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Can tin store perfect pitch and perfect color recognition


Koloss17

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So tin can store senses. A lot of senses. I’d say perfect color recognition is not a sense. You need to see to use it. But it is definitely separate from overall sight. It is distinct in that matter. Is it distinct enough to be it’s own aspect in a metalmind? Same goes with perfect pitch. I’d guess so, but I’m not certain.

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I don't think so.  Sense is different from the way your mind works to interpret things.  A person born blind who goes through surgery to make their eyes work still can't interpret what they see.  We have no indication that your ability to spot things is inherently better with breath it is just that your mind and soul become better at parsing the physical world around you.

Edited by Karger
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3 hours ago, Koloss17 said:

So tin can store senses. A lot of senses. I’d say perfect color recognition is not a sense. You need to see to use it. But it is definitely separate from overall sight. It is distinct in that matter. Is it distinct enough to be it’s own aspect in a metalmind? Same goes with perfect pitch. I’d guess so, but I’m not certain.

First off, Hello again! You seem to be really thinking about Tin. No worries though, I'm here to help. So, sight is a sense that can be stored. Remember Sazed having to wear glasses in Mistborn after finding Vin while filling his tin mind. So, "You need to see to use it." is moot. Second, I would say that this might work in a way similar to compounding maybe? if this is just an ability granted to you, then no, but if it actually enhances your senses, you could probably store that 'excess' sense into a coppermind which you could tap later. Think of it like burning tin and then storing the extra sense that tin gave you into a metal mind, except tin it's your heightening.

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3 minutes ago, Karger said:

I don't think so.  Sense is different from the way your mind works to interpret things.  A person born blind who goes through surgery to make their eyes work still can't interpret what they see.  We have no indication that your ability to spot things is inherently better with breath it is just that your mind and soul become better at parsing the physical world around you.

Okay, he has a point. My theory above only works if it is making a sense stronger, but it could also be enhanced perception ability, which is more of a mental capability. So Tin probably won't, if that's the case. Also hello Krager. Here we meet again. You couldn't finish your post a few minutes before I posted mine? Would've saved me the embarrassment. You know how that feels, right? XD RIGHT? #Assholerighthere

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Quote

BartimaeusTrilogyFan

Can Feruchemists store more than the five ‘traditional’ senses, and does Allomantic tin enhance more than the traditional five senses?

Brandon Sanderson

More is possible.

/r/books AMA 2015 (May 17, 2015)
Quote

NewbSombrero

Can Feruchemical tin store Allomantically granted senses like bronze sense?

Brandon Sanderson

Possible.

General Signed Books 2018 (Feb. 8, 2018)

Makes me think, yes, it can.

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1 hour ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Also hello Krager. Here we meet again. You couldn't finish your post a few minutes before I posted mine? Would've saved me the embarrassment. You know how that feels, right? XD RIGHT? #Assholerighthere

Oh sorry.  Getting ninjed is annoying.  However any animosity is kind of pointless in this case as Honorless has the most relevant WoB.

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Just now, Karger said:

Oh sorry.  Getting ninjed is annoying.  However any animosity is kind of pointless in this case as Honorless has the most relevent WoB.

Animosity? My, good man, you seem to think I was annoyed at your post. I found it delightful. And yes, perhaps my theory still holds. Victory is mine! Thank you @Honorless you saved my hypothesis.

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So I’m not too sure on the color recognition. It’s clear that without sight, you couldn’t use it. But can it stored within a metalmind under, say, sight? Would the same go for perfect pitch? Perfect pitch is distinct from general hearing, but is it enough to be separately stored? I don’t know. Will it be stored with hearing? Will an unkeyed metalmind actually be able to give others perfect pitch? 
 

and @Honorless, you can store atium, electrum, gold, bronze, steel, and iron perks when it comes to what you see, because they do not need to be chained to your sight, like we see with inquisitors.

Edited by Koloss17
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6 hours ago, Koloss17 said:

So I’m not too sure on the color recognition. It’s clear that without sight, you couldn’t use it. But can it stored within a metalmind under, say, sight? Would the same go for perfect pitch? Perfect pitch is distinct from general hearing, but is it enough to be separately stored? I don’t know. Will it be stored with hearing? Will an unkeyed metalmind actually be able to give others perfect pitch? 
 

and @Honorless, you can store atium, electrum, gold, bronze, steel, and iron perks when it comes to what you see, because they do not need to be chained to your sight, like we see with inquisitors.

I think so yes. Either they will go under sight and hearing or they will go in their own special category, and an unkeyed metal mind will be able to grant the power to someone else. What I am wondering now is what happens if a blind person stores sight? WIll they just store nothing? And what if they tap a metal mind with someone else sight stored? Will they be able to restore their sight for a while?

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1 hour ago, Aspiring Writer said:

I think so yes. Either they will go under sight and hearing or they will go in their own special category, and an unkeyed metal mind will be able to grant the power to someone else. What I am wondering now is what happens if a blind person stores sight? WIll they just store nothing? And what if they tap a metal mind with someone else sight stored? Will they be able to restore their sight for a while?

Really depends how they are blind, friend. Blindness is just a heavy impairment on vision, but there is so many shades of that. For some types, the blindness Can be lifted in this way. In others, not so much. If you needed your eyes removed, welp, your screwed.

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1 minute ago, Koloss17 said:

Really depends how they are blind, friend. Blindness is just a heavy impairment on vision, but there is so many shades of that. For some types, the blindness Can be lifted in this way. In others, not so much. If you needed your eyes removed, welp, your screwed.

I was referring to the blindness where all you see is black, not really blurry vision that makes it impossible to see.

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Just now, Aspiring Writer said:

I was referring to the blindness where all you see is black, not really blurry vision that makes it impossible to see.

So if you literally can’t see jack, most likely not. But that ain’t the only type of blindness. In many cases, the tin will work.

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This is an interesting question.  If you got perfect pitch from the Second Heightening, then you could store the Breaths in a metal mind.  But what about normal perfect pitch?  Perfect pitch is not a function of the ear; people with perfect pitch do not hear differently than the rest of us.  Rather, their brains process the information differently.  Therefore, perfect pitch would not likely be able to be stored in a tin mind.  The analogy here is muscle memory not being stored in a Coppermind.

Perfect color awareness is trickier.  I would argue that the answer here depends on how this awareness works.  Peolpe with perfect color awareness are likely to have tetrachromacy.  Research suggests that tetrachromacy would allow the eye to have a fourth absorption peak around 380nm.  Given that the lens absorbs most light between 300-400 nm, it is not clear if this fourth cone is significant to perfect color awareness.  In addition, it is not known if the optic nerve has capacity for a fourth pathway.  If perfect color awareness is a result of eye structure, then it is likely able to be stored in a tinmind 

However, perfect color vision may be a result of processing in the brain, rather than a change in input.

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12 hours ago, Brgst13 said:

This is an interesting question.  If you got perfect pitch from the Second Heightening, then you could store the Breaths in a metal mind.  But what about normal perfect pitch?  Perfect pitch is not a function of the ear; people with perfect pitch do not hear differently than the rest of us.  Rather, their brains process the information differently.  Therefore, perfect pitch would not likely be able to be stored in a tin mind.  The analogy here is muscle memory not being stored in a Coppermind.

Perfect color awareness is trickier.  I would argue that the answer here depends on how this awareness works.  Peolpe with perfect color awareness are likely to have tetrachromacy.  Research suggests that tetrachromacy would allow the eye to have a fourth absorption peak around 380nm.  Given that the lens absorbs most light between 300-400 nm, it is not clear if this fourth cone is significant to perfect color awareness.  In addition, it is not known if the optic nerve has capacity for a fourth pathway.  If perfect color awareness is a result of eye structure, then it is likely able to be stored in a tinmind 

However, perfect color vision may be a result of processing in the brain, rather than a change in input.

So mainly what I’m wondering if you could cheat the system by storing some breath-given capabilities in a timind to basically replicate a heightening. Storing breaths in a nicrosilmind-or anything for that matter-wont have the same effect. And I do think it’s important to note that biochroma perfect pitch is different from human perfect pitch. It seems to be a bit more like an algorithmic thing going on where it is immediately recognized-wait hold on you’re right. 
 

NEW QUESTION:

can you store it in a zincmind, which I believe is the one that stores mental speed? This is getting fun... >: )

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I'm not sure it could be stored in a zincmind, either.  From the Coppermind:

Quote

Storing does not affect the Sparker's ability to process physical information, such as being able to hear when they are spoken to but it does have the odd side effect of making the user hungry.

If we are agreeing that perfect pitch is a proceesing-related phenomena, then you would still get the note right every time, it might just take a bit longer.

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19 hours ago, Brgst13 said:

I'm not sure it could be stored in a zincmind, either.  From the Coppermind:

If we are agreeing that perfect pitch is a proceesing-related phenomena, then you would still get the note right every time, it might just take a bit longer.

Yeah, I thought it would be like that. Welp, this was a cool idea. On to my quest to find more things tin can store!

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12 hours ago, Brgst13 said:

I bet you could split and store sight by color groups, and taste by receptor.  You could draw on taste to detect minute concentrations of things, like a shark.  Imagine if you could boost your red-green color vision to detect changes in blood flow.

Good question! I have no idea. @Aspiring Writer, you might be good in this. Maybe. I dunno.

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9 minutes ago, Koloss17 said:

Good question! I have no idea. @Aspiring Writer, you might be good in this. Maybe. I dunno.

Not sure about the taste idea, as perfect pitch and vision have nothing to do with taste, but I don't think you can focus a receptor. It's all or none of your vision, not a certain aspect. I can see how storing your perfect vision will allow you to do things like notice changes in blood, but I don't think you can do it by receptor. Feruchemy has never been that specific. Also, thx for ating me in Koloss!

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1 hour ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Not sure about the taste idea, as perfect pitch and vision have nothing to do with taste, but I don't think you can focus a receptor. It's all or none of your vision, not a certain aspect. I can see how storing your perfect vision will allow you to do things like notice changes in blood, but I don't think you can do it by receptor. Feruchemy has never been that specific. Also, thx for ating me in Koloss!

Mainly it’s the question of in general, could you store certain aspects. Maybe that’s a savant aspect?

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13 minutes ago, Koloss17 said:

F-tin savants. hard to get, but not impossible.

Yeah, but if their anything like F-Gold savants, they become dependant on using the metal at the cost of probably having really intense senses, and probably feel numb without them. It would feel very weird for them, but I guess tin is pretty easy to come by. Also, P.S. just made a Thread called Sources of the Universe in the community section. Little chapter fo a book I'm writing. Thought you might be interested.

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18 minutes ago, Aspiring Writer said:

Yeah, but if their anything like F-Gold savants, they become dependant on using the metal at the cost of probably having really intense senses, and probably feel numb without them. It would feel very weird for them, but I guess tin is pretty easy to come by. Also, P.S. just made a Thread called Sources of the Universe in the community section. Little chapter fo a book I'm writing. Thought you might be interested.

Wait for F-gold? That’s exactly what A-tin savant does! Huh. 

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