Arceoxys

A minor quibble here: making him a villain does not necessitate making him mindlessly evil. Kelsier has been heroic, and may well be again (or currently) but I think what they're referring to is the WoB that I'm too lazy to find, where BS himself reflected on Kelsier's nature and his ability to be villainous depending on your perspective, and he half explored that with Miles Hundredlives. Although I view Kelsier in a positive light I don't think it would be too far a stretch to see him become a villain, at the very least, to characters off Scadrial, and since we have *heroes* off Scadrial it's merely a matter of perspective. Even then I could see him be willing to go too far and do too much in the name of protecting Scadrial.

Frankly, this sounds more like you're uncomfortable with the idea of dating someone that is ugly to you. Which is fine, but that is clearly not the case for Renarin, who does not find the singer species to be unappealing to look at. It really is quite as simple as that. I personally would also date a singer. This is not even a big leap, considering speculative fiction.

I have a theory about Harmony, and others do as well, that part of the problem for Harmony (which might also become a problem for Retribution) is the Intent behind the thought of it. In MB Era 2, Harmony is never thought of as 1 thing, but 2 things come together. Harmony isn't Harmony, Harmony is Ruin and Preservation, if that makes sense. And we've seen a lot how Intent matters, as well as cognition. If everyone, including the person holding those 2 shards, thinks of them as separate but together, that might affect things. In fact, there's an argument to be made that Sazed shouldnt be holding 2 shards, but 1, formerly 2. Another part of this theory is the idea that since Dawnshards were used to shatter Ado, perhaps they are required to fully merge shards (and thus Sazed can't be holding just 1 because they will always be separate without Dawnshard assistance, though perhaps Intent/Cognition would help this regardless) All this being said, Retribution might fall under similar problems with his 2 shards coming into conflict about how to act regarding situations where each would prefer different actions being taken. As for differences in description, this could also be caused by Intent. For instance, if Dalinar!Honor took Odium, would it be Retribution? Did the pervasiveness of "Divine God's Rage" influence how the coming together of these 2 shards would be? Does the Intent/Cognition of the Vessel matter? Etc.

I believe based on the timeline that Retribution was made concurrently with TLM, not before. Kelsier mentioned that the time will normalize in 70-80 years off-world, and 10 years on-world. BS has said that the next Mistborn trilogy will take place 70-80 years after Wax & Wayne.

I largely enjoyed this book for the most part. I've read a few grievances I also agree with. Largely to do with prose, and the quality of the *writing* itself. (As a quick aside, I am frankly shocked at how many people place RoW at the bottom of the SA books. It is my favourite, and it isn't close) Pros: Kaladin and Szeth. I really enjoyed this section. This felt like a good use of rehashing growth we have seen from Kaladin already, to have it solidify. There wasn't much going on here, but the PoVs were usually short and sweet, so it also never felt like it was dragging. Adolin was also great, though his section did drag on. I expect this was intentional from BS, and I disagree with it. He has mentioned before (when writing Wheel of Time) that he will write those battles, the ones meant to be a slog for the PoV character, that he wants the reader to feel it as well. I did. I do not think that adds to it, merely subtracts. Regardless, I liked this section a lot, but I am also Adolins #1 fan Sigzil. I also enjoyed this. I have not actually read TSM as I did not like the secret projects and stopped reading them before I got here, but I do know the spoilers. It was really cool to get more PoVs from him, get a handle on how thinks and feels, and see how decisive he can be. Only qualm here was this was also where El and Moash were, and they were basically nothing in this book. Cons: Most everything in the Spiritual Realm, frankly. I enjoyed the *lore* of it all. Tanavasts flashbacks, even getting fuller details on the founding of the Heralds, etc. I enjoyed the lore. Everything else felt rehashed, but not in a satisfying way how it did with Kaladins sections. I, for the most part, did not mind Rlain and Renarin, but I also find them to be pretty shallow characters, and this didn't do much to deepen them for me. But I had to keep reading over and over how no one really gets them, except each other. It's nice, and I'm happy to see some real gay stuff on screen, but it was too overly drawn out. Shallan I feel is the inverse of Kaladin, where I enjoyed his hammering home the things he's learned, here I felt it was largely uninteresting. I am very mixed on Shallan as a whole, where I really, really enjoyed her in OB and RoW, but this felt like more of that, but to a less satisfying degree. This might moreso be about how I find the Roshar Ghostbloods deeply uninteresting, and while they were a large part of Shallans stuff in OB and RoW, I found her development there to be doing the heavy lifting. I'll see how I feel about this after a reread. Navani. there really isn't even much to say here. she didn't do much, or experience much, or have many PoV's, which I found pretty disappointing as she came storming into RoW as my favourite PoV in that book. BS does a really good job of letting us sit in her head and how she thinks and I found it deeply satisfying, and we just basically didn't get that in this book. No fault of hers Dalinar... this one might need to stew a little longer, like Shallan. I really enjoy Dalinar, but I also don't think he is that good a person, and it was nice to see him confronted with that (and I don't just mean the wife-murdering while he was essentially drunk on an Unmade. I mean the stuff he does after) so I was a little disappointed he seemingly got a get out of jail free card. I browse these forums every once in awhile, so I was aware of Child Champion theory, and it seemed incredibly likely to me, so that wasn't a surprise. I guess I just wanted Dalinar to lose, because while I really enjoy the character, I do not like the man. Ah well. I will miss him from SA series though. He had really strong PoVs. His time in the spiritual realm with Navani was interesting for lore reasons, but also generally boring as well. Overall, I liked the book. Nothing really bumped me overly much, but it feels like a step down from RoW. A reread will probably change some opinions, and solidify how I feel about a lot of other things I haven't mentioned here, which I'm doing now, by audiobook.

Page 18, at the bottom of the page "You do not reverence the position you seek," Should be "You do not revere the position you seek,"

My most favourite small (actually not that small since it's directly commenting on the character and nature of our protagonist) moment is in Well of Ascension when Tindwyl says some deeply kind words to Vin which, of course, puts Vin on high alert and her asking why Tindwyl is nice to her but mean to Elend and she explains that Vin has seen and felt enough "firm hands" so to speak in motivation and Elend has not had enough, ending with my favourite line from the book, "Oh child, when will you let yourself be loved?" I never really get all that emotional about sad moments i.e. Kelsier's death, etc. but I do get very emotional at moments of small kindesses, especially from characters who are otherwise not that kind

I am curious if there is a WoB about this, or if it's been theorized before etc and if so please point me to the relevant discussions/WoB Anyway, the crux of my question is this: Is part of the reason for Sazed's inability to act (and potentially becoming of Discord if that is in fact what is happening) as Harmony is because everyone, seemingly including himself, thinks of Harmony as Ruin and Preservation, rather than a single entity? To explain my thoughts: Intent is everything, or at least, a lot of everything. Intent matters. We are shown how Intent matters in most Cosmere books, and I was recently rereading Mistborn Era 2 and I found it interesting that whenever anyone thinks about Harmony as a concept, they conceptualize it as Ruin and Preservation together, rather than as a single thing, once two sources of Investiture, now one. I am curious if a simple (although, I think, difficult) restructuring of how Harmony is viewed could be a change to how it acts. I find it odd that Sazed constantly talks about how can't act because of his opposing natures of Preservation and Ruin, but he should only have *one* nature, that of Harmony. Now, of course, this could be as simple as him explaining a fault of Harmony itself in terms that make sense, it was two powers, now one, etc. But I find it odd. I feel like the combination of Ruin and Preservation shouldn't be as simple as addition, if that makes sense. Anyway, I'm curious what anyone thinks or if this has any merit or if it's been asked to Brandon.

Why can't Marsh take the Atium that was produced and mix it with electrum to make nalatium (Era 1 Atium) and live that way

I've actually been posting here since... *checks notes* 2014? But basically like 2 posts a year, and never introduced myself! I got into big time theorizing by joining Theoryland back in like, '06. Huge WoT fan, and got into Brandy Sandy himself by picking up Mistborn in whatever year it was announced he was taking over for Wheel of Time. A few notable hot takes from me: I think Mistborn is his best work so far*. Kelsier is not a good dude. I share Adolin's view of Dalinar. Anyway, hi whats up hello, long time frequenter reader, formally introducing myself! *this however is largely because it's fully finished and I love endings, especially if done well. the arcs of Vin, Elend, Spook, etc are done and through, and the story of that stuff is /done./ whether it remains the best post SA front 5, or the conclusion of MB Era 2, remains to be seen

I read the first few pages of this thread, and the last, and all I'm gonna say is: Idk if anyone brought it up but Gideon the Ninth and the sequel Harrowhark the Ninth feature lesbian main characters and it's a AWESOME sci-fi fantasy story. Just a kick ass read with a lot of fun combat and as it was described to me, a "resident evil-style murder house" Apologies if this one has been mentioned already

I really dislike most of Sandersons comic relief characters and also moments. Not that he writes bad, I've just come to a sad conclusion that he and I must have different comedic tastes. He's very blunt with his humour, whereas I grew up reading WoT and kind of learning to love RJ's very subtle almost anti-comedy. I found Lightsong irritating for most of Warbreaker (ironically, though, I identify with Lightsong probably the most of BS' characters). I cannot stand Lift at all (hopefully he gives her more characterization later) and anytime Wayne is being 'eccentric' I want to just skip past it (Wayne, however, has moments that make me love him so I won't actually include him on the list) SO, I'd say Lift is easily my least favourite. Lightsong a very close second.

When Faile makes Perrin confront his sadness about his entire family being dead and she just strokes his hair, and as RJ wrote, each stroke brought more tears from him. Then, when he meets a distant cousin of his who's still alive, and he's young and mentions how girls are 'gross' and 'weird' and Perrin muses to himself that that will change, in time. There's a scene in Winter's Heart where Rand gets cornered in an alleyway? Or similar, in Far Madding. And without his ability to channel, he still takes the fight directly to the enemies (I haven't read past book 8 in a long, long time) by punching one guy in the throat, pushing him down, rolling over him and drawing that guys sword as he does so and challenging another guy. Truly awesome. When Rand meets with Tam after his epiphany and breaking down apologizing, and saying he has someone very important to introduce to him [Min] and Tam says "I've already met her" and Rand says "But I haven't introduced you"

I got Seeker, which actually, I'm cool with. I wanted Thug or Tineye though

My favourite scene is Kelsiers death, specifically the writing around how unaffected by anything the Lord Ruler is, getting impaled by spears twice, and then ripping one out and stabbing Kelsier through the chest. But the cherry on top that makes it my favourite scene is TLR's single line after killing Kell that punctuates the scene in a way that gives me chills every time "Let the executions begin."

This is by far my favourite relationship, romantic or otherwise. When he dies, and Vin is so angry in her internal dialogue at him for abandoning her, and then she reads his note left to her, how she's the groups Mistborn now, and how he doesn't say it but simply said "Mare would have liked you. She always wanted a daughter" I cry every time

Is there a WoB saying that the Heralds are tortured by Odium? What is the arrangement, and why are they tortured by Odium? Are they released to face the desolations, and then "strung up" again?

Ohhhh, so like Allomancy and Feruchemy and I'm guessing then there's theories about a third set of 'binders?

Alright, so if there are 10 Radiant Orders, and in the above quote it was said there are 30 Orders, what are the other 20? I feel like I am just not grasping this at ALL and I truly apologize if I am making anyone facedesk

So Kaladin is a part of 1 order, and has access to 1 surge, which gives him multiple surgebindings? EDIT: or is it multiple surges for 1 Surgebinding?

And I thought my score was pretty good...

2948.

I was reading in the Coppermind Wiki forum about Surges and Surgebinding In a thread about wanting to update some things, I came across "Second, we need an infotable for the three types of Surgebinding, the ten Surges, and the 30 orders." I thought there were 10 orders? And what is the difference between surges and surgebinding?

Another query for you fellas Has it been confirmed if Hemalurgy, depending on the spike point, can steal the "powers" of another Shard? I mean, if you spiked someone with the right metal in the right place, could you take a surgebinding power?

Then, do we know what the 17th Shard is, or just we just know that it exists? Like, is it an organization of people (akin to the Ghostbloods) or is it an actual 17th Shard, like the other 16