Frustration

The Table Model of Dawnshards

4 posts in this topic

So I've been thinking about the Alignment of Dawnshards to shards for a long time but I've never made a post about it, mainly because I've never been able to pin down one I've liked. However I recently decided to sit down and work through it.

So one thing that bothered me about sorting Shards solely into groups of four is that Ruin and Odium both speak of Passion with great importance. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/171/#e8330 https://wob.coppermind.net/events/355/#e10447

But Ruin belongs quite clearly in the Change dawnshard, something Odium does not.

So I propose that there is a second set of four ideas, I'm not sure whether to call them intents or flavors or whatever, but these when cross referenced with the Dawnshard Commands will give us a Table of the Shards like so, With Dawnshard Commands along the top, and the attributes along the side

          

 

     Change

 

     Unite

 

     Give  

 

     Choose

Natural

 

     Cultivation

 

     Honor

 

     Endowment

 

     Autonomy

Passion

 

     Ruin

 

     Odium

 

     Mercy

 

     Valor

Control

 

     Preservation

 

     Dominion

 

     Invention

 

     Ambition

???

 

     Whimsy

 

     Devotion

 

     ???

 

     ???


I feel this does a much better job of explaining the Shards and their Alignment with Dawnshards.

Question?

 
Edited by Frustration
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I like it as an idea, but several don't sit well with me.  I feel like cultivation is controlled growth, so could fit easily in either row. Odium doesn't feel like something that unites, and I've always wondered if that shard was interpreted that way due to Rayse being hateful anyways. And whimsy feels hard to categorize by definition. 

Im sure there is a definitive chart or something close to it, and I've wondered about it too. I just wonder if we have enough information without more dawnshards.

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7 hours ago, Frustration said:

So I've been thinking about the Alignment of Dawnshards to shards for a long time but I've never made a post about it, mainly because I've never been able to pin down one I've liked. However I recently decided to sit down and work through it.

So one thing that bothered me about sorting Shards solely into groups of four is that Ruin and Odium both speak of Passion with great importance. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/171/#e8330 https://wob.coppermind.net/events/355/#e10447

Wouldn't a double-Dawnshard theory with Feel or Passion as one of the Dawnshards solve this issue without having to create a new concept?

Quote

Question?

A lot

  1. Why did you put the God of stasis in the Change part?
  2. As @Solant said Cultivation is controlled growth and therefore fits Natural far less than Ruin (entropy)
  3. Why did you put the Goddess of love (Devotion) out of the Passion line?
  4. Isn't the Give Dawnshard a bit redundant with Endowment the Goddess of gifts?
  5. Why is Invention in Give?

 

Here's my attempt at a double Dawnshards theory based on Change/Bind/Continue/Feel that take into account the Passion WoBs, placement of course not finals (especially Endowment)

Spoiler

 

Change

Bind

Continue

Feel

Change

Whimsy

Dominion

Autonomy

Ambition

Bind

Cultivation

Honour

Preservation

Odium

Continue

Invention

 In Hiding

Endowment

Valour

Feel

Ruin

Devotion

Mercy

Unknown

Hey @LewsTherinTelescope and @Kingsdaughter613, there's a new Shard-Dawnshard theory in town

 

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18 hours ago, Solant said:

Odium doesn't feel like something that unites, and I've always wondered if that shard was interpreted that way due to Rayse being hateful anyways.

Here's my best recreation of a quote from Elantris, someone with the book can be more accurate.

"...hatred can unify men far more quickly and far more powerfully than devotion ever could."

11 hours ago, mathiau said:

Wouldn't a double-Dawnshard theory with Feel or Passion as one of the Dawnshards solve this issue without having to create a new concept?

Well it wouldn't be a new concept so much as identifying an existing one.

14 hours ago, mathiau said:
  1. Why did you put the God of stasis in the Change part?

In order to preserve something you have to change it's condition.

And how does stasis and destruction make Harmony?

14 hours ago, mathiau said:
  1. As @Solant said Cultivation is controlled growth and therefore fits Natural far less than Ruin (entropy)

Ruin isn't just entropy though, it's about the feeling of destroying, that's why both he and the Inquisitors feel intense emotional reactions.

14 hours ago, mathiau said:
  1. Why did you put the Goddess of love (Devotion) out of the Passion line?

So if we asked a bunch of Stick fans why they like Stick, and a bunch of Moash haters why they hate Moash, who do you think will have the more passionate response?

14 hours ago, mathiau said:
  1. Isn't the Give Dawnshard a bit redundant with Endowment the Goddess of gifts?
  2. Why is Invention in Give?

What can you describe Mercy as other than a gift?

And Inventions are gifts to everyone.

14 hours ago, mathiau said:

Here's my attempt at a double Dawnshards theory based on Change/Bind/Continue/Feel that take into account the Passion WoBs, placement of course not finals (especially Endowment)

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

Change

 

Bind

 

Continue

 

Feel

 

Change

 

Whimsy

 

Dominion

 

Autonomy

 

Ambition

 

Bind

 

Cultivation

 

Honour

 

Preservation

 

Odium

 

Continue

 

Invention

 

 

 In Hiding

Endowment

 

Valour

 

Feel

 

Ruin

 

Devotion

 

Mercy

 

 

Unknown

 

I would love to compare theories, but this isn't the thread for that.

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