Mid-Range Game 49: Lode of Luthadel

[Archer]

57 minutes ago, Flyingbooks said:

I'll RP as Lan MinRai

That's that guy who wrote Hamilton right? 

Hey TJ, say there's three players, one from each faction. The exe kills the villager, so they lose. Then the elims try to kill each other with their elim kills. Who wins? 

[STINK]

hello yes is this thing on

Signing up as Udfolt

[|TJ|]

2 hours ago, Archer said:

Hey TJ, say there's three players, one from each faction. The exe kills the villager, so they lose. Then the elims try to kill each other with their elim kills. Who wins? 

I am already dreading endgame scenarios *sigh* Technically no one would have won, cause there is not last team standing, but I'd give the victory to the two elim teams, as they'd have done the equivalent of eliminate all other parties.

[Quivil]

@TJ Shade Can I change my name to Reva?

Edited March 16, 2021 by Tani

[|TJ|]

1 hour ago, Tani said:

@TJ Shade Can I change my name to Reva?

Sure you can. 

Tiny clarification - Randomized Seeker scan from a Terris cannot be Smoked. 

[Shard of Reading]

I'll sign up.

TJ, is this a role madness game, and can I bribe you to give me the terris role? Please? I want it....

[|TJ|]

2 hours ago, Shard of Reading said:

TJ, is this a role madness game, and can I bribe you to give me the terris role? Please? I want it....

PAFO :P. and you can try. Maybe I'll take the bribe and just...ignore the other part of the bribe :P.

Also, the first cycle will probably go up a bit late because *sigh* work. 

[|TJ|]

Annnnd time! Sign-ups are closed, you should be receiving you PMs shortly. Have a good game!

[|TJ|]

Cycle One - Starlight

Zane hung from atop of one of the looming spires of Kredik Shaw. He’d reckon the info was solid, as old Straff only recruited the best of the spies. He looked down at the entourage that was passing by, which confirmed what the spies had relayed. Lord Ruler’s final resting place was indeed a treasure trove of atium. Straff didn’t trust him of course. He’d have surely sent his other mercs to watch him or even kill him if he even made a false move, though he didn’t know any of them. It didn’t matter-

Kill them. All of them! One after another, till no one remains!

He ignored it as he always did, though the voice in his head grew louder in the recent months. Well, perhaps the end was near. He supposed it would be a mercy, after everything he’d done. There was only one tiny hope for him. 

Hope for normalcy. Hope for a cure from this insanity. The one thing that’s stopping me from wishing my own death. She’s supposed to help me. She has to…

He swooped down in a single move and slowed himself to a halt as he Pushed on a fallen coin just as the Cett entourage had entered the monstrous mansion of the Lord Ruler. Starlight shone on his face as he quietly went about his business. 

***

Elsewhere, a young lady slipped and sneaked away from under her father’s steadfast attention, guised as her brother as she set out to meet the Wind.

---

Welcome to MR49! Cycle 1 has begun and will end on March 18, at 23:30 IST [GMT +5:30]. Let me know if you haven't received you GM PM. Please try to bold your votes and give retractions in green (not a rule, unlike in Kas' game). There are no PMs in this game. Have fun and don't forget to put your actions in! Eliminators, do not forget to vote for your kill in your GM PMs. 

Player List: 

Spoiler

1. @Quintessential - Tess Mourn
2. @Flyingbooks - Lan MinRai
3. @Liranil
4. @Matrim's Dice - Philico
5. @Random Bystander
6. @Ashbringer - Faleast
7. @Archer - Dim
8. @StrikerEZ
9. @Illwei
10. @Gears - Roko the Basilisk
11. @Biplet
12. @The Unknown Order - Nicole Atyo
13. @Ventyl
14. @Experience
15. @Tani - Reva
16. @PizzaPower55
17. @STINK - Udfolt
18. @Shard of Reading

Additional Clarifications: 

Spoiler

Since Kas' game had similar roles, it might cause confusion at times where things are different, so I'm highlighting those stuff so that it's clear

1. Smokers will have to give an action to Smoke themselves (and their target). There is no auto self-Smoking.
2. Seekers only see the metal being burned by their target. If their target do not burn any metal in that cycle, then no result is obtained.
3. Soother and Rioter targets will not be told that they were manipulated.
4. Coinshot targets will be told they were redirected.

Edited March 16, 2021 by TJ Shade

[The Unknown Ajah]

Hooray, I'm finally in a game again.

[Gears]

The following is an analysis of the rules

Factions: This game involves several aspects that are not standard, specifically limited communication eliminator teams, unknown eliminator teams, multiple eliminator teams.

Venture Loyalists: Semi-standard village. 2 opponents to get rid of, with the stipulation that the other factions will do your work for you inadvertently.

Cett Opportunists: Semi-eliminator. Off the village [like normal] but also kill off the other group. You do not know your allies. Take care not to get them X-ed by mistake, though you can’t kill them. Protect your Mistborn at all costs. You all know who that one is. A thought: Ally with the enemy to eliminate the enemy upon which the alliance was founded and then kill everyone else. Perhaps your Mistborn can communicate through RP and such. Quick word for the wise, if Vin claims, you should kill them instantly along with the other elim faction. If you double-tap successfully, you’ll either burn their extra life [if they were protected] or kill them [if not]. Murder is always good.

Straff Mercenaries: See Cett Opportunists.

Kill Mechanics: We live in a democracy. A very random democracy. A person who voted for it may get their action snatched. As such, people taking crucial actions may wish to abstain from the vote. Those who do not risk being snatched. Of course, take an action. Always do that. Since the vote count itself is not revealed, communications cannot transpire via that route, so simply vote for players one thinks may be dangerous. Alas, this is also not a way to find other members of the group, since again, no vote count reveal. Mistborns are fortunate to not lose their action, so perhaps everyone should abstain from the vote except for the Mistborn, ensuring the superior action economy. It only works if everyone concurs, but it is viable.

Roles

Coinshot: Redirect randomly. Works best if one knows the role of the relevant individual, but without PMs, that is a distant hope. Chaos is always good, though. Possibly a way to learn the target’s role if it has a visible effect [id est Rioter, Soother, Lurcher]

Lurcher: Protection without self-targeting or double-protecting. Elims: Alternate between the Mistborn and the random person you know. Villagers: Good luck.

Tineye: Learn target of player. Better than Coinshot at determining role. Can determine murderers. Elims: Try to find power roles as a terrible Seeker. Villagers: Watch the night for knives and tell the Watch in the light.

Thug: Passive extra life. Not much to say here.

Rioter: Force vote on a person. Good way to ensure X. Of course, there is the stipulation that one would often vote on a person again, so look for someone who is lenient in suspicion.

Soother: Force vote off a person. Good way to save someone under fire.

Smoker: Immune to vote manip and scans. Always have this up, perhaps target your Mistborn if you are elim because if they get scanned multiple times and those scans contradict each other, they will be discovered instantly.

Seeker: See metal burned. A semi-role scan. Scan a person twice to catch Mistborn.

Terris: You determine a random piece of information about a random person.  

Mistborn: Each group gets a Mistborn, but the elim Mistborns each have a distinct disadvantage. Zane cannot choose his own metals, and Gneorndin [who I didn’t realise the existence of] does not have atium or duraluminium. This is to compensate for the village’s lack of knowledge as to the identity of their Mistborn. I would say that Zane is at a worse disadvantage, and thus the Straff Mercenaries might have a stronger team. Then again, it is hard to know exactly how strong atium and duraluminium are, so perhaps Gneorndin and that lot will need a stronger team.

Atium: Know actions and respond. Works best if you are of the appropriate time zone, use in moments of great danger. Alternately, everyone in a faction target the Mistborn, Mistborn uses atium first cycle, instantly learn the roles of everyone in the faction, with the error of perhaps being targeted by someone else. [This is a terrible idea. Teammates, don’t do this]

Duralumin: Two targets instead of one. Vote manip? Seeker?

Basics [perhaps this should have gone up top]: One action per cycle with exceptions, no PMs [to prevent just getting in touch with the relevant people, id est everyone in a faction PMs the Mistborn, the Mistborn reveals all to everyone. Good choice there.]. Random ties. No distinguished kills.

Order of Actions: Redirects, immunity to vote manip, vote manip, vote off, protection, elim murder, scans. Does this mean that being X-ed will affect one’s ability to vote in the elim kill?

[Sidenote: 800 words exactly on analysis [including this portion meant to reach that goal but that’s not important], huzzah!]

---

Roko the Basilisk, slightly broken machine, dragged itself towards the city of Luthadel, following in the footsteps of Straff Venture and his mercenaries. The other groups were interesting in theory but dull up close, much like a lump of pyrite shining in the sun, but the mercenary group had one aspect that drew its attention: Zane. The connections to Ruin, the fractured mind, the perceived lack of control, all fascinating for both psychological and Investiture-related reasons. There was one of their number that had fallen ill a few days ago, a foreign disease from off-world. They had stayed behind, saying that they would return if they recovered. And now they would never recover. This one was clever enough, it supposed, with a fascination for numbers that they kept buried deep. An adequate candidate in lieu of any other choices. The mind of the mercenary mixed well with the rest, the lack of moral principles matching the Multitude and the numerical aptitude co-existing with the moneylender’s excellently.

With the mind of the mercenary sufficiently assimilated, Roko began restructuring its form to match. It took some time, but with a wealth of genetic material ready for sampling, it was not difficult. Soon, Roko looked almost… human. In its normal form, it of course took on a vaguely humanoid shape, but there were many spots where humanity was sacrificed for efficiency. The eyes, the veins, the limbs, all restructured for optimal use. But this form was for blending in among people who knew the individual it was trying to be, for being human, truly human, not a mere facsimile. It would have to be perfect. It would settle for nothing less. Flesh slid across bone, blood began to flow, a heart started beating regularly. Human. Real. It stared at its new face in a mirror, checked the hair follicles one last time, and grinned. It truly looked like one of Straff’s Mercenaries now.

[Mat]

I’m kinda busy right now, but a post to say hello, I’m here

I’ll reread the rules later, when I have more time, likely this afternoon.

(Oh, a side note being that I probably won’t be as active this game cause I’ll be running the LG after Kas’, though when exactly that will start I don’t know. It might not impact that much.)

[Shard of Reading]

This game is going to be fun!

So, 2 ideas about the possibilities for the elim team are either 1: normal size elim team cut in half. (18 players, 1/5th is 3.6, 1/4th is 4.5. That means 2 from cett, and 2 from venture.) Or, 2 you double the team sizes. This means 3-4 players on each team. The teams are probably equal, and so that means 6-8 elimintors. I think that makes more sense because they have to kill everyone not just reach parity.

Edit: I meant Straff, not Venture.

Edited March 16, 2021 by Shard of Reading

[|TJ|]

A quick reminder that any sort of communication through code or cipher is not allowed and strictly prohibited in SE :P.

[Quivil]

4 minutes ago, The Unknown Order said:

Hooray, I'm finally in a game again.

Same.

 

Are we s'posed to vote for the exe in-thread? I don't remember...

 

Gneorndin's not a Mistborn... Cett has no Mistborn... and he has barely any Mistings...

[Shard of Reading]

Just now, Tani said:

Gneorndin's not a Mistborn...

Gneorndin's not cannon. I think he was added to balance it for Cett's team.

[Ashbringer]

Cett had a Mistborn, but he wasn’t Gneorndin. (He was also murdered by Vin in WoA around Chaper Two ).

But yeah Gneorndin is just for name-recognition and balancing the teams... and him versus Zane does it fairly well, as I’m not sure which is more powerful. Randomness and Power versus Choice and Comparitive Weakness... Gneordin has the edge in my opinion but a Duralumin-boosted Rioting can pull off a four-vote swing. That’s... that’s something.

Edited March 16, 2021 by Ashbringer
Around, not about

[Archer]

“Wasing the buying of washing from Walter?”

“No, no, buying the washing was Walter,” said a helpful shirt salesman, as Archer remembered he can use dialogue tags in this game.

“Right,” replied Dim, scribbling notes on his pad. “Wasing washing from Walter.”

“Wasing right ‘til you write washing and wasnot.”

Archer was already regretting his RP decisions.

***

Rules Analysis (I wrote this prior to game start, so I’ll respond to others’ below)

The roles can be categorized as:

-Vote manip: Rioter, Soother

-Protection: Lurcher (can’t stop exes), Thug, Mistborn*

-Scanner: Tineye, Seeker, Terris

-Action manip: Coinshot, Smoker

TJ’s last game was role madness, so my working assumption is that this one is as well. Alternatively, we have one player of each role and the rest (6 people) are vanillas. My guess for the former distribution is that we have three mistborn, four vote manipulators, three protectors (excluding mistborn), four scanners, and four action manipulators. It’s going to take a while to figure out the exact distribution, as the vote manipulators can’t start working until C2, and even then, a mistborn might get the role too. The kill flips at rollover will likely be more informative.

I assume that the eliminator factions will be of equal strength, very likely by having the same number of players on them. For variety, they likely won’t have players with the same roles, however, the roles will be balanced between the two teams. For example, Straff co might have a thug and a Rioter, while the Cett Ops might have a Lurcher and a Soother.

A quarter of 18 is 4.5, so a fair regular distribution would be 5. The elims lack a doc and are divided, so I’m thinking it’s teams of 3 or 4, for a total of 6 or 8. Four is not necessarily the worst-case scenario, as if it’s threes, they will have stronger roles, such as protection roles.

Let’s say it’s 3:3:12 and a non-role madness game. If every exe kills an elim and every NK kills a villager, it will go 2:3:10 – 2:2:8 – 1:2:6 – 1:1:4 (at this point, elims have only mistborn, and village has a mistborn and a thug. Let’s say the kills all hit protected people) – ½:1:[1/2+1/2+2] – 0:1:2 – 0:1/2:1 – 0:0:0 (but village wins because of OoA.) This is an oversimplification that doesn’t really engage with the potential of roles or potential elim crossfire, but as you can see by how close it is, 3:3:12 is hard enough for the village to win. I feel that eight elims would be too many.

Other Notes:

Please avoiding speculating about optimal eliminator strategies in ways that may actually benefit the elim teams. Since there is no elim docs, they have to do their planning in the open or not at all. If we avoid comments like “the elims will probably vote for so and so tonight,” they will struggle to coordinate. I will be watching for any subtle signalling that is attempted.

Please use your roles, scanners. We will struggle to win without a clutch insight or two.

Please do not lie about your role. Disinformation hurts the village more than the elims. It is reasonable to assume that anyone who lies is an elim.

33 minutes ago, Gears said:

Cett Opportunists: Semi-eliminator. Off the village [like normal] but also kill off the other group. You do not know your allies. Take care not to get them X-ed by mistake, though you can’t kill them. Protect your Mistborn at all costs. You all know who that one is. A thought: Ally with the enemy to eliminate the enemy upon which the alliance was founded and then kill everyone else. Perhaps your Mistborn can communicate through RP and such. Quick word for the wise, if Vin claims, you should kill them instantly along with the other elim faction. If you double-tap successfully, you’ll either burn their extra life [if they were protected] or kill them [if not]. Murder is always good.

Since the vote count itself is not revealed, communications cannot transpire via that route

Does this mean that being X-ed will affect one’s ability to vote in the elim kill?

 

1. This appears to be an elim signaling strategy to his teammates under the guise of his usual analysis. In a limited communication game, this advantages the elims exponentially more than it helps the village. It's not great signaling, as it doesn't say much the elims wouldn't already be thinking, but it's still dangerous. 

2. I hadn't caught that, good eye. 

3. I also had this question. It affects my exlo scenario listed above, so depending what TJ says, I may need to change that. 

30 minutes ago, Shard of Reading said:

This game is going to be fun!

So, 2 ideas about the possibilities for the elim team are either 1: normal size elim team cut in half. (18 players, 1/5th is 3.6, 1/4th is 4.5. That means 2 from cett, and 2 from venture.) Or, 2 you double the team sizes. This means 3-4 players on each team. The teams are probably equal, and so that means 6-8 elimintors. I think that makes more sense because they have to kill everyone not just reach parity.

Edit: I meant Straff, not Venture.

You thought along similar lines as I, although I completely discounted two person teams as a possibility. Thoughts on potential role distribution among them? (I realize that could also be used to signal, but we have to talk about something.)

26 minutes ago, Tani said:

Are we s'posed to vote for the exe in-thread? I don't remember...

Yes, vote in thread. For example, I'll cast my vote in red here: Gears (to retract it, put it in green) 

Hi! This might be our first game together. Same with the pizza guy, whose name I forget. Hi, pizza guy!

Edit: Also hi to Biplet! 

Edited March 16, 2021 by Archer

[Mat]

19 minutes ago, Shard of Reading said:

So, 2 ideas about the possibilities for the elim team are either 1: normal size elim team cut in half. (18 players, 1/5th is 3.6, 1/4th is 4.5. That means 2 from cett, and 2 from venture.) Or, 2 you double the team sizes. This means 3-4 players on each team. The teams are probably equal, and so that means 6-8 elimintors. I think that makes more sense because they have to kill everyone not just reach parity.

I don't think the teams are equal because of the knowledge (though limited) the elim factions do have. I think that Cett and Straff's teams are likely the same size (maybe one is larger or smaller depending on roles, but I doubt it) and the village team is probably larger.

Looking at the numbers... my guess would be 10/4/4 or 8/5/5, with a slight preference towards 10/4/4, but that's just going with my gut  I've never seen a game like this play out so TJ could have done anything.

I'm with Ash on Gneorndin vs Zane- I think the randomness is a pretty large crutch but Atium and Duralumin are strong.

22 minutes ago, Tani said:

Are we s'posed to vote for the exe in-thread? I don't remember...

Yeah, where else would we vote?

Ninja'd by Archer.

[PizzaPower55]

4 minutes ago, Archer said:

Hi! This might be our first game together. Same with the pizza guy, whose name I forget. Hi, pizza guy!

I believe you refer to me when you say "pizza guy", so hello!

[Shard of Reading]

1 minute ago, Matrim's Dice said:

I don't think the teams are equal because of the knowledge (though limited) the elim factions do have. I think that Cett and Straff's teams are likely the same size (maybe one is larger or smaller depending on roles, but I doubt it) and the village team is probably larger.

When I said equal teams, I was talking about only the elims. Not the village.

5 minutes ago, Archer said:

You thought along similar lines as I, although I completely discounted two person teams as a possibility. Thoughts on potential role distribution among them? (I realize that could also be used to signal, but we have to talk about something.)

Ummm.... I don't really do much role distribution guessing. I think it might be a seeker, mistborn, vote manip and protection.

I'm operating under the assumption this is a role madness game, because I don't want a repeat of TJ's last game.

[Mat]

1 minute ago, Shard of Reading said:

When I said equal teams, I was talking about only the elims. Not the village.

Ah, well in that case, we agree

[---]

Yo idk what I'm doing this game but if someone dares to call meta on me i will smite you

in a fun, friendly way :P.

53 minutes ago, Gears said:

Cett Opportunists: Semi-eliminator. Off the village [like normal] but also kill off the other group. You do not know your allies. Take care not to get them X-ed by mistake, though you can’t kill them. Protect your Mistborn at all costs. You all know who that one is. A thought: Ally with the enemy to eliminate the enemy upon which the alliance was founded and then kill everyone else. Perhaps your Mistborn can communicate through RP and such. Quick word for the wise, if Vin claims, you should kill them instantly along with the other elim faction. If you double-tap successfully, you’ll either burn their extra life [if they were protected] or kill them [if not]. Murder is always good.

Yeah idrk what you're saying here but yeah both teams are probably smaller because there's more of them, so theoretically the best plan for them is to obviously take eachother out and find the other elims

Yo honestly this game is gonna be tougher for village because the Elims...don't have as much TMI as normal? especially with both 1) a second elim team that they have to find as well, either to take out or avoid and 2) The other members of their faction to find. so it's going to be a ton easier for them to try and look like they're solving the game, and a tonne easier for them to not look coordinated because...they can't coordinate. so yeah.

53 minutes ago, Gears said:

Mistborn: Each group gets a Mistborn, but the elim Mistborns each have a distinct disadvantage. Zane cannot choose his own metals, and Gneorndin [who I didn’t realise the existence of] does not have atium or duraluminium. This is to compensate for the village’s lack of knowledge as to the identity of their Mistborn. I would say that Zane is at a worse disadvantage, and thus the Straff Mercenaries might have a stronger team. Then again, it is hard to know exactly how strong atium and duraluminium are, so perhaps Gneorndin and that lot will need a stronger team.

Okay the Elim nerf here makes sense then, with me actually thinking things through. it still doesn't make it any easier to identify villagers or Elims imo though, so it's a debuff/buff in a completely different area so /shrug

50 minutes ago, Shard of Reading said:

So, 2 ideas about the possibilities for the elim team are either 1: normal size elim team cut in half. (18 players, 1/5th is 3.6, 1/4th is 4.5. That means 2 from cett, and 2 from venture.) Or, 2 you double the team sizes. This means 3-4 players on each team. The teams are probably equal, and so that means 6-8 elimintors. I think that makes more sense because they have to kill everyone not just reach parity.

Note that there are going to be two factional kills a cycle though. the counter here I assume is the Elims not knowing their own teams /shrug.

24 minutes ago, Archer said:

It is reasonable to assume that anyone who lies is an elim.

I will kill you right now

Sorry this is just my dislike of people trying to control the thread coming through :P.

 

[Liranil]

Hello! I'll go back and read the rules and people's analysis of the rules after I've gotten some productive real-life things done, but until then... I exist!

[Gears]

29 minutes ago, Archer said:

Rules Analysis (I wrote this prior to game start, so I’ll respond to others’ below)

The roles can be categorized as:

-Vote manip: Rioter, Soother

-Protection: Lurcher (can’t stop exes), Thug, Mistborn*

-Scanner: Tineye, Seeker, Terris

-Action manip: Coinshot, Smoker

TJ’s last game was role madness, so my working assumption is that this one is as well. Alternatively, we have one player of each role and the rest (6 people) are vanillas. My guess for the former distribution is that we have three mistborn, four vote manipulators, three protectors (excluding mistborn), four scanners, and four action manipulators. It’s going to take a while to figure out the exact distribution, as the vote manipulators can’t start working until C2, and even then, a mistborn might get the role too. The kill flips at rollover will likely be more informative.

The roles in this game are weak enough that I find role madness a reasonable assumption until a counterclaim exists. I would lean towards more protects instead of action or vote manipulators because there are two faction kills thrown about in the midnight hours.

29 minutes ago, Archer said:

I assume that the eliminator factions will be of equal strength, very likely by having the same number of players on them. For variety, they likely won’t have players with the same roles, however, the roles will be balanced between the two teams. For example, Straff co might have a thug and a Rioter, while the Cett Ops might have a Lurcher and a Soother.

A quarter of 18 is 4.5, so a fair regular distribution would be 5. The elims lack a doc and are divided, so I’m thinking it’s teams of 3 or 4, for a total of 6 or 8. Four is not necessarily the worst-case scenario, as if it’s threes, they will have stronger roles, such as protection roles.

Given that each elim knows the Mistborn and one other, teams of three mean that the non-Mistborns all know who each other are. As such, I'm discounting teams of 3 because it removes the 'unknown teammates' aspect of the game.

29 minutes ago, Archer said:

Other Notes:

Please avoiding speculating about optimal eliminator strategies in ways that may actually benefit the elim teams. Since there is no elim docs, they have to do their planning in the open or not at all. If we avoid comments like “the elims will probably vote for so and so tonight,” they will struggle to coordinate. I will be watching for any subtle signalling that is attempted.

Please do not lie about your role. Disinformation hurts the village more than the elims. It is reasonable to assume that anyone who lies is an elim.

Better that everyone knows, yes? Better that everyone is aware of the worst-case. [I do concede that you're probably right about this, but I find that public knowledge about every possible thing is advantageous as well.]

Exactly the opposite. Elims would be more honest if anything because they have much more to lose. Also, Vin, our Mistborn, all hail, would plausibly lie about their role considering their power. And chaos is good. A note: You have great analysis but make broad assumptions at the end. Assumptions are inherently bad [not suspicious, disadvantageous].

29 minutes ago, Archer said:

1. This appears to be an elim signaling strategy to his teammates under the guise of his usual analysis. In a limited communication game, this advantages the elims exponentially more than it helps the village. It's not great signaling, as it doesn't say much the elims wouldn't already be thinking, but it's still dangerous. 

Pre-written analysis is prewritten. And NAI, presumably. Unless you think otherwise, in which case do inform me as to why.

1 minute ago, Illwei said:

Yo idk what I'm doing this game but if someone dares to call meta on me i will smite you

in a fun, friendly way :P.

Meta!Wei does not match Current!Wei! Congratulations on your attempts to diversify your play. Getting trapped in one meta is always a nuisance.

1 minute ago, Illwei said:

Yeah idrk what you're saying here but yeah both teams are probably smaller because there's more of them, so theoretically the best plan for them is to obviously take eachother out and find the other elims

The thought was every semi-elim openly claiming their faction to vote as a bloc and constantly X and kill villagers to get rid of the X and then promptly slaughtering each other. It's not viable because the first team to betray wins in that case but there must be a certain degree of villagers killed.

1 minute ago, Illwei said:

Yo honestly this game is gonna be tougher for village because the Elims...don't have as much TMI as normal? especially with both 1) a second elim team that they have to find as well, either to take out or avoid and 2) The other members of their faction to find. so it's going to be a ton easier for them to try and look like they're solving the game, and a tonne easier for them to not look coordinated because...they can't coordinate. so yeah.

You make an excellent point. Though do be on the lookout for kamikazee saving throws towards a Mistborn. 

1 minute ago, Illwei said:

I will kill you right now

Sorry this is just my dislike of people trying to control the thread coming through :P.

Murder is good.