Long Game 80: Skaa Tenements

[Squirrelwatcher]

13 minutes ago, Archer said:

The flaw is I had no way of knowing where you were to block you. Did anyone get any locations from Elk? Is there any precedent for this, because I think it's unlikely 

Back when I was sus of elk, I messaged you about him and in the process mentioned that I was in either x or y. (Not giving names publicly obviously)

So you would have had a 50 50 shot of hitting me.

---

Edit: not to mention the possibility of an elim informant

Edited September 11, 2021 by Squirrelwatcher

[Devotary of Spontaneity]

3 hours ago, Archer said:

Devo added to Illwei’s vote, making a viable wagon on me, a villager. It was for jumping around with my votes and offering little explanation for them, which is a bad habit I’ve gotten into recently (last three or four games, especially early on. I’m drunk on the power of stabs). But I thought people were gut village reading me by then; it feels like this vote was technically very defensible, but unreasonable if you’re actually thinking like a villager (with your heart and dartboard).

Devo then went on to question Esooa about their read on me. Coupled with them answering a TJ question, this gives me a little hesitation. Elims don’t tend to challenge their teammates much. Except, Devo kept their vote on me after my e-e approach was verified by my Fancy Chart, so I still get hit job vibes.

I was always going to vote for you, it just took me long enough to write my post that Illwei cast their vote first. Why do you think people should have been gut reading you as village? I saw trying to kill someone apparently without regard for who, with  some residual desire not to ignore suspicious behavior from you after the last LG, and voted for you. A chart doesn't verify you, though mostly this is because not e-e doesn't mean that one of them isn't evil and the fact that I associate you and spreadsheets with the Reckoners QF where you were an elim.

40 minutes ago, Squirrelwatcher said:

e!Archer, on the other hand, would want to roleblock me because that way he could pin the roleblock on Esooa and potentially get Esooa misexed as a result

• Archer was also the one who suggested that I ask Esooa for location in the first place

This seems to run into the same problems as before, since the elims would only have one location scan as of N2. Did Archer know that you'd claimed an accurate location to Essoa? Is there any way he could have gotten your location without a location scan or him being teammates with Esooa?

[Esooa]

Probably relevant to mention I edited the above vote with reasons

[Squirrelwatcher]

4 minutes ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

This seems to run into the same problems as before, since the elims would only have one location scan as of N2. Did Archer know that you'd claimed an accurate location to Essoa? Is there any way he could have gotten your location without a location scan or him being teammates with Esooa?

Archer knew I'd traded locations, yes.

And I'd inadvertently given him a 50 50 when was messaging people about elk because I mentioned which locations elk had asked me about (and said that i didn't tell him any new ones)

[---]

TJ stop tunneling me it's bad form smh

Archer

I'm so conflicted right now

[Archer]

25 minutes ago, Esooa said:

Archer

EDIT: kinda bored might bury archer itt

I didn't wanna talk about the game more cause it's annoying but I was messaging illwei, decided to tell her all the reasons archers vote on me was bad, but then I read archers post where he's like "well I saved illwei" and it reminds me they're decently likely to be wolves together if archer is so I didn't want to just have my reasons contained in messages with illwei

First of all, Archers idea that I need an explanation of how Squirrel got role blocked or why is ridiculous

There's a reason I refuse to answer questions like that and it's because it's impossible to know

There is conjecture, but that's all. I have no interest in giving vaugities on how it could happen, necessarily easily dismissable by the uncertainty of them due to my perspective

The only important thing is *if* there's wolf motive in my actions themselves

I didn't ask Squirrel for his location

Squirrel offered it, and I told him I have no need of it, but I'll tell him mine

My role doesn't rely on locations

I then accurately gave him my location

Why am I telling squirrel my location just to RB him? Of what use is that? Not only an I offering myself up to be cop checked-the opposite of wolf motivated-I don't even know at the time who the cop is

I could assume it's him, yes, but I'm literally, if a wolf, freely putting myself into this wifom, with no gain, with the best case scenario being... That I role block the cop and get scum read for it?

It's ridiculous

I advocated for a TJ vote yesterday, it doesn't matter that I was the only one on him I still clearly had the intention to get him killed, especially when I was town reading and gave reasons for town reading the primary wagons

I solved as much as TJ but Archer says TJ is solving so he doesn't want to vote him

In general Archer is doing everything he can to worm his way out of excuses to not vote me

So I'm going to call him a wolf

And vote him

And that's that

sorry you don't like our game 

The TJ vote came late, so it's less impactful. Felt like an elim who needed to park a vote. 

I can understand you not knowing what happened, but the obvious implication is its highly likely someone is lying. V!You knows it's highly likely Squirrel is lying, and yet your vote is on me now, based on Squirrel's arguments. That doesn't make sense, so I suspect opportunism. 

17 minutes ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

I was always going to vote for you, it just took me long enough to write my post that Illwei cast their vote first. Why do you think people should have been gut reading you as village? I saw trying to kill someone apparently without regard for who, with  some residual desire not to ignore suspicious behavior from you after the last LG, and voted for you. A chart doesn't verify you, though mostly this is because not e-e doesn't mean that one of them isn't evil and the fact that I associate you and spreadsheets with the Reckoners QF where you were an elim.

This seems to run into the same problems as before, since the elims would only have one location scan as of N2. Did Archer know that you'd claimed an accurate location to Essoa? Is there any way he could have gotten your location without a location scan or him being teammates with Esooa?

People always gut read me as village Also I started the Az train and picked the Mint train to succeed, and am driving this Esooa one, so either I'm being really brazen or I'm an ignorant villager. 

11 minutes ago, Squirrelwatcher said:

Archer knew I'd traded locations, yes.

And I'd inadvertently given him a 50 50 when was messaging people about elk because I mentioned which locations elk had asked me about (and said that i didn't tell him any new ones)

This isn't true. Don't vote based on that, at least not until I can get Squirrel to quote it to me because he never said he was one of the two 

Edit: Illwei is either my teammate, in which case it's weird they're voting me right now, or a fellow villager, because my team left it really late to protect me last Day. 

Edited September 11, 2021 by Archer

[Esooa]

10 minutes ago, Archer said:

I can understand you not knowing what happened, but the obvious implication is its highly likely someone is lying. V!You knows it's highly likely Squirrel is lying, and yet your vote is on me now, based on Squirrel's arguments. That doesn't make sense, so I suspect opportunism. 

I said he was lying earlier

That was probably excessive

He was misconstruing what actually happened, at least slightly

Such as by leaving out that I did not want his location and he told me it anyways

But misconstruing doesn't make someone a wolf by itself, and he's since changed his mind

You yourself have already provided arguments why wolf Squirrel wouldn't do what he is; why would he do this just to get me killed?

I also town read Squirrel outside of this

I gave reasons your posts this day are wolfy

I have more (your basing a lot of your game on a premise of "wolves saving illwei" while saving illwei. I think wolves accurately describe their actions/intent but prescribe these things to villagers decently often, as with TMI you know what's going on in a game and feel the need to shift the blame of true on goings/continue to use the true perspective even if a villager wouldn't, etc) reasons to believe your positioning in these actions is wolfy

And other such things

EDIT: also re: "sorry you don't like our game" it's nothing about this site, I just find role madness boring and I always underestimate how much it puts me off

Edited September 11, 2021 by Esooa

[---]

13 minutes ago, Esooa said:

EDIT: also re: "sorry you don't like our game" it's nothing about this site, I just find role madness boring and I always underestimate how much it puts me off

i just like simple games

[Devotary of Spontaneity]

18 minutes ago, Squirrelwatcher said:

Archer knew I'd traded locations, yes.

And I'd inadvertently given him a 50 50 when was messaging people about elk because I mentioned which locations elk had asked me about (and said that i didn't tell him any new ones)

As in you implied to Archer which two locations you were not in? Elk could have asked you about a location you were in if he'd heard from someone else in that location.

8 minutes ago, Archer said:

V!You knows it's highly likely Squirrel is lying, and yet your vote is on me now, based on Squirrel's arguments. That doesn't make sense, so I suspect opportunism. 

Also I started the Az train and picked the Mint train to succeed, and am driving this Esooa one, so either I'm being really brazen or I'm an ignorant villager. 

Edit: Illwei is either my teammate, in which case it's weird they're voting me right now, or a fellow villager, because my team left it really late to protect me last Day.

What would Squirrel be lying about? An elim Squirrel with village Esooa wouldn't benefit from accusing someone he knew would flip village since it would implicate him next cycle, and village Squirrel lying about being roleblocked makes even less sense.

Well you are brazen as an elim so this is irrelevant.

This is somewhat more relevant. You weren't in danger until my vote two hours before rollover, two hours before rollover. Squirrel's vote forty five minutes later put you in critical danger. Chantara putting a vote on Illwei an hour before rollover is the main concrete thing that could be an attempt to save you, since your and Illwei's switch to Mint looks like self-preservation on both your parts.

[Mat]

Archer

[Archer]

Okay, regarding Squirrel. I think he's village. Misguided, misremembering our PM, but village. So he's probably not lying about having been blocked. So one needs to have discovered his location before the night they needed to use it, so from a role on N1, or from Esooa, who is presumed innocent if you're not voting her, or from Elk, who I know wasn't giving out that information. He only gave put his location, not others'. Again, Squirrel never said he was one of the two houses, he just said Elk told him the two houses of Hasting and Venture. So if it came from me it was a 1 in 4 guess. 

I expect the elim plan was to scan Squirrel last night, use the guaranteed kill they already had lined up, then block Squirrel to stall for time. If he'd been lying about his house, it would have caused a failed NK, and I suspect they were suspicious of the ease at which the information came to them. That's the overwhelmingly most likely way it panned out. 

*

If it's any help in clearing me, I'll mention that I'm the Coinshot. (How else did you think I was able to kill Scorched's parents?) 

And for the record, my notes are accurate. I don't think I have any on going lies, so everything I haven't walked back you can trust was genuine. I stand by my reads, especially the evil and null (evil you kill after the other suspects are dead) ones. 

[Esooa]

If you're town then the most likely person I'm voting otherwise today is TJ

[Archer]

5 hours ago, Archer said:

If it came down to them versus someone in my trusts, I’d vote out TJ. But his posts are really game solvey, so I’d rather not tap that barrel yet.

Although at this point I'm not gonna vote alongside Esooa unless it's on Devo, just on principle 

[---]

Esooa

mrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[Esooa]

5 minutes ago, Illwei said:

Esooa

mrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

you know it doesn't count as distancing if your vote doesn't even last an hour

[---]

Just now, Esooa said:

you know it doesn't count as distancing if your vote doesn't even last an hour

I was 8 minutes too late

[Esooa]

I would have still believed you may have been town too

I don't really care if I die, but I don't know the vote count so

if I do there's practically no excuse to not killing Archer the next day. If he's a wolf it means illwei and TJ are both almost always wolves

He is refusing to accept that I'm town despite that fact pushing him into a corner because the alternative is killing his partner TJ. He makes multiple excuses to avoid that direction which hold up to, well, not even a couple seconds of scrutiny. TJ and illweis interactions are far from not w/w

The vote onto who ever died the previous day phase, as well as the incentive to try and kill me specifically in the way they are, was also likely catalyzed by me just being correct on TJ

yawn

[---]

TJ

I just want people to talk more i stg no one is even online

Edited September 11, 2021 by Illwei

[Esooa]

And by the way, the actual direct prompting of me to explain why Archer was a wolf, was because once I told illwei why he is in PM's she didn't respond. I think she just didn't know how, which doubtfully comes from town there, and led me to believe I was correct enough I should probably push for my view of the game at that time to be accepted. I didn't particularly care prior to that point because I want confident in anything

[Mat]

Btw Archer claimed CS to me awhile ago but said he didn’t kill Kas or Elk

Personally I doubt there’s two village Coinshots

[---]

3 minutes ago, Matrim's Dice said:

Btw Archer claimed CS to me awhile ago but said he didn’t kill Kas or Elk

Personally I doubt there’s two village Coinshots

counterstrike

[Esooa]

Gonna point out I pretty much invalidated every point Archer had to vote me and offered him an opportunity to vote another one of his wolf reads with me

There was no reconsideration. Only outright refusal. My directing attention to him was met by him with a poor attempt at misdirection, "why aren't you voting squirrel," a just fully wrong conception even by his own admission in prior posts by calling squirrel likely just town for his play today

I don't believe any of it is genuine

[Chantara]

(OOC: Okay, busy couple days, but I’m back and caught up. I’ve only been able to check in every once in a while.) 

to sum up the discussion over the last couple days: Squirrel is losing their mind because someone role blocked them. They suspect Esooa. Esooa defended themselves, and everyone suspected them.  Then, Archer got involved, now everyone suspects Archer. But on the sidelines we have Devo and TJ who are hanging on the fringes and just making comments here and there. Dalinar just came out with location information on both himself and Esooa. Which quite frankly confused everyone, they then peaced out. Now Archer is claiming to be the coinshot in hopes of some self-preservation. 
 

Dalinar

[---]

1 minute ago, Chantara said:

(OOC: Okay, busy couple days, but I’m back and caught up. I’ve only been able to check in every once in a while.) 

to sum up the discussion over the last couple days: Squirrel is losing their mind because someone role blocked them. They suspect Esooa. Esooa defended themselves, and everyone suspected them.  Then, Archer got involved, now everyone suspects Archer. But on the sidelines we have Devo and TJ who are hanging on the fringes and just making comments here and there. Dalinar just came out with location information on both himself and Esooa. Which quite frankly confused everyone, they then peaced out. Now Archer is claiming to be the coinshot in hopes of some self-preservation. 
 

Dalinar

do you care to take an active stance on the current leading wagons

Edited September 11, 2021 by Illwei

[Esooa]

Just now, Chantara said:

(OOC: Okay, busy couple days, but I’m back and caught up. I’ve only been able to check in every once in a while.) 

to sum up the discussion over the last couple days: Squirrel is losing their mind because someone role blocked them. They suspect Esooa. Esooa defended themselves, and everyone suspected them.  Then, Archer got involved, now everyone suspects Archer. But on the sidelines we have Devo and TJ who are hanging on the fringes and just making comments here and there. Dalinar just came out with location information on both himself and Esooa. Which quite frankly confused everyone, they then peaced out. Now Archer is claiming to be the coinshot in hopes of some self-preservation. 
 

Dalinar

I'm gonna call this person town