Chinkoln Posted March 23, 2021 Report Share Posted March 23, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Parzival said: Just cause you can see the future doesn't mean you won't get injured. In the first few chapters of steelheart they kill a precognitive epic by making it impossible for him to have a way out. And the closer they are the less the seer can see movement form atium shadows and the harder it is to not get hit at all. Well how would you pull off something like a metal bracer from someones arm and not get hit or grabbed? I don't think the seer could get every metalmind off without getting hit, worn down, or grabbed. I just meant they would put metalminds in themselves to prevent that, not for this specific example. Thanks so much! Signature lign here I come! Reckoners and Cosmere have some similarities, but different functions. Also, precognition is not the same as seeing the literal future. Proximity wouldn’t affect anything. The deer’s mind is enhanced to be able to comprehend all the shadow(s). If the seer can remove even a single metalmind, they now have an advantage. The compounder will run out before the seer. Edited March 23, 2021 by Chinkoln Autocorrect + Brandon Terminology don’t mix wel 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted March 23, 2021 Report Share Posted March 23, 2021 1 hour ago, Chinkoln said: What if the seer removes the “immortality” aspect from the gold compounder? The seer jumps around and rips the metal minds off, and now this compounder is just a guy who can use gold. Seers aren't any faster, It is really dificult to get a hit in on an opponent without getting hit yourself, even if they find a way to dodge, they aren't fast enough to remove all metalminds 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 23, 2021 Report Share Posted March 23, 2021 2 minutes ago, Frustration said: Seers aren't any faster, It is really dificult to get a hit in on an opponent without getting hit yourself, even if they find a way to dodge, they aren't fast enough to remove all metalminds They only need to remove one to gain an advantage. Removing one takes away a small piece of metal, and will mean they run out before the seer. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted March 23, 2021 Report Share Posted March 23, 2021 1 minute ago, Chinkoln said: They only need to remove one to gain an advantage. Removing one takes away a small piece of metal, and will mean they run out before the seer. You can't just rip a bracer off, depending on how it's designed you would need a key, or to push in the right area, it's not that simple. And on top of that one bracer would outlast the entirety of a seers supply. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 23, 2021 Report Share Posted March 23, 2021 30 minutes ago, Frustration said: You can't just rip a bracer off, depending on how it's designed you would need a key, or to push in the right area, it's not that simple. And on top of that one bracer would outlast the entirety of a seers supply. I guess it does depend. A ring like Sazed has could be taken off, but embedded in flesh like the Lord Ruler might be difficult. Also, taking off a bracer would be enough. The scenario states that they have the perfect amount of metals to have the exact same time of healing/future sight 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parzival Posted March 23, 2021 Report Share Posted March 23, 2021 9 minutes ago, Chinkoln said: I guess it does depend. A ring like Sazed has could be taken off, but embedded in flesh like the Lord Ruler might be difficult. Also, taking off a bracer would be enough. The scenario states that they have the perfect amount of metals to have the exact same time of healing/future sight But the gold compounder wouldn't have to be drawing on their health stores the whole time, only when they get injured 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 23, 2021 Report Share Posted March 23, 2021 35 minutes ago, Parzival said: But the gold compounder wouldn't have to be drawing on their health stores the whole time, only when they get injured And the seer only has to burn atium when they are attacking or when the compounder gets close 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 23, 2021 Report Share Posted March 23, 2021 Why can’t the compounder just grapple? What’s the seer going to do, every time he gets close the Compounder would just grab him in a chokehold and the Compounder can leave himself open to attack while the Seer can’t 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parzival Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 6 hours ago, Chinkoln said: And the seer only has to burn atium when they are attacking or when the compounder gets close Which would be far more than the gold compounder needs to heal if they are in a fight to the death. If they are fighting to the death the seer would have to burn it constantly cause the gold compounder isn't gonna want a dragged out fight in which they run out of health. 5 hours ago, Bejardin1250 said: Why can’t the compounder just grapple? What’s the seer going to do, every time he gets close the Compounder would just grab him in a chokehold and the Compounder can leave himself open to attack while the Seer can’t This is exactly what would happen, since both are confined to hand to hand combat they would be so close that it would be impossible for the seer to not get hit or grabbed at all, especially against an opponent who knows he can't be beat so long as he has health 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 7 hours ago, Parzival said: Which would be far more than the gold compounder needs to heal if they are in a fight to the death. If they are fighting to the death the seer would have to burn it constantly cause the gold compounder isn't gonna want a dragged out fight in which they run out of health. The compounder has to burn a lot more than the seer, in my opinion. A direct blow to the head would knock them out if they aren't compounding. They need to be actively healing when wounded to withstand certain types of injuries. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 3 hours ago, Chinkoln said: The compounder has to burn a lot more than the seer, in my opinion. A direct blow to the head would knock them out if they aren't compounding. They need to be actively healing when wounded to withstand certain types of injuries. Well since he’s a compounder he can have a beer infinite store of healing like we saw with Miles Hundredlives So there is not a conceivable way that the Seer will last longer 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Bejardin1250 said: Well since he’s a compounder he can have a beer infinite store of healing like we saw with Miles Hundredlives So there is not a conceivable way that the Seer will last longer You can only compound if you have gold to burn and reserves to draw upon. It is a complicated process, but having less metal minds or having less metal to burn would put you at a disadvantage. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, Chinkoln said: You can only compound if you have gold to burn and reserves to draw upon. It is a complicated process, but having less metal minds or having less metal to burn would put you at a disadvantage. Well seeing as Atium is the most rare metal basically anywhere if you give that to a Seer you can’t withhold Gold from a Compounder 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 7 minutes ago, Bejardin1250 said: Well seeing as Atium is the most rare metal basically anywhere if you give that to a Seer you can’t withhold Gold from a Compounder We aren't withholding gold or atium. they each have the perfect amount so that if they started burning/compounding at the exact same time they would run out at the exact same time. I am saying that if they were to have a metal mind stolen, they wouldn't be able to compound for as long because a key ingredient was just stolen. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 Just now, Chinkoln said: We aren't withholding gold or atium. they each have the perfect amount so that if they started burning/compounding at the exact same time they would run out at the exact same time. I am saying that if they were to have a metal mind stolen, they wouldn't be able to compound for as long because a key ingredient was just stolen. The entire brokenness of Compounding is the limitness of it If you take that away he might as well be a ferring You can’t take away his biggest strength 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 3 hours ago, Chinkoln said: The compounder has to burn a lot more than the seer, in my opinion. A direct blow to the head would knock them out if they aren't compounding. They need to be actively healing when wounded to withstand certain types of injuries. Atium doesn't give boosted strength so I'm failing to see how a single hit would be a KO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 31 minutes ago, Frustration said: Atium doesn't give boosted strength so I'm failing to see how a single hit would be a KO. A finger in the eye An elbow into the solar plexus Hitting a pressure point 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 Just now, Chinkoln said: A finger in the eye An elbow into the solar plexus Hitting a pressure point If our dear seer is able to hit those places with zero negative consequences he has plot armor. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 Just now, Frustration said: If our dear seer is able to hit those places with zero negative consequences he has plot armor. It doesn’t matter if there is a negative consequence if it incapacitates the compounder. In WoR Spoiler Jakamav charged Adolin in the duel and knocked him off balance. He got a hit on the back for it, but it didn’t matter because he now had an advantage. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 Just now, Chinkoln said: It doesn’t matter if there is a negative consequence if it incapacitates the compounder. In WoR Reveal hidden contents Jakamav charged Adolin in the duel and knocked him off balance. He got a hit on the back for it, but it didn’t matter because he now had an advantage. A seer has to hit with no draw backs or he loses. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, Frustration said: A seer has to hit with no draw backs or he loses. Why? Depending on the drawback he would be fine. A broken bone doesn’t kill you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 Just now, Chinkoln said: Why? Depending on the drawback he would be fine. A broken bone doesn’t kill you. But it would put you out of fighting capability, unless your pain tolerance is superhuman 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Frustration said: But it would put you out of fighting capability, unless your pain tolerance is superhuman It really depends on which bone is broken, and the way it is broken. Pain tolerance isn’t as big as you might think. A few years ago I was doing gymnastics, broke my left arm, stood up, and went and played some GaGa Ball (You might not know what this is, but it is where you are in an enclosure and have to try and hit other people’s legs with a ball.). I didn’t notice anything wrong for a while. Edited March 24, 2021 by Chinkoln 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bejarden Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Chinkoln said: It really depends on which bone is broken, and the way it is broken. Pain tolerance isn’t as big as you might think. A few years ago I was doing gymnastics, broke my left arm, stood up, and went and played some GaGa Ball (You might not know what this is, but it is where you are in an enclosure and have to try and hit other people’s legs with a ball.). I didn’t notice anything wrong for a while. Usually in a Mistborn fight it will be brute strength that will break the bone which would probably hurt a lot Although I’ve never broken a bone so I can’t really estimate 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parzival Posted March 24, 2021 Report Share Posted March 24, 2021 3 hours ago, Chinkoln said: A finger in the eye An elbow into the solar plexus Hitting a pressure point Hitting any one of these spots would put the seer in the compounder's grasp and would be very hard to pull off, being a seer doesn't make them a better fighter either, just lets them react to future data faster. Plus a compounder would heal from any of these easily. And a single hit to the head wouldn't neccessarily be a KO, I do martial arts and I've kicked people in the head, and been kicked in the head, and it takes a lot more force in the exactly correct spot to knock someone out than lots of people think. And if the seer has the skills and know how to complete these techniques the compounder would have the same knowledge. 4 hours ago, Bejardin1250 said: The entire brokenness of Compounding is the limitness of it If you take that away he might as well be a ferring You can’t take away his biggest strength I agree, with even healing and atium its just a gold ferring versus a seer not a gold compounder vs a seer. 3 hours ago, Chinkoln said: Why? Depending on the drawback he would be fine. A broken bone doesn’t kill you. Yes, but it would slow you down, and every time you put wight and pressure on it it would flare up and get worse. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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