something was done to achieve this:  “I used to think it wasn’t my fault. But you know, we can’t escape what we did? We let them in. We attracted them, befriended them, took them out to dance and courted them. It is our fault. You open yourself to it, and you pay the price. Same for the stele - For their betrayal extended even to our gods: to spren, Stone & wind.

Very good points! And the we let them in quote I had totally forgotten about. I really don’t think half of what we are told is true. Cultivation even said it after Dalinar went to the ardents for truth, they told you the truth you crafted for yourselfs or  something.

9 hours ago, Dofurion said:

I think there is something fishy here.

I don't think all the interactions between Humans and Singers were entirely violent, I mean there are the Horneaters and the Herdacians for a reason. Additionally we have the "dance" that the Fused and Hoid were in.

Yeah I agree, I think a lot happened in that time but I can’t get over why honor and cultivation didn’t do more for the Parshendi, he could have given them 10 “Heralds” to deal with the humans..

14 hours ago, CognitiveShadow said:

Interesting topic! I have a few thoughts:

• I think Honor and Cultivation allowed Odium to enter/join their system under the condition that he would be bound to it and unable to leave. That was the trade off: they had to deal with him, but at least he was stuck in their system and could not continue to wreak havoc on the other parts of the cosmere
• There's a WoB about Honor 'going down swinging' when Odium finally did attack him, so I think that implies that Honor did something that opened him up to Odium's attack. We don't know what that might be.
• We also know that the stormfather is/contains the cognitive shadow of Tanavast as well. They are kind of a dual being and it gets murky which memories or intentions belong to the original spren vs Tanavast himself
  • My thoughts here are that Honor intentionally attached himself to the SF so that he would be involved in the selection and development of the next bondsmith, who he knew would be unchained. This was probably a last-ditch effort to create an opportunity for someone to forcefully merge the powers of Odium and Honor (and maybe Cultivation?) together as one

Good point about honor opening him self to an attack.

I agree with you on all this but the unchained bondsmith part. Honor placed those restrictions so he should be able to remove them at will. But a point in your favor is, it could be the agreement that opened him for an attack, and a self sacrifices was necessary to be able to have a bondsmith unchained.

Cause I think what Odium excels at is just that, manipulating other shards to make an agreement they can’t keep and open them self up for an attack.

Even more reason to stay far away from contracts with this Shard.

Yeah I agree with you that time is really valuable but I still feel there’s a lot missing here.

I think Odium hasn’t killed Cultivation yet because can’t as long as he’s bound by the agreement, but the moment he’s free he says he will kill her, not try. So he’s pretty confident in his ability to at least kill the vessel. 
And investing something doesn’t seem to make him vulnerable as he has made the fused and unmade while not opening himself to an attack. Breaking of an oath seems to be the key for letting him get attacked.

He is so invested in Roshar at this point that he is a part of Roshar. Proven by Navani. 
So I don’t feel his been that careful in his investing.

And Cultivation set the plan for the Odium switch a long time ago so I don’t feel she just used a moment of weakness. And she was also prepared for it not working as future stuff is iffy.

I agree that they never shattered cause the opportunity never came. But I feel there are a lot of moments where they should have had an opportunity, like his investing of the Parshendi to the point of immortality and creating the unmade. Or when the humans left Shinovar but that you could get around if the humans made the oath and not Odium.

And why not help the Parshendi but die for the humans?
 

I know we are not supposed to know everything yet, but as I laid this out I feel we don’t know anything yet.

Cultivation and Honor is on Roshar with the Parshendi as their people.

Odium enters system and is allowed to settle with the humans on Ashyn.

At what exact point honor and cultivation locked Odium to the system we don’t know.

Odium tempts Ishar to mess with the surges and destroy Ashyn. They are at the point of arrival on Roshar still Odiums main guys as he is brought over with them.(Original human voidbringers)

Humans get to live in Shinovar on the condition they stay there and not use any surgebinding.

The Parshendi is at this point still backed by Honor and Cultivation as I understand it.

The humans leave Shinovar and slaughter Parshendi to the point that the Parshendi ask Odium for power and become the fused.

Why didn’t cultivation and honor shatter Odium the moment “his” people broke their oath of staying in Shinovar. 

Why not help the Parshendi in any way?

Then when the humans gets slaughtered by the fused, honor helps the humans with 10 heralds to seal the Fused away aka his former people.

Why switch sides at all?

It then escalates to the point that Odium and his Fused are able to kill Tanavast.

Its even said he died defending mankind so he was willing to die for the humans but not the Parshendi.

Tanavast got killed by Odium with full Honor power and Champion options.

He then sets up visions to find a new champion and he says in the visions that the most important thing the humans can win is Time.

How can more time get them any closer to defeating Odium? Why is a contest even important? 

Odium would never agree to terms that would destroy him, proven by the fact that he can’t agree to certain terms with Dalinar or it would destroy him. 

So I’m left to believe Honor and Cultivation never wanted/tried shattering Odium.

Honor and Cultivation can’t have seen shattering odium as a good option.

So to my understanding team Honor and Cultivations only real win condition is merging Odium with another shard. Which a contest of champions won’t help them do.

And that leads me back to why is the contest of champions this important when the chances of Odium sneaking in a release term is this high and “the good side” basically doesn’t have a winning term.
 

Thoughts?

9 hours ago, alder24 said:

Yes, that's a Bondsmith power. The Stormfather was seeing something else and was referring to what he saw, he wasn't talking about the perpendicularity Dalinar made. 

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Questioner

Dalinar Ascends, right? Like, right then, there.

Brandon Sanderson

I have RAFO'd that. Whether he is Ascending or not is a RAFO.

Questioner

Okay, because I know he kind of mentions from that, I don't know how to say his name but the older guy who has the Diagram--

Brandon Sanderson

Taravangian, yeah. Whether that deserves to be a capital "A" or not is a matter of argument. It can be disputed.

Questioner

I guess my main question would just be Dalinar's now able to pull Stormlight and give it to people now.

Brandon Sanderson

He definitely can. That is a Bondsmith power, so.

Questioner

That is a Bondsmith power, okay.

Brandon Sanderson

That is specifically a Bondsmith power.

Questioner

Because my roommate was saying well, the Stormfather was surprised he could do that or was the Stormfather surprised that he was able to bridge--

Brandon Sanderson

He was surprised by what was happening to Dalinar as a whole.

Questioner

Oh okay, that's what I thought because I was like, because I felt like the Stormlight, that power would be a Bondsmith power.

Brandon Sanderson

Let's say that the Stormfather and Odium were seeing something in Dalinar that, perhaps, the average person watching even who is knowledgeable about Surges would not completely understand... But he will be able to use that power and Bondsmiths in the past have used that same power.

Footnote: Brandon clarified that he might have been unintentionally misleading in his answers to this question during his Stormlight 4 Update 1.
Idaho Falls signing (Dec. 29, 2018)

 

Thanks for that WoB had forgotten that

Is it confirmed that the previous bondsmiths could open perpendicularities? 

I thought the Stormfather was suprised that Dalinar could open it, and Dalinar explains that they are something new?

Thanks for replying

Agree with the school, was more thinking in the lines of someone to turn to for guidance in that area.

on another note, Vasher needs to meet Navani so she can get some juicy info out of him

Not really a theory, but havent seen it disscussed alot.
As we progress the cosmere our characters are beginning to understand the importance of Intent, and ive been trying to think of what role Vasher will play in stormlight. 

I would argue that the best use of Intent we have seen is Vasher telling his cloak to protect him. That is such a loose term open to interpetation, that it really needs 100% control over your Intent.

Soo im hoping we will see Vasher not as a swordmaster, but as a teacher of Intent.

Thoughts? 

I believe Nightblood is the destruction Dawnshard.( Explaning the insane effect of the Command he was given)

I think the Unite them Dalinar hears is Tanavast saying unite the Change Dawnshard, the Destroy Dawnshard and the splinters of Honor.
 

Then Dalinar would have the Commands of a God(Destroy and Change), the Intent of a God(Honor) The two things required for the ultimate level of surgebinding and the capacity to defeat/change Odium.

Thoughts?

I love it! 

Where in Norway do you live? Norwegian myself, feel free to answer in a PM if you dont want it public