Chaos in Odiumland

[Toaster Retribution]

Sooo, at the end of this book, we saw a power shake-up in Odiumland. Since Rayse is now deader than dead, and Taravangian is the Vessel of Odium, what will become Odiums forces? I feel like they can be divided into five groups, who might act differently from eachother:

*The normal Singers, who are with Odium due to tradition and a hatred of human invasions. They don't really seem to have a leading figure of their own. Will they abandon Taravangian in favor of hanging out with Venli/Dalinar? 

*The Fused, who are with Odium due to bonds and and vengeance for human invasions. We dont know the leader of their faction, but El seems to be influential, so I guess many of them will follow him. El seems intent on serving Odium no matter if it is Mr T or Rayse holding the Shard, but will all of the Fused feel the same?

*The Skybreakers, who are with Odium due to the fact that Nale is confused about laws. They are led by Nale. Will he offer his services to the Singers of Venli or the Singers who are (potentially) staying with Mr T? And will he care about Rayses death?

*Moash, who is his own faction. He is led by Moash. His main reason for joing Odium was being able to ignore his pain, which he seems to need more than ever. Him follwoing was in large due to a personal relationship with Rayse. Will Mr T be able to give him a good deal and make him stay, or will he set out on his own?

*The Unmade, who were led by Rayse. Does the shift in Vessel matter, or will they be able to roam more freely after Rayses death?

So, what will happen with the forces of Odium?

 

[AlejandroTeodoro]

I think that the change in Odium doesn’t affect directly non of this forces. They will continue following Odium and probably un case of normal Singers they will not even know.

I found interesting your point that Nale could support Venli and her group now that they are  clearly separated from the Singers and Odium

[WhiteLeeopard]

Following the thread of the Unmade, I wonder if it will be easier or harder for Sja-anat to escape Odium. Could be since T is smarter than Rayse he will be able to fully chain her. Or could be she escapes in the chaos of a new Shard.

I know T will be super powered in the next book and know everything there is to know, but I'm not even sure how realistic that is. Sazed has been a Shard for much longer and he is still learning of the Cosmere and his powers. His powers can be excused since Harmony is a hard Shard which cancels itself out. But that is no reason for the lack of knowledge. Sazed did not know of Hoid till he introduced himself, yet T already knew all there was to know of him? (even before stealing his memories). The only arguments to say T knows much more is 1. Cultivation and 2. Brandon wanted Odium (enemy) to be super powerful and Harmony (ally) to be harmless.

[+Oltux72]

The new Odium, like the old Odium wants to turn outward. That has consequences. Singers have biological requirements that tie them to Roshar as a people. Without the Highstorm they cannot change forms. That means that the next generation at the latest would degenerate into parshmen. Odium will need new, due to abundance most likely human troops.

1 hour ago, Toaster Retribution said:

*The normal Singers, who are with Odium due to tradition and a hatred of human invasions. They don't really seem to have a leading figure of their own. Will they abandon Taravangian in favor of hanging out with Venli/Dalinar? 

Why? If left without leadership they are most likely to fragment along national lines. They are not Listeners. At most a small group would join them. If a lot of Spren bound to their number, those may be the building blocks of new leaders, But why would they associate with a traitor? Her recruiting worked based on getting out of the war. That stops with an armistice.

1 hour ago, Toaster Retribution said:

*The Fused, who are with Odium due to bonds and and vengeance for human invasions. We dont know the leader of their faction, but El seems to be influential, so I guess many of them will follow him. El seems intent on serving Odium no matter if it is Mr T or Rayse holding the Shard, but will all of the Fused feel the same?

What else is open to them? They are stuck in the form specific to their brand. Hence they cannot reproduce or function as normal Singers.

If they have or get the ability to leave Roshar, some of them may become mercenaries. Also depending how long a Fused in a Singer body actually lives. Thet may also set up some sort of monasteries or academies. But in general people people who have spent hundreds of years of getting used to being a warrior aristocracy rarely go back to normal civilian lives. And the Fused would forever be marked by their unchangable form. And in a certain sense they are walking corpses.

Some of course will serve Odium. But there is the problem that he will use more and more humans.

1 hour ago, Toaster Retribution said:

*The Skybreakers, who are with Odium due to the fact that Nale is confused about laws. They are led by Nale. Will he offer his services to the Singers of Venli or the Singers who are (potentially) staying with Mr T? And will he care about Rayses death?

With the war on Roshar over Nale will no longer fight. You ought to be ready for him turning up the day after the duell (if it is conclusive) and demand a seat in Urithiru as the leader of the Skybreakers.

1 hour ago, Toaster Retribution said:

*Moash, who is his own faction. He is led by Moash. His main reason for joing Odium was being able to ignore his pain, which he seems to need more than ever. Him follwoing was in large due to a personal relationship with Rayse. Will Mr T be able to give him a good deal and make him stay, or will he set out on his own?

A blind man? During a genocidal war? He can only hope that they don't just slit his throat.

1 hour ago, Toaster Retribution said:

*The Unmade, who were led by Rayse. Does the shift in Vessel matter, or will they be able to roam more freely after Rayses death?

Each Unmade will have to be looked at separately. And some of them we know nothimg but a name about

1 hour ago, Toaster Retribution said:

So, what will happen with the forces of Odium?

What will happen to the war? That is the question you need to first ask. That determines what comes next.

[Karger]

I don't thin considering normal singers a political entity makes much sense.  Very few of them have the knowledge or wherewithal to make important choices.  Ultimately their fate will probably be decided by who they happen to live near.  I agree this is unfair.

2 hours ago, Toaster Retribution said:

*The Fused, who are with Odium due to bonds and and vengeance for human invasions. We dont know the leader of their faction, but El seems to be influential, so I guess many of them will follow him. El seems intent on serving Odium no matter if it is Mr T or Rayse holding the Shard, but will all of the Fused feel the same?

We know that Leshwi has already changed sides.  I think that many different groups of fused are going to do many different things.  I will term El's faction Odium loyalists.  I am not sure about their action's why but at least we know that they are surviving Odium.

Leshwi and co will join the listeners.  Other singers will probably chose to die now that that is an option.

Nalen is VERY unpredictable.  He and his skybreaker's will act according to whatever he decides is a good idea for whatever reason.

M**** will be tortured to death an infinite number of times by me.

2 hours ago, Toaster Retribution said:

*The Unmade, who were led by Rayse. Does the shift in Vessel matter, or will they be able to roam more freely after Rayses death?

They are still of Odium's investiture.  T can still unmake them again if they want.  I personally think remaking them will be a big plot point either in the next book or the back five.

[Truthless of Shinovar]

What’s really interesting is that Todd wants to save everyone. So... in theory, couldn’t he just command everyone loyal to him to step down and make friends with the humans?

[+Bliev]

@Toaster Retribution I want you to know that I just read that entire thing like a voiceover announcer for a bad teledrama, so, actually, thank you for that. lol

23 minutes ago, Karger said:

They are still of Odium's investiture.  T can still unmake them again if they want.  I personally think remaking them will be a big plot point either in the next book or the back five.

Can he? Just remake them? I mean, I assume in theory, yes, but given we don't know exactly how he unmade them to begin with, I'm just cautious on that? We saw that the power liked when Sja-Anat pushed back, while Rayse didn't. Whose to say what Todd will do?

3 minutes ago, Truthless of Shinovar said:

What’s really interesting is that Todd wants to save everyone. So... in theory, couldn’t he just command everyone loyal to him to step down and make friends with the humans?

This is one reason I think that perhaps he's not the perfect vessel and the power will tear him apart. He was perfect in that moment that the power was coalescing, but if Rayse's scheming and strategizing pissed the power off, how will it react to someone smarter?? Navani's research uncovered that Odium's investiture is angry and chaotic,  but with an underlying logic. This doesn't seem to fit T well at all, imho. But perhaps I'm wrong on that. I wonder if we'll get another vessel change at the end of Book 5...