Laras/Preservation Murderer? Spoilers

[Random Wookie]

Ok so new to the forums and not sure if this has been covered or not, Spoilers for Secret History Stormlight and Mistborn. So after reading secret history I found one line that makes me think Laras was not a great dude back on Yolen.  Now i know that each of the 16 got shards, we do not know if they picked shards or was random or whatever. But we do know that Ati was a good guy before he became Ruin and Ryse was a dick before Odium.  Now when Laras was at the well of Ascension and Kelsier was trying to get him to kill Elend. Laras pulls out a dagger and says "Hello old friend".  Is it just me or does that kinda sound like something a Serial Killer or Murderer would say to their weapon? If it was a sword or axe I'd be inclined to think Laras was kinda like a kelsier antihero and just grew attached to his weapon.  And I like the idea that Laras either chose Preservation because of some kind of weird obsession or was given it because he tended to destroy things or even better a regretful killer who now only wants to preserve life instead of destroying it.  Thoughts?

[+Invocation]

2 minutes ago, Random Wookie said:

Ruin and Ryse was a d*ck before Odium

Let's keep it PG, alright?

To be perfectly honest, we don't know much about Leras's knife, or Leras before the Shattering at all, and probably won't until Dragonsteel. Until then, it's a solid RAFO to prevent Brandon from locking himself down.

[Karger he/him]

I think that as something he carried for thousands of years he has a degree fondness for his knife.

[Random Wookie]

11 minutes ago, Karger said:

I think that as something he carried for thousands of years he has a degree fondness for his knife.

Yes he carried but probably didn't use it or unsheathe it until Kelsier forced his hand, and trope wise calling a Knife old friend usually means a killer of some sort. I know its RAFO but i still like my theory.  I'm a knife collector and I would never refer to one as old friend, even my Buck I've had most of my life. Now if I'd used it memorably then I might consider it a friend

[Snipexe he/him]

23 minutes ago, Invocation said:

To be perfectly honest, we don't know much about Leras's knife, or Leras before the Shattering at all, and probably won't until Dragonsteel. Until then, it's a solid RAFO to prevent Brandon from locking himself down.

These are the most relevant WoBs on the subject:

Quote

FirstSelector[PENDING REVIEW]

Here's a Dragonsteel question. If I were to wave Leras' knife over a candle, would it light?

Brandon Sanderson[PENDING REVIEW]

...We'll RAFO that.

Oathbringer San Francisco signing (Nov. 15, 2017)

Quote

Questioner[PENDING REVIEW]

Cephandrius is kinda like a bard. And Tanavast is almost a Paladin. And Ati we're thinking like a priest or cleric?

Brandon Sanderson[PENDING REVIEW]

You're starting to stretch. You can definitely put Hoid into a bard category.

Questioner[PENDING REVIEW]

And then our final one was Preservation. Is he almost like a rogue or thief type person? Because he gives off that kind of vibe.

Brandon Sanderson[PENDING REVIEW]

I'll RAFO it. You're going to have to wait on those until I write them out.

Orem signing (Dec. 21, 2017)

 

[Nathrangking he/him]

42 minutes ago, Random Wookie said:

Ok so new to the forums and not sure if this has been covered or not, Spoilers for Secret History Stormlight and Mistborn. So after reading secret history I found one line that makes me think Laras was not a great dude back on Yolen.  Now i know that each of the 16 got shards, we do not know if they picked shards or was random or whatever. But we do know that Ati was a good guy before he became Ruin and Ryse was a dick before Odium.  Now when Laras was at the well of Ascension and Kelsier was trying to get him to kill Elend. Laras pulls out a dagger and says "Hello old friend".  Is it just me or does that kinda sound like something a Serial Killer or Murderer would say to their weapon? If it was a sword or axe I'd be inclined to think Laras was kinda like a kelsier antihero and just grew attached to his weapon.  And I like the idea that Laras either chose Preservation because of some kind of weird obsession or was given it because he tended to destroy things or even better a regretful killer who now only wants to preserve life instead of destroying it.  Thoughts?

13 minutes ago, Random Wookie said:

Yes he carried but probably didn't use it or unsheathe it until Kelsier forced his hand, and trope wise calling a Knife old friend usually means a killer of some sort. I know its RAFO but i still like my theory.  I'm a knife collector and I would never refer to one as old friend, even my Buck I've had most of my life. Now if I'd used it memorably then I might consider it a friend

29 minutes ago, Karger said:

I think that as something he carried for thousands of years he has a degree fondness for his knife.

Personally I agree with @Karger. While there may be a trope of knife loving serial killers Brandon rarely goes after the simple or easy explanation. It would not be a stretch that perhaps this blade at some point in the distant past saved his life perhaps at the cost of something important to him. This blade then would in fact be an old friend, but one that he refuses to draw until now. Alternatively, perhaps ......

Spoiler

the blade is sentient in which case it would not be odd for him to say something like that. Also if I recall Tanavast has a similar knife.

 

 

[Zephrun’s Imperium they/he]

I think one thing that's important to consider is that Preservation says in SH, "I've never been able to kill," which to me, sounds like something in his past that he's refering to. Maybe something that haunts him even. 

Oooo, now I'm thinking about it, it would be really sad if he were talking about Ati. His Shard forced him to lock his friend away rather than put him out of his misery. I don't know, thinking about those two gives me chills. It'll be really sad to read about them later knowing how their story ends.

[Ixthos Luke/Luke]

In a sense, considering how Leras gained the shard of Preservation ... he actually is a murderer. Its also possible that knife is the method used - maybe every vessel has one, or Leras once was a killer but turned his back on it - aside from the shattering - and this is why his attitude matches Preservation, though he kept his knife.

[+robardin he/him]

6 hours ago, Ixthos said:

In a sense, considering how Leras gained the shard of Preservation ... he actually is a murderer. Its also possible that knife is the method used - maybe every vessel has one, or Leras once was a killer but turned his back on it - aside from the shattering - and this is why his attitude matches Preservation, though he kept his knife.

It's also interesting that it's an object associated with the Shard in its Cognitive form.

In general, it seems like the "human facing" projection that a Shard creates is modeled on their original Physical form, as confirmed by how Harmony appears to Wax, which is the same as how he's described while a mortal man in Mistborn Era 1.

We see Harmony appear dressed in the traditional V-patterned Terris robes, more or less (though each stripe was like a strata in time in the CR), but we also see Ruin and Preservation appear dressed in garb that likely matches what they habitually wore before Ascending, unless they make an effort to form a different image (Preservation is described as wearing clothing that looks strange to Kelsier when he first meets him in Secret History).

But of the Shards we've seen "in person", we've only seen two who carried around a talisman of sorts: Preservation with his knife, and Odium with his scepter (which form he does play around with a bit). Ruin didn't seem to have one, nor Harmony, nor Cultivation.

[Nathrangking he/him]

8 minutes ago, robardin said:

It's also interesting that it's an object associated with the Shard in its Cognitive form.

In general, it seems like the "human facing" projection that a Shard creates is modeled on their original Physical form, as confirmed by how Harmony appears to Wax, which is the same as how he's described while a mortal man in Mistborn Era 1.

We see Harmony appear dressed in the traditional V-patterned Terris robes, more or less (though each stripe was like a strata in time in the CR), but we also see Ruin and Preservation appear dressed in garb that likely matches what they habitually wore before Ascending, unless they make an effort to form a different image (Preservation is described as wearing clothing that looks strange to Kelsier when he first meets him in Secret History).

But of the Shards we've seen "in person", we've only seen two who carried around a talisman of sorts: Preservation with his knife, and Odium with his scepter (which form he does play around with a bit). Ruin didn't seem to have one, nor Harmony, nor Cultivation.

I seem to recall Honor may have had a knife in one of the visions unless I am misremembering the vision.

[+robardin he/him]

26 minutes ago, Nathrangking said:

I seem to recall Honor may have had a knife in one of the visions unless I am misremembering the vision.

Hmm. I thought in most of the visions Dalinar heard Honor as a voice, but at the very end of The Way of Kings, when he realizes the visions were basically one-sided playbacks and not the interactive conversations he'd thought he'd been having, he also appears to "see" Honor for the first time:

Quote

"I cannot fight him any longer," the voice said.

Dalinar jumped, glancing to the side. A man stood there. He had dark skin and pure white hair. Tall, thick of chest but not massive, he wore exotic clothing of a strange cut: loose, billowing trousers and a coat that came down only to his waist. Both seemed made of gold.

No mention of carrying an object, but again, the clothing is exotic/strange to the local viewer.

As for how Odium is described as dressed in Oathbringer: the first time we see him "on screen", it's in Ch. 56 when he enters one of Dalinar's visions of Feverstone Keep and the Recreance after he used it to pull in Yanagawn in for another chat:

Quote

Why was he still here? Last time, the vision had ended before this.

"Stormfather?" he asked.

No reply. Dalinar turned around.

A man in white and gold stood there.

Dalinar jumped, scrambling backward. The man was old, with a wide, furrowed face and bone-white hair that swept back from his head as if blown by wind. Thick mustaches with a hint of black in them blended into a short white beard. He seemed to be Shin, judging by his skin and eyes, and he wore a golden crown in his powdery hair.

Those eyes... they were ancient, the skin surrounding them deeply creased, and they danced with joy as he smiled at Dalinar and rested a golden scepter on his shoulder.

And elsewhere in Oathbringer, from Dalinar's and Venli's POV and others, Odium is desribed as holding or tapping his scepter "like a cane."

Somehow I wouldn't be surprised if it was the kind of cane with a sword hidden it it, eh?

On quick perusal (and eBook search), I didn't find any description of Odium's "clothing", though, only his face and his cane. He appears at Thaylen Fields as a gold-and-white-marbled "ancient parshman" with "a regal scepter he carried like a cane" and later, when Amaram brings him the aluminum sheath for Nightblood, with a "golden carapace"; and later to Taravangian as a 20-foot tall colossus before shrinking down to normal human size. Both times only his face or features are described, his hair and beard, plus mention of the scepter... Always the scepter.

Edited March 4, 2019 by robardin