Bejarden Posted March 30, 2021 Report Share Posted March 30, 2021 It seems like what your saying is that since X happened there was no possible way Y could have happened because it didn’t This is not the way it works. Dalinar made decisions and he made the right ones. The way that happens is irrelevant because he could have decided not to change Cultivation pruned him but Dalinar grew into the man he always wanted to be or something like that. A man like his brother who he idolized I’d guess 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quick Ben Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 (edited) 19 hours ago, Frustration said: He had the everstorm down to the day, and call Tefts arival early so that is false, the only thing he got wrong is Dalinar falling, and Odium thought he would fall to. The only thing he got right was the everstorm Got Dalinar turning wrong, Jasnah killing him wrong etc, if i recall correctly he only got the everstorm right. 19 hours ago, Frustration said: The way you wrote it made it seem that you thought he had no choice I would say he had a choice with a very low possibility or probability that he wouldnt turn out how he did. Given that Everything making him who he was (the person who would become Odiums champion was removed, @Bejardin1250 Not what i am saying at all, What i am saying is what i said above. People seem to argue very little was taken from Dalinar when everything making him who he was, was taken. Every negative characteristic, every bass impulse etc etc what was left was only the good qualities, only the person Evi seen he could be was left. Edited March 31, 2021 by Quick Ben 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 8 minutes ago, Quick Ben said: Not what i am saying at all, What i am saying is what i said above. People seem to argue very little was taken from Dalinar when everything making him who he was, was taken. Every negative characteristic, every bass impulse etc etc what was left was only the good qualities, only the person Evi seen he could be was left. How did you see this exactly? The only thing that was taken from him was Evi and his memories of her that’s all. What exactly do you mean when you say “Good qualities” he’s still totally ignores Navanis right to lead her own ship. And he still hurts his nephew. And he still felt the urge to drink If the change was so drastic as you say it was. Then why didn’t everyone know he had seen the Nightwatcher it must have been a natural change that took time over the years. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LewsTherinTelescope Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 hour ago, Quick Ben said: Jasnah killing him wrong This one was likely directly due to his own actions interfering, though. She was struggling with the decision, but him turning and nodding was what broke her determination. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quick Ben Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 1 hour ago, Bejardin1250 said: How did you see this exactly? The only thing that was taken from him was Evi and his memories of her that’s all. What exactly do you mean when you say “Good qualities” he’s still totally ignores Navanis right to lead her own ship. And he still hurts his nephew. And he still felt the urge to drink If the change was so drastic as you say it was. Then why didn’t everyone know he had seen the Nightwatcher it must have been a natural change that took time over the years. I already explained all of the above in previous posts, you don't see it how i do, which is fine, but i also don't see it how you do, You clearly think all that was taken was memories of Evi, and that is what changed him. I think far more was. All that changed with the memories of Evi were his need to drink, and responsibilities for her death. If the man we seen before rathalas and after the nightwatcher seens the same to you then fair enough. To be hes an entirely different person. 41 minutes ago, LewsTherinTelescope said: This one was likely directly due to his own actions interfering, though. She was struggling with the decision, but him turning and nodding was what broke her determination. Still has only got one thing he has "foreseen" right. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LewsTherinTelescope Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Quick Ben said: Still has only got one thing he has "foreseen" right. He also saw that they'd go to Thaylen City, as well as what was going to happen with the Eila Stele reveal. And they showed him how to find the gemstones in Urithiru. Plus he saw Teft coming out of the Oathgate. And considering how he talks about it, it sounds like there's a lot more that were showing too, and yet, Jasnah killing him was the first that was wrong. Edited March 31, 2021 by LewsTherinTelescope 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quick Ben Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 28 minutes ago, LewsTherinTelescope said: He also saw that they'd go to Thaylen City, as well as what was going to happen with the Eila Stele reveal. And they showed him how to find the gemstones in Urithiru. Plus he saw Teft coming out of the Oathgate. And considering how he talks about it, it sounds like there's a lot more that were showing too, and yet, Jasnah killing him was the first that was wrong. Ya your right, had forgot those, as being honest don't overly like Renarin so don't pay to much attention to him. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CameronUluvara Posted March 31, 2021 Report Share Posted March 31, 2021 Honestly, I think this isn't making sense because you're looking at it like a Skybreaker. Yeah, Roshone committed manslaughter-three times-but it's not Kaladin's oath to right wrongs or even uphold the law. The Windrunners are a balancing force on the Skybreakers: everyone has broken some law at some point, and therefore deserves punishment, but the Windrunners plea for mercy, try to protect people. That's why the drawers back in Oathbringer talk about the conflicts between those orders; they have nearly opposite ideologies and the Skybreakers resent the Windrunners' supernatural ability to discern good from bad situationally instead of lawfully. Another problem is that Kaladin didn't have the legal authority to deal with Roshone. Not to kill him, not even to put him in a jail. Sure, Dalinar probably could have smoothed things over, but that's a really bad precedent to set. People who hate the law dealing out arbitrary justice? Not killing Roshone separates the orders. Kaladin swore his third oath, essentially, to put responsibility over personal grievances. To then have him then turn around and kill Roshone would have been cheap. The Windrunners protect, protect, protect. Anyone. And that's how they temper the harshness of the law. Even when people fail, fall, break the law, they're still people, and somebody still loves them. Like how Raboniel knew Kaladin wouldn't kill her, it's a common theme throughout Sanderson's work that if you're not a direct, immediate threat, you don't deserve to die. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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