3 Boons 3 Vessels

[+Child of Hodor]

It was confirmed in this book that Cultivation personally intervened in 3 Valley  visits Dalinar, Taravangian and Lift.

Mr. T is the new Vessel for Odium. Dalinar is bound to Honor’s remnants and can create his perpendicularity. 

Lift? New Cultivation someday? She has a back 5 book, currently slated to be book 6, I wouldn’t expect it to happen for her anytime soon, but someday.

No proof of this just sensing a pattern. She was given the ability to use Lifelight instead of Stormlight which connects her to Cultivation more than the other two.

Edited November 18, 2020 by Child of Hodor

[spitfireky]

Super interesting theory! And since a major part of her character is about resisting change, maybe book 6 will be about her accepting and encouraging it. Additionally, Cultivation's choice in having Lift use Lifelight, aside from connecting her more to Cultivation, might be similar to how:

Mistborn spoilers

Spoiler

Preservation was grooming Vin for the power.

Since Honor was splintered, it'd be interesting to see how and if Dalinar is able to "unite" all the pieces.

[Zedseayou]

I like this idea a lot, though we have not seen any sign of impending death for Cultivation in the way that Preservation intentionally knew would come to pass for him. Honestly, we do need to try and figure out what Cultivation's long term gameplan is, because it seems like it's not limited to just Roshar at all, and it is a lot bigger and more subtle than we might have previously thought. It would definitely be great to understand the details of Lift's boon more...

[---]

Personally I don't think that Lift's purpose is to become the new Vessel for Cultivation. 

I don't know what Cultivation's plan is for Lift, tbh. I think- I mean, I never knew she used Lifelight, but when I saw that in the book I thought it was going to tie back to her helping the Sibling get back up on it's feet. 

[TheOneKEA]

At first I thought Lift had been altered by Cultivation to provide Lifelight to heal the Sibling. Now I suspect that Lift was altered to serve as a means of generating Lifelight anywhere on Roshar.

What will Lift eventually become?

[Subvisual Haze]

Great catch.  It's hard to ignore that 2/3 of Cultivation's chosen are now ascended.

Lift becoming the immortal vessel of a shard would be a fulfilment of her wish too.

[Ba-Ado-Fisherman]

Maybe Cultivation used her excellent foresight to see that she would inevitably be killed in the near future, leading to her finding Lift to be a replacement?  I'm still not sure though if whatever TOdium does with this new power will be what she expected to happen.  It seemed like she was confident in her ability to teach Taravangian how to manage the power honorably, but it certainly seems like he has his own plans already.  

 

I was kind of bummed that Rayse was killed, because a part of me wanted to see Dalinar loose to Odium, and then travel to Cosmere as his lieutenant, destroying everything in his path.  But yeah, I could definitely see Dalinar reforming Honor.  It fits his abilities as a Bondsmith and his personality.

[Subvisual Haze]

I feel like Cultivation's vessel might just want to finally pass beyond.  End the war, put the shards in new hands, rejoin Tanavast in the afterlife.

From what we've seen Eternal Life is wearisome in the Cosmere.  Your soul gets thin, your personality is warped to match the power, you develop peculiar insanities etc.

[spitfireky]

41 minutes ago, Subvisual Haze said:

I feel like Cultivation's vessel might just want to finally pass beyond.  End the war, put the shards in new hands, rejoin Tanavast in the afterlife.

From what we've seen Eternal Life is wearisome in the Cosmere.  Your soul gets thin, your personality is warped to match the power, you develop peculiar insanities etc.

Maybe she's looking for new Vessels because at this point the existing Vessels are almost completely taken over by their Intents, and having new ones would "revitalize" them, so to speak.

[+Bliev]

4 hours ago, spitfireky said:

Maybe she's looking for new Vessels because at this point the existing Vessels are almost completely taken over by their Intents, and having new ones would "revitalize" them, so to speak.

She’s..cultivating new vessels perhaps?

[ftl]

9 hours ago, ShalladinForever said:

I was kind of bummed that Rayse was killed, because a part of me wanted to see Dalinar loose to Odium, and then travel to Cosmere as his lieutenant, destroying everything in his path.

That might still happen! Odium's still there; the Shard's just got a new Vessel steering it (or acting as it's impotent figurehead; TBD). The contest of champions is still on, with the same stakes as before.

[Michael Portz]

Another angle for consideration, cross posted:

1 hour ago, Michael Portz said:

I think, Cultiviation prepared three weapons against Rayse, not knowing or really caring which one would work in the end: Dalinar, Taravangian and Lift. Let's have a look of Hoids letter to "the old reptile", which we now can safely guess is Cultivations vessel. These are from chapters 18 and 19:

and

We never really found out, when these letter was actually written. So it might well be, that Cultivations manipulations of the three was initialized by this very letter. 

Apparently she agreed, that everything was better than Rayse holding Odium.

 

[Blacksmithki]

I agree with the idea that cultivation might be grooming new vessels in general. What possible way could cultivation work on a grander scale then cultivating the vessels of the shards themselves? It would also work to tie into the greater cosmere as surgebinders may be powerful enough to pose a threat to the existing vessels on other worlds, whilst also not threatening to overlap too hard with mistborn because it already has a new vessel so cultivation does not need to get involved.

[Michael Portz]

Another angle for consideration, crossposted:

I think, Cultiviation prepared three weapons against Rayse, not knowing or really caring which one would work in the end: Dalinar, Taravangian and Lift. Let's have a look of Hoids letter to "the old reptile", which we now can safely guess is Cultivations vessel. These are from chapters 18 and 19:

Quote

Ati was once a kind and generous man, and you saw what became of him. Rayse, on the other hand, was among the most loathsome, crafty, and dangerous individuals I had ever met.

Sanderson, Brandon. The Way of Kings (The Stormlight Archive, Book 1) (S.274). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle-Version. 

 

and

Quote

He holds the most frightening and terrible of all of the Shards. Ponder on that for a time, you old reptile, and tell me if your insistence on nonintervention holds firm. Because I assure you, Rayse will not be similarly inhibited.

Sanderson, Brandon. The Way of Kings (The Stormlight Archive, Book 1) (S.295). Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle-Version. 

 

We never really found out, when these letter was actually written. So it might well be, that Cultivations manipulations of the three was initialized by this very letter. 

Apparently she agreed, that everything was better than Rayse holding Odium

[Ytsken]

Wasn't that letter meant for Frost, the writer of the firt letter in way of kings?

[+Oltux72]

On 18.11.2020 at 1:47 PM, Child of Hodor said:

Lift? New Cultivation someday? She has a back 5 book, currently slated to be book 6, I wouldn’t expect it to happen for her anytime soon, but someday.

Am I the only one who sees an issue with a girl asking to remain sexually immature becoming the vessel of a Shard whose domain includes fertility?

On 18.11.2020 at 1:47 PM, Child of Hodor said:

No proof of this just sensing a pattern. She was given the ability to use Lifelight instead of Stormlight which connects her to Cultivation more than the other two.

She was given the ability to make Lifelight, not just to use it. That has very practical implications. She is independent from the Highstorms as a fuel source. And she is iimune to weapons targeting users of Stormlight to an extent.

1 hour ago, Michael Portz said:

Let's have a look of Hoids letter to "the old reptile", which we now can safely guess is Cultivations vessel.

Can we? A protest against a policy of intervention looks like it comes from outside the Rosharan system. I still seems likeliest that this is correspondence with Edgli.

[Kingsdaughter613]

13 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

Am I the only one who sees an issue with a girl asking to remain sexually immature becoming the vessel of a Shard whose domain includes fertility?

She was given the ability to make Lifelight, not just to use it. That has very practical implications. She is independent from the Highstorms as a fuel source. And she is iimune to weapons targeting users of Stormlight to an extent.

Can we? A protest against a policy of intervention looks like it comes from outside the Rosharan system. I still seems likeliest that this is correspondence with Edgli.

Lift did not ask to remain sexually immature. She asked to not grow up, or change, so she could stay her mother’s little girl forever which is a rather different thing. She wants to stay a child. She’d be just as upset if she grew up without developing secondary sex characteristics because that isn’t her issue at all.

[Michael Portz]

23 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

Can we? A protest against a policy of intervention looks like it comes from outside the Rosharan system. I still seems likeliest that this is correspondence with Edgli.

The last sentence of Taravangians perception hints at a fundamentally different form of Cultivations vessel, aka the form of the one promised Dragon:

Quote

A woman stepped up beside him. He recognized her full hair, black and tightly curled, along with her vibrant round face and dark skin. She had another shape as well. Many of them, but one deeper and truer than the others.

Sanderson, Brandon. Rhythm of War (The Stormlight Archive) . Tom Doherty Associates. Kindle-Version. 

 

[+Oltux72]

50 minutes ago, Kingsdaughter613 said:

Lift did not ask to remain sexually immature. She asked to not grow up, or change, so she could stay her mother’s little girl forever which is a rather different thing.

Correct. Let me put it that way. Do you see an issue with a girl asking for something that implies her remaining sexually immature becoming the vessel of a Shard whose domain includes fertility?

50 minutes ago, Kingsdaughter613 said:

She wants to stay a child. She’d be just as upset if she grew up without developing secondary sex characteristics because that isn’t her issue at all.

Yes. And that is a problem for Cultivation. It is about things that grow. She says so. Literally.

1 hour ago, Michael Portz said:

The last sentence of Taravangians perception hints at a fundamentally different form of Cultivations vessel, aka the form of the one promised Dragon:

Maybe. Maybe not. It is a bit thin.

[Greywatch]

4 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

Correct. Let me put it that way. Do you see an issue with a girl asking for something that implies her remaining sexually immature becoming the vessel of a Shard whose domain includes fertility?

 

I think Kingsdaughter's point was that it was weird you went right to "sexual (im)maturity" - or at least, that's my take on it. I don't think it's weird at all, because the term "sexually mature" didn't come into my thinking at all. Nor do I think of Cultivation as a fertility god. Feels like a stretch.

[+Bliev]

Agreeing with @Greywatch and @Kingsdaughter613 here. I would never have either thought of cultivation as a god of fertility nor Lift as associated with sexual immaturity in any particular way. Def a stretch.

[Guest Parallax]

Hoid's first letter was to Frost not Cultivation's vessel.

Lift could bind the Nightwatcher and become the third Bondsmith. 

[Kingsdaughter613]

On 11/20/2020 at 3:12 PM, Michael Portz said:

The last sentence of Taravangians perception hints at a fundamentally different form of Cultivations vessel, aka the form of the one promised Dragon:

 

@Greywatch and @Bliev got it right. I thought the sexual immaturity comment weird. Cultivation isn’t a fertility goddess and Lift doesn’t care about being sexually mature. That’s not her real problem.

But your second point is a good one, and I agree. Cultivation is all about Change through Growth. Lift is not ready to accept that yet - but I think learning that will be part of her Radiant Path.

[teknopathetic]

I am hoping (oh gosh am I hoping) that Cultivation is not as fooled by Odivangian, and that she still has Lift as the final part of her plan. 

[Kingsdaughter613]

6 hours ago, teknopathetic said:

I am hoping (oh gosh am I hoping) that Cultivation is not as fooled by Odivangian, and that she still has Lift as the final part of her plan. 

I think Cultivation is the real villain of SA. Everyone else is dancing to her tone.

Edited November 22, 2020 by Kingsdaughter613