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Everything posted by Comatose
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Wasn’t Obliteration also involved in Oregon’s destruction? I remember we started that sharing thread just in case. I know Mary kind of became Night’s Sorrow at the end (or a Night’s Sorrow), at least in our continuity, so she was involved.
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If we feel things are kind of consolidating, how would people feel if I put together a rough draft of a premise or prologue based on our discussions and then post for fine tuning? I’m eager to get going but don’t want to be presumptuous or discourage further collaborative world building.
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Welcome here Bitbio!! Not a bad idea to start with one or two and seeing how it goes before getting carried away.
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I agree with starting things off with an assassination would be fun but would prefer no weather epic. With Snowfall in California, the weather epic in Alaska, and Rainmaker, we have a lot of major weather epics already. I’d also prefer if this epic hadn’t assumed complete control to explain the continued existence of the vanilla government but I’m down with them being more powerful.
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Altermind was mental/hallucination based illusions, so you are correct that writing an optical illusionist would be a good start.
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This is the WOB I was going off of (which was basically a jump on for information for this RP). I guess I was getting caught up on the "unique and useful" bit, and that "common powers" were the ones we know from media. I guess though you are correct that there is a distinction between "unique powers" and generic powers with a twist. (sorry for editing out your part of the question Voidus - it just wasn't on point for these purposes, but it was very good )
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I'm totally fine with some epics having set borders, I just don't think the whole city should be divided out like that. Lethe it is then I like it! I think that gifting does work the same way every time? Didn't we get some confirmation of that in Calamity? Here's a WOB that kind of goes along those lines: So gifting is a distinct power, and when you have it, you can gift any of your other powers. I also remember after Calamity came out I had to retcon Euphoria for sure, and maybe some others because of what we learned about gifting. If we look at intangibility, for example, in Steelheart David says all intangibles can fly - in that way at least, the power works more or less the same for all intangibles. I also think we need to remember there aren't that many unique powers in the Reckonersverse, so chances are much higher that someone would have generic gifting than a unique alternative. I do really like the idea of a gifter leading a faction (kind of like how Conflux was perceived, rather than his reality). I also love illusion epics :). We've had a significant one in Altermind already, so it would be important to change things up to distinguish, but illusions are fun.
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I agree with this. I think there should be significant no man’s land.
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I think it's important to remember we don't need to RP every faction - there can be some NPC ones up to their own stuff in the background that doesn't have a huge impact on the main plot. I do agree that the Reckoners are probably more a small team than an actual faction, since they wouldn't have 'followers' really. Yeah I think that's good. This way he's more distinguishable from Cornucopia and that other plant epic in the Dalles whose name I am momentarily blanking on.
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I like that breakdown Young Pyromancer! I was thinking the Vanillas could control a sector (maybe Sherwood Park if its not taken, so they can be kind of 'ruling in exile' or one of the suburbs). I think it would be good to start placing some of these factions as well. Depending on his range, Epoch likely needs to be somewhat central. If the players in charge want to start picking spots on the map. Orbit wanted the WDM, right? And Phyto needed somewhere on the edge (or perhaps a large park) to use his powers to grow food (lots of agricultural land around Edmonton, so that wouldn't be difficult). Maybe the vanilla faction and Phyto have an agreement/treaty whereby some of them work on his farms to supplement the vanillas that Phyto commands? Then one thing not on the list is, if we are going with it, the territory of a recently deceased high epic? @Edgedancer had mentioned that concept initially I think and I still like it. Maybe, emboldened by Steelheart's death, the Reckoners brought this High Epic (who perhaps led a faction and was in the process of expanding), bringing one faction into chaos, and giving the others an opportunity to expand? Most of my characters will be arriving incognito I think, but I would like to add Taylor Swift to the list (I know I haven't added her to the main sheet yet, but I will). I'm thinking that sometime before the Dalles was destroyed, Reader discovered her weakness, and the Reckoners got their hands on it somehow, forcing her to go more underground. A Reckoners squad has since been hunting her, and she's been fleeing, while waiting for an opportunity to get the jump on them and kill them (maybe she was headed to Edmonton because she heard about the Dream Storm, and thought to use it as a back up to get rid of the threat? Building on that, and my idea for Taylor Swift's intro, I really like the idea of a squad keeping careful track of the Oregonians and attempting to prevent the Oregon situation from happening again. EDIT: Just saw Phyto's location is on his epic profile. I'll look more closely at some of those since I may have missed actual locations.
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Also if we have a vanilla faction that is in charge of its area, it would be less of a rebellion and more of a campaign against other factions. I kind of like the idea of the vanilla faction and the Reckoners being cross purposes, just to make things interesting. Maybe the vanillas are seeking diplomacy with their epic neighbours and the Reckoners are causing trouble? For PI targeting, the Reckoners always targeting epics with PIs is what helped David guess they were tracking Fortuity. Since I want to being Taylor Swift in, what if the Reckoners are tracking/hunting her? We could also have the Reckoners responding to steelhearts death and becoming more bold, possibly leading to friction with the Alberta Government.
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The Reckoners could be NPCs, and anyone who wants to play one could do so and check in. They’d likely be aligned with the vanillas but would probably keep to the shadows. I’m thinking of bringing my unused Lorist Ian Buhler over so maybe he can connect with them.
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So, I think things are coming together well for Edmonton, but one thing I think would be good to have is an inciting event to kick things off - something big that all of our characters can react to and help drive the plot so it's not just a bunch of random epics bumping into each other. If possible, I also thought it might be cool to tie this in with Steelheart's death, but for the life of me I can't think of any good suggestions. Does anyone else have any? Also, I think I have a concept together for the memory epic (thanks to everyone who helped with suggestions). Let me know what you think. I ended up making her a minor epic with a supposed single power who is just unaware of her second ability. Still working on name, weakness, and history, so let me know if you have suggestions. EDIT: A thought, should we include a Reckoners Cell in Edmonton, and if so, what should their goals and modus operandi be?
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I definitely agree we should have a GM in place before starting. I am not sure about my time commitments right now, but I would maybe consider co-GMing if someone else is interested (maybe @Voidus or @Edgedancer since you have both GMed before), just so that things can keep progressing if I get too busy at work. Portland was always my favourite city. The writing and characters are excellent. Hopefully we can recreate some of that magic in Edmonton. I'm down for character death, with the consent of the writer. It will probably depend on how focused the RP becomes on interpersonal vs physical confrontation and conflict. I definitely think you should be able to have characters in as many factions as you want. I think we are all capable of separating personal knowledge from character knowledge, and switching between viewpoints. Check back in when you are less busy then! If this is anything like the previous RP, another option could be to start out with a side character who won't hold people up, and then get in to the main plot when you have more time.
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Hey all. I just went through and merged a few double posts from a couple different people. Remember to edit your post if there haven't been any replies instead of posting repeatedly. For quoting, the little "+" icon should allow you to quote multiple posts at once. Thanks, and feel free to PM with any questions.
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I added an "Edmonton" Layer for our Reckoners Map, and added in a couple of the locations we've been discussing. As we finalize things, we can start customizing icons and specifying where the different Epics are holed up. I also added in some direction information for our immigrants. It looks like Corvallis, Salem, and Portland would all take the same route, whereas there would be a different quickest route for anyone coming directly from Astoria.
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Found our old timeline, for reference. It was in the wiki. what-happened-in-oregon-rp.wikia.com/wiki/Timeline Looks like we are looking at about a two year time skip or so?
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Yeah that was one thing I had to edit for some of my characters. If you can gift you can gift everything and before I knew it was a distinct power I had epics with weird restrictions and had to change. She could still choose what to gift though so she doesn’t need to gift the punishment power
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Sounds cool! One thing I would mention, for the tertiary power, it sounds like gifting, which is a distinct power which works the same way epic to epic. It would still allow Judgement to gift her ability to make a certain number of promises to an agent, just like you have set out there, but she would likely be considered a gifter.
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Yay Neverthere!!!! I thought Epoch would be more central than Sherwood Park (I kind of still like the idea of the government being out there). And a new landmark/relic of an epic battle would be super cool! For memory epic (or anyone else), I still like constellations idea, but I thought of another cool city wide effect due to an epic based one Voidus’s suggestions: intangible slightly luminescent rain that falls up from the ground into the sky.
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Beautiful Destroyer: Depictions of Violence in the Cosmere
Comatose posted a article in Columns and Features
“Beautiful destroyer. Blunt and effective. Of all those I've claimed over this brief thousand years, you are the only one I think just might be able to understand me.” -Ruin, Hero of Ages, ch. 57. [CONTAINS OATHBRINGER SPOILERS] I once listened to a speaker presenting on the story-telling potential of role-playing MMOs. The thesis was that, through the mechanics of the open-ended game play, the players became story-tellers, crafting unique collaborative narratives through the actions and interactions of their created characters. The presentation was very well done, and I was pleased to see alternative forms of story-telling (focusing on fantasy!) getting some of the spotlight. However, I wondered about the boundaries of this story-telling model: which stories were allowed in, and which were barred at the door? “What about stories of non-violence?” I asked. While there were options available for those stories, blacksmiths or farmers, the presenter admitted that it would be difficult to advance in the games without violence of some kind, and the story-telling potential would thus be limited. Violence is often a staple of fantasy. One of the escapist attractions of the genre is that feeling of power you feel when witnessing a character you identify with have a moment of awesome. While some of us may be martial arts experts or hardened soldiers in our daily lives, many of us are not, and reading about epic heroes laying waste to their evil enemies can be an empowering and gratifying experience for those of us with frustrations we are unable to take a fist or bolt of magical energy to. There's a reason The Emperor's Soul is about Shai, and not the simple life version of her that would be created if she used her final Essence Mark. One of the reasons we read fantasy is to see extraordinary characters doing amazing things. It is important, however, to question the violence we see when reading. Is it realistic? What do these moments of awesome cost the characters? In my opinion, the cosmere books do a good job of providing diverse moments of awesome, unlike the MMOs from that presentation: Raoden reviving Elantris in a burst of light by scraping the chasm line into the ground, Sazed ascending and recreating the world with the knowledge in his metalminds, or Shallan discovering the secret of the Oathgates through scholarship and ingenuity. On the other hand, many moments of awesome in the cosmere are moments of great violence. So where does this leave us as readers? Are we, like Re-Shephir, creatures “of instinct and curiosity, drawn to violence and pain like scavengers to the scent of blood” (Oathbringer, ch. 30)? I don't think so, and furthermore, I don't think Brandon wants his readers to be mere spectators of blood sport. In particular, Brandon's characterization of Vin and Dalinar, arguably the two most violent figures in the cosmere, displays a sensitive and nuanced approach to depicting violence, thrilling readers with incredible fights scenes, without glorifying killing and death. Awe and disgust may be opposites, but they are brought together in Vin and Dalinar: the beautiful destroyers. The Mistborn Trilogy is known for its gorgeous fight scenes. Mistborn possess a grace that few cosmere killers can match. When Vin sets out with Zane to attack Cett, she doesn’t just go to make a dent in Cett’s forces. The killing is secondary, while Vin’s primary purpose is to awe Cett with her power: While we see men screaming and falling in this scene, Vin captivates the majority of the reader’s attention. She is the “terrible weapon”, a Mistborn at the height of her power. Even without atium, in this scene, Vin demonstrates to Cett’s entire army that none can stand against her. In many ways, this should be a triumphant moment for Vin. After being trapped between two armies, fearful and paralyzed with indecision, in this scene she is unleashed and allowed to stretch her abilities to their full potential. And, after patiently waiting for this moment, it is difficult not to be in awe of her. But at what cost? After decimating Cett’s forces, Vin comes across Cett and his son, one of whom she is convinced is Mistborn. Vin seeks to solve her problems with Cett through violence, but when she finally reaches him, she finds she cannot. Though she commands him to fight her, neither Cett nor his son, Gneorndin, can respond to her challenge. Brandon excites us by setting Vin loose to use her powers, but even the incredible, dazzling violence Vin unleashes is not an answer to her problems. The next morning, when Elend finds Vin, she is consumed with regret, confessing that while her old crew leader, Camon, was brutal and terrible, she likely killed more people in a single night than he had in his entire life. She goes on to say: “My entire life has been death, Elend. Death of my sister, the death of Reen. Crewmembers dead around me, Kelsier falling to the Lord Ruler, then my own spear in the Lord Ruler’s chest. I try to protect, and tell myself that I’m escaping it all. And then…I do something like I did last night” (The Well of Ascension, ch. 44). Following her massacre, Vin struggles to come to terms with being both surviving and causing great violence. This personal conflict is eventually resolved in Hero of Ages, when Vin uses the power of Preservation to destroy herself and Ruin, but along the way Brandon is careful to remind his readers of the human cost associated with his awesome fight scenes, both for the victims, and for the destroyer herself. Brandon continues his discussion of the relationship between beauty and destruction in Oathbringer. Like Vin, violence gives Dalinar a sense of purpose: Dalinar, and the reader along with him, fall under the Nergaoul’’s seductive spell. This moment is one of many where Dalinar is described as being more than a man. Here, he is judgement, sent by the Almighty to test the skill and worthiness of his enemies. While fighting with Blade and Plate might lack some of the otherworldly elegance of Mistborn or Windrunners, Dalinar’s fight scenes in Oathbringer remain captivating, even in their brutality. After hearing about the might and power of the Blackthorn in his prime, the reader is encouraged here to indulge as they enjoy watching Dalinar be awesome (sorry Lift, but you can’t hog it all to yourself). The way Brandon describes Dalinar in these fight scenes resembles how he describes Vin: both come to think of themselves as concepts or roles, rather than as individual people: Vin as Mistborn, and Dalinar as judgement. And yet, even the Blackthorn, who, despite his later redemption is likely the most brutal character in the cosmere, retains enough humanity to recognize the horror of what he is doing: Dalinar’s Shards and incredible fighting skills give him great power to defeat his enemies, but Brandon is quick to point out that there is a cost to getting lost in the glory of battle by emphasizing the destruction Dalinar has caused, and by highlighting that some of Dalinar’s own men also fell to his onslaught. After defeating the enemy general, Kalanor, Dalinar struggles to feel satisfied with his victory: It is this voice which drives Dalinar to continue his killing spree beyond what is necessary to win the battle. He wonders, “Shouldn’t the strongest rule? Why should he sit back so often, listening to men chat instead of war?” (Oathbringer, ch. 26). It is only after the Thrill almost drives Dalinar to kill his brother Gavilar that Dalinar stops and realizes what he has done. Gavilar’s celebration of Dalinar’s great victory is undermined by Dalinar’s feelings of guilt and shame for almost killing his brother. Despite Dalinar’s aptitude for war and fighting, and his oft emphasized disdain for conversation and politics, his great skill and power are not enough to satisfy him. Like Vin, Dalinar’s power and might leave him unfulfilled and unable to solve his problems. When he finally remembers burning the Rift, the voices of Evi and the children he killed haunt him: “Hypocrite, they said. Murderer. Destroyer” (Oathbringer, ch. 100). As he remembers his past, the actions that made Dalinar a fearsome warrior are a source of torment, rather than triumph, for him. Throughout Oathbringer, Dalinar often remarks about how difficult it is to adjust his thinking and unify people with politics and persuasion rather than by brute force, and how ill suited he is to the task of brokering peace. Both Hero of Ages and Oathbringer end with their respective destroyers overcoming inner turmoil to find some measure of self-acceptance. Vin determines that she can destroy to protect and is able to use Preservation in a way Leras never could. In doing so, she overcomes destruction incarnate by defeating Ruin, arguably the greatest destroyer the in the cosmere. Faced with a seemingly unstoppable force in Odium and the Fused, Brandon makes the reader think Dalinar may succumb to his past of destruction and violence and become that which he set out to defeat: Odium’s Champion. Armed with a book and, more importantly, the convictions it has taught him, Dalinar refuses to be a destroyer any longer. While Vin conquers destruction, she does so through continued violence. With Dalinar, Brandon takes his examination of violence further. Despite all of the breath-taking fight scenes in Oathbringer, the most awe-inspiring scene in the novel, and the crux of the epic climax, is the moment Dalinar, surrounded by gloryspren, refuses to give Odium his pain and opens the perpendicularity. In that moment, Daliner bests Odium, not with force, but by taking responsibility for his actions. Similarly, Dalinar overcomes Nergaoul with understanding, rather than a contest of force: While his history of struggle and violence is what allows Dalinar to capture Nergaoul, the capture itself, and the subsequent defeat of Odium’s forces, does not come about through violence on Dalinar’s part. Instead, Dalinar embraces the Thrill, thanking it for what it did for him in the past, and drawing it in close. He convinces it to rest in the gemstone. Like Vin overcoming Ruin, in this scene Dalinar, the destroyer, overcomes a divine force of destruction in a captivating way, but he does it without resorting to violence himself. In both Vin and Dalinar, Brandon sets out heroes who struggle with their self definition in the face of the violence they have committed against others. Brandon juxtaposes the hauntingly beautiful action sequences against the emotional impact those acts of violence have on the human soul, allowing his readers to enjoy the display while still being critical of that enjoyment. In their greatest moments, Brandon shows Vin and Dalinar overcoming violence and destruction, despite their status as destroyers, demonstrating that the ‘moments of awesome’ fantasy is known for do not always need to be violent ones, and that the beauty of destruction comes at a cost. _________ Post Script: As it turns out, Brandon himself has commented on the concept of beautiful but terrible violence in the Well of Ascension Annotations. Unfortunately, I did not find this quote until after I finished the essay above, but it has probably been bouncing around in the back of my head since I originally read it way back when. Enjoy Brandon’s take on the violence in Well of Ascension: Image Credit: "Vin in the Mists" by Xenia de Vries. You can also find her work on Instagram! Used with permission.- 7 comments
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That was me haha. I like constellations! Maybe they have a coloured glow (violet or green or something) and kind of overlay the actual moon and stars.
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Here's a map of Edmonton. Eventually we will need to make a custom one like we made for Oregon, but for now this should help with visualization hopefully. If you go directly to the east of Edmonton, you will see a bedroom community called Sherwood park - I think this would be a great sector for one of our factions. I was thinking, the obvious choice for a vanilla run government would be the legislature building (their old centre of power - Edmonton was the Albertan capital) - but it's also an obvious place for an epic to take over. What if the vanilla government is holed up in Sherwood park instead, sitting back and plotting to 'take over the city'. What if instead of grouping the different parts of the city (And maybe allowing for a "no man's land" down town, we have different populations kind of grouping together? Something we could do is pick landmarks, and think about which epics/factions would use those as a home base, and then look at the area around that and build the territory from there? Like I said, the River Valley is very large and steep, so it works as a good barrier. The West Edmonton Mall (North America's largest shopping mall) would be an interesting fortress. It's got hotels attached, a wave pool waterpark, an indoor amusement park complete with a roller coaster, both of which could probably be transformed into something neat, and a big building with not many windows which could be defensible. The aformentioned legislature building could also be another base, unless it's destroyed. I assume Epoch will want to be central to cover a lot of the city, so this could be a good place for him. The University of Alberta and the attached Hospital could be a base for another group. Maybe an Altermind style coalition of intelligentsia? Or perhaps the opposite, a bunch of drop outs reclaiming the space? We could have like, a "young epics" coalition - essentially a group of hipster 20 somethings with powers to large for their ages or ambitions, who take over Whyte Ave (82 Ave on the Map) in the Strathcona and Garneau neighbourhoods) and don't do much but hang out in formerly trendy spots while harassing passersby This is interesting. I kind of like the idea though, if the time dilation thing is happening, of keeping Epoch as a separate epic, and having another epic creating area wide effects making the city zany. The idea of changing up the effects is interesting though. You could also have the effects change if the character is sleep deprived or sleeping too much? I'm not sure how I feel about mists any more (I really don't want it to be too similar to Mistborn, but maybe it's too late and the idea is stuck). Did anyone have thoughts about light bubbles or ghostly flowers as a manifestation of the sleep power instead? Or have any other ideas?
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I’m curious how these sectors would develop. Most cities (Edmonton included) aren’t split up that cleanly and if we have power destabilized I would think each faction’s turf would need a little of everything. Strictly regimented sectors is something you usually see in dictator city states with strict regulation. You also have to account for things like the core/downtown area having most of the tall structures in the city and the arena, and the huge river valley running through the city. It might be okay for some of the factions to have ‘specialities’ so to speak, based on their locale, but it should probably be a little more complex and messy than five distinct sectors with singular focii. If we do mist for time dilation (totally fine with that) what do people think of still having an epic with a wide spread intermittent memory interference ability? I really am partial to that as a plot point but if others are opposed I’m good to scrap it.
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I was thinking of it kind of as a passive effect than an active use power that only works when they are sleeping or unconscious. It's less about losing control, and more that the power just automatically triggers when the epic loses consciousness. Similar to how Steelheart's steel transfusion power responds involuntarily to his emotions. If the unaware of his abilities thing is too far fetched though, I'm not super attached to the idea (I'm not even that attached to the epic, so if someone else wanted to actually play them, I would be open to that. It could also be interesting is the epic is aware of a secondary active power that she or he uses consciously, but is not aware of the power they use while sleeping. In response to the mist thing, other phenomena I thought about could be that the epic produces balls of light that float around and cause some disorientation or memory loss, or mysterious flowers that bloom all over the city and then vanish when the epic wakes up. Either of those I think could make for a kind of cool visual and would give Edmonton some amount of weirdness factor. EDIT - just spitballing ideas as well, if people have a better idea of how to incorporate some of these concepts I'm open to suggestions. For factions, I am down to worldbuild, but I also think we can add as we go. I also think it's fine if parts of the city are basically factionless - people just go about minding their own business. Right now I could see us having: Epoch's Faction Epic who recently lost control - faction - this one is in the process of dissolving; Maybe a "former city of Edmonton government" faction? A maple led coalition attempting to proceed with life as normal? Factionless - people go about their daily lives, with little to no laws or rules. Wild west basically. That's already a good start in my opinion, and people can always add in some more epics to make it interesting.
