+Oltux72 Posted November 25, 2020 Report Share Posted November 25, 2020 6 hours ago, AlejandroTeodoro said: I disagree with the opinion that lot of people start to have about Rayse being simple or simpler than BigT. We are talking about Rayse/Odium who killed and splitter 4 shards!! When we know how difficult is to destroy other shard and not to die like Vin/Cultivation. We have a direct comment from Sja-anat on that: Quote The mind and the power seek different goals. This leaves him ... not weak, but vulnerable. 6 hours ago, AlejandroTeodoro said: About Rayse Hoid told in one of the letters that he is one of the most dangerous person Hoid has ever known. Again. Odium is, apparently, divine hatred. That is not the same as being dangerous. An amoral egotist without a shred of hatred can be supremely dangerous. A well-meaning fanatic can be horrifying, for they cannot be deterred. 6 hours ago, AlejandroTeodoro said: Taravangian was clever due to Cultivation “boon”. We should not assume him being clever than Rayse. He was realist and clever enough to know that he needed external help. And then he did not go for wishful thinking or hope over cold understanding. Most foolish actions do not arise from insufficient intelligence but the inability to face reality. 6 hours ago, Infinitysliver said: And didnt Cultivation mess with Dalinar's memories? those weren't stored as investiture. They were. They were not only stored as Investiture, for Dalinar has an organic, functional brain. But memories must basically always exist as Investiture. Otherwise Cognitive Shadows could not retain their memories. And extensive head wounds or being smashed to pulp by a Thunderclast would leave you amnesiac after healing by Stormlight or Regrowth. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
danox46 Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 Do wit has cooperminds? For sure. Still, you need to fill a coopermind for it to work. If wit had the coopermind on him Odivargo would have seen it too, not sure if he would have been able to corrupt it as Ruin could. But, definitively would not be surprised. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Khol Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 On 11/24/2020 at 10:03 PM, Oltux72 said: His current method has an order of magnitude more testing and was designed by a Shard for sustaining immortal beings was any of this stated/confirmed? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Oltux72 Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 16 minutes ago, Eternal Khol said: was any of this stated/confirmed? The Fifth Heightening and its effects are well documented. Even Khrissalla wrote about it. The Returned have been known for centuries. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teknopathetic Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 (edited) The entire speech was "making people think you have lived a thousand years" which is all about the deception of presenting one's experiences as true when they are not; this really makes me think Hoid was leaking bad intel to the enemy. Now whether or not he knew it was Tod is in question, but my gut says yes. Hoid's power is to be where he needs to be, and I think that pushed the question of "did he know" over to the Yes side of the line. Hold is old, has a lot of magic, and is friends with at least one Shard. I think it is likely he found out in some way even if he heard what happened with the body Szeth found (he know what Nightblood should have done and would be suspicious of what had occurred) I don't for a second believe Hoid would not realize his lack of perfect pitch, so I am convinced he played dumb to not risk more occurring. I agree with other that the coin might have been a metal mind, and that he used that to store memory and do some investigating. It would be hilarious if there was a way of storing untrue memories (especially if one was a good story teller). Edited November 29, 2020 by teknopathetic 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Khol Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Oltux72 said: The Fifth Heightening and its effects are well documented. Even Khrissalla wrote about it. The Returned have been known for centuries. I know that, but what you originally quoted was about storing memories using invested Arts. How does the fifth heightening and Returned relate to that? Edited November 29, 2020 by Eternal Khol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Oltux72 Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 Just now, Eternal Khol said: I know that, but what you originally quoted was about storing memories using invested Arts. How does the fifth heightening relate to that? The problem of memories applies to all immortals, including those of the fifth heightening. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teknopathetic Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, Oltux72 said: The problem of memories applies to all immortals, including those of the fifth heightening. Your comment makes me think how strange it is that breath can be used to store memories (confirmed in RoW) but that Returned do not have any memories at all (minus flashes).... I wonder if breath can be used to endow people with memories or experiences or if those memories are by default locked similar to feruchemy. Wouldn't society be hugely effected if you could leave an endowment gift of all your surgical skills to one of your students.... Edited November 29, 2020 by teknopathetic 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Khol Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Oltux72 said: The problem of memories applies to all immortals, including those of the fifth heightening. I'm sorry, but I still don't quite get your point. Back to this quote "His current method has an order of magnitude more testing and was designed by a Shard for sustaining immortal beings" Were you trying to say that all Returned are storing memories in Breath? Or more specifically the ones that live too long?that they all somehow know the technique and have been practicing with it for some time now? Edited November 29, 2020 by Eternal Khol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Oltux72 Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 2 minutes ago, Eternal Khol said: I'm sorry, but I still don't quite get your point. Back to this quote "His current method has an order of magnitude more testing and was designed by a Shard for sustaining immortal beings" Were you trying to say that all Returned are storing memories in Breath? Or more specifically the ones that live too long? and that they all somehow know the technique and have been practicing with it for some time now? The Returned are not the only immortals on Nalthis. The corporal living people of the fifth heightening are also immortal. And they must be more numerous than the one immortal being operating with the metallic arts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Khol Posted November 29, 2020 Report Share Posted November 29, 2020 (edited) 31 minutes ago, Oltux72 said: The Returned are not the only immortals on Nalthis. The corporal living people of the fifth heightening are also immortal. Yeah,I know. that's really just semantics in the point of this topic though. In the case of Nalthis, Breath, Immortals and specifically storing memories in that breath. You can use "returned" and "fifth heightening persons" interchangeably almost 100% of the time 31 minutes ago, Oltux72 said: they must be more numerous than the one immortal being operating with the metallic arts. True. And with this quote, I finally understand. lol on a side note, what do you think happens if you don't store memories? Would you just forgot them? Would you go crazy? Or would you just like... die or something... I feel like maybe there is some spiritual aspect to why it needs to be done. Like how your spiritweb knows how old you are and pushes for that, maybe it only allows for a certain amount of memory? But if that were the case, I feel like we would know it by now Edited November 29, 2020 by Eternal Khol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infinity Sliver Posted December 3, 2020 Report Share Posted December 3, 2020 On 11/29/2020 at 2:19 PM, Oltux72 said: The Fifth Heightening and its effects are well documented. Even Khrissalla wrote about it. The Returned have been known for centuries. Ok,i am having difficulty finding where this is stated On 11/25/2020 at 5:11 PM, Oltux72 said: They were. They were not only stored as Investiture, for Dalinar has an organic, functional brain. But memories must basically always exist as Investiture. Otherwise Cognitive Shadows could not retain their memories. And extensive head wounds or being smashed to pulp by a Thunderclast would leave you amnesiac after healing by Stormlight or Regrowth. Does it have to be though? I mean,Im not sure,I'm just asking,I just thought if they healed,they healed to their spiritual aspect. The point is, I dont know but I wanna know how you know 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Oltux72 Posted December 3, 2020 Report Share Posted December 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, Infinitysliver said: Ok,i am having difficulty finding where this is stated Ars Arcanum of Warbreaker 2 minutes ago, Infinitysliver said: Does it have to be though? I mean,Im not sure,I'm just asking,I just thought if they healed,they healed to their spiritual aspect. The point is, I dont know but I wanna know how you know Well, the spiritual is supposed to be unchanging. Memories change by experience. And they did heal back to their current age, not an ideal state. This has to come from somewhere. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infinity Sliver Posted December 3, 2020 Report Share Posted December 3, 2020 4 minutes ago, Oltux72 said: Ars Arcanum of Warbreaker Ok,youre saying 5th heightening gives perfect memory? cause thats not in the ars arcanum Well, the spiritual is supposed to be unchanging. Memories change by experience. And they did heal back to their current age, not an ideal state. This has to come from somewhere. No,the spiritual changes. Spoiler Thats why TLR died. Because when his bracers were removed,he reverted to what his body knew should be his spiritual age. Again,i'm not saying I know for sure the memory isn't stored as investiture,I just don't buy your explanantion is all 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HiddenCoin Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 (edited) I feel like Hoid put the memory of Toad attacking him into one of his coins as it was happening and then - "He tucked the coin into his belt with a quick gesture, keeping up the flourishes of his other hand as a distraction. Then he heard a pling as something slipped free of his belt. He stopped and found one of his fake coins on the ground, the ones that could be stuck together to appear as one. But just one half? That should have been safely tucked away in the little pocket hidden in his shirt." It wasn't where it should've been because he tucked the memory away in there - "What game do you play here? “A game of sense.” … What? “Sense, Odium. The only kind I have is nonsense. Well, and some cents …” He glanced down at the coin he still held in his hand, then cocked his head.." That's when Hoid started to remember Edited February 9, 2021 by HiddenCoin 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Technovore Posted February 9, 2021 Report Share Posted February 9, 2021 13 hours ago, HiddenCoin said: ~Snip~ Welcome to the Shard! I love the connection between your name and your first post. Have an upvote! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.