Frustration

I know Ba-Ado-Mishrams location.

78 posts in this topic

Do you remember which chapter of WoK Prime it was where that was mentioned? 

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3 minutes ago, Honorless said:

Do you remember which chapter of WoK Prime it was where that was mentioned? 

I do not, but it was when

Spoiler

Taln had just lead Jasnah through the tunnels, he thinks something along the lines of "the tunnels sereved another purpose, they hid something under the city"

 

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1 hour ago, Frustration said:

Now the only reason I could think of for a city to be called the City of Shadows was an unmade

Well, could also be that it could be this place Kaladin saw when riding the storm:

Quote

A city where people lived in gigantic, hollowed-out stalactites hanging beneath a titanic sheltered ridge.

That would probably be very shadowy.

Of course, an Unmade could be possible too, and it would likely be close to where Mishram was captured, so she could very well be there. It seems a reasonable location to me. Just pointing out it's not necessarily the only reason it could be named that.

1 hour ago, Frustration said:

WoK prime spoilers

  Hide contents

There is something the Heralds put under Rall Elorim that they wanted to remain secret.

Spoiler

Wasn't Ral Eram more like an early version of Urithiru in that version, and the name got changed?

Anyway, imo, the thing behind the door's a Dawnshard, or an early Cosmere equivalent.

Quote

Jasnah sighed, following him, last in line. She paused a second later, however, as she noticed a side passage. It appeared to be the only one in the corridor. She held her lantern high, revealing a door in the distance.

It was beautiful. Worked of metal and gemstones, it sparkled in her lanternlight. She could make out the pattern of the Double Eye set in its face, marked by ten massive gemstones at the Pole positions. Even from the distance, she could hear them humming slightly in her mind.

“Come on,” Taln said, appearing again at her side.

“What is that?” she asked.

Taln paused, his eyes quiet as he regarded the door. “It is nothing,” he finally said. “Come.”

 

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2 minutes ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

Well, could also be that it could be this place Kaladin saw when riding the storm:

That would probably be very shadowy.

Of course, an Unmade could be possible too, and it would likely be close to where Mishram was captured, so she could very well be there. It seems a reasonable location to me. Just pointing out it's not necessarily the only reason it could be named that.

  Reveal hidden contents

Wasn't Ral Eram more like an early version of Urithiru in that version, and the name got changed?

Anyway, imo, the thing behind the door's a Dawnshard, or an early Cosmere equivalent.

 

Thanks, I had forgoten about that place.

and thanks for the quote to, I suppose thats possible,

Spoiler

And yes it is early Urithiru, it's name is so similar I'm inclined to believe there is a realtion of more than an Oathgate.

 

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2 minutes ago, Frustration said:

it's name is so similar I'm inclined to believe there is a realtion of more than an Oathgate.

That might just be a reuse of a name he liked, similar to "Kkoloss" from Mythwalker becoming the word "koloss", despite the two things being nothing alike, or (to take things moved from one unpublished work to another) the name "amberite" for a material being moved from Mythwalker to Aether, despite the two materials being different. (Mythwalker was cannibalized for a lot, lol.)

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Just now, LewsTherinTelescope said:

That might just be a reuse of a name he liked, similar to "Kkoloss" from Mythwalker becoming the word "koloss", despite the two things being nothing alike, or (to take things moved from one unpublished work to another) the name "amberite" for a material being moved from Mythwalker to Aether, despite the two materials being different. (Mythwalker was cannibalized for a lot, lol.)

Fair enough, but it is just a revision of the same story, rather than a different one

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4 hours ago, Frustration said:

Fair enough, but it is just a revision of the same story, rather than a different one

Eh.... sort of. Prime is a very different story, even if there's some relation.

Spoiler

I don't think the Recreance, False Desolation, or even Unmade were ever mentioned in Prime, were they? The Knights Epellion seemingly sorta just... stopped existing when the kingdoms turned on one another. The powers were also tied to the royal lines of the nations. So the scenario was completely different. I mean, spren didn't even exist!

Edited by LewsTherinTelescope
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Just now, LewsTherinTelescope said:

Eh.... sort of. Prime is a very different story, even if there's some relation.

I wouldn't say different story altogether, but you are right it was a very different beast.

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4 hours ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

Eh.... sort of. Prime is a very different story, even if there's some relation.

I think you meant to spoil the second part instead of quoting it :)

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1 minute ago, mathiau said:

I think you meant to spoil the second part instead of quoting it :)

Oops, yep! Fixed, thanks.

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Seems like a pretty feasible theory. Glad I could be the one to inspire it :P

I like how you managed to use WoK prime as evidence, even though it seems like Brandon didn’t want us to do that. Didn’t he only release the book when he finally thought there wouldn’t really be any new info? Well looks like you found some. 

12 hours ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

Well, could also be that it could be this place Kaladin saw when riding the storm:

Quote

A city where people lived in gigantic, hollowed-out stalactites hanging beneath a titanic sheltered ridge.

That would probably be very shadowy.

I hope this is the case, I just reread that scene, and that description in particular made me a bit surprised. Like, we have a city as crazy as that, and we haven’t seen it in four entire books???? If Brandon is holding out on a setting that cool, it’s gotta be important later. I wonder if we could use the rest of Kal’s storm vision to try and place that city on the map, see if it lines up with Rall Elorim.

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That's an interesting thought. I could buy into it! Rall Elorim has been set up as something interesting, so there is definitely a thing of some significance there. Perhaps it is BAM, and the difficulty in freeing her will come not from finding her necessarily, but in getting to her.

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1 hour ago, Dannex said:

I wonder if we could use the rest of Kal’s storm vision to try and place that city on the map, see if it lines up with Rall Elorim

He generally seems to be moving east to west in the vision. Prior, he was seemingly likely in Tashikk, Azir, and Babatharnam, so Rall Elorim could match up, though it could be elsewhere.

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On 2/4/2021 at 6:35 AM, Frustration said:

Chemorish

Dai-Gonalthis

and Ba-Ado-Mishram

One of the first two was at the Davar household 

Uh... where did we learn this?

I have a irrational interest in Chemorish :P

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1 minute ago, Ashbringer said:

Uh... where did we learn this?

I have a irrational interest in Chemorish :P

here

Spoiler

Stormlightning

You told someone that Nan Balat likes to hurt things. Like, a supernatural tendency to hurt things.

Brandon Sanderson

It's more along the lines of, "He has suffered some...enhancement of a psychological issue through supernatural effects."

Stormlightning

It's not an Unmade thing?

Brandon Sanderson

RAFO! Good question! That's basically a confirmation, isn't it? *teasing laugh*

FanX 2018 (Sept. 7, 2018)

 

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Just now, Frustration said:

here

Huh. Do we know it's an Unmade we haven't found yet? I remember reading that (or something similar) but I thought it was just the Thrill.

... I guess the Thrill was in the Shattered Plains while Nan Balat was in Jah Keved. So who knows.

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Just now, Ashbringer said:

Huh. Do we know it's an Unmade we haven't found yet? I remember reading that (or something similar) but I thought it was just the Thrill.

... I guess the Thrill was in the Shattered Plains while Nan Balat was in Jah Keved. So who knows.

Nergural - Alethkar

Moeloch - Kharbranth

Re-Shephir - Urithiru

Ashertmarn/Sja-Anat inactive

Yelig nar - unbonded

BAM -bound(Rall Elorim)

Chemorish/Dai-Gonalthis unacounted for

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1 minute ago, Frustration said:

Chemorish/Dai-Gonalthis unacounted for

Wasn't one of them in Shinovar? Might be Ashertmarn though

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On 2/4/2021 at 9:35 AM, Frustration said:

I was asking my followers about what theory I should do next when @Dannex suggested Ba-Ado-Mishram

Which in my usuall style got me to go over everything we know for certain about BAM.

And while I didn't get a theory on powers, I think I know where she is.

In order to get to where Mishram is currently located we must first learn about the people who captured her, a quick read of the Gemstone Archive reveals two things related to BAM.

1. BAM had connected to the "Parsh" drawer 30-20 fourth emerald

  Reveal hidden contents

"Ba-Ado-Mishram has somehow Connected with the parsh people, as Odium once did. She provides Voidlight and facilitates forms of power. Our strike team is going to imprison her."

And something I think to be overlooked yet of more note

2.BAM's forces were going somewhere drawer 19-2 third Topaz

  Reveal hidden contents
"The enemy makes another push toward Feverstone Keep. I wish we knew what it was that had them so interested in that area. Could they be intent on capturing Rall Elorim?"

Rall Elorim, is the only thing that this Radiant can think of after what appears to be multiple attempts to take Feverstone, I think it safe to assume this is the case.

 

Now Rall Elorim is an intresting place, but at the same time very vauge, it has yet to be shown, in fact we only know a few things about it

1. It's called the city of Shadows for a reason, and Brandon won't tell us

  Reveal hidden contents

Blightsong

Can you give us any information on Rall Elorim?

Brandon Sanderson

Uhhhm, no other than its called City of Shadows for a reason.

OdysseyCon 2016 (April 8, 2016)

2. It has an Oathgate

3. and it was one of the First places Odium took on Roshar.

Now the only reason I could think of for a city to be called the City of Shadows was an unmade and currently only three are unaccounted for

Chemorish

Dai-Gonalthis

and Ba-Ado-Mishram

One of the first two was at the Davar household 

and one was so devestating that they caused the scouring of Aimia, but nothing like that has happened to either place, and was maybe in Shinovar but that came from Ishar and is to be questioned.

 

Another thing is the term Shadows, Shadows are created by a mixing of light and darkness, Light that is dark, or Voidlight, which happens to be something BAM could create.

And nothing but shadows has been made known to us, almost as if the unmade were limited, or bound in some way.

On top of that Odium's quick arival to Rall Elorim I believe is because he knows BAM is there, but has so far been unable to free her. Why? becasue his forces have only looked in the Physical realm.

Knowing that Unmade have a large pressence in the CR

  Reveal hidden contents

Chaos

There has been a question in the fandom ever since [Rhythm of War] Part One, where we learned that the Thrill got tossed in the ocean.

Brandon Sanderson

They, at Jasnah's suggestion (which came through Hoid), locked it in an aluminum box and threw it in the ocean. The argument for this being that anywhere they could hide it, the enemy could get to. And an Unmade would be pretty easy to find in the Cognitive Realm. You can't hide an Unmade very easily. Aluminum's gonna help a ton with doing that. So, what you have to do is try to make it as inaccessible as possible. And the most inaccessible thing they could do is lock it in an aluminum box and throw it in the ocean. If they had kept it anywhere in the city or what-not, then the enemy would have been able to find it very easily, even inside an aluminum box. This method was their best guess at being able to keep it out of the enemy's hands. It is not a great solution, unfortunately. There just isn't one that they could find. As we talk about a certain other Unmade who is somewhere locked in a gemstone that might come up in the next book maybe, we'll talk more about this.

Shardcast Interview (Jan. 23, 2021)

The recreance Radiants knew this and did something clever, just like when a human is physically brought into the cognitive their CA is replaced so they brought the gem into the CR to hide BAM's cognitive presence.

Aluminum gives an additional layer of protection and then place it in a convienent nearby city with access to the CR so as to hide any other oddities from the cognitive side, have the sibling keep the Oathgates from allowing CR travel, from anyplace but the Horneater peaks which is almost accrossed the enite continent, and you have yourself an airtight prision for an unmade.

 

In addition

WoK prime spoilers

  Reveal hidden contents

There is something the Heralds put under Rall Elorim that they wanted to remain secret.

TLDR

BAM is in the cognitive realm around Rall Elorim

If the enemy was intent on capturing rall elorim the obviously BAM has not yet been captured 

as that would have made them the parsh

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Just now, mathiau said:

Wasn't one of them in Shinovar? Might be Ashertmarn though

That was imformation from Ishar, so while possible, should be taken with a grain of salt.

1 minute ago, Bejardin1250 said:

If the enemy was intent on capturing rall elorim the obviously BAM has not yet been captured 

as that would have made them the parsh

So, when BAM was captured(2,000 years ago) they were trying to capture Rall Elorim. In OB one of the first cities to fall to Odium was Rall Elorim

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5 minutes ago, Frustration said:

 

So, when BAM was captured(2,000 years ago) they were trying to capture Rall Elorim. In OB one of the first cities to fall to Odium was Rall Elorim

My point is that they tried to capture it before BAM was captured so there’s no reason to think that she is there

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Oooooh.

I wonder if Odium purposefully didn't free Mishram in order to keep... whatever the heck happened when Mishram got captured from undoing itself.

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Just now, Bejardin1250 said:

My point is that they tried to capture it before BAM was captured so there’s no reason to think that she is there

The idea of that theory was they didn't move her and made protections for her gemstone at the same place they captured her

1 minute ago, Ashbringer said:

Oooooh.

I wonder if Odium purposefully didn't free Mishram in order to keep... whatever the heck happened when Mishram got captured from undoing itself.

And possibly to punish her for acting like a God

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Just now, Bejardin1250 said:

My point is that they tried to capture it before BAM was captured so there’s no reason to think that she is there

She was captured near there, as Feverstone was where the WIndrunners and Stonewards broke their oaths, and it'd be odd for them to break their oaths before having secured Mishram, so her still being nearby isn't too much of a strech.

2 minutes ago, Ashbringer said:

Oooooh.

I wonder if Odium purposefully didn't free Mishram in order to keep... whatever the heck happened when Mishram got captured from undoing itself.

That could be the case.

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