Oudeis he/him Posted January 3, 2014 Author Posted January 3, 2014 Perhaps those symbols are the 'Final Metal' and it's alloys. Haha, fact is, I have no clue. I've heard it speculated that the "Final Metal" is chromium (and its alloy, nicrosil) which never showed up, nor was mentioned, in Alloy of Law. Just a fan theory, I believe, with no real basis. As a slight sidetrack, is it possible that those metals have Hemalurgic/Feruchemical abilities? I would suspect not, for the same reason that they don't have Allomantic properties. 16 is a big number to all three Arts, and there's not been a case yet of a metal having properties for one Art but not all three. (Unknown properties, sure, but known-to-not-exist, no)
name_here Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 There's always the possibility that they represent alloys of the Shard metals. They theoretically could also represent sounds/numbers without any Allomantic meaning, but given that it's both a pretty simple alphabet and the symbols have a specific additional meaning, I'd expect them to use multiple symbols or modifiers instead of expanding the character set.
loganmathewjohnson Posted January 3, 2014 Posted January 3, 2014 I'd expect them to use multiple symbols or modifiers instead of expanding the character set. Yeah, that makes perfect sense to me!!
Gamma Fiend he/him Posted January 4, 2014 Posted January 4, 2014 What about Alloys of Harmonium? Has that idea been discredited at all yet?
Swimmingly he/him Posted January 7, 2014 Posted January 7, 2014 What about aluminums actual, magical-interaction nonstick properties? Could that be a hint as to a "fourth art?" 1
Oudeis he/him Posted January 7, 2014 Author Posted January 7, 2014 What about aluminums actual, magical-interaction nonstick properties? Could that be a hint as to a "fourth art?" I'm not sure I know what you are replying to here. Also... I suppose technically just using metal for innate properties is, in fact, a "fourth art," though I personally would never have thought of it that way. Perhaps this is why Mr. Sanderson spoke of "a mechanical way to access the Metallic Arts". He wasn't talking about any of the three we already know, he just didn't want to spoil the existence of a fourth. Four is also a number more related to 16 than three is. Anyone want to speculate what this fourth art is called? 1
Aether he/him Posted January 7, 2014 Posted January 7, 2014 I'm not sure I know what you are replying to here. Also... I suppose technically just using metal for innate properties is, in fact, a "fourth art," though I personally would never have thought of it that way. Perhaps this is why Mr. Sanderson spoke of "a mechanical way to access the Metallic Arts". He wasn't talking about any of the three we already know, he just didn't want to spoil the existence of a fourth. Four is also a number more related to 16 than three is. Anyone want to speculate what this fourth art is called? How about "the Fourth Metallic Art"? Or maybe "Metallurgy"? And while I think it would be cool to have four metallic arts because of its relationship with 16, I do not think "a mechanical way to access the Metallic Arts" would necessarily mean that there is a fourth one. The three Metallic arts had more to do with the interaction of the Scadrian Shards themselves, I felt, rather than the expression of investiture on Scardial. On the other hand, it fits well with Brandon's devious nature as a writer.
Oudeis he/him Posted January 7, 2014 Author Posted January 7, 2014 I do not think "a mechanical way to access the Metallic Arts" would necessarily mean that there is a fourth one. It needs a better name than that. I don't think that the quote means there has to be a fourth art; I think the fact that there's ostensibly a fourth one means there is a fourth one. Aluminum cannot be Pushed or Pulled, it blocks emotional allomancy, and was stated to have an unknown effect on Thugs. This all happens without someone burning it, touching it, or having it shoved through them, so it's not allomancy, feruchemy, or hemalurgy. It's a fourth art. I was using the quote in a roundabout way, which I should have been more clear on, and I apologize. I have my own theories on how the Southern Scadrians use the metallic arts mechanically, and one of the flaws in my theory is that Mr. Sanderson has specifically used the term "the metallic arts" when I so far believe there's no need to use feruchemy or hemalurgy any differently down south; why then is allomancy alone referred to as "arts"? If there's a fourth art, one that's inherently mechanical, it might resolve the flaw in my theory. I'm sorry I confused you.
Aether he/him Posted January 7, 2014 Posted January 7, 2014 It needs a better name than that. I don't think that the quote means there has to be a fourth art; I think the fact that there's ostensibly a fourth one means there is a fourth one. Aluminum cannot be Pushed or Pulled, it blocks emotional allomancy, and was stated to have an unknown effect on Thugs. This all happens without someone burning it, touching it, or having it shoved through them, so it's not allomancy, feruchemy, or hemalurgy. It's a fourth art. I was using the quote in a roundabout way, which I should have been more clear on, and I apologize. I have my own theories on how the Southern Scadrians use the metallic arts mechanically, and one of the flaws in my theory is that Mr. Sanderson has specifically used the term "the metallic arts" when I so far believe there's no need to use feruchemy or hemalurgy any differently down south; why then is allomancy alone referred to as "arts"? If there's a fourth art, one that's inherently mechanical, it might resolve the flaw in my theory. I'm sorry I confused you. Alas, again my feeble attempt at a joke is thwarted by my own lack of humour! In the Emperor's Soul, there is an "unforgeable metal". Does this mean that there are two kinds of Soulforging? I do not think Aluminum's peculiar nature on Scadrial necessitate a fourth metallic art. I suppose you could call whatever the Southerners are doing "the fourth metallic art", but I don't think that makes it an actual system of "Shardic" magic. I think it is exactly what we've been told: a mechanical way of accessing Allomancy (and possibly Feruchemy as well).
WeiryWriter he/him Posted January 7, 2014 Posted January 7, 2014 I don't think there is a "fourth art" since it would ruin the symmetry that currently exists, a symmetry that exists because of the perfect dichotomy between the two shards. We have a magic of Preservation, a magic of Ruin, and a magic that is the balance between the two, where would a fourth fit in? I don't think the mechanical ways of accessing would count as a new system since Brandon has said its just a mechanical instead of genetic way of accessing the systems. If they were a different system he would have said it differently. As Aether pointed out, just because aluminum has special powers doesn't mean those powers are part of a fourth art. We have seen a number of manifestations of investiture that aren't a part of a specific system (such as the boons/curses of the Nightwatcher). 1
thecatinthehat Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 I don't think there is a "fourth art" since it would ruin the symmetry that currently exists, a symmetry that exists because of the perfect dichotomy between the two shards. We have a magic of Preservation, a magic of Ruin, and a magic that is the balance between the two, where would a fourth fit in?If it were "a magic of none", then Metallurgy would fit… perfectly!
Moogle Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) Highly unlikely to be anything, but for 'red and gold', this stood out in Warbreaker: Vasher didn’t know how to respond to that. He paused atop the wall,overlooking Lightsong’s palace. Red and gold. Bold colors indeed. There's going to be something involving Warbreaker in SA2, so it's possible there's something going on. Highly unlikely though. Edited January 13, 2014 by Moogle
Oudeis he/him Posted January 13, 2014 Author Posted January 13, 2014 Spoilers for the Chapter 1 released on tor.com. The captain wore a "coat of gold and red matched by the cap on his head." Red and gold show up a lot. Either this means something, or Mr. Sanderson truthfully just really likes the colors. 1
Swimmingly he/him Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 They're very versatile colours. It fits boldness and assurance, but also opulence and wealth.
Moogle Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 (edited) The quote talks about the bearers of read and gold bringing a 'final metal'. The two 'unknowns' as of AoL are the two external enhancement metals, which aren't very scary. So... I'm guessing Odium or another Shard comes visiting. A new Shard means a new metal. Anyone know if we have a list of Shard-colors? Offhand I know: White for Preservation Black for Ruin Blue for Devotion (? If the Elantrian Shardpool was Devotion's.) Red for Dominion (? I recall reading this somewhere.) Black/violet for either Honor, Odium, or Cultivation (from the black sphere Gavilar had). I'd honestly guess Cultivation, since she's the 'Nightwatcher', but night is referred to in the series so many times as evil that it may as well be Odium. The back cover of TWOK has violet for Cultivation if that's who's on the Voidbinding (?) chart. Edit: Probably best to make a new thread for it. I'll go do that. Edited January 13, 2014 by Moogle
WeiryWriter he/him Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 The quote talks about the bearers of read and gold bringing a 'final metal'. The two 'unknowns' as of AoL are the two external enhancement metals, which aren't very scary. So... I'm guessing Odium or another Shard comes visiting. A new Shard means a new metal. Anyone know if we have a list of Shard-colors? Offhand I know: White for Preservation Black for Ruin Blue for Devotion (? If the Elantrian Shardpool was Devotion's.) Red for Dominion (? I recall reading this somewhere.) Black/violet for either Honor, Odium, or Cultivation (from the black sphere Gavilar had). I'd honestly guess Cultivation, since she's the 'Nightwatcher', but night is referred to in the series so many times as evil that it may as well be Odium. The back cover of TWOK has violet for Cultivation if that's who's on the Voidbinding (?) chart. Edit: Probably best to make a new thread for it. I'll go do that. That was a long-standing theory but someone asked Brandon about it and he said no, Shard's don't all have an associated color. Preservation and Ruin being represented by white/black has more to do with them being opposites (or something along those lines, I'll try and find the quote).
Swimmingly he/him Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 The quote talks about the bearers of read and gold bringing a 'final metal'. The two 'unknowns' as of AoL are the two external enhancement metals, which aren't very scary. So... I'm guessing Odium or another Shard comes visiting. A new Shard means a new metal. Anyone know if we have a list of Shard-colors? Offhand I know: White for Preservation Black for Ruin Blue for Devotion (? If the Elantrian Shardpool was Devotion's.) Red for Dominion (? I recall reading this somewhere.) Black/violet for either Honor, Odium, or Cultivation (from the black sphere Gavilar had). I'd honestly guess Cultivation, since she's the 'Nightwatcher', but night is referred to in the series so many times as evil that it may as well be Odium. The back cover of TWOK has violet for Cultivation if that's who's on the Voidbinding (?) chart. Edit: Probably best to make a new thread for it. I'll go do that. Pretty scary for an allomancer - they can just wipe out your metals with a touch. Doubly scary if they're using them Feruchemically - Investiture and Luck could be anything from annoying to terrifying, depending on how Brandon plays it. Triply scary if they're using them hemalurgically somehow - we have no idea. Quadruply scary if the "final metal" is just a reference to the mechanical metallic arts they're using, as they almost certainly are, which have effects we can't really predict at all.
Moogle Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 That was a long-standing theory but someone asked Brandon about it and he said no, Shard's don't all have an associated color. Preservation and Ruin being represented by white/black has more to do with them being opposites (or something along those lines, I'll try and find the quote). Darnit. There goes that theory. I think I recall the WoB you're talking about, too. Still, Shards have Shardpools, and those have colors, so I'm not entirely sure on the matter - how can they not have a color?
Swimmingly he/him Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 Just cause their Shardpool's a certain colour doesn't mean that it'll leak into every aspect of their magic and power.
Oudeis he/him Posted January 13, 2014 Author Posted January 13, 2014 Darnit. There goes that theory. I think I recall the WoB you're talking about, too. Still, Shards have Shardpools, and those have colors, so I'm not entirely sure on the matter - how can they not have a color? If I recall correctly, Ruin and Preservation's shardpools were the same metallic sheen, for certain neither of them were black or white.
Moogle Posted January 13, 2014 Posted January 13, 2014 Just cause their Shardpool's a certain colour doesn't mean that it'll leak into every aspect of their magic and power. Well then, let me be amend my statement to say that I want to find out the color of every Shardpool.
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