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A little confused by something on Tor.com regarding Dalinar
sheep replied to Platysaur's topic in Stormlight Archive
Looks like the author of the article is just reading between the lines. At the end of WoR, Elhokar was at The Lopen's house during the discovery and move into Urithiru. And he was injured from the assassination attempt by Moash and Graves, so I doubt he was up for much "ruling", if he does that at all. Could "the city" perhaps refer to Kholinar? -
No, but we must view someone's actions in the context of the situation and society. Our judgements are filtered through the lens of Earth society, ingrained with moral codes distilled from thousands of years of Judeo-Christian and Greek philosophy. That doesn't necessarily apply to Alethkar, so I find it kind of jarring when someone uses the word "evil", when we've seen that Roshar is fifty shades of grey. We find it shocking that Amaram sentenced his own men to death, which is something that would never happen in an Earth military. But Alethi armies use tactics like letting little boys be bait, and Sadeas sends men who enlisted to his banner to run bridges if they displease him, and most people don't bat an eye. They just prefer that whoever it happens to isn't them. Or someone they know. I think the ideals, even the First Ideal, are up to interpretation by you and your bonded spren. If it was Syl and Kaladin, she would have shut off his Stormlight after the first guy, but Ivory did nothing. Looks like Elsecallers are morally okay with the protection of the many. And if Jasnah was a Skybreaker, and the punishment in Kharbranth for attacking or threatening a noblewoman of her rank was death, they'd have been fine with her killing them too.
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I think it shows something about Alethi and lighteyes culture in general. A Shardbearer is one in 30 in all of Alethkar, and instantly promotes you to fourth dahn, important frontline officer, and personal bodyguard to your Highprince overlord; not to mention that Shards are pretty much priceless. The fact that Amaram feels bad at all says something about his character. Imagine Sadeas in that situation (remember, he's salty because he's 50 years old and only has Plate), or heck, even Lamaril, and they would have done much worse. If they killed a Shardbearer, they wouldn't give up the Shards - why would anyone ever do that? Kaladin wouldn't have ended up a slave, that's for sure. And if you consider why Amaram supports the Sons of Honor, it wouldn't be very hard to imagine that they are the same sort of brainwashing crazy cult that Teft's family were in. Religious devotion in Vorin kingdoms seems to start young and be pressed onto you from your family. See Shallan's father pushing her into the Devotary of Purity, which she didn't pick.
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Oh gosh, Szeth and Eshonai hugging. :wub: :wub: I felt bad for Eshonai being tossed into a chasm in a highstorm. But then I remembered that no one dies for real if their "death" happens off screen and even then, it doesn't count unless they're confirmed for permanently brain dead.
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I think Adolin has better poetry skills than that! He's not amazing, but he can tell what style of poetry is fashionable and what is not, even if he abuses cliches and is formulaic and is completely unoriginal in his subject matter. Nothing is more romantic and perpetually fashionable than complimenting a girl's looks by comparing it to nature. I'm too lazy to write ketek poetry, but then again, it would probably be blasphemous to write about girls with holy palindromes.
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Adolin was 17 at the time the Vengeance Pact happened, so that was before Dalinar accepted the Codes as a lifestyle, which said that in times of war, officers shouldn't be allowed to duel because that risks injury or death when they are necessary for the war effort. So maybe Dalinar wouldn't have liked it, but it was a time of peace, and Adolin was defending the family honour from insults. In the past, Blackthorn Dalinar killed people who insulted him. So there was probably no order against it, and Dalinar wouldn't have thought to give it because no one would think Adolin would be stupid enough to wager the Plate he only got a few months before. Seriously, when you put the timeline into perspective, Adolin sure does a lot of things without thinking about the consequences. That's exactly why the 4-on-1 duel happened. Moash, I think, was given land in the Kholin princedom, which makes the Kholins his direct overlords. I'm not sure if the Princedoms work the same way as federated monarchies work on Earth, but if they do, then families who hold their land independently and swear allegiance to their overlord, like Amaram's, have more freedom in governance and exercising power than direct subordinates. It's interesting to note that in some translations of WoK, the Highprinces are called Archdukes. Well, whatever happens, we can safely assume that Moash's land will get confiscated and the former Shardbearers who lost against Adolin will be demoted and no one will ever lend them Shards again unless there are strict conditions and the ownership is made clear. I don't think the Kholins would force a Shardbearer in their army to hand their Shards back, as you can't force Shardbearer to do anything -as Dalinar said, there are very few options when dealing with Shardbearer criminals. They could pressure another Bearer to give the Shards to Adolin because he is the best and it is necessary for the war, if they follow the Codes and don't act completely selfishly all the time like other nobles *cough*. I still thought it was pretty rude of Adolin to bet Renarin's Shards, especially Dalinar's Plate, on duels without asking. I know Dalinar gave permission to start duelling again, and Renarin has no training and doesn't even like Shards. But after reading hundreds of pages of how important the identity of Shardbearer is to themselves and society, and how close some people feel to their Shards, seeing Adolin do that left a bad taste in my mouth. I even felt a bit of cringe when he held Salinor (?) down with his foot and pulled the gemstone from his Blade and crushed it in front of the arena audience. He's obviously doing it for the show but I found it pretty jarring when compared to his later personality. If you're used to reading books or watching movies depicting people who train realistically with medieval combat weapons, reading how Shardbearers fight gives plenty of moments when all you can say is WHAT. I actually sketched Shardplate on paper to show a friend, and he said that an opponent with a rapier or fencing foil could stab a Shardbearer in Plate in the eye and instakill. I told him that Shardplate turns clear from the inside, so there's better peripheral vision, Plate gives you superspeed, and Blades are long and light enough that a man with a metal sword wouldn't be able to get close. He told me that sounded like it was from a video game. So yeah, dropping down from Plate-enhancement and instant Blade summoning back into normal territory is a massive paradigm shift when you have to start being aware and afraid that any guy with a sidesword (pretty much every lighteyes) can pose a serious threat to your life. Do you think Adolin offing Sadeas was the first time he ever killed a human? I don't think there's been any mention of him fighting to kill outside the battlefield, and they were all Parshendi who bleed orange, and those two times with Szeth were massive failures. The problem with Adolin being a mostly laid back guy who does crazy unpredictable things 10% of the time is that they feel like they just came out of nowhere. Most of the time he gets angry or emotional and does something, nothing bad really happens as a consequence and they are considered relatively insignificant in-universe. Things like smacking Kaladin in the training arena when Zahel says you're supposed to control yourself in Plate around regular soldiers. It was stupid, but Kaladin can heal so it's all right. Unless you have analysed Adolin's character all the way through, the times where he does an extreme crazy thing is completely unexpected and at odds with your surface impression of his personality. Renarin is the type of person who would have a neatly organised mind, and thinks in cause and effect, action and consequence. That's why he thinks before he speaks, that's why his body language and facial expressions are described as "measured" and "careful". It matches what we know of the Truthwatchers, if his future visions are more like mathematical statistical projections like Taravangian's. Which is interesting, since their gifts originate more from Cultivation than Honor. When Adolin's emotions get the better of him, it's like an outlier in Renarin's tidy data sets. Renarin and Dalinar both love Adolin and don't like to see him go crazyangry, but each of them have their own reasons for disliking it, other than caring about him a lot. Dalinar sees and regrets his younger self. And Renarin notices something odd about Adolin's dating failures that Adolin is blind to, is because he put together cause and effect. The effect, the girl leaving, is always the same, and the cause is always something different, like looking at girl's sister or double booking a dinner date. But Renarin notices there is a pattern and an underlying reason (which is what you stated about protecting his fragile inner ego from rejection), even if he doesn't have the social graces to put it into words and tell his brother. Adolin is stated not to have trouble holding girl's freehands and kissing them on the hand, which means he is not completely unable to touch a woman. If you are close enough, or forward enough, to kiss a girl on the hand as a farewell, it's normal for them to be able to kiss you on the cheek if they like you. In IRL Earth formal/old-fashioned etiquette, a bachelor kissing an unmarried woman's hand directly is considered naughty, as he's supposed to kiss the air above her hand. So I don't know what's up with Adolin other than a contrived plot point making him endearingly equal in relationship intimacy to Shallan. And I have to wonder if the 2 months spent in spearmen's barracks was like a non-stop version of Renarin cleaning bowls for Bridge Four. They were awkward and quiet the whole time, never being able to relax and always watching they were saying. Eventually they got comfortable with him, though I still can't imagine Bridge Four inviting Renarin to the tavern for a drink. Brandon has a habit of making his characters pure to the point of disbelief. If you've finished Bands of Mourning, Steris (Wax's fiance) at age ~27 was so pure and innocent that she was reading a book on anatomy to prepare for her wedding. I wish there were more authors that wrote characters who have realistic troubles with being inexperienced and awkward -in that way-, where it isn't just played for humour. In fact, I can't really think of any male fictional characters who are like that over the age of 20.
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Jasnah murdered (your interpretation on murder may vary, if you consider the first guy as a self defense) a few men who were running away because she was being a vigilante who wanted to clean up a crooked city. So if you read it like that, Jasnah and Amaram are surprisingly more similar than you'd think.
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The reason why people don't understand is because they're not as invested in one character as you. People who like the SA/Cosmere enjoy the works and expanded universe as a whole, instead of one single character, and the concept of fairness within the universe is not something that is ever considered. Because they see the Cosmere as Brandon's artistic vision, and they trust Brandon's decisions as the God Beyond as to how he tells his story. Because in the end, it does all come down to Brandon and you really can't apply fair or unfair to what is ultimately artistic license. Yeah, it's harsh, but the big picture is that Brandon sells entertainment and it's a measure of his skill that he can write characters that people can get invested in, whether it's Adolin or Vasher or that Rithmatist kid. Everyone has pet characters like Dobby or Ned Stark but if seeing bad things happen to them makes you ragequit, then it means you have your blinkers on and you should take them off if you want to continue reading. But I would think that Brandon's writing style would not let someone die horribly unless it was necessary for the plot or they deserved it. Jacob Black is the werewolf from Twilight and what made many long-time fans mad was that in Breaking Dawn, he fell in love with Bella's infant daughter, and that the reason why he liked Bella in the first place was explained as him being unconsciously attracted to her ovaries. I mean, This post has been reported for attempting to skirt the rules kind of ending is that? Many Team Jacob fans felt betrayed at that, but imho it's better to have read a book and liked a character even he gets a horrible ending rather than never read the book in the first place. Journey before destination, they say.
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Yes, you should check out my gallery if you want. And as a side note, my favourite character design so far is probably Navani. But her love triangle plot is ignored by the shippers as boring because it's canon.
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Someday I'll get around to organising and dumping all my artfiles. I think the concept behind this came into being after seeing re-runs of the cartoon series Xiaolin Showdown on TV, and the stylised opening titles inspired me. It makes a good desktop background. FULL SIZE: Featuring: 1. Perpetual left swipe 2. Highprince of projection 3. Totally spy 4. Demon crabgirl 5. Vorin fundie 6. Machiavelli grandpa Some notes I wanted to add: I have no idea what Pattern's blade form is like (other than glowing red designs) since he changes shape in every sword appearance. But Shardblades appear out of mist so I assumed Pattern sort of went blurry on the edges and phased into swordform. Taravangian's rock isn't really a cool weapon, but I didn't want to put Szeth in there because Szeth is not actually on the "doing bad things" side anymore. I wanted each "villain" to be the enemy or the opposite of the "heroes" piece, as Amaram is to Kaladin. Szeth didn't really fit there and the most appropriate named person I could think of for Shallan was the guy who pretty much killed a quarter of Jah Keved. I tried to keep the heights and sizes canonically proportional, but Shallan is around 20-25cm (8-10") shorter than Kaladin and so should be at his chin-level if I was being accurate. I upsized her (maybe she's standing on a box like they use when filming kissing scenes?) to make the heights slope evenly But Eshonai really is a 215cm (7') giant who towers over all the human characters when she's in Shardplate. I always imagined Amaram to look like the Alethi model illustration in the fashion folio from WoR. And his uniform is a similar design to the Kholin officer one, but in green with rectangular shoulder patches and yellow and white piping. He also has flash cufflinks and cravat stickpin.
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Yes, crack pairings are the best. And honestly, I think Szeth and Eshonai would like each other if they met. Even if they were just friends, it would be pretty storming adorable. If you throw in Nightblood, it could be bumped up from crack pair to crack triangle. And #1 on top incompatible crack ships (if we're not talking insanely out there like Lopen's left arm and a chasmfiend) is Jashah x Amaram. Jasnaram? Amarasnah? I'm surprised that everyone who supports Shalladin because they believe arguing means inevitable love, and opposites attract, hasn't jumped on this ship yet.
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If someone can stop you from doing what you want with your Shards (like forbidding duels with wagers) then I would say that you don't fully own them. It's like Kaladin giving away his Shards to Moash. Since Adolin allowed it, he relinquished his claim. But I'm not sure if the Shards given to Teleb and Captain Khal had the same deal, or if they were on conditional loan by House Kholin. Roion and Aladar lend their Shards out to other bearers, but they still own them, and can presumably choose a new bearer when their current gets injured or too old. It would be dangerous to just give Shards away with no strings, see Moash. It'd be too easy for a Shardbearer given Shards by their patron House to be tempted to join another warcamp by the promise of more lands and a bump from Fourth Dahn to Third Dahn. Dalinar talked to Amaram about switching sides from Sadeas' Princedom to his, so it must happen. Shardbearers are too valuable, especially for gemhunting, when you need a Blade to cut the chrysalis and any extras can hold off the Parshendi. It would have been pretty rare for a foreign woman to have a Shard. Alethkar and Jah Keved have the most, with the other countries having around 1-5. Maybe that is why Dalinar courted Shshshsh when he went travelling, if he didn't have his Plate by then. Owning or inheriting Shards must make someone valuable marriage material...another bit of weirdness for Adolin. And Renarin still has his dead Shard by the end of WoR, in the battle during the Everstorm. He used it unsuccessfully to open the Oathgate. And even if he keeps it, Dalinar's Shardblade that was switched from Taln's Honorblade is still out there, if they can find it from where he threw it off the roof. You have to use different styles of fighting for Shardblade compared to conventional weapons, just like you have to learn in and out of Shardplate. Shardblades are much lighter than other weapons their size, and can cut through anything, so they're swung with minimal force to conserve energy. That is why Adolin can use his finger push a Blade away in a duel, and why Dalinar and Kaladin can pull off the lastclap. Also, Adolin doesn't fight on horseback. He uses his horse to get him to the plateau battlezone, but gets off when the fighting actually happens - Shardbearers fight at the front and and if he was on horseback surrounded on three sides by the enemy, they'd kill the horse quickly and pull him out of the saddle since there's not enough room to move. Fighting with a Shardblade means you aim for the neck or spine to sever the soul. Fighting with regular metal swords means slashing until your opponent gives up or runs out of blood. I doubt Adolin will go Shardless if he's stripped of his current set, but if he does, it will teach him to be a better strategist-tactician and be more careful instead of taking stupid risks. Oh, Adolin. The next book will be a bumpy ride for him if they find his knife with A.K. engraved all over. He realised that the blood had to be hidden, and he used his Shardblade to cut his chalk marks off the wall. He threw Sadeas' Shardblade out the window. I'm still undecided at how panicked and dazed he was, because, tome, Adolin is a bit of a wildcard because he can be an unreliable narrator at times. He's not prone to deeper introspection, especially if doing so will harm his ego. He reminds me of Shallan in that way - if their train of thoughts will lead to an unwanted revelation, they will stop before they get there. Adolin doesn't know what keeps going wrong in his relationships, and Shallan doesn't think about where Pattern came from, because she must have been broken before she killed her mother. WoK, chapter 12 To me, the reader, Renarin kind of just fades into the background. He's there and gets the occasional brief side mention to establish that he's present in the scene, but then the narrator forgets he's there unless he says or does something. So in-universe, he's must be forgotten about or ignored a lot, but since he's perceptive he gets to watch everyone and establish a library of normal conversational responses and socially acceptable behaviour. Since he isn't intuitively neurotypical, he has to watch and learn to figure out how socialising works. If you ever grew up as a weird kid who moved to a new school where you didn't know anyone, it's standard to watch for a while to see who is friends with who and where you can sit to eat lunch. Renarin has been doing this his entire life. He may not understand how emotions work for normies, but he sees what the reactions to standard responses are - Question A must be answered with Reply A, and when you use Reply H instead of A people get upset with you. So I think he noticed that there's something wrong about Adolin and dating girls, and tells him to treat them better. I would say it's a combination of him caring for his brother and also not liking it when Adolin gets emotional and starts acting erratically, because the library of social cues and responses goes out the window at that point. I read Outlander...about five years ago. But I still remember Jamie saying that he may be a virgin, but he wasn't a monk. And as a soldier/outlaw he'd been around the block a few times, even if he never stopped at any of the buildings. On Roshar, horses are rare and cremlings and skyeels probably don't do things the way they are done on Earth. But surely there must be some education on these things, and soldiers will find their way into making various raunchy and euphemistic jokes. You can't bunk with darkeyed spearmen for 2 months and not hear a single bawdy song. Adolin, at age 23, blushes from a peck on the cheek. He's as emotionally developed -in that way- as Susebron the God-King, and there was good reason for Susebron to be like that, as he was locked in a palace full of priests his entire life. There is another weird thing I remembered: Elhokar at Adolin's age was already married or formally betrothed to Aesudan. Elhokar is 27-28 in WoK; therefore his father Gavilar had been away during his adolescent years, chasing down the highprinces. It is possible that it was Navani who taught him the Facts About Life and arranged his marriage, and Adolin didn't get any of that knowledge because Dalinar. But Elhokar is a spoiled manchild princeling and he still managed to father a child. I wouldn't say Dalinar is "love shy". He's just overly fixated on propriety and dating your brother's widow is not acceptable by Vorin rules and that is why it makes him uncomfortable. In the past, he went on a foreign holiday and came back with a wife (who had a Shard so she must have been a noble lady with lots of other suitors), so he must have some effective courting skills. I'm surprised Shallan is so forward, since her childhood never had any loving marriages or functional romances. She had less experience with boys than Adolin with girls, if you count Kabsal and the Thaylen sailor Yalb (?) as flirting with her. Maybe it's a Veden cultural quirk to be more accepting of emotional outbursts like Lin Davar yelling at dinner guests or the bastard messenger, where it would make you a social pariah in Alethkar. I did notice that Eylita lived with Shallan's brother Balat in the Davar mansion even though they were just engaged. That would be very improper in Alethkar, where Shallan said she didn't want to live in the Kholin warcamp if she was dating Adolin. Adolin mentioned at one point that his ex-gf Janala liked poetry, and that he should compose poetry for her so she'd un-dump him. How can you read and write poetry if you can't read and write? Is he making the ardents compose love poems to the girls he is courting? Is he a poetry genius who can make up poems in his head and recite them from memory? Either way is pretty hilarious.
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Well the whole 10 book story arc is more than just one character it's all the characters interacting and bumping along like billiard balls while Odium pokes the cue in now and then. Adolin does things, and he develops, but it's off-screen because the things Kaladin does are more relevant in moving The Plot from point A to point B. Adolin acts as the "normal guy" in the series so far, even though he was dead in WoK Prime and non-existent in the first draft. His being normal is why he can't have flashbacks, and why his character progression won't have the depth of development that everyone else has when their focus books show they go from broken to functional to reforged. Just be happy he exists! That is what I told the people who were upset about Jacob Black in the ending of Breaking Dawn.
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You're too focused on one character rather than the story as a whole. Adolin is a supporting character whose purpose is to provide a foil to Kaladin and Dalinar, as a human yardstick to show their character development. He's pretty much the token normal guy in a cast full of broken people. If he was broken from the beginning, he'd be less likable.
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The Heralds and Renarin are considered main characters too but I didn't want to go by the official rating because they've barely appeared so far. So I judged "MC rating" by the frequency of their PoV chapters, their appearances in non-PoV chapters, and their impact on the story arc so far. For a non-MC, Adolin has gotten a lot of screentime, and that's why I picked him. And also because I wanted to draw him talking to his sword with is mum's necklace.
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I know these are not all what people would consider "main characters", but we're up to book 2/5 and this is who I decided were the main plot movers and shakers so far. When I read SA for the first time, I was struck by how vibrantly colourful the world was. Many readers see Roshar as a grim world on the edge of apocalypse, and WoK especially, drawn in their minds in shades of crem beige and bridge brown and grey, if you are a visualiser type of person who associates mood and tone with colours. I drew this originally as a bookmark so I could have cool colours while reading other, more boring books and textbooks and stuff. As usual, it's better in full resolution: OPTIONS > VIEW ALL SIZES > LARGE Or see below: Adolin's spren is dead and can't talk back. Sad. I have no idea what Parshmen and Parshendi are supposed to look like. There is one little chapter heading picture of Eshonai in silhouette, and after reading WoR, I got the picture in my head that Stormform and Shardbearer Parshendi were shaped like red skinned Predators (from the movie series) with red and black dreadlocks. I also thought about the Tsurani Cho-ja from the Riftwar series, and the Formics/Buggers from the Ender series. Image dumping time. Szeshonai (Eshoneth?) is OTP Sometimes books read like comic books to me and when I read a good chapter of anything I want to get my first impression of it down. It's pretty interesting to compare sketches from the first reading to sketches drawn after a re-read several months later. Thanks for reading to the end. Now here's a picture of Kaladin getting a haircut.
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"By being possible" are the watchwords I live by. After all, one-in-million chances happen nine times out of ten in fiction. What is the probability that Szeth and Eshonai met and had their own chasm scene at the end of WoR? EXACTLY. Ladies and gentlemen, enjoy your new ultimate OTP.
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A 16 year old full Shardbearer...Sadeas is jealous and for good reason, and maybe that is why he enjoys trolling Adolin so much, not just because he has beef with Dalinar. It makes me wonder about the exact legal status of Shards in Roshar - are they owned by the individual, or the family? And obviously there's some governmental control on Shard ownership, since selling one to a foreigner counts as treason. It's a good thing Blades and Plates all have unique shapes, because otherwise a duel loser would be tempted to stab the winner in the dark and take the Shards back. Adolin doesn't use a sidesword in the arena for practice or duels, because there's no point in fighting a Shardbearer opponent with a sidesword. He, Dalinar, Renarin and every other high ranking lighteyes carries sideswords as their "casual dress" during the day, outside of battle. Adolin wore his on the zoo date with Shallan; Dalinar had his when Szeth busted through the wall in WoR assassination attempt, but ignored it and used a spear instead. If Adolin were to lose his own Plate and Blade, I honestly think that other Shardbearers in the Kholin army would offer to give back the Plate and Blades that Adolin won in duels. Renarin would give back his dead blade. They wouldn't have the same sentimental value as his mother's Plate and his Edgedancer Blade, but WoB has said that Shards will gradually shift themselves to fit their owners better so there would be no physical difference in the end. Not letting the best fighter in Alethkar fight is like throwing an ace in the rubbish bin. But then again, when plot induced stupidity strikes, no one is safe. I'm not sure how sideknife protocol works and if you aren't supposed to wear one if you are wearing your sidesword, or if you wear both, one on either side of your belt. Here's what I have on sideknives. It's a good thing I have an eReader and can just search by keywords. From WoR, chapter 50, when they find mysterious glyphs scratched on the wall: After Adolin killed Sadeas, it isn't mentioned that he pulled the knife out of his eye, probably because it would have sprayed blood everywhere. He still managed to cut his cuffs off, with no side knife. Either he took his coat off and used his Shardblade to do it, or he had a second knife. Dalinar carries a second knife. WoK, chapter 22. I think everyone is hoping that Adolin wasn't stupid enough to have "A.K" engraved on it like his buttons. And since there's no more Highprince of Information, maybe no one will be smart enough to check under the hilt and find a blacksmith's stamp that points to Kholinar or the Kholin warcamp. Renarin, to me, is perceptive and thinks analytically and tries to be composed 90% of the time. The other 10% of the time is when he's jumping in front of a chasmfiend or a Shardbearer or seeing visions about the end of the world. Pretty much the opposite of Adolin who is emotional and thinks in direct lines, and 10% of the time does something that proves he has foresight, like duelling like a noob and observing that some plateau formations look too precise to be natural (like that 3 layer cake shaped one when he used his Shardblade as a springboard). Renarin analyses what it means to be "normal" and tries to emulate it - not that it always works. I would consider "normalness" and neurotypical behaviour to be a first language to most people, and a second language to Renarin. He can speak "normietalk" but he isn't fluent enough for it to be automatic. He thinks Renarin thoughts, and has to translate them into "normietalk", and that short processing delay is why girls think there's something off about him. Now that I re-read the chasmfiend hunt scene, it looks like Renarin perceives that Adolin's interactions with women are not normal and he's unknowingly self-sabotaging. There is hope for him yet. Adolin is 23 and lives in a warcamp, how lacking can his -education- be? He has to know what his soldiers get up to in their spare time, and I am certain he knows about how the mechanics of the chickens...and the cremlings(?) works, at least theoretically. The question is, after so many years, if his imagination has been stunted in that area so he no longer knows how that sort of stuff applies to him, rather than how it works for people in general. I don't think Alethi are that prudish, as there are lighteyed officers shown visiting courtesans. They're reserved about PDA, since men and women are supposed to be separated when in public, but it seems to me that Adolin's prudishness (way above lighteye average) stems from Dalinar being extreme (as usual) on what constitutes proper behaviour in relationships with women. Namely, doing nothing and saying nothing. Instead of accepting Navani as his brother's wife, Dalinar avoided her for 20 years (!!!); instead of grieving for Shshshsh and moving on like everyone else, he wiped his memory. It wouldn't be surprising if Adolin unconsciously grew up thinking that feeling impulses -in that way- is embarrassingly vulgar or a sign of being weak-willed. Shallan will just have to teach him better. In most instances, I would think an age gap of 6 years would be a bit much, but Adolin and Shallan seem equally developed in terms of emotional maturity. It would make me laugh if Shallan was sending smiley faces to Adolin via spanreed. He can't read, but he can figure out what or means. I bet pages full of "What are you wearing? :)" or "You hang up first!" would make the ardents draw straws to avoid getting assigned scribe duty.
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How about a mixed doubles tennis or badminton with one Coinshot and one Lurcher against an identical team? It would be fair enough to be a proper show of skill. And pretty entertaining to boot, as long as you had rules about no killing and proper head and eye protection.
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Unstable/corrupt government + low childhood mortality + subsistence farming = pretty strict "family planning". If people know their babies are guaranteed to reach adulthood, they won't be pumping out 6 - 14 per woman, because if they all survive, that will be too many for the family to feed and still pay taxes/rent. They wouldn't be able to work for 10 years after birth, and if you have girls they won't be able to heavy labour. It's more likely that in Roshar, working families have fewer children, anywhere from 2-4, and the children stay with the family into adulthood rather than starting their own family asap. A pre-industrial society has no mechanised industries that allow unskilled and weak children to work menial labour in factories to bring money to the family; therefore there aren't many incentives to have more children than necessary to manage and inherit the farm. WoK, chapter 44. So Laral, at 15 or 16, is getting married and the darkeyed villagers are shocked at seeing this because it must be unusually young. The farmer boys in town aren't married, nor is Kaladin at 15, and other than Laral there are no other village girls trying to get his attention. It seems overly generous to use medieval European populations to estimate Roshar's. Alethi cities can have a higher population density than the equivalent of Earth cities in 1400-1600, because they don't have to worry about airborne or fleaborne diseases. But given that the armies in the warcamps Soulcast the contents of their latrine pits (chapter 28, WoK, when Dalinar digs a pooptube in Shardplate) and filter the crem out of the water, Rosharans can still get sick through ingesting contaminated things. They get their drinking water from highstorms, but where does all the sewage go? The wealthy areas would have Soulcasters remove their wastes, but the poor people, of which Kholinar seems to have many if they have beggars and food riots, can't afford that. And Rosharan cities, being built in laits, are physically limited from expanding outwards after reaching the valley walls. As an interesting note, England's population in 1600 was ~4.5 million, and London's population was ~300 000.
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Human development and civilisation isn't just about the capacity to produce food, but the ability to transport to where it is needed by specialists. All the big cities are built into laits, which are limited in area so end up as high density, high value living and working areas. They can't farm in the lait, so the farmers must live in surrounding regions and ship the food in, and/or they must rely on Soulcasters to feed the citizenry. Before the war of the Vengeance Pact, there weren't huge numbers of gemhearts flooding into Alethkar, and even after the Highprinces learned to camp the spawnpoints, the gemhearts and their wealth mostly stayed in the Shattered Plains. Alethkar can't have anything better than dirt roads, as pavings or cobbles would be washed away after a year or two of highstorms. Their river systems (cheapest and most efficient means of transport in medieval times) are probably narrow, fast flowing gorges that get dangerously blocked up after storms and change courses on a regular basis. Standard road transport would have to be slow moving chull caravans. And then storing food has its own problems, when you need to feed a city during the Weeping and your Soulcaster gems run out of Stormlight and you can't farm or harvest in the constant rain. The Palanaeum (Karbranth royal library) was a specially built underground pyramid, to be watertight, because moisture is a known problem. How are they storing their harvests to last for longer than several months? Not everyone can afford water repelling fabrials, or seamless Soulcast stone storage rooms. There must be some sort of secure storage system since you can see rotspren in Roshar and people associate them with spoiled food. Here's an interesting quote: Interlude 1-12, Words of Radiance. If farmers are starving, then something is wrong - it means they can't be producing that much of an excess if shipping food to the city means they can't feed themselves. If farmers are barely better than subsistence levels of agriculture, they must rely heavily on Soulcasters to avoid famine on bad years, and their population can't be that big. I'd guesstimate Alethkar's population to be around 5 million, which was Australia's population in 1900. There are a number of parallels with extreme climate and huge distances between cities and farming regions, as well as limited technology in transport and storage. And I would also say most people in the Alethi power structure would definitely prefer 10+ bridgemen to die instead of 1 cavalry unit. Shallan is shocked to see that someone trusted Kaladin and Bridge Four with valuable horses when they meet her and Tyn with the caravan. So cavalry riders will almost always always be lighteyes, and lighteyes are the type of people who are important enough that Sadeas will have to send people back to collect the bodies and Soulcast (again, expensive as the king owns them and highprinces have to pay to play) them into metal statues for their families.
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Pattern can't hide his buzzing during storms. The rest of the time he is quiet until he wants to be heard. When Shallan was drawing the map of the plateaus in the chasm, Kaladin overheard her muttering about how how weirdly symmetrical they are, but he couldn't hear Pattern and thought she was just talking to herself. Yeah, personal environments and experiences make up a lot of how individuals perceive the written word. You associate Alethi with First Nations peoples, while for me, they seem more like Maori (New Zealand native) for their culture based on warfare. Brandon was inspired by Utah landscapes when he designed the Shattered Plains, but when I read it, I thought it was more Australian-like, except less red. We even have a similar version of laits - billabongs in low ground that hold water even when summer has dried out all the rivers. Perhaps Stormlight has something to do with how large and healthy Alethi appear to be. Maybe it's silly of me to try to find parallels of Roshar to real life Earth, since their planet has Investiture and that's an important factor which is completely absent on Earth. The Highstorms start from the Origin, east to west, hitting Alethkar first, and Alethi are probably the tallest nation on Roshar, since Vedens are mentioned to be around 2"/5cm shorter on average and Shinovar, farthest away from the storms and with so little Investiture that they don't even get sprens, is inhabited by people considered small and childlike to the rest of the continent. Maybe their plants are more nutritious and calorie dense per gram than Earth crops - they do have Cultivation's shard and she is still alive, even if she prefers to ignore everything outside her wish granting cave. I still can't decide if it's charming or annoying that Dalinar treats everyone like they're children. He calls everyone "son", like Elhokar and Kaladin, he listens to people even though most of the time he will say his way is better. Maybe part of his character development is to realise that there are people who are adults with legitimate, valid opinions, not just him. Sadly, Adolin is a supporting character, whose only purpose of existing within the narrative is to set up plot points, such as setting up Shallan to find Urithiru, and to act as a foil to Dalinar and Kaladin. We can still make up plenty of unsatisfying theories about his failed love life- like Shshshsh dying when Adolin was ~13, and Dalinar always away helping Gavilar and Sadeas beat up the other Highprinces and take revenge on the Parshendi, so he had no female (or adult in general) parental figure or role model in adolescence to demonstrate how (non-superficial) relationships between men and women work. Renarin was even younger when Shshshsh died and as far as we know, he has never even been on a single date while people at his age are upgrading their contracts from causal to formal. There would be plenty of lighteyed girls fifth dahn or lower who would jump at the chance to marry him and have a comfortable life as a wealthy citylord's wife. Growing up in a big empty house with servants and no friends possibly triggered a disconnect between him and with other people who weren't family. Everyone would be lower ranking than him, since Adolin is heir to a Princedom, pretty much the highest rank you can be before Alethkar became a unified kingdom. The typical to response to an invitation as a kid would have gone along the lines of, "sorry guys I can't hang out with you, I've got sword practice this afternoon, tomorrow, the day after...and pretty much forever." And likely it was worse for Renarin, who spent his developing years only talking to Adolin and ardents, aka people his dad owns. Was Danlan the only girl on-screen who approached him first? I got the impression that a lot of his former dates dropped him because he forgot about them and went after someone else. Still, even if Adolin is awkward with anything past first base, he seems to have no problem with "socially acceptable contact", or holding and kissing girls' freehands or footsie under the table. I would have thought that if you can do step 1, step 2 isn't really an issue. Then again, after re-reading his bragging interactions from Kaladin's point of view, and then comparing it to the Adolin viewpoint chapters, I have the feeling that Adolin is an unreliable narrator who subconsciously glosses over the reasons for his failed relationships to girls and guy friends because he doesn't want to see himself as a failure at something. The "It's not me, it's them" mentality. From the double date with Danlan, Inkima and Jakamav in WoK: WoK, chapter 58. Maybe he's the problem. I think it's funny that people are critical of how successful and fast Shallan is at learning surgebinding and con artist skills in something like 4 months. But Kaladin has been naturally good at everything since his childhood. He may not have a natural affinity to medicine but he learns things very quickly, and in other skills he is supernaturally intuitive. His ability to learn, however, tends to be overshadowed by his other character traits of depression and plot-relevant stupidity.
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Yes, now that I think about it, it's pretty strange that Sadeas never won a Blade even though he was around the same skill level of Gavilar and Dalinar, who were both full Shardbearers. Dalinar even won a second set of Shards for Elhokar, so that Gavilar's set could be used for training. I suspect it's because winning a Blade is a matter of what you have to wager and how you cultivate your reputation. Duels for Shards are relatively rare, as most people fight to settle an argument or raise their duelling score. Only half bearers would duel for Shards, and only those willing to risk their own for the wager. So you can't win a Shard unless you have a Shard already - but possibly there are people willing to bet their entire family estates on a duel, though this would be very very unusual since Shards are considered priceless. Sadeas was either not willing to risk his Plate, or everyone was afraid of his reputation after he duelled and killed Yenev. Seeing Adolin win 5 (or 6?) Shards in a two month period would be considered unprecendented, probably because most people wager 1:1 and stop immediately after become a full Bearer, since it instantly raises you to Fourth Dahn. Adolin has a Shardblade, but he also carries a sidesword outside the arena. I don't think he would carry it unless he knew how to use it. When you think about it, there are 100 000 soldiers on the Shattered Plains, and if 5% of them are lighteyed officers, that's still 5 000 people. There are only 3 shards (out of the ~30 Shardbearers from the ten princely houses) publicly available for training, Gavilar and Elhokar's Plate, and Gavilar's Blade. Even if they had people rotating all day and training at night by spherelight, there still wouldn't be enough Shards to go around to train people. So I think the most efficient thiing to do is for people to practice fencing outside of Blade and Plate with sideswords and only let the capable (or well connected) people graduate to Shard practice. Adolin probably trained with a sidesword before he was tall and strong enough for Plate and Blade. Ugh, Kaladin. A lot of people find his struggles make him relatable and human, but sometimes the really face-palm worthy things he does are almost contrived blindness for plot advancement purposes. Amaram is a bad guy, I must kill him! Moash is a good guy, I won't report him! Dalinar is a lighteyes, I won't trust him! If he had Adolin's character alignment judging skills, the Third Ideal would have been spoken by page 500. I also think that a main reason for why he is so angry and fixated with his slavery (and why the brands won't heal) happened during the 8 months where he escaped multiple times and got recaptured. But they were only glossed over in Part 1 of WoK when he was in the slave wagon, so to many people the constant saltiness seems like him being a primadonna. I found one of the few description lines for Renarin in WoK, from the chasmfiend hunt scene. So maybe he goes to the fashionable hairdresser for lighteyes and gets the plainest style they have, which is still fancy relative to the darkeye military barbers but nothing compared to Sadeas's shoulder length hair or Aladar's styled mustache. He wouldn't pay attention to fashion folios as Adolin does, but he still cares enough about what is appropriate for his rank as well as the Codes of War to make sure his clothes are clean and pressed and his hair is combed but not styled with wax or scented oils. From what I recall of the people I know, most of the 19-20 year olds got away with shaving once every 3 days, and it was just clearing up patches of wispy fuzz on the cheeks and a scattering of proper beard hairs on chin and mustache. I would hesitate to call that a beard, it's more like face moss. I find it slightly amusing that Shallan thinks she's plain and very strange looking, and too skinny and flat to be pretty. The Bridge Four bodyguards think she's attractive and seems more approachable than the cold and aloof Alethi ladies; only Kaladin disagrees because lighteyes can't be attractive. Adolin probably thinks she's endearingly small and cute and spoonable if he allowed himself to imagine physical contact more intimate than touching her freehand. It's straight out of a teen romance novel. "Why do you even like me, Adolin? I'm not hot like you, I don't deserve you. :(" "But Shallan, you're beautiful!!!!" "A-am I?"
