Maya's full restoration (theory)

[Marabout]

It’s stated in RoW that Dalinar should be able to enhance other Radiants’ powers the same way he does for Shallan.

My theory is that he will enhance Renarin’s ability to show the “perfected” version of someone while healing and add cognitive/spiritual connections to the healing.

When the Nahel bonds were broken, I conceptualize it as inadvertently tearing out other connections (like forcefully tearing out a string from a braided thread)

The process may be possible without them, as Adolin seems to be succeeding well so far at reattaching the connections, but I think the D+R combo would be faster and could potentially heal many deadeyes.

Alternatively, maybe the Adolin effect would be needed on other deadeyes as well (an initial pseudo-bond to start the healing process).

[+robardin he/him]

Well if you believe Kalak, finding and freeing Ba-Ado-Mishram just might fix all the Connection problems on Roshar - including deadeye spren which only started happening around then, too!

For all we know, that imprisonment was also part of the reason the Heralds started to go insane, too.

Of course, this is a presently insane Herald telling this to Shallan, so, who knows what freeing B-A-M would really accomplish.

[Letryx13]

On 11/10/2022 at 4:59 PM, Marabout said:

It’s stated in RoW that Dalinar should be able to enhance other Radiants’ powers the same way he does for Shallan.

My theory is that he will enhance Renarin’s ability to show the “perfected” version of someone while healing and add cognitive/spiritual connections to the healing.

When the Nahel bonds were broken, I conceptualize it as inadvertently tearing out other connections (like forcefully tearing out a string from a braided thread)

The process may be possible without them, as Adolin seems to be succeeding well so far at reattaching the connections, but I think the D+R combo would be faster and could potentially heal many deadeyes.

Alternatively, maybe the Adolin effect would be needed on other deadeyes as well (an initial pseudo-bond to start the healing process).

I see the state of dead eye spree as similar to the parshmen. It took the everstorm to bring them back, so it will probably take something similarly poweful.  The storm father called the everstorm his opposite, which implies it’s as powerful as he is, or close to. And since the unmade are about as powerful as the storm father, there is a logical train  of thought that leads to releasing BAM is the key to restoring the dead eyes 

[Marabout]

It’s an interesting theory that it will take BAM’s release to bring back the deadeyes.

A lot of it is dependent on the timeline which we aren’t very clear on.

When exactly did the Spren become deadeyes?

We are told that all the Radiants didn’t break their bonds at the exact same time.  You would think that if the Spren became deadeyes as soon as the bonds were broken, then those that weren’t in the initial wave would know the consequences and wouldn’t all proceed with the process.

You could argue that all the bonded Spren became deadeyes when BAM was imprisoned but we know that the Skybreaker Spren did not.

Also, Shallan created a deadeye simply by breaking her bond without BAM being involved at all.

The preponderance of evidence is that becoming a deadeye has nothing to do with BAM’s imprisonment.

So why would freeing BAM reverse the process?

 

[Letryx13]

48 minutes ago, Marabout said:

It’s an interesting theory that it will take BAM’s release to bring back the deadeyes.

A lot of it is dependent on the timeline which we aren’t very clear on.

When exactly did the Spren become deadeyes?

We are told that all the Radiants didn’t break their bonds at the exact same time.  You would think that if the Spren became deadeyes as soon as the bonds were broken, then those that weren’t in the initial wave would know the consequences and wouldn’t all proceed with the process.

You could argue that all the bonded Spren became deadeyes when BAM was imprisoned but we know that the Skybreaker Spren did not.

Also, Shallan created a deadeye simply by breaking her bond without BAM being involved at all.

The preponderance of evidence is that becoming a deadeye has nothing to do with BAM’s imprisonment.

So why would freeing BAM reverse the process?

 

BAM was probably imprisoned before all the radiants ended the orders.  The imprisoning of the unmade damaged Roshar, according to Kellek.

And we've seen something almost identical happen before. 

Spoiler

I know this is dipping into larger Cosmere territory, but I'm all but certain it's similar to the earthquake that created the huge chasm on the planet Sel.  When the Reod happened and the chasm formed, the Aon's stopped working (including Ellantris itself) which caused the the Seon's to become something comparable to dead-eyes. Even after that happened, if someone became an Ellantrian while having a Seon bonded to them, the Seon went mindless.  Then the city was restored, and all the Seon's came back to life.

 

[Marabout]

Your example disproves your argument

If the two events were similar, then imprisoning BAM would have damaged the Spren instantly.

 

[Letryx13]

9 minutes ago, Marabout said:

Your example disproves your argument

If the two events were similar, then imprisoning BAM would have damaged the Spren instantly.

 

I said almost identical, not exactly. 
The damage in my example was done when the Aon’s shapes no longer matched the land. And specifically done to the Seon’s when they became bonded to someone connected to that damaged power. The powers of Devotion and Dominion are tied to precise shape of things in the different ways they are channeled, via Aon’s or the other methods. The damage to the spren specifically happened when oaths were broken, but they only became dead-eyes after Bah-Ado-Mishram was imprisoned. BAM’s imprisonment damaged Roshar, not Honor’s power. The power of Honor is tied to oaths. It’s when the spren or Seon is connected to a person and the power is damaged at the same time that dead-eyes or the equivalent are formed. Just like how Seon’s who weren’t bonded to Ellantrians didn’t change during the Reod. 

[Marabout]

Your timeline still makes no sense

If BAM was imprisoned before the bonds were broken then the bond breaking and “damage” to Roshar did not occur at the same time.

Also, every new Spren bond made would result in an instant deadeye and this obviously isn’t the case.

The facts are that Nahel bonds have been made both before and after BAM’s imprisonment with no apparent difference.

The Only way your theory makes sense is if prior to BAM’s imprisonment breaking the Nahel bond did Not create a deadeye.  In other words, the process of becoming deadeye requires a double injury with a combo of BAM and the broken bond.  But there is just no evidence of this.  All information we have so far is broken bond = deadeye.

There is simply no evidence that BAM has anything to do with deadeyes.

[Letryx13]

2 hours ago, Marabout said:

Your timeline still makes no sense

If BAM was imprisoned before the bonds were broken then the bond breaking and “damage” to Roshar did not occur at the same time.

Also, every new Spren bond made would result in an instant deadeye and this obviously isn’t the case.

The facts are that Nahel bonds have been made both before and after BAM’s imprisonment with no apparent difference.

The Only way your theory makes sense is if prior to BAM’s imprisonment breaking the Nahel bond did Not create a deadeye.  In other words, the process of becoming deadeye requires a double injury with a combo of BAM and the broken bond.  But there is just no evidence of this.  All information we have so far is broken bond = deadeye.

There is simply no evidence that BAM has anything to do with deadeyes.

Then why is it that no dead-eyes existed before the Recreance? Considering what Shallan did to Testament when she was a child and what Kaladin almost did to Syl, it makes no logical sense to assume that no radiant, not one, across thousands of years broke their oaths.  Even if only by accident.  True, there is no known case of this happening.  But to consider that it never happened once before the Recreance when we've seen it happen after the Recreance happened makes no sense.  

The point I'm trying to make is that it's the combination of the wound to Roshar from Bah-Ado-Mishram's imprisonment and the ending of the orders that damaged the Spren enough to turn them into dead-eyes.  It's conjecture, true, but logical, based on when we know dead-eyes first existed.  

[offer]

9 hours ago, Marabout said:

The Only way your theory makes sense is if prior to BAM’s imprisonment breaking the Nahel bond did Not create a deadeye.  In other words, the process of becoming deadeye requires a double injury with a combo of BAM and the broken bond.  But there is just no evidence of this.  All information we have so far is broken bond = deadeye.

 

This is the case according to WoB:

Quote

James Smallwood

Can the Voidspren bonded by the Regals be killed and become deadeyes?

Brandon Sanderson

Voidspren bonded by the Regals, right, okay. I'll RAFO that for now. I haven't gotten into the mechanics of the Regals nearly as much as I want to eventually get into it.

Let's just say something weird is happening to make deadeyes. They didn't exist before the Recreance. There should be a relationship here that reminds you of something else you've seen in the Cosmere.

YouTube Spoiler Stream 1 (Dec. 17, 2020)

In this WoB Brandon is probably refering to the damaged seons in elantris.

 

Also, in RoW we learn that the spren did not know ab out deadeyes before the recreance.