Jofwu

RoW Chapter 18 Discussion

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Teft not wanting to be a companylord figures.

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“Lirin surgically removed his sense of humor,” Hesina said.

“Got good money for it on the open market too,” Lirin said.

We need more of this!! It is refreshing.

Edited by Nathrangking
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Poor Kaladin.  Also Larual has kids?

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*spits out water*

A metal that conducts Stormlight?! Hmm... could it be Nicrosil?

Pressure differential, huh. That does make some sense but I didn't expect Investiture to behave this way, maybe under certain conditions or if it's free Investiture? I'm thinking Stormlight (as it's crucial to the ecosystem of Roshar and that shapes how it behaves) and the Dor (simply because it's pressurized) but the Mists don't behave that way (not entering houses) but Preservation's power leaking through the Spiritual via metals seems to

Edited by Honorless
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Hmm.. it seems Kaladin is quite good at helping others find purpose in their lives. I wonder, will he need external help to find his own purpose, or perhaps self motivation will play a big part in him swearing the 4th Oath? 
 

Something tells me however, that Kaladin will not be fully satisfied being his father’s assistant forever. Or even a full surgeon himself, eventually. 

Edited by lightweaver spy
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"They say they’ve found a way to infect people with a weak, easily overcome version of a disease—which leaves them immune for life to more harsh variants.”

Ah Rosharan vaccination!! 

Quote

“Father,” Kaladin said, “we have fewer than fifty Edgedancers—and just three Truthwatchers. Those are the only orders that can heal.”

There are 3 truthwatchers. Hmm.. did they get stump to return with them?

Edited by Nathrangking
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I loved this so, so much. Snark-to-snark combat, family banter, some progress on Kaladin’s part- it’s phenomenal. Also, Roshar has discovered vaccines?!?! That’s incredible. They’re way more advanced than I thought them to be. I wonder if Taravangian’s herald is responsible for these advances...

I also thought it quite poetic that Lirin and Kaladin faced a similar situation- even if Lirin’s issue was more easily resolved. I’m excited to see how their dynamic plays out.

Just a few more days!!! 

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Man I'm  imagining syl trying to lift a fat, lethargic rat with all her strenght. 

It's one of the most joyful and funny images I have imagined till now. 

Edited by PrinceGenocide
A little polishing
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6 minutes ago, Honorless said:

A metal that conducts Stormlight?!

Maybe my theory on aluminum is correct?

4 minutes ago, Nathrangking said:

There are 3 truthwatchers. Hmm.. did they get stump to return with them?

Maybe.  We know she visited Azir.  I wonder if that number includes Renarin.

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Hesina knows of minerals. That might or might not become interesting in interpreting the strata of Urithiru.

Kaladin going back to be his father's surgeon apprentice I am not really fond of. Feels like regression, but who knows. Might be the step backwards he needs to get ready for another leap. Syl seems to be more than fine with it and even urges him towards the decision.

10 minutes ago, Honorless said:

Pressure differential, huh. That does make some sense but I didn't expect Investiture to behave this way, maybe under certain conditions? I'm thinking Stormlight and the Dor

This seems to be in line with voidlight sucking in or warping normal light around the spheres containing it. Now we can guess what sucked Jezrien.

Edited by Pattern
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I am glad that Kal has found a new purpose and will be helping Lirin. However, I am a little put off by Lirin's attitude. His smugness at proclaiming that he was right all along is definitely not a good look for him. 

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5 minutes ago, Nathrangking said:

There are 3 truthwatchers. Hmm.. did they get stump to return with them?

Obviously we've "been away" for a year, but do we know who the 3 are? Are they still counting Renarin, with his modified spren? I can only think of Renarin, Stump, and Ym (who is obviously not one of the 3) as people we've seen as Truthwatchers in the past.

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4 minutes ago, Pattern said:

Hesina knows of minerals. That might or might not become interesting in interpreting the strata of Urithiru.

Of Kaladin going back to be his father's surgeon apprentice I am not really fond of. Feels like regression, but who knows. Might be the step backwards he needs to get ready for another leap. Syl seems to be more than fine with it and even urges him.

I think the problem we face is, that we just don't know how a Radiant Windrunner can make use of his Radiant Powers as a Surgeon :-)

The lashings might come in handy, though, I'ld say :-D

Edited by Michael Portz
idea added
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2 minutes ago, Michael Portz said:

I think the problem we face is, that we just don't know how a Radiant Windrunner can make use of his Radiant Powers as a Surgeon :-)

He can lash/stick his tools whereever handy.

Edited by Pattern
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0) metal that conducts Stormlight, Navani theorises that empty gem serves as a low pressure area to siphon Stormlight from high pressure areas (Radiants), might be how gems store Stormlight from the Highstorm

1) Kaladin tried to pass on leadership to Teft who vehemently refused, Sigzil is the current leader. Skar and Drehy accompanied Rock and his family to the Horneater peaks (so we might see them in the Rock novella)

2) just to note: so Oathgates do seem to operate via the Spiritual Realm, so that old WoB about how people came from Ashyn to Roshar might be on a bit more solid ground. And Elsecallers might indeed be able to teleport instantaneously by a similar mechanism, though so far we've only seen Phy-Cog travel

3) Kaladin is good at logistics and strategy (points at WoK chapter 1, how Kal got the epithet of "Stormblessed") so he could be that. An ambassador... maybe with training, he is very methodical, has experience as a surgeon, on the battlefield, surgeon on the battlefield, so he's used to making decisions under pressure, leadership qualities, is charismatic, is a Radiant which serves as an awe factor... with training I could actually see him as an ambassador, but not with his current mental state.

We know from Syl's interlude he goes back to being a doctor, I hope he and Lirin make up during this perhaps? With Lirin acknowledging Kaladin could save more lives on the battlefield and Lirin teaching Kaladin to let go of those he couldn't save so he could concentrate on the people he could save

4) they tried to organize living space by Princedoms initially but the arrangement didn't work, this might help break the Alethi highprinces' power a little bit. The Kholins are much more powerful in Urithiru than they were in Kholinar, they were the ruling family but they were roughly equal to the other Highprinces during the War of Reckoning. Urithiru is much more communal.

hey, Kaladin's high-ranking! Shouldn't his family get a nice room too! Why are they still operating based on Lighteyes Darkeyes hierarchy. What does Laral provide as service do the would-be community compared to Kaladin or Lirin?

Edit: okay, resolved

5) Urithiru's design

He ducked under a strange outcropping of stone in the hallway. Urithiru had numerous such oddities; this one was round, a stone tube crossing the center of the hallway. Perhaps it was ventilation? Why had it been put right where people walked?

Many other features of the tower defied logic. Hallways dead-ended. Rooms were discovered with no way in save tiny holes to peek through. Small shafts were discovered plummeting down thirty or more stories.

Those are rather strange. Maybe spren used those? I dunno

6) Jasnah has already done one reform, it seems, making Laral able to inherit

7) “Disrespectful of lighteyed authority,” Hesina said, “and generally inclined to do whatever he wants, regardless of social class or traditions. Where in Roshar did he get it?”

is this a hint of how Lirin charmed Hesina?

8) Hesina knows rather a lot.

Also yeah iron deposits do look green, the color of rock changes as iron oxidizes. Often ferrous iron imparts a green color, while oxidized rock containing ferric iron is reddish or rusty.

9) I sometimes forget Syl isn't human unlike with the other spren due to how... human she seems compared to most of them.

Syl might learn to read Kaladin better with Hesina's help, so sweet! She's so sensitive and attentive towards him! 

10) reading through some of these WoBs (https://wob.coppermind.net/adv_search/?query=matter%2Benergy%2BInvestiture) wouldn't getting Investiture from matter and energy be possible in the future? 

11) That’s part of how I persuaded Dalinar to let me fetch everyone from Hearthstone—we have a lot of soldiers, but surprisingly few people who know their way around a lavis field during worming season.

I was hoping Dalinar just let Kaladin put his family first with how much he asks of Kaladin for his own family

12) Kharbranth has discovered vaccines

13) Hmm... the question of what happens with medical professions in Urithiru with Edgedancers and Truthwatchers able to heal with a touch

Also, hahaha, like father, like son. 

“I guess I’ll need to find something else to do.”

He's not obsolete yet though

Most of the time those Edgedancers are serving on the battlefront, healing soldiers. The few on duty in Urithiru can be used for only the most dire of wounds.

“Plus their powers have limitations. They can’t do anything for old wounds, for example. We have a large clinic in the market staffed by ordinary surgeons, and it’s busy all hours of the day. You’re not obsolete. Trust me, you’re going to be very, very useful here

14) Ooh we got some numbers on the Radiants! 50 Edgedancers (wow, Cultivationspren work fast) & 3 Truthwatchers

15) She kept bullying him with her frustratingly insistent spren stare—she didn’t blink unless she pointedly decided to, so he’d never met anyone else who could glare quite like Syl. Once she’d even enlarged her eyes to disturbing proportions to deliver a particularly important point.

Wow playing the stare game with Syl would not work, lol

16) “That’s what this is about, isn’t it?” Lirin said. “The surgery room, the supplies, that talk of the clinic. You’ve realized it. You finally understand that I’ve been right. You’re going to become a surgeon like we always dreamed!”

Well... I think Kaladin should recount what happened to him to his family. They can't just continue on to manage each other, instead of communicating.

Why the dread though

That was the answer, of course. The one Kaladin had been purposely avoiding. He’d considered the ardents, he’d considered the generals, and he’d considered running away.

The answer was in the face of his father, a face that a part of Kaladin dreaded. Deep down, Kaladin had known there was only one place he could go once the spear was taken from him.

“Yes,” Kaladin said. “You’re right. You’ve always been right, Father. I guess… it’s time to continue my training.”

Edited by Honorless
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1 minute ago, Pattern said:

He can lash/stick his tools whereever handy.

I more think of microscopic lashings to close internal bleeding etc.

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They could be talking about Chromium, which means either they're wrong about the pressure differential or they understand more than the Scadrians do. But who knows? It doesn't seem to work the way we understand the enhancement metals.

4 minutes ago, Pattern said:

Hesina knows of minerals. That might or might not become interesting in interpreting the strata of Urithiru.

Of Kaladin going back to be his father's surgeon apprentice I am not really fond of. Feels like regression, but who knows. Might be the step backwards he needs to get ready for another leap. Syl seems to be more than fine with it and even urges him.

I agree that this doesn't seem like the right direction. I don't think Kaladin will be happy healing, and I think it'll cause a bigger rift with Lirin later. More and more, I'm hoping Syl's interlude is right after this section.

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It was a very beautiful chapter, I think. Really nice how Kaladin put together a new life for his parents in Urithiru. And I wonder if he will spend his time in New Hearthstone reconnecting with Laral?

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7 minutes ago, Pattern said:

Kaladin going back to be his father's surgeon apprentice I am not really fond of. Feels like regression, but who knows. Might be the step backwards he needs to get ready for another leap. Syl seems to be more than fine with it and even urges him towards the decision.

Really? I thought the opposite. On some level, I don’t think Kaladin ever resolved the whole ‘Can I kill to protect?’ issue, and there’s also some underlying beef with his father he has to work out.

Plus, he’d hit a wall as a soldier. When you can’t move forward, you may have to move to the side- or even backwards. This experience should open new opportunities for him, even if he doesn’t stay a surgeon.

Edited by HipsterStick
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5 minutes ago, Karger said:

Maybe my theory on aluminum is correct?

I think navani would be able to identify aluminium or test it with a small sample. 

Man I still hope kal becomes jasnahs bodyguard after the syl interlude. 

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6 minutes ago, Michael Portz said:

I think the problem we face is, that we just don't know how a Radiant Windrunner can make use of his Radiant Powers as a Surgeon :-)

The lashings might come in handy, though, I'ld say :-D

5 minutes ago, Pattern said:

He can lash his tools whereever handy.

Definitely lashing tools to hang in the air for convenient reach. Also, using a full lashing on a wound as temporary stitches while you put the real stitches in might be useful.

Edited by The Silverlight Scholar
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Just now, Kittalia said:

They could be talking about Chromium, which means either they're wrong about the pressure differential or they understand more than the Scadrians do. But who knows? It doesn't seem to work the way we understand the enhancement metals.

I agree that this doesn't seem like the right direction. I don't think Kaladin will be happy healing, and I think it'll cause a bigger rift with Lirin later. More and more, I'm hoping Syl's interlude is right after this section.

It might be right before this even; chapter feels a bit like being at the start of the 2nd book, so the interludes might be before it.

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Only a few thoughts this week:

  • I've got no idea what this epigraph is about. Is this a god metal? Or a normal metal that has other realmatic properties? (Nicrosil is the prime suspect for a lot of these mysteries.) Anywhere we've seen this phenomenon elsewhere? This feels significant.
  • Iron in the Urithiru strata. The cage of the Urithiru fabrial? I had been wondering if ancient fabrials even needed a cage, mostly because the Heart of the Sibling wasn't described with any metal. (Although soulcasters and the Regrowth fabrial both had cages, so there's obviously some function to it.) But now we see where the metal is; it snakes out all the way around the city.
  • In terms of Urithiru's strange architecture, I suspect we'll see some of that coming up once the city's awake. I'm guessing rooms without doors are prison cells made accessible through cohesion fabrials. Small shafts are pneumatic tubes operated by adhesion. And I suspect the "pipe" running right through the walkways transmits Stormlight, and it's out in the open so anybody can tap off of it. Dead-end hallways, I don't have a good guess at; maybe there's a Lightweaving control station or map or something down there? You don't need a room, because everything is virtual?
  • Kaladin has finally caught up to the Syl interlude (which I'm growing increasingly confident is in the first set of interludes). We'll see how long this lasts for... the fact that Kal has a spear on the release party shirt certainly makes me doubt this role has sticking power.
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So the alliance only have 3 Truthwatchers, and probably only one Elsecaller. There is also no signs of Stonewards. Seems like some spren still stubborn to bond humans. 

With Willshappers largely being refunded among Singers and Skybreakers also fighting for the singers, it leaves alliance with only 4 full orders

My bet is there is around a dozen or two Lighweavers, and a similar number of Dustrbringers (maybe a few more). Around a hundred Windrunners, and less than half of that for Edgedancers 

Plus only one Skybreaker, one Elsecaller, the three Truthwatchers and one Bondsmisth (there was never many of them anyways)

So maybe around 200 Radiants

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Just now, Michael Portz said:

It might be right before this even; chapter feels a bit like being at the start of the 2nd book, so the interludes might be before it.

I thought I read somewhere that the prereleases were supposed to end with the end of part 1, and I'd be surprised if they just skipped over the interludes if it wasn't. I was reading this as Kaladin's last chapter/moment of decision before jumping into a new arc, although the time gap is interesting. 

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