Vorinism and its connection to the Knights Radiant.

[callumke]

I've been thinking about this for a while, and I don’t know if this has been mentioned before on the forums but here we go.

First, Teft links old Vorinism and the Radiants by describing what his parents believed.

"My parents believed in all of it. The Immortal Words, the Ideals,the Knights Radiant, the Almighty. Even old Vorinism. In fact, especially old Vorinism.” - Pg 862

Secondly, there is a connection between what Vorinism teaches and what we can observe in all our up-and-coming Radiants. Vorinism teaches that

“the Almighty accepted the excellence of any man or woman,regardless of what they did.” - Pg 281

And each of our Radiants (Kaladin, Dalinar, Shallan andJasnah) all excel in specific fields (the spear, the sword and war, drawing,and scholarship respectively). Using this, I predict that Navani and Adolin will both become Radiants soon, as both of them are also excellent at being an Artifabrian and a duelist respectively.

I think that Vorinism is a relic of the days of the Radiants, and contains information about how to become a radiant. The concepts of a Calling and a Glory tie into this.

“You just did your best, picking a profession and an attribute of the Almighty to emulate. A Calling and a Glory, it was said. You worked hard at your profession, and you spent your life trying to live according to a single ideal.” - Pg 282

Thus, to become a Radiant, you need to excel at your profession, and be completely dedicated to emulating an ideal of the almighty.

Thus, to start on the path toward becoming a Radiant of the Windrunners, you need to excel at something and dedicate yourself to Protecting. I think this is what separates a Primary from a Secondary divine attribute. To start becoming a Radiant, you need to commit to a Primary Divine Attribute (Kaladin Protects and Shallan is Creative), and I suspect that to advance further as a Radiant you need to dedicate yourself tothe linked Secondary Divine Attribute. My guess is that in Stormlight 2, Kaladin will need to live his life asa leader, and Shallan will need to live an honest life, in order to progress through the Ideals of the Radiants.

By the way, there are two big things that this doesn’t explain. Firstly, why have the Radiants returned now? Surely at some point in the last few thousand years, someone has been dedicated to leading and also excelled at something? Secondly, we have no evidence of excellence OR commitment to creativity in Elohkar who seems to be of the same Radiant Order as Shallan.

So, my theory is that being dedicated to an Attribute of Honour is not enough to become a Radiant. Vorinism suggests that excellence is necessary. Thoughts?

[Cayden]

In some ways it makes a lot of sense, in others it doesnt. Its something which will require quite a bit of thought to give it the reply it deserves, I think you might be onto something to an extent... But what if not all the Callings and Glories are of Honor? Only those which were truly linked to him would be beneficial as far as becoming a Radiant. In many respects I think it is Jasnah's Dedication rather than her Scholarly goals which would tie her most to Honor, but time will tell.

However regarding the why haven't they shown up beforehand.

Everything in the world changed when Galivar and Dalinar went to the Shattered Plains, something they did or didn't do effected the world in some way. From what is said in the books that is when the Highstorm Visions began in people as well as the Deathly Visions. (Dalinar was not the only one who used to receive the Highstorm based ones, we have a few quotes in the Chapter Intro's about people who received them)

I think it has something to do with what is essentially a Time Capsule of Honor's last thoughts that he left in the wind waiting for the time they would be needed, and something to do with that has allowed the last remnants of his Powers on Roshar to find the fertile soil within people whom would be most receptive to his Powers and his Visions, and even then they have to accept and follow those of their own choice.

Most of those Chapter quotes were from people who had died and then Taravangian had then had killed, perhaps anyone who see's those visions whether they be Highstorm or Near Death have the potential to embrace Stormlight? If that is the case then Taravangian might well be working indirectly for Odium in killing people who could one day become Champions of Honor.

[Turos]

Thus, to start on the path toward becoming a Radiant of the Windrunners, you need to excel at something and dedicate yourself to Protecting. I think this is what separates a Primary from a Secondary divine attribute. To start becoming a Radiant, you need to commit to a Primary Divine Attribute (Kaladin Protects and Shallan is Creative), and I suspect that to advance further as a Radiant you need to dedicate yourself tothe linked Secondary Divine Attribute. My guess is that in Stormlight 2, Kaladin will need to live his life asa leader, and Shallan will need to live an honest life, in order to progress through the Ideals of the Radiants.

Remember, though, that each Order of the Knights Radiant had two Surges. So technically to qualify for an Order by this theory, would you need to meet two required attributes? If so, this could limit who became a Radiant.

By the way, there are two big things that this doesn’t explain. Firstly, why have the Radiants returned now? Surely at some point in the last few thousand years, someone has been dedicated to leading and also excelled at something? Secondly, we have no evidence of excellence OR commitment to creativity in Elohkar who seems to be of the same Radiant Order as Shallan.

I think the main reason for the Orders returning is that the next Desolation is about to come, as who seems to be Herald Talenelat claims at the end of the book.

As far as Elohkar, him seeing what are likely Truthspren is entirely possible without him being in the same Order, but it would likely mean he is going to end up in an Order that shares one of the two Surges Shallan's Order possesses. Other than that, I have no idea how Elohkar would be considered 'excellent', heh. Maybe Odium is messin' with him.

Additional note:

I just realized something. Isn't Bridge Four member Rock, the Horneater, able to see Syl, the spren who follows Kaladin? Oooo... possible Knight-to-be?

Edited January 18, 2013 by Turos

[Dros]

I always wondered that about Elohkar. He just always seemed way in over his head.

[dj26792]

He is quite cunning in a way though, and despite his problems has a good heart. Paranoia is a weakness sure, but if only good people became Radiants, Kalladin (despite his awesomeness) is a massive jerk, has a depressive personality and genuinely loaths an entire social class based on the actions of 2 or 3 people. He's probably doing worse than Elhokar a lot of the time.

[Cayden]

He is quite cunning in a way though, and despite his problems has a good heart. Paranoia is a weakness sure, but if only good people became Radiants, Kalladin (despite his awesomeness) is a massive jerk, has a depressive personality and genuinely loaths an entire social class based on the actions of 2 or 3 people. He's probably doing worse than Elhokar a lot of the time.

In Kaladin's Defence from what we have seen in the books a good 80-90% of the Lighteyes are suffering from a rather large case of their heads having a holiday home in their rectum. Most of them see Darkeyes as mere servants who should be honoured to be in their presence.

Elhokar has his reasons as well, can any of you imagine someone murdering your father and no one being able to stop it from happening. And then start seeing really weird stuff? damnation I'd be panicky and paranoid as well.

[Dros]

In Kaladin's Defence from what we have seen in the books a good 80-90% of the Lighteyes are suffering from a rather large case of their heads having a holiday home in their rectum. Most of them see Darkeyes as mere servants who should be honoured to be in their presence.

Elhokar has his reasons as well, can any of you imagine someone murdering your father and no one being able to stop it from happening. And then start seeing really weird stuff? damnation I'd be panicky and paranoid as well.

True, but the others still seem to be handling it a bit better than him. I'm not saying he's not manly enough because he doesn't want to die, but as the monarch of a society based on warfare and a vicious code of soldierly life, he doesn't seem very hard.