MistbornMathematician Posted January 15 Report Share Posted January 15 (THERE IS A TL;DR AT THE BOTTOM, DON'T WORRY)  In my last post I discussed a theory that the Dawnshards corresponded to the Three Realms (calling those Exist, Feel, and Connect) plus Change, that each had a push-pull and internal-external alignment, and that every Shard corresponded to two Dawnshards, one first and one second, thus having a primary Dawnshard alignment and a push-pull and internal-external alignment corresponding to the second Dawnshard. I also discussed how it appeared that if a Shard's first Dawnshard formed a push-pull pair with the second, then they ended up "rebelling" against their Dawnshard alignment. The primary examples I used were Preservation, against Change, and Autonomy, against Connect, with a theory that Mercy is against Feel. However, due to Prudence/Wisdom/Survival (I'll call it Prudence) probably being an Exist Shard and this WoB Spoiler Paleo (paraphrased) Is Wisdom a Shard? If so, how bad does it want to survive? Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased) There is a Shard with a similar intent. The Shard has realized that survival might not be the most desirable/important. Footnote: Paleo later asked Brandon for clarification on this one because he couldn't quite remember the survival part when he wrote it down. Brandon stressed again what the Shard has realized. Stuttgart signing (May 17, 2019) it seems quite likely that, if this theory has any merits at all, Prudence should be the Shard against Exist. If we assume that, then, we have a slight adjustment to the previous chart, which I'll take a moment to adjust now. Anything that I've said in the previous post I'll leave fairly short and uncited so there isn't too much redundancy.  First off, we assume Ruin and Preservation form a push-pull pair, and if we believe Ruin that he is the "True" Shard of Change (which I do), and we consider them to be the External Temporal Shards to correspond with the effects of Bendalloy and Cadmium, we again have Change being the External Pushing Dawnshard, making Exist the External Pulling Dawnshard, making (by our assumption) Prudence the External Pushing Physical Dawnshard. The arguments for Prudence and Whimsy being a push-pull pair still hold, in my opinion, so this would make Whimsy the "True" Shard of Exist. The "Rebel" Shard opposes the "True" Shard, which again makes sense with Odium and Mercy, and Honor and Autonomy. Feel and Connect have to be Internal, and Duralumin and Aluminum do seem to correspond quite well with Honor and Autonomy (who in turn are associated with Connection and Identity) so making Honor the Internal Pushing Spiritual Shard, and thus making Connect the Internal Pushing Dawnshard and Feel the Internal Pulling Dawnshard, fixes the other three. This does still make Odium correspond to Copper and Mercy to Bronze, which I personally do not like, but at least they have the same push-pull orientation as Rioting and Soothing. The rest fall into place quite well, using much the same arguments as before: Gold and Electrum correspond to Cultivation and Invention, Chromium and Nicrosil correspond to Ambition and Endowment, Tin and Pewter correspond to Virtuosity and Valor, and Zinc and Brass correspond to Dominion and Devotion. The one change, Valor and Virtuosity being Internal, does hold quite well with the metals, especially if Valor's Intent is indeed more like "Functionality" or "Efficacy" where Virtuosity's is more like "Artistry". The chart is, then (reordering things a little so the corners correspond to their proper Dawnshards): SPIRITUAL Pushing Pulling  Pushing Pulling COGNITIVE Internal Honor Autonomy Mercy Odium Internal External Endowment Ambition Devotion Dominion External  Internal Invention Cultivation Valor Virtuosity Internal External Ruin Preservation Prudence Whimsy External TEMPORAL Pushing Pulling Pushing Pulling PHYSICAL This is what we will be going with from now on.  So, onto what you're here for: attempting to categorize every bit of magic in the Cosmere. We start with the biggest question: Can we categorize how Shards influence the Cosmere as a whole? I propose that they do so in four ways, which correspond to Dawnshards. The first are the mundane consequences, like Honor's existence enforcing the fundamental forces: Spoiler Pawell2812 Cultivation, Ruin, and Preservation seem like aspects of Adonalsium's cosmic nature rather than personality traits like other Shards. Is there a fourth Shard that is cosmic in nature? Brandon Sanderson I think they all are cosmic in nature. Even Honor, like you could say that's a personality trait, I don't think it is, I think it's a cosmic sense of justice and order, if that makes sense. We're phrasing it as a personality trait but that's not really what it is. There are those who would argue that the Shard of Honor is what makes things fall to the ground when you drop them and obey natural laws. Ben Epic Assuming the Dawnshards each represent four Shards, and considering their Intents seem to be similar, are Endowment, Cultivation, and Ruin all from the same category? Are they all Change Shards? Brandon Sanderson Oh, I get what you're saying. I'm going to RAFO that for now. Or Preservation and Ruin enforcing the first and second laws of thermodynamics. I will claim these are the "Natural Laws", corresponding to Exist. Then, you have laws of how Investiture works: Spoiler yurisses You once said that Investiture follows its own version of the laws of thermodynamics. The first one is that Investiture is neither created nor destroyed. Is the second law of Investodynamics that the amount of corrupted Investiture in the Cosmere cannot decrease? Brandon Sanderson Basically, the idea is that there is a third item in the equations--matter, energy, and investiture. That's the basis of how they work. Entropy is not corrupted Investiture. The second law stands as is. However, there is a fourth law that relates to Adonalsium, which I'm not going to talk about at the moment. /r/books AMA 2015 (July 14, 2015) I again argue that the first and second laws would be from Preservation and Ruin. I'll call these "Arcane Laws", corresponding to Feel. Next, we have what I'll refer to as "Invested Laws", corresponding to Connect, which have the following properties: They do not require any Connection to their Shard or a specific kind of (or unkeyed) Investiture. They require a supplied Intent which aligns with the Intent of their Shard. These three categories of Shardic influence also have one overarching property: they are largely unaffected by the Shard itself and whatever state they may be in. We have two clear examples of this, I believe: the first is Hemalurgy, which I claim is Ruin's Invested Law, and the second is Bonding, which I claim is Honor's Invested Law. Finally, we have "Invested Arts", corresponding to Change, which have the following properties: They require some kind of Connection to their Shard. Their Shard can exert a measure of control over them. They require that the user be Invested with Investiture keyed to their Shard. They involve use of kinetic Investiture. They can be taken by power-stealing Hemalurgic metals. Allomancy, Surgebinding, Forgery, and Sand Mastery are some clear examples. I'll further claim that there are two more properties:    5. They each have 16 sub-arts, each of which also have a Dawnshard/Internal-External/Push-Pull orientation in addition to the main "pinnacle" art.    6. An Invested Art can be affected and modified by a Shard or Shards that are not one it belongs to.  So let's start with the Natural Laws, since we know relatively little about them, since our real-world knowledge of physics doesn't fully apply to the Cosmere. We do know the Laws of Thermodynamics hold, and that the first and second are of Preservation and Ruin, and we also know that "obeying the fundamental laws" is of Honor. We also know that the Strong and Weak Axial forces exist, corresponding to the Surges of Cohesion and Tension, but it's hard to say exactly who they'd belong to. Given that Hion lines appear to be somewhat related to electricity, one might suspect Virtuosity corresponds to light or possibly even the electric and magnetic forces, or perhaps given Virtuosity expressing the push-pull duality more prominantly: Spoiler Cheyenne Sedai We only know the people of Komashi as having Investiture from Virtuosity, why does their Investiture seem to be split into the two streams of power known as hion? Is this something unique to Virtuosity as a Shard, or just how it happens to manifest on Komashi? Brandon Sanderson Yes. This will be a theme you will see wherever Virtuosity is involved. So yeah. hmmmmm interesting. This will be a theme. There is a sub theme to this in the Cosmere. The Push and Pull. The opposites should be echoing through the magic systems. It is more expressed in Virtuosity than the others but do keep in mind that the Yin Yang sort of thing is there in the Cosmere as well in the general magic system, but more pronounced with Virtuosity, shall we say. Shardcast Interview (July 30, 2023) Virtuosity actually corresponds to some form of wave-particle duality. There's not much more to say about this aside from some even more baseless speculation, though -- maybe the Cognitive ones have something to do with how emotions work? Or how life works? Very hard to say. So let's put the four I have some reasoning for in the chart, and move on. SPIRITUAL Pushing Pulling  Pushing Pulling COGNITIVE Internal Honor Things obeying the laws of physics Autonomy ? Mercy ? Odium ? Internal External Endowment ? Ambition ? Devotion ? Dominion ? External  Internal Invention ? Cultivation ? Valor ? Virtuosity Something related to light or electricity Internal External Ruin Entropy Preservation Conservation laws Prudence ? Whimsy ? External TEMPORAL Pushing Pulling Pushing Pulling PHYSICAL We actually know a fairly large number of potential Arcane Laws: First Law: Investiture cannot be created or destroyed. (Preservation's?) Second Law: Investiture is subject to entropy. (Ruin's?) Third Law: Unknown, but it exists. Fourth Law: Unknown, but it relates to Adonalsium. Investiture can be Kinetic or Static. Investiture can be "keyed" to a Shard. (Dominion's?) Every form of Investiture generates some kind of emotion. (Odium's?) High concentrations of Investiture can dilate time. Raw Investiture is highly responsive to emotions and Intents. (Devotion's?) Connection. (Honor's?) Identity. (Autonomy's?) Fortune. (Ambition's?) Objects and entities can be Invested. (Endowment's?) Investiture tends to repel Investiture. (Could be part of Identity, given what Trellium does) Invested art "resonances". Large quantities of Investiture can become self-aware. Each type of Investiture has a color. And a taste. (Virtuosity's?) Solid Investiture is metallic, and each Shard's kind has a specific property. Investiture encodes a person's memories and "self". Invested people being healthier. (Cultivation's?) A cracked or broken Spiritweb allows for more Investiture usage. Every type of Investiture has an anti-Investiture. Every type of Investiture has a push and a pull. (Though this might not be a law, per se, just a consequence of the categorization. The existence of the categorization might be Adonalisium's Arcane Law, though. Who knows?) And there's probably some more possibilities out there that I've missed. Here are the ones I feel confident enough about to put in the chart: SPIRITUAL Pushing Pulling  Pushing Pulling COGNITIVE Internal Honor Things obeying the laws of physics Connection Autonomy ? Identity Mercy ? ? Odium ? Investiture causing emotion Internal External Endowment ? Objects and people being able to be Invested Ambition ? Fortune Devotion ? Investiture responding to emotions and intents Dominion ? Investiture being able to be "keyed" to a specific Shard External  Internal Invention ? ? Cultivation ? Investiture innately healing and bolstering Invested things Valor ? ? Virtuosity Something related to light or electricity Investiture types having different colors and flavors Internal External Ruin Entropy Investiture Entropy Preservation Conservation laws Investiture Conservation Prudence ? ? Whimsy ? ? External TEMPORAL Pushing Pulling Pushing Pulling PHYSICAL  Now, onto the Invested Laws. Hemalurgy and Bonding are pretty straightforward: Hemalurgy can be done anywhere, by anyone, to anything, as long as there is some supplied intent to create a Hemalurgic spike and an Invested victim. Spoiler Questioner I'm trying to understand the relationship between Hemalurgy and the Shard Ruin. Most of the Invested Arts involve inputs of energy of the Shardic Investiture that corresponds to it. That doesn't seem to be the case for Feruchemy and Hemalurgy. So I'm wondering what the relationship is between the corresponding Shards and those two Metallic Arts. Brandon Sanderson There's a whole lot going on here, and I'm not sure how much I can get into right here. But one of the basic concepts I built for the cosmere, way back when, was that a lot of the different magics would be showing up in different systems. And there are certain underpinning fundamental rules. And this is why you'll see Lightweaving working the same way across three different magic systems; I think you've seen it in three different ones so far. Elsecalling's gonna work the same way. Hemalurgy is a thing that is, like, part of the nature of the cosmere, that the Shard simply knew and was able to tell people how to do So is it of that Shard? Well, yes, because you would have to be following that Shard's Intent in order to use it. But it could be discovered on other planets, as well. Questioner And independent of Ruin's presence, really, except for as Ruin affects the cosmere as a whole? Brandon Sanderson Yes. Exactly. You are correct. Dragonsteel 2022 (Nov. 14, 2022) Spoiler asmodeus You've said before that a lot of the magics we see across the cosmere come from an interaction of Shards and their Investiture with the planets they Invest in. What does this mean practically? If Scadrial explodes tomorrow, will Hemalurgy stop working across the cosmere? Brandon Sanderson Hemalurgy wouldn't stop working, most likely, but it could. There are ways that you could make it stop working. I kind of mean that the Shards are an innate part of physics in the cosmere, and the magics that arise are an innate part of physics because of that. Like atium seeped out into the Pits of Hathsin, in the same way, these magics are just gonna leak out, and different places are going to affect them. You'll see Lightweaving happening in different places, and the way the Shard is interacting with the local... The way the Shard is is going to affect how Lightweaving is administrated in the various magics, but it's still gonna be there. Hemalurgy is kind of a similar thing to that. You will see Midnight Essence, you will see some of these recurring ideas popping up, and these are like natural parts of the physics, but they're influenced by the Shards on the local planets. I don't know if that answer, that's gonna be a really fun one for them to transcribe into the Q&A thing, because I go around in circles on that question a ton. Put this part in when you do it. Footnote: It was a really fun one. YouTube Spoiler Stream 4 (June 16, 2022) Bonding is similar: as long as there's an intent to bond and a highly invested entity to bond with, you can bond with a ton of stuff across the Cosmere, from Aviar to Seons to Aethers to Nightmares to, of course, Spren. We also know that Bonds on Roshar do grant powers, but not the same ones: Spoiler Questioner If an Elantrian bonded to a Seon were to travel to Roshar, would that act as a Nahel bond? Brandon Sanderson It would act very, very similarly, yes. But it would be like... it wouldn't necessarily do the exact same things. Like if you've got two radios tuned to a frequency, they won't necessarily pick up another radio frequency, or things like this. I don't know, that's a bad metaphor, I'd have to think of a better one. But it would be treated exactly the same way but it might not grant the same powers. Words of Radiance Washington, DC signing (March 20, 2014) though it does seem likely that not all bonds would have some unique power, given that a cognitive shadow could bond someone Spoiler Blightsong Could Kelsier theoretically bond with someone on Roshar? Brandon Sanderson Yes. OdysseyCon 2016 (April 8, 2016) and bonding giving powers isn't unique to Roshar Spoiler Thadamin How important are bonds like the Nahel Bond and a seon bond in the Cosmere? Brandon Sanderson I'd say very important. Thadamin Is this kind of bond relatively common or is what seons, spren, and Nightblood do little more rare among Splinters. I'm specifically talking about the act of making bonds not a giving of magic powers really, that appearing to be function of Roshar. Also regarding your post about Stormlight 3 I am personally okay with 2000 pages if need be so make the chapters as long as you want.:) Brandon Sanderson The bonding is basically the same mechanic, regardless of the world, just with different flavoring. Roshar isn't the only place where the bond gives powers; it's a matter of what's stuffed into the soul, and how. /r/books AMA 2015 (June 19, 2015) though perhaps he's referring to lower-key powers like controlling Aethers. It is, again, hard to say, but according to that WoB, bonding is essentially the same mechanic everywhere, "just with different flavoring". Other potential Invested Laws might include: Investiture-based healing, which can be found in many Invested Arts and always has the same properties of healing the physical form to match the perception of "self", Lightweaving (not the surge, the power), and Elsecalling (also the power and not the surge). As per these WoBs: Spoiler Argent In the Syl interlude in Rhythm of War, she is speaking with Dalinar about his powers and the things those powers have done in the past. And what she says is "a Bondsmith bound other Surges". First of all, what other Surges? Brandon Sanderson One potential interpretation for you on this, remember they use Surge and spren sometimes interchangeably in-world. Just making you aware of that. Argent Yeah I'm aware of that. Bound other Surges.... Argent Then the term Bondsmith. To me it seems like she's talking about Ishar and the Ashyn stuff. So would they use Bondsmith to describe him in that place? Brandon Sanderson That might be what she's talking about. I'm not guaranteeing it. Brandon Sanderson So one other thing to keep aware of in the cosmere - for instance they call "Lightweaving" any illusion-based magic working on the same fundamentals. And so you could argue - and people will use it that way in-world - that Bondsmithing is both an order [of Knights Radiant] and a power that exists outside the order. Argent And that would be maybe the power of Connection, the way Lightweaving is the power of illusion? Brandon Sanderson Yes. And for instance, there were not Elsecallers to get people between Ashyn and Roshar, but on Roshar they would explain what happened there as Elsecalling. Does that make sense? Argent I mean, as much as these things make sense, yes. JordanCon 2021 (July 17, 2021) Spoiler Comatose Kind of a similar question about the Midnight Essence, now that we have seen that crop up in Tress as well as in Stormlight Archive. Is something similar happening with the Midnight Essence? We have also the nightmares, in Yumi, that appear similar, they're also mimicking things. Brandon Sanderson So, there's a couple of things getting interwoven here. The actual idea of Midnight Essence is a concept like Lightweaving that predates the Shattering of Adonalsium, that various magic systems are basically "borrowing" a law of the cosmere and creating a parallel effect from the same basis, if that makes any sense. Yumi is a little distinct from that. It's feeling similar; I would not call it true Midnight Essence. It's an awful lot more like a Lightweaving that has--because Lightweavings can have mass to them, because investiture can have mass to it--so you're looking a little bit more like... imagine a bunch of Stormlight becoming tangible, you can touch it, because of a powerful Lightweaving or something like that. Of course, these things all bleed together because I'm using the same fundamental principles to make them. But, for me, Midnight Essence has this personality that comes prefixed. What the Midnight Mother is making, what you're seeing in the Midnight Sea and things like this, you're gonna get some similar personalities to these things, and not necessarily the same with the nightmares. Comatose So it's more of a autonomous-- a Lightweaving that's become autonomous and has kind of broken down a bit? Brandon Sanderson Yeah...  the problem is it's also got the Cognitive Shadow, right? It's a really invested Cognitive Shadow that is borrowing this Investiture to interact with the world. Because these are their shadows; these are their Cognitive Shadows, all of these people's Cognitive Shadows. But the power is not themselves. Remember, a Cognitive Shadow is a little bit like a fossil, like Vasher describes it. You've got this pattern there, and then the power kind of makes it manifest and be able to interact, and things like that. And, when that personality asserts itself with that power in the right place, you end up with a person that is the shadow running it. But at the same time, you've got this mass of power and energy that the machine is kind of controlling, which pulls back and overrides the personality sometimes. You've got a very weird set of circumstances going on here. But it was very fun to figure out all the backstory and the behind on it, and get it all working. This one was a little complex, to get these things all working behind the scenes. I like how they turned out. Yumi, if you dig into it, it has both pluses and minuses. The minuses is - from the beta readers and the alpha readers - the ending for non-arcanists was really overwhelming, which is why we have those Hoid scenes where he's like, "Okay, let me explain." It seems pretty obvious, I would expect that this is, like, "Alright, Brandon needs to do better explanations, Hoid's just gonna do it." But, because of all the work I did behind the scenes on Yumi, Yumi matches kind of cosmerological magic system stuff in ways that a lot of the side projects that I do just don't. Yumi is very deeply intertwined and following all of these processes in a way that works really well for me. But it also gets you into where you start to need a master's degree in the cosmere to figure it all out, which is why to make it easier, we have Hoid just spell it out for people. It is a little clunky; I prefer the clunkiness to the previous version where you needed a master's degree in the cosmere to understand even what was going on. Shardcast Interview (July 30, 2023) Spoiler Wetlander When Shallan does Lightweaving, is that a combination of Illumination and Transformation, or is Lightweaving just of Illumination? Brandon Sanderson Lightweaving is just of Illumination. Lightweaving is a long-established power in the cosmere. Very early books, in fact one of the very first stories I ever wrote, Lightweaving was the magic. (That story is unpublished, written long ago - long before Liar of Partinel) And so, this stems from my own personal affection for illusion and my feeling that it had not been used as well as I wanted it to be used in fantasy fiction. So I consider it only Illumination truly in The Stormlight Archive. Firefight Seattle UBooks signing (Jan. 6, 2015) Spoiler Questioner Wayne's ability to heal himself, obviously doesn't mimic his natural ability because he can regrow fingers. So if he lost a limb, could he regrow the--just heal it roughly until he stored up enough Health and then regrow the limb at a later time? Does it have to be an instantaneous-- Brandon Sanderson No, he could totally get that back. Questioner And if say somebody was born with an extra finger, could they cut that off, heal that up and have a whole fingers-worth of Health saved? Brandon Sanderson It depends on how they view themselves. Healing in the cosmere is based on replacing-- returning you to the state you view as your natural state... Almost every cosmere magic is going to work that way, unless-- There’s certain ones that-- Yeah almost everyone is going to work that way. Shadows of Self London UK signing (Oct. 19, 2015) Spoiler Questioner Is there any way it's possible that somebody could have gotten to the Cognitive Realm on Scadrial without the Well of Ascension? Brandon Sanderson Yes. Questioner And can we know how? Brandon Sanderson Well, how many Shardpools would Scadrial have? Questioner Two, so the Pits of Hathsin would be so? That's what I theorized. Brandon Sanderson Yes. So you've adopted the term "Shardpool". That was never really my term, but I've started using it. What happens with a perpendicularity is large concentrations of Investiture, particularly purely attuned to one of the Shards, will create an access point. You've seen another one in-- Questioner Yeah, yeah I know these. Brandon Sanderson You know which one I'm referencing? Questioner Yes. Brandon Sanderson That you didn't see a Pool from? Questioner Oh wait-- Brandon Sanderson Okay, he knows, so… We'll move on. *general outcry* Okay, fine. Umm, at the end of Words of Radiance. Argent There has to be one there because Jasnah has to leave somehow, right? Brandon Sanderson Yes, but Honor's Perpendicularity moves. Questioner Woah...so...Highstorm? Brandon Sanderson *makes non-committal noises* Questioner 2 Kind of related to that, I don't know if this is a RAFO kind of question, but you call them perpendicularities, are we going to see this sort of thing created? Could there be, like-- Brandon Sanderson Yeah, perpendicularities can be created. You'd need a lot of Investiture, right? You'd need a ton of Investiture. But, basically what Jasnah does is create a little mini perpendicularity, right? And slips herself into the Cognitive Realm. Questioner 2 So it's just a question of skill, not a question of-- Brandon Sanderson Yeah. It's hard to pull off, but some of the powers are built to do it. Arcanum Unbounded Chicago signing (Dec. 6, 2016) These three are noted as fundamental "powers", with Healing manifesting in various Invested Arts in the same way each time, Lightweaving being the "Illusion" power that's also manifested in several Invested Arts, and Elsecalling uses the same mechanic as a Perpendicularity. Given the prevalence of artists among Lightweavers, how art is often necessary to Lightweave properly, and Hoid's use of art alongside his own Yolish Lightweaving, it does seem likely that Lightweaving is of Virtuosity. Since gold corresponds with Cultivation, the Surge of Regrowth is of Cultivation, and everyone from Fused to Radiants is healing on Roshar, it does seem likely that Healing is of Cultivation. Healing and Lightweaving definitely follow the Intent of Cultivation and Virtuosity, respectively, but it is unclear what Intent Elsecalling follows. Perhaps we'll find out when we get a full explanation of how you use a Perpendicularity to travel between Realms, since that's a kind of Elsecalling that appears to have no requirements on the user whatsoever. Other possibilities for Invested Laws, such as fabrialcraft, which can work with any being of Investiture: Spoiler Questioner Could someone use a [seon] or skaze to build a fabrial and what would that do? Brandon Sanderson It depends on how you define fabrial. If you define fabrial as trapping a sapient Splinter in a gemstone--I guess they don't all have to be sapient--they can all--flamespren and stuff like that--so if you define it as capturing a spren in a gemstone, could you capture a seon in a gemstone, and I would say, yes. The fabrial--what it will do is going to depend on a whole lot of factors--how you build fabrials even sometimes have to do with... Some of the fabrials don't care as much what the Splinter piece is. Obviously a heating fabrial or something like that does. Other ones, it's not as related. So I would say what the power of the Aon in the seon is, would influence what kind of fabrial you could make from it. Good question, excellent question, I've never been asked it before. DragonCon 2019 (Aug. 29, 2019) and Soulcasting (given that it can be used through a fabrial and that such use can produce a Savant). Awakening is a big question, though. These WoBs: Spoiler Ilkhan2016 Breath and Stormlight are both forms of Investiture. AFAIK you can power any of the magic systems from any form of Investiture. Zahel is on Roshar, I believe, primarily due to how easy Investiture (Stormlight) is to come across. AFAIK the form of Investiture doesn't change anything about the abilities. For example, Szeth was sucked out of Stormlight when he drew Nightblood; and Azure used Stormlight to Awaken in Shadesmar. /u/mistborn is that right? Brandon Sanderson A lot of this depends on the Investiture and the magic in question. Azure was legit using Breaths, for example--ones she'd brought with her. But Szeth was able to feed Stormlight to Nightblood, much as Vasher uses Stormlight to keep himself alive. To Awaken with Stormlight, the easiest thing to do would be to first change Stormlight into Breaths--something that Azure doesn't know how to do. (Admittedly, Hoid doesn't either, so it's not like it's a simple thing to achieve.) You could also theoretically use some magical (or mechanical) means to power your Awakening with a different form of Investiture. Extesian This is very interesting. Is it possible then in the Cosmere for the 'intent' (spin or however described) of Investiture to be changed? And I mean within reasonable limits (not the powers of six shards or any of that). Can a Shard effectively grow in power in a place (e.g. toward an avatar) through another Shard's Investiture being changed (not just corrupted)? Or is it just making one type ('intent' - you should canonize a word for this :D) of Investiture mimic the properties of another? Brandon Sanderson Most of the ways of accomplishing what you're talking about would involve either 1) fooling/overwriting your spiritual makeup somehow. (This is what Hemalurgy does, for example.) 2) Refining the power somehow into a more pure form. But there are a lot of variables. The way magic from Nalthis works, for example, the system is just looking for any available Investiture to power itself--and so basically anything will do, regardless of the source. This includes consuming your own soul, in some cases... You'll see terminology coming along eventually that facilitates talking about all of this. I'm not yet decided on some of it. Celestial_Blu3 How many Breaths does [Azure] have by her final appearance in OB? Brandon Sanderson That's a RAFO, I'm afraid. General Reddit 2019 (April 25, 2019) Spoiler Moogle If you used Stormlight to Awaken, would you drain color or create frost? Brandon Sanderson You'll have to see if this happens in the future! (Note that mixing the investitures is usually not easy to do.) Goodreads: Ask the Author Q&A (Aug. 13, 2014) Spoiler Questioner So assuming you have mentioned that it is technically possible to be able to use one magic system on another planet from a different one... Brandon Sanderson Yes. Questioner Is it possible to fuel that... Like, say could you fuel Awakening using Stormlight, or do you have to bring Breaths? Brandon Sanderson Yes, you could! Questioner Okay. Brandon Sanderson Excellent question. Now it's-- there are tricks to making it happen on each world. Some are easier than others, but yes you can. Questioner So could that allow a loophole to maybe... convert from one form of power to another? Or like from Stormlight to Breath? Brandon Sanderson Yes. In fact, that's part of why Vasher-- Questioner Vasher. I wondered that. Brandon Sanderson --is on Roshar, is because it's a lot easier to get Stormlight than Breath. Calamity release party (Feb. 16, 2016) Spoiler Argent Staying with Yumi, since we're asking the big questions here. I want to talk about the big machine, the father machine. Brandon Sanderson Yes. Argent There are some really interesting what feel like intentional parallels between it and Nightblood. Brandon Sanderson Yes. Argent There's smoke involved, there's eating of souls, there's a whole bunch of things. So what I do want to ask is: one, was the father machine Awakened using Breaths, using Nalthian Awakening? Or are you using Awakening as Lightweaving or Bondsmithing which is an overarching system in the Cosmere? Brandon Sanderson It's the second. This wouldn't exist in the pre-space-age as much; by space age there's a certain terminology that is going between... basically it's starting with the arcanists and moving to the general population. What certain themes in the Cosmere magics mean. And so when Hoid says "this is an Awakened machine" his audience understands what that means. It does not necessarily mean Breaths Awaken, but Breaths are one of the main ways that people see things be Awakened. You should be noticing those parallels, but that's a term that in the Cosmere is becoming genericized to mean un-living object being given some measure of sentience and even sapience by application of Investiture, Commands, and these sorts of things. By this point they've all interacted with various Awakened machines of sorts in the future Cosmere. They know what this means. They've talked to an Awakened computer. Argent Interesting! Very interesting! That's what I was hoping you would answer. Because Awakening is such a cool term for Awakening an object, right! One notable difference between the father machine and Nightblood other than them using different magic systems to be Awakened is that the Machine was able to somehow draw people's souls at a distance, which seems EXTREMELY broken to me. Brandon Sanderson Yeah. I had to let... This is going to be a pretty special circumstance for this book. But yes. It is pretty broken. You wouldn't want this to be... this could be very dangerous in the wrong hands. Don't expect this to be very commonly used in the Cosmere. Argent Was that a side effect of the magic system that was used to Awaken the machine, or was there something else going on? Brandon Sanderson This is a side effect of what Virtuosity did and the bit of Virtuosity in all the people allowing the Machine to have enough of a plausible Connection to them to draw upon them. Argent Ok. Interesting. I will think about this while I pass the ball back to Matt. Brandon Sanderson Yeah. This is me pushing just a little bit hard on the boundaries of what is possible. It is possible, but it it is pushing further than I normally would on the bounds of what that can do. Shardcast Interview (July 30, 2023) do seem to imply that Awakening can be done with anything, and with no Connection to Endowment, though her Investiture is best for it. We do already know that any Investiture can fuel any Invested Art, such as Ruin fueling Allomancy, but in that kind of case, there is still the Connection to Preservation (or the primary Shard in question), which is a marked difference. I personally believe that Awakening is an Invested Law, since Endowment does have some other magic which does seem to be more specific to her and her Investiture: Spoiler Questioner Is there any other magic types on the Warbreaker world? Brandon Sanderson There are different manipulations and manifestations of Breath. Questioner Okay. Brandon Sanderson They are gonna be much closer than, like, the Selish magic systems and things like that. Questioner Okay. Brandon Sanderson So, the deviation is much smaller, but it does manifest in slightly different ways-- Kind of a thing. TheHunter Have we seen any? Brandon Sanderson Ahh! RAFO! Ad Astra 2017 (May 5, 2017) Spoiler ccstat Vasher uses Awakening in a very interesting way, off-stage, to modify the memories of the girl he rescues. Can Hemalurgy do the same thing if used carefully? Brandon Sanderson *long pause* No, I don't really think that it can. Nobody has asked that before, but just looking at the way the magics work, I don't think that is something that Hemalurgy is capable of doing. Firefight Atlanta signing (Jan. 24, 2015) Spoiler vandar10 Could someone with enough Breaths use part of them to heal himself without the help of a Returned?? Could the God King have healed himself without Lightsong with enough knowledge? Brandon Sanderson The nature of the Warbreaker magic is tied to the shard of Endowment, which is about giving. There are, therefore, things you cannot do for yourself. RobotAztec For healing can Big Breaths heal only one person at a time or can you heal a bunch of people at once?(as long as they are not yourself)? Brandon Sanderson Legends say you can heal many. /r/books AMA 2015 (June 8, 2015) Moreover, anyone with Breath can Awaken, and Breath is stolen with Nicrosil, not one of the power-stealing metals. Spoiler Pagerunner The Hemalurgy table, you wrote down "atium steals any power, lerasium is all abilities, nicrosil is Investiture"; what's the difference between those three? Hemalurgic atium, lerasium, and nicrosil. What's powers, abilities, and Investiture? Brandon Sanderson People are Invested in ways that do not give them active powers. So for instance, everyone on Nalthis is Invested. Everyone in the cosmere is, really. You want to steal their Investiture, but they don't have a power. You're still ripping off a piece of their soul. So there is a distinction between the actual Investiture that's in a human being and a specific power that they have. So that distinction is pretty easy. You can also, with Hemalurgy, steal specific things. You can steal just general Investiture. You can steal, if you want--this is where the kandra Blessings come from. You can instead steal specific things that are not like stealing Allomancy. Stealing, for instance, someone's mental acuity. Pagerunner So abilities is like the half that's all the strength, speed, all that kind of stuff? Those are abilities, versus the Metallic Arts are all powers? Brandon Sanderson Yes. Pagerunner Then Investiture, is that offworld magics? Brandon Sanderson No, no, it's the raw power. Pagerunner Nicrosil is their soul? Brandon Sanderson Yes. A piece of their soul, essentially. Pagerunner So how would you go about stealing an offworld power? Brandon Sanderson It's going to depend. A Breath, you would steal with nicrosil. It's general Investiture, is what you would probably going call that. You could forcibly remove someone's Breath from them. The ability to be a Sand Master you would steal with the power ability. JordanCon 2021 (July 16, 2021) I also suppose that the nature of what having a lot of Breath does to a person could also be seen to be an Invested Art, even if it might be an extension of her Arcane Law. And we know too little about using Connection to learn a planet's language and how so many worldhoppers become immortal (or at least age very, very slowly). So now, my chart: SPIRITUAL Pushing Pulling  Pushing Pulling COGNITIVE Internal Honor Things obeying the laws of physics Connection Bonding Autonomy ? Identity ? Mercy ? ? ? Odium ? Investiture causing emotion ? Internal External Endowment ? Objects and people being able to be Invested Awakening (using Investiture to give a kind of sentience to an inanimate object) Ambition ? Fortune ? Devotion ? Investiture responding to emotions and intents ? Dominion ? Investiture being able to be "keyed" to a specific Shard ? External  Internal Invention ? ? ? Cultivation ? Investiture innately healing and bolstering Invested things Healing Valor ? ? ? Virtuosity Something related to light or electricity Investiture types having different colors and flavors Lightweaving Internal External Ruin Entropy Investiture Entropy Hemalurgy Preservation Conservation laws Investiture Conservation ? Prudence ? ? ? Whimsy ? ? ? External TEMPORAL Pushing Pulling Pushing Pulling PHYSICAL  And finally, for Invested Arts. Allomancy is obvious: it's Preservation's. Feruchemy, though, is much less so. In a previous post I detailed reasons why I thought Feruchemy was Ruin's Invested Art, and I'll summarize them here. Feruchemy isn't actually "truly" end-neutral. In fact, there's some decay. Shards can and do influence each others' Invested Arts, such as with Cultivation and Honor with Surgebinding. If Hemalurgy is an Invested Law, and not an Invested Art, then Ruin should have an Invested Art manifesting on Scadrial since magic "just kind of leaks out". Lerasium appears to be able to, just on its own (so without any Invested Art) be burned with an alloy to gain access to an Invested Art. Lerasium with itself (i.e. pure Lerasium) gives Preservation's Invested Art, alloying with a base metal can be burned to gain access to one of the sixteen sub-arts, and alloying with a god metal (and perhaps something else) can give you another Shard's Invested Art. I conjectured that burning Lerasium with a god metal tuned you to the Shard's art, and with a base metal tuned you to a specific sub-art. So if Sand Mastery was, say, Autonomy's Internal Pushing Physical Invested Art, then burning Lerasium with Bavadinium and Pewter would give you Sand Mastery. So what would a Lerasium and Atium alloy give you? It can't give you Hemalurgy, since that requires some kind of external power and not internal Investiture. But it could give you Feruchemy, as we know there is a way. And here's one more: First, Feruchemy is stealable by Hemalurgy, while Hemalurgy doesn't appear to be. Moreover, we know all Invested Arts can be stolen by Hemalurgy, and there is an odd relation between which metals steal Allomancy and which ones steal Feruchemy. Physical powers are stolen by Physical Pushing, Cognitive powers are stolen by Cognitive Pushing, Spiritual powers are stolen by Temporal Pushing, and Temporal powers are stolen by Temporal Pulling. However, for Physical powers, Allomancy is External while Feruchemy is Internal, for Cogntive, Feruchemy is External while Allomancy is Internal, for Spiritual, Feruchemy is External while Allomancy is Internal, and for Temporal, Allomancy is External while Feruchemy is Internal. Physical and Temporal powers correspond to External Dawnshards, while Cognitive and Spiritual correspond to Internal Dawnshards. This aligns with Allomancy, but opposes Feruchemy. If Preservation, and thus Allomancy, is Temporal External Pulling, then something in that classification is very likely to be the reason Allomancy aligns with the Dawnshards' internal-external split in Hemalurgy while Feruchemy doesn't. The most sensical, in my opinion, is a push-pull pair: pulling Invested Arts stay in the same internal-external space, while pushing ones go to the other one. So Hemalurgic Steel doesn't steal Physical Allomantic powers, it steals all Physical Pulling powers. And so, I think there's a very strong case for Feruchemy being Ruin's Invested Art.  Some Invested Arts are pretty easy to place as a whole: Surgebinding is of Honor (with Cultivation's influence), Voidbinding is of Odium, and Old Magic is of Cultivation. Selish magics are pretty heavily blended between Devotion and Dominion, so the only way to tell which is which would likely be via Hemalurgic spikes (so if you took eight Elantrians and spiked them with Steel, Pewter, Brass, Bronze, Cadmium, Gold, Bendalloy, and Electrum, you'd be able to tell the Dawnshard correlation of Aon Dor and whether it's of Devotion or Dominion). Same thing for Autonomy's arts. Starmarks, Sand Mastery, the various Aviar abilities, and whatever was going on with Telsin's calculating powers do seem hard to pin down without experimentation, similar to how I bet it would be very difficult for a Feruchemist with no knowledge of Allomancy to figure out which metals were internal and which were external, even if they did know that pulling metals are pure and pushing are alloys. The other magics on Nalthis must belong to Endowment, but they're very vague. If the self-memory-erasing thing is in fact one of Endowment's sixteen sub-arts, it's probably Internal and Cognitive, but is it Pushing or Pulling? Does it correspond to copper or bronze? Copper is associated with memory, but this magic does seem to be doing the opposite of that. Perhaps copper's is how to imprint memories on Breath, while bronze's is how to erase them. I do have a rather wild theory that while most Shards' Invested Arts have to be fairly similar to each other, and are somewhat constrained by what existed before Adonalisium (as per one of the above WoBs), Autonomy and Invention are not at all limited by that. Autonomy's Invested Arts seem to be localized around, or perhaps based on, her Avatars, such as Patji and the Sand Lord. Invention, meanwhile, we know absolutely nothing about. But this WoB Spoiler Yosef Joe If Brandon got a Shard, what Shard would it be and what would he do with it? Brandon Sanderson I don't know, I've been asked something along these lines before. I do fit Autonomy pretty well, but I also feel like I fit Invention pretty well, so probably one of those two. There's definitely some that are not very Brandon. Whimsy: not a very Brandon Shard, let's just point that one out, but I could see myself with bunches of them. What would I do? Pocket universes and... I guess you can't really create those in the... well you can and in the Spiritual Realm, but... Y'know, building funky planets and weird magic systems, that's what I do anyway. You would probably just float through the cosmere and find just planet after planet of screwball magic systems that people are trying to figure out how to use and being like wow, the person who did this, why did they make us use magic based on bagel flavors, can't we have the one where we just fly? YouTube Spoiler Stream 2 (June 3, 2021) does make it seem like both of them are capable of making pretty whacky magic systems if they so choose, given that they're what Brandon would want for himself. So with these assumptions, our final overall chart looks like SPIRITUAL Pushing Pulling  Pushing Pulling COGNITIVE Internal Honor Things obeying the laws of physics Connection Bonding Surgebinding Autonomy ? Identity ? 16 unrelated sub-arts Mercy ? ? ? ? Odium ? Investiture causing emotion ? Voidbinding Internal External Endowment ? Objects and people being able to be Invested Awakening (using Investiture to give a kind of sentience to an inanimate object) Other Nalthis magic? Ambition ? Fortune ? ? Devotion ? Investiture responding to emotions and intents ? Some of Sel's magic Dominion ? Investiture being able to be "keyed" to a specific Shard ? Some of Sel's magic External  Internal Invention ? ? ? 16 unrelated sub-arts? Cultivation ? Investiture innately healing and bolstering Invested things Healing Old Magic Valor ? ? ? ? Virtuosity Something related to light or electricity Investiture types having different colors and flavors Lightweaving ? Internal External Ruin Entropy Investiture Entropy Hemalurgy Feruchemy Preservation Conservation laws Investiture Conservation ? Allomancy Prudence ? ? ? ? Whimsy ? ? ? ? External TEMPORAL Pushing Pulling Pushing Pulling PHYSICAL  And, finally, let's move on to the subarts. Allomancy and Feruchemy are easy: each of the 16 subarts gives you access to the Allomantic or Feruchemical properties of one base metal and all its god metal alloys. Autonomy's two explored arts, Sand Mastery and Aviar, are the only ones we can properly speculate on for her, though perhaps we can associate Telsin's mental speed with Zinc and thus call it External Pulling Cognitive. Sand Mastery seems External and Physical, but the push-pull is unclear. Aviar seem to be able to somewhat mimic other powers in the Cosmere, but appear to be "built to be Cognitive" Spoiler PrinceDusty You've talked about some of the correlation between Aviar abilities and Allomantic abilities. Are there any Aviar abilities that are not related to Allomancy, or what are some other abilities that we might see? Brandon Sanderson I'll RAFO that, mostly because I want to be free to pick and choose from my list as I canonize them. A lot of Aviar abilities are Cognitive type stuff, just from the way I built them so I can separate the magics. The whole Seeker/coppercloud thing, a lot of Aviar abilities are going to be riffs on that, or they're going to be riffs on glimpsing the Spiritual a little bit. And you see a lot of that in Allomancy. There are abilities that they have that you won't see in Allomancy. The trick is Allomany is so broad. I built the main magic systems to be able to get a little bit of everything. You see the same thing in Stormlight. So seeing Aviar abilities that you haven't seen some version of it in Mistborn or Stormlight, it's going to be... Mistborn and Stormlight touch on all different parts of the magic system on purpose. But I think you will eventually see some that don't. But they're all going to work on the Cosmere magic, so you can say they're all related. PrinceDusty Where might we see them? Brandon Sanderson Aviar are known in the Cosmere but are very, very rare. But as you move forward in the future, perhaps you'll see them more often. Legion Release Party (Sept. 19, 2018) Spoiler Questioner Sak, Dusk's non-native Aviar. That ability is very, very similar to Allomantic electrum. Brandon Sanderson It is! Questioner And his other Aviar is very, very similar to Allomantic copper. Brandon Sanderson It is. Questioner Is there a connection between those two, deeper? Or is it-- Brandon Sanderson will RAFO that. Let's just say it is an intentional reference, but I'm not going to say whether it's a direct connection to Scadrial magic systems or more that fundamental rules of magics can reproduce one another. We have seen multiple instances of Lightweaving, so-- It's one of those two... That at least narrows it down for you. Arcanum Unbounded Chicago signing (Dec. 6, 2016) so I'd put the whole Aviar thing as definitely Cognitive.  With Sel, Forgery is most likely External and Spiritual, given how it affect the spiritual aspects of things, and it's possible Bloodsealing is a push-pull pair with Forgery given the similarities. If that's true, then given Chromium's Hemalurgic and Feruchemical properties, it seems likely that Forgery would correspond to it and thus be External Pulling Spiritual. Then, ChayShan and Dakhor might both be Physical, and AonDor might be Internal and Spiritual. Finally, with Roshar, we only know enough to talk about Surgebinding, but its ten surges do have some easily classified elements. First, we definitely know that Honor put limitations on Surgebinding, which are now relaxing somewhat after his death, which does mean that while Cultivation has affected nine of the ten, they remain firmly "his" Invested Art. More supporting evidence for this is how Odium can directly grant the nine that Cultivation has touched, perhaps suggesting that if a Shard allows some parts of their Invested Art to become influenced by another Shard, those parts become more susceptible to being granted by other Shards. Adhesion is the "truest Surge of Honor", after all, and so is probably Internal Pushing Enhancement, and similarly Regrowth is the "truest Surge of Cultivation", and so is probably Internal Pulling Temporal. If we make the bold assumption that Ruin and Virtuosity correspond to Division and Illumination, respectively, we get: Adhesion: Internal Pushing Spiritual (Internal Pushing) Gravitation: Division: External Pushing Temporal (External Pushing) Abrasion: Progression: Internal Pulling Temporal (External Pushing) Illumination: Internal Pulling Physical (External Pulling) Transformation: Transportation: Cohesion: Tension: This doesn't look half bad, actually -- Adhesion and Division are two internal-external flips away, Division and Progression are an internal-external and push-pull flip away, and Progression and Illumination are a single push-pull flip away. It actually lines up. So if this is indeed the pattern, then Gravitation would be either Internal Pushing Temporal or External Pushing Spiritual, and Abrasion would be External Pulling Temporal or Internal Pushing Temporal. So Gravitation corresponds to Electrum/Invention or Nicrosil/Endowment and Abrasion would correspond to Chromium/Ambition or Electrum/Invention. Before we tackle that, let's also check Illumination to Adhesion: that's Internal Pulling (External Pulling) to Internal Pushing (Internal Pushing) in five flips. So we have three flips in positions 2, 3, and 4, and then one double flip that happens somewhere. Is this even possible, avoiding repetition? Turns out not only is it possible to get from Illumination to Adhesion, but if we have Gravitation be Internal Pushing Temporal/Nicrosil/Endowment and Abrasion be Internal Pushing Temporal/Electrum/Invention, we can get back using the exact same flips in the exact same order. If we flip positions 1, 3, 1, 2, 4, then 1, 3, 1, 2, 4, again, we get Adhesion: Internal Pushing Spiritual (Internal Pushing), Honor Gravitation: External Pushing Spiritual (Internal Pushing), Endowment Division: External Pushing Temporal (External Pushing), Ruin Abrasion: Internal Pushing Temporal (External Pushing), Invention Progression: Internal Pulling Temporal (External Pushing), Cultivation Illumination: Internal Pulling Physical (External Pulling), Virtuosity Transformation: External Pulling Physical (External Pulling), Whimsy Transportation: External Pulling Cognitive (Internal Pulling), Dominion Cohesion: Internal Pulling Cognitive (Internal Pulling), Odium Tension: Internal Pushing Cognitive (Internal Pulling), Mercy There's something quite nice about finding a somewhat natural symmetry in the magic system for the Stormlight Archives, given how symmetrical they like everything to be. (Note that there can't be a palindrome as a pattern, as two adjacent flips in the same position would cause a repetition.) There are even some decent correspondences: Transformation-Whimsy and Transportation-Dominion seem the nicest, though, as I find it hard to see what Odium or Copper has to do with Cohesion.   And that's basically every magic system in the Cosmere that we know enough about!  TL;DR  I believe everything Adonalsium/Investiture-related in the Cosmere can be categorized by the push-pull and internal-external dichotomies. I've proposed a system for this from the Dawnshards on down. For example, I propose that Allomantic Steel is the External Pushing Physical (Internal Pulling) Invested Sub-Art of the External Pulling Temporal (External Pushing) Shard. I also propose that Shards have a Natural Law, the effect they have upon mundane physics in the Cosmere, an Arcane Law, the effect they have upon Investiture-based physics in the Cosmere, an Invested Law, a magic system that is a direct result of their power's existence and is more-or-less unrelated to them specifically, and an Invested Art, a magic system that they somewhat control and other Shards may influence. A Natural Law is something like gravity, entropy, or the "strong axial force". An Arcane Law is something like the Laws of Investiture, Identity, or Connection. An Invested Law is something like Hemalurgy or Bonding. An Invested Art is something like Allomancy, Surgebinding, or AonDor. Each Invested Art has 16 sub-arts. The best way to distinguish between an Invested Law and an Invested Art is to ask the following three questions: Can I steal it with Hemalurgic Steel, Pewter, Brass, Bronze, Cadmium, Bendalloy, Gold, Electrum, or pure Atium? Does it generally require that I be Invested with an Investiture keyed to a specific Shard? Can the power be obtained through a non-invested person burning a Lerasium alloy? If the answer is "yes" to all, it's an Invested Art or Sub-Art. If it's "no" to all, it's an Invested Law.  The theory proposes some of the following potentially observable facts: The Dawnshards are Exist (or something corresponding to the Physical Realm), Feel (or something corresponding to the Cognitive Realm), Connect (or something corresponding to the Spiritual Realm), and Change. Mercy is against Feeling and is probably somewhat unstable. Prudence/Wisdom/Survival (whatever its real name is) is against Existing and is probably very unstable. Valor's Intent is "practicality" or "functionality". Feruchemy is technically Ruin's Invested Art. Lerasium alloyed with a God Metal grants the corresponding Shard's Invested Art. Adding a base metal grants the corresponding sub-art. Voidbinding and Surgebinding each have six unused powers which are currently only obtainable through Lerasium alloys. Autonomy and possibly also Invention each have the potential to create sixteen unrelated Invested Sub-Arts. Sand Mastery can most likely be stolen by a steel Hemalurgic spike. Bloodsealing and Forgery can most likely be stolen by a Bendalloy or Electrum Hemalurgic spike. And this is the full suggested chart. SPIRITUAL Pushing Pulling  Pushing Pulling COGNITIVE Internal Honor Things obeying the laws of physics Connection Bonding Surgebinding Autonomy ? Identity ? 16 unrelated sub-arts Mercy ? ? ? ? Odium ? Investiture causing emotion ? Voidbinding Internal External Endowment ? Objects and people being able to be Invested Awakening (using Investiture to give a kind of sentience to an inanimate object) Other Nalthis magic? Ambition ? Fortune ? ? Devotion ? Investiture responding to emotions and intents ? Some of Sel's magic Dominion ? Investiture being able to be "keyed" to a specific Shard ? Some of Sel's magic External  Internal Invention ? ? ? 16 unrelated sub-arts? Cultivation ? Investiture innately healing and bolstering Invested things Healing Old Magic Valor ? ? ? ? Virtuosity Something related to light or electricity Investiture types having different colors and flavors Lightweaving ? Internal External Ruin Entropy Investiture Entropy Hemalurgy Feruchemy Preservation Conservation laws Investiture Conservation ? Allomancy Prudence ? ? ? ? Whimsy ? ? ? ? External TEMPORAL Pushing Pulling Pushing Pulling PHYSICAL  And the Surge list: Adhesion: Internal Pushing Spiritual Gravitation: External Pushing Spiritual Division: External Pushing Temporal Abrasion: Internal Pushing Temporal Progression: Internal Pulling Temporal Illumination: Internal Pulling Physical Transformation: External Pulling Physical Transportation: External Pulling Cognitive Cohesion: Internal Pulling Cognitive Tension: Internal Pushing Cognitive  As before, this is all speculation oftentimes based on tricky WoB phrasing or outright guesswork. Particularly with the Surges, even if they do have a very nice symmetry. Take everything here with as much salt (or copper) as you please. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonk Posted January 18 Report Share Posted January 18 I made an account after years of lurking to thank you for writing the most insane, detailed fantheory I have seen outside of the ASOIAF fanbase. This is like preston jacobs tier. Could not be true because no author is so mentally inflamed to think of it. I am so relieved to see people outside of my favorite authors forums saying things like this. I thought winds of winter never coming was what drove us to this, but I see here you doing exact same thing. Â Unless you are also a ASOIAF theory writer saying things like roose bolton is a skinwearing immortal vampire or bran eating jojen. Then stay in ASOIAF please. Â JKJK 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MistbornMathematician Posted January 18 Author Report Share Posted January 18 Not sure what exactly to make of this, but for the record I do fully support the Jojen paste theory. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gonk Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 On 1/18/2024 at 12:53 AM, MistbornMathematician said: Not sure what exactly to make of this, but for the record I do fully support the Jojen paste theory. You are delusional. Stories are stories. George RR Martin wanted Bran to eat. So he had food. That is it. No more. No deeper. Brandon Sanderson wanted push and pull in alomancy. No more. No deeper. What would have MADE the paste from Jojen? Ancient Westeros meat grinder? And same with you here. What IS a push shard??? Makes NO sense. You say push and pull is for everything. Why? Who says this? Nobody. Things do not work like that anywhere. Insane. Like conspiracy theories of your 911. Insane. In Europe this would be illegal. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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