the_archduke

Double Eye of the Almighty

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Screenshot_2020-11-24-22-34-28-481.jpeg.6450e7cc0fe4cb55ae2af64fc57c4a65.jpeg

I think we are all familiar with the Double Eye of the Almighty that shows up in the surgebinding charts.  10 symbols in a sideways hourglass shape.  If you overlap Kora and Rayse's glyphs, the diamonds form this pattern.  Does it mean anything that symbols that represent the Edgedancers, Lightweavers and Bondsmiths show up in Rayse's glyph?

 

 

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On 11/24/2020 at 2:57 PM, the_archduke said:

10 symbols in a sideways hourglass shape.  If you overlap Kora and Rayse's glyphs, the diamonds form this pattern.  Does it mean anything that symbols that represent the Edgedancers, Lightweavers and Bondsmiths show up in Rayse's glyph?

I'm glad someone else found this too. I just noticed it today when looking back through the interior art from RoW. The diamonds are definitely arranged in the double eye of the almighty shape. The diamonds could represent essences or surges instead of the orders of Knights Radiant. But I don't think that gives any more of a clue why some of the diamonds appear as part of the glyph representing Cultivation's s light and others appear as part of the glyph representing Odium's light. Curiously, none of the diamonds are part of the glyph representing stormlight.

I've also been trying to tease out which parts of the Roshar glyph are shared by all three Shards, which are shared by two of the Shards, and which are unique to a particular Shard. I'm no expert on picking apart these glyphs, but it seems to me that the vaguely s-shaped glyphs pointing out to each side in the partial screen shot below are the only thing shared by all three glyphs:

So, I guess that would be the part of the glyphs that means "light"? There are definitely parts that the stormlight and lifelight glyphs share, and parts that the lifelight and voidlight glyphs share. There seems to be less overlap between the stormlight and voidlight glyphs.

I've also been trying to see whether I could parse any of the linguistics from this page in a way that would reveal any new information, but have hit a dead-end there as well. I'm hoping maybe others can find something here.

The phonemes in the stormlight glyph say "tavodovast" which means Tavast's light. The phonemes in the lifelight glyph say "koradaros" which means Koravari's light. And the phenomes in the voidlight glyph say "rasodonar" which means Rasan's light.

With tavadovast, it looks like maybe the word Tavast is split between the beginning and end of the word like so: tav-odo-vast. Which would make "odo" the portion of the word that means light.

Neither of the other two split quite as neatly. Although with rasodonar, there is again the "odo" in the middle, but "ras" and "nar" don't line up with Rasan the same way "tav" and "vast" line up with Tavast.

And then there's koradaros. I thought perhaps the "ada" in the middle is a gendered difference. With Cultivation being female, maybe they use "ada" instead of "odo" but then that leaves "kor" and "ros" on either side, which, again doesn't really line up with Koravari.

I can't seem to make heads or tails of this. But I'll note that the glyph for "light" is adoda, which seems like it could be some kind of combination of "odo" and "ada"

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4 minutes ago, mdross81 said:

I'm glad someone else found this too. I just noticed it today when looking back through the interior art from RoW. The diamonds are definitely arranged in the double eye of the almighty shape. The diamonds could represent essences or surges instead of the orders of Knights Radiant. But I don't think that gives any more of a clue why some of the diamonds appear as part of the glyph representing Cultivation's s light and others appear as part of the glyph representing Odium's light. Curiously, none of the diamonds are part of the glyph representing stormlight.

I've also been trying to tease out which parts of the Roshar glyph are shared by all three Shards, which are shared by two of the Shards, and which are unique to a particular Shard. I'm no expert on picking apart these glyphs, but it seems to me that the vaguely s-shaped glyphs pointing out to each side in the partial screen shot below are the only thing shared by all three glyphs:

 

So, I guess that would be the part of the glyphs that means "light"? There are definitely parts that the stormlight and lifelight glyphs share, and parts that the lifelight and voidlight glyphs share. There seems to be less overlap between the stormlight and voidlight glyphs.

I've also been trying to see whether I could parse any of the linguistics from this page in a way that would reveal any new information, but have hit a dead-end there as well. I'm hoping maybe others can find something here.

The phonemes in the stormlight glyph say "tavodovast" which means Tavast's light. The phonemes in the lifelight glyph say "koradaros" which means Koravari's light. And the phenomes in the voidlight glyph say "rasodonar" which means Rasan's light.

With tavadovast, it looks like maybe the word Tavast is split between the beginning and end of the word like so: tav-odo-vast. Which would make "odo" the portion of the word that means light.

Neither of the other two split quite as neatly. Although with rasodonar, there is again the "odo" in the middle, but "ras" and "nar" don't line up with Rasan the same way "tav" and "vast" line up with Tavast.

And then there's koradaros. I thought perhaps the "ada" in the middle is a gendered difference. With Cultivation being female, maybe they use "ada" instead of "odo" but then that leaves "kor" and "ros" on either side, which, again doesn't really line up with Koravari.

I can't seem to make heads or tails of this. But I'll note that the glyph for "light" is adoda, which seems like it could be some kind of combination of "odo" and "ada"

His name is Tanavast so even his doesn't line up.

The perfect form of light is Adoda so o and a are both used next to a d so it is probably gendered.

Edited by Frustration
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7 minutes ago, mdross81 said:

But I'll note that the glyph for "light" is adoda, which seems like it could be some kind of combination of "odo" and "ada"

Probably is just "ado" reflected, the way other Alethi words usually are made (example: khokh and linil are kho and lin). If I had to guess, it's just weird variance in things ("zeradoreh" has plain "ado" rather than "ada" or "odo") but maybe the language was more gendered in the past and so the old glyphs are too? Might explain why women's script seemingly has gendered words that the spoken language does not, like how "I" has a gender in the written version that does not obviously correspond to a spoken version. 

Could also be trying to avoid repeating the vowel too much for some reason? ("kor"/"ros" in Lifelight's glyph vs "tav"/"vast" and "ras"/"nar" in Voidlight's, so use the vowel not in the rest of the word, vs "zer"/"reh" in "zeradoreh", so just use "ado" in its original form.) Spitballing here, though. 

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13 minutes ago, Frustration said:

His name is Tanavast so even his doesn't line up.

It doesn't line up with his real name. But the page notes that Tanavast's Alethi name is Tavast.

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8 minutes ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

Probably is just "ado" reflected, the way other Alethi words usually are made

You're probably right. Storming Alethi and their forced symmetry.

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On 2/28/2021 at 9:34 PM, mdross81 said:

You're probably right. Storming Alethi and their forced symmetry.

Ado like Adonalsium? Or Ba-Ado-Mishram? Or... Both???

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8 hours ago, Halyo_Alex said:

Ado like Adonalsium? Or Ba-Ado-Mishram? Or... Both???

That’s an ongoing question I think. I’ve seen theories on both sides of what the ado in ba-ado-mishram (or in the middle of koradaros as mentioned above) is referring to: either Adonalsium or Adoda (the Alethi word for light). It could ultimately be both if the word for light was derived from adonalsium a long time ago. 

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8 hours ago, Halyo_Alex said:

Ado like Adonalsium? Or Ba-Ado-Mishram? Or... Both???

Imo, while "adoda" quite possibly does derive from Adonalsium, the "Ado" in Ba-Ado-Mishram is a reference to "adoda" (perhaps the name's even old enough to be from before symmetrification of words? but names like Kholin show they're willing to just combine halves of words).

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4 hours ago, LewsTherinTelescope said:

Imo, while "adoda" quite possibly does derive from Adonalsium, the "Ado" in Ba-Ado-Mishram is a reference to "adoda" (perhaps the name's even old enough to be from before symmetrification of words? but names like Kholin show they're willing to just combine halves of words).

That makes sense.

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On 3/3/2021 at 6:27 AM, mdross81 said:

That’s an ongoing question I think. I’ve seen theories on both sides of what the ado in ba-ado-mishram (or in the middle of koradaros as mentioned above) is referring to: either Adonalsium or Adoda (the Alethi word for light). It could ultimately be both if the word for light was derived from adonalsium a long time ago. 

I think the adoda glyph is in itself a reference to Adonalsium, so...

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