Is Adolin as good as dead?

[Shardsplinter]

Hi, Sharders!! It has been a recurring topic that this book will have some very painful deaths...and a lot of people seem to put their bet on Adolin. A lot of really great arguments have been made as to why his charachter arc appears to be heading that way and in comparison to other main charachters maybe he does play a smaller role in the fight against the forces of Odium. But at the same time I feel like he still has a lot to accomplish( I stand on the Maya has to come back to life and Shadolin is the best fandom)  and as a charachter he adds a breeze of fresh air that I would miss deeply.

So, where does the fandom stand? Do we need to prepare ourselfs to say goodbye?

[Xerun]

No way. You can’t kill off Adolin. I have no justification for this. It just won’t happen. 

[Tjeed]

I certainly hope so.

[garlick]

He wont die until Maya is revived. Hes showing alot of edgedancer traits, this last chapter really shows this imo. They was he refuses to drop Maya to have a better chance at becoming a radiant.  So unless he revives Maya in this book then goes on to die I really think adolin is safe in this book. 

[LuckyJim]

I wouldn't say "as good as dead", I think for that to apply, someone would have to be making some very disastrous decisions that were likely to lead to them getting killed, and that doesn't really apply to Adolin. I think there's more for his character to do, but the same could also be said about Elhokar or Eshonai. Most of all, I think I just resent the idea that Adolin is going to die out of process of elimination, someone has to die and he's the most disposable, I don't know, it just seems very cynical. If someone's going to die, I'd rather it make sense for the story than just done out of some obligation.

And yeah, Adolin is also my favorite character, I'm not immune to bias.

[Harbour]

I makes not much sense for Brandon to kill him given the certain direction with "Maya revival". And after Maya revival it also makes little sense to kill him. My bet is not this book. Maybe Book 5 or any of back 5 books or never.

I also think its Dalinar who will die and Adolin will have to learn how to fit into father's boots. Thats where his arc will actually kick start.

[Mat]

I think a book 5 death is way more likely than a RoW death.

Though Adolin dying might just be so obvious it's not gonna happen

[Valigus]

Sorry but kaladin is the dead one, he is literally a messiah figure, he is arguably the single most capable and dangerous radiant, and even his name sounds legendary no way he survives it’s like kelsier they spend so long building him up he has to die

[Subvisual Haze]

I don't want him to die necessarily, but from a narrative perspective it seems likely.  He just has it a bit too "together" for the size of his role in the story.  It's not like you can't have a more "normal" perspective in a cast full of psychologically scarred heroes, but usually due to their lack of internal conflict they'll be relegated to a more minor side role like Lopen.

He's remarkably devoid of character flaws, burdens and external conflicts.  Without those it's very hard for him to grow internally or have much of an arc moving forward. His sword is an interesting plot thread and he seems to have a minor disagreement with his father, but that's about it. His murder of Sadeas was his biggest remaining thread of doubt/guilt/apprehension, and that plot thread seems to have been largely resolved with minimal consequence.

Even worse (from a survivability standpoint) he's something of an emotional load bearing pillar for Shallan, Renarin, and Kaladin.  He has sort of filled the emotional equivalent of the "mentor" role in the monomyth, helping our other protagonists survive and grow in the early stages of the story.  His death (or sidelining by an permanent injury perhaps?) would force our other heroes into conflict and finding new methods of coping with their burdens and personal growth.

It's hardly guaranteed or anything, Brandon will of course do what he thinks is best for the story, but Adolin as a character has some big danger signs. 

[GriffinMaze]

No way. Killing the Normie is way too easy, the Normie needs to live until the 2nd arc to be the leader 

[Toaster Retribution]

Adolin reviving Maya seems almost guaranteed at this point, and I doubt Brandon would kill him off just after accomplishing that. He will live until at least book 5, is my bet. 

[DeployParachute]

On 9/24/2020 at 1:24 PM, Subvisual Haze said:

I don't want him to die necessarily, but from a narrative perspective it seems likely.  He just has it a bit too "together" for the size of his role in the story.  It's not like you can't have a more "normal" perspective in a cast full of psychologically scarred heroes, but usually due to their lack of internal conflict they'll be relegated to a more minor side role like Lopen.

He's remarkably devoid of character flaws, burdens and external conflicts.  Without those it's very hard for him to grow internally or have much of an arc moving forward. His sword is an interesting plot thread and he seems to have a minor disagreement with his father, but that's about it. His murder of Sadeas was his biggest remaining thread of doubt/guilt/apprehension, and that plot thread seems to have been largely resolved with minimal consequence.

Even worse (from a survivability standpoint) he's something of an emotional load bearing pillar for Shallan, Renarin, and Kaladin.  He has sort of filled the emotional equivalent of the "mentor" role in the monomyth, helping our other protagonists survive and grow in the early stages of the story.  His death (or sidelining by an permanent injury perhaps?) would force our other heroes into conflict and finding new methods of coping with their burdens and personal growth.

It's hardly guaranteed or anything, Brandon will of course do what he thinks is best for the story, but Adolin as a character has some big danger signs. 

Couldn't have said it better myself, and I have been trying since the end of OB.

One thing I want to expand on, and would be interested in your take, would be the manner of his death, and this is related to one of the poll options.

Is Adolin fated for a NOBLE death, or a TRAGIC death, and can we speculate based on some of the tropes and traits that Brandon has taken with this character. I personally lean towards the latter, and here is why:

What are the potential motivations or reasons an author would insert a main character death? Serving the plot would certainly be of principal importance. Serving the arc of another character would be another. Generating a strong emotional response within the reader would be close behind. Ideally an author can accomplish all of these, though there are instances where a main character death can serve the plot, another character, but not elicit much of an emotional reaction for the reader, and this is totally fine. Probably the last thing an author should do is kill a character solely for the purpose of eliciting an emotional reaction, as it is generally considered a cheap play, and tends to piss readers off. Brandon certainly will not do this. If Brandon were to kill Adolin, it would most certainly be in service of the plot, another character's arc, or both. And he will do so while trying to maximize the emotional reaction of his readers.

A noble death.

What does this mean for Adolin, how does it play out? Well, a noble death for a character would normally involve a form of self sacrifice in order to accomplish something that benefits others. Whether it be securing an item of great importance, or saving a nation, or even a single life, the noble death involves Adolin choosing to exchange his life to the benefit of others. That is where the "noble" part comes into our understanding of the act: choosing to prioritize someone or something else over something that we as mortal creatures are programmed to hold most dear: our own life. If the character chooses this sacrifice, and the cause is worthy, it is thus noble. (choosing to sacrifice oneself for a cause that is not "worthy" would be tragic, but more on that later)

My problem with this ending for Adolin is that such a "noble" death that does not come at the end of an arc for him, does not carry as much of an emotional weight as it would otherwise. I'm not saying NONE, but I don't think it is necessarily maximizing the emotional reaction of the reader as it could. I'll give an example of how I'm viewing this. Let's look at Star Wars OT for a moment.

Old Ben sacrificed himself in ANH, to buy his companions time to escape the Death Star to avoid capture and possibly death. Now most people likely felt the loss, and felt for Luke as he experienced the loss. But it was not something that I think many people dwelt on for very long. We expected it from him, it was within his character, and he had no particular arc that was concluded in that moment (though after the prequels came out one could try and claim that a bit of an arc was added retroactively). There was no believable possibility that this character wouldn't make such a sacrifice. He was who he was, who the audience knew him to be. He served his purpose to the plot, he acted in accordance with his character, and we as an audience grieved briefly, but moved on. The death carried a bit of a shock, but in the aftermath, the general reaction is: well, he wouldn't have done anything else.

Alternatively, you have Vader at the end of RotJ, sacrificing himself to save his son. His sacrifice was not so expected, not so in accordance with his nature. Vader had to make his choice acting against the person he had been for most of the films. He had to choose to prioritize something other than what we as an audience had come to expect of him: his desire for power, and control. Thus him choosing to sacrifice himself for his son closed his character arc: he had to change in order to be able to make that choice. His life may not have been noble, but his death was. His arc concluded, and then he died. To this day, Vader's sacrifice had far more impact to most audiences as a result.

Adolin, unfortunately, currently fits an Old Ben style of "Noble Death". He has no arc, nothing about himself that he would have to change in order to be able to make the choice to sacrifice himself for others. He will do it because, well, he's ADOLIN KHOLIN, the most noble of nobles in existence in Roshar. If the cause is right, he won't hesitate, and of course we wouldn't expect him to. There is nothing in text across the 3 published novels thus far that would indicate to me that he would balk at such a decision. So he'll do it, and we as readers will think: well, it needed to be done, and he was the man to do it. How much of an emotional weight is that going to carry for us the readers? Some, but not as much as his death could, I believe.

A tragic death.

Now we move on to what I think is a much more interesting option, a tragic death. What does it mean for a death to be "tragic"? Well, my brief summation would be a death that did not have to happen, but was only the result of the poor choices of the character themselves, or the poor choices of characters around them. A life cut short, snuffed out in its prime. Tragic deaths automatically have more emotional weight for readers because it leaves you with that sinking feeling in your stomach. That gut punch that has you saying after, over and over: "It didn't have to be this way, why did <character> do that?" And the more innocent, the more noble, the more likeable and unsullied character that suffers such a death, the greater the visceral reaction from the reader. A sacrificial lamb, so to speak. And who better fits the bill than Adolin as he currently is?

That, I think is the state that Brandon has written himself into for Adolin: a choice between a mediocre "noble self sacrifice", or an emotionally supercharged tragic death. He hasn't done the writing leg work to make a maximally emotional Noble Death ala Vader (not the "evil turned good" part, but the acting outside his nature to sacrifice himself part). He would have already had to have been writing for that since OB at least. And before any of the Maya shippers jump on me: reviving Maya is a task, not a character arc. Also, for the record, a "noble death" for Kaladin would have the very same problem as it does for Adolin. And hey, perhaps many readers would actually prefer the mediocre noble death over the alternative, but not I.

If Adolin is to be the only MC death we get this 5 book arc, then it better be good, it better shake me to my core. Otherwise, I think the overall narrative (you know, the one about this epic interplanetary eternal war that thus far has been short on tragedy), will suffer for it.

[Subvisual Haze]

Let's build on Maya, since she is the only real plot thread we have left with Adolin. 

One problem I had reading the Windrunner vs. Fused battle is that Stormlight healing is too powerful and as a result it limits the risk and consequence of battle.  Sure you can still die if you run out stormlight, but any injury short of that can be healed by a radiant just holding stormlight in their body (Lopen's arm, Gaz' eye, Shallan's brain).  War feels weirdly clinical as a result.  Nobody is dealing with even the possibility of a permanent leg wound that limits their mobility or a missing hand or migraines etc.  Even non-Radiants can be patched up if regrowth is given in a quick timeframe, or barring even that a future bonding of a spren (or being a squire under a radiant) unlocks stormlight with the potential to eliminate any bodily injuries.

Adolin is the interesting possible exception here though.  His unwillingness to give up Maya is directly stopping him from becoming a Radiant.  What if Adolin suffers some sort of wound that makes him incapable of combat and too much time passes before he can be brought to a healer with regrowth surge.  He would be placed in an interesting personal conflict, having to decide between accepting a spren bond to heal his injuries, or keeping his connection with Maya.