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RoW Chapter 11 Discussion

206 posts in this topic

4 minutes ago, NeutroniumAlchemist said:

This chapter got me interested in Mosh again, and what's up with his new Fused title and what does it mean?

 

He Who Quiets Jezrien???

 

Which unknown 11th herald did the He Who Quiets kill during the last desolation and what sexy herald power did that honorblade possess?

 

this raises many questions

 

He Who Quiets is the meaning of Vyre(I think),the name he was given qwhen he killed Jezrien at the end of OB

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55 minutes ago, Karger said:

That is possible but if true it implies that she could use stormlight rather then voidlight unless fueling with voidlight is also quiter.

Yes. But risking a mistake and to be found glowing with Stormlight and without red eyes is just an unnecessary risk.

55 minutes ago, Karger said:

I think we can reject this one.  A fused that was acting but behind enough interference to avoid positive identification would create a false positive.

What would create such interference? The point of Venli's check is that Fused cannot hide in the CR.

55 minutes ago, Karger said:

Also if they could figure this one they could also show them how to identify fabrails.

By the spren? It looks like the spren in a fabrial are totally drawn into the PR. There is nothing to see for them.

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31 minutes ago, Lightspine said:

As I've said before, I think that "He killed Lezian, the Pursuer" is being supplied as an explanation to Venli for why Leshwi fears she "might not have a chance to face him again." Lezian is going to take revenge, and either Leshwi thinks this means Kaladin is as good as dead, or there is some sort of system where Leshwi has to defer to Lezian and let him hunt Kaladin without her interference.

This made me consider the possibility of Lezian killing one Windrunner after another in order to provoke Kaladin out of surgeon job, and these deaths would heavy the burden of guilt Kaladin has, untill the breaking point when he will say 4th Ideal.

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1 minute ago, Harbour said:

This made me consider the possibility of Lezian killing one Windrunner after another in order to provoke Kaladin out of surgeon job, and these deaths would heavy the burden of guilt Kaladin has, untill the breaking point when he will say 4th Ideal.

I wish I could unread this because now I'm very scared of the possibility. Poor Kal, that would be one rough journey to the 4th ideal.

I could definitely imagine Lezian becoming an important antagonist this book, kind of taking the place of Amaram or Sadeas (although we already know the Ghostbloods and SoH are also kind of taking those spots)

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Quote

“Gather yourself, Last Listener,” Leshwi said to the Rhythm of Agony. “Something is happening. Something dangerous. I fear the war is about to take a distinctly different turn.”

I like the idea that Sja-Anat's defection is the "dangerous" change mentioned by Leshwi.  It stands to reason that if Sja-Anat was powerful enough to corrupt a Radiant spren (Glys), she might also be powerful enough to corrupt Odium's spren in turn.

Including potentially the "spren" form of the Fused.

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Something dawned on me with this chapter. We've obviously made the connection between Scadrian magic and fabrial tech. What's interesting to me is that fabrials are just machines using metallic arts properties with trapped spren to emulate singer forms. Gem heart with a trapped spren, using a metal cage as a catalyst empowering the function of the body (the fabrial itself). Just something to consider. 

Do we know if steel even has been discovered on Roshar? I can't recall ever seeing it mentioned.

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4 minutes ago, Solant said:

Do we know if steel even has been discovered on Roshar? I can't recall ever seeing it mentioned.

There are references. The epigraph before this one indicates they know steel and im fairly certain there are other references as well

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maybe the new thing is rlain bonding a spren?

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21 minutes ago, StanLemon said:

There are references. The epigraph before this one indicates they know steel and im fairly certain there are other references as well

I've seen elsewhere on the shard that that epigraph was a typo and was supposed to be pewter and tin (I think). I don't think that Roshar has steel.

One of the core components to steel is carbon. On Earth we use coal or charcoal to create this and I don't think that there has been enough time on Roshar for an abundance of a carbon source to form.

All coal on Earth was created over a very specific time period and required very specific conditions that I don't think have existed on Roshar.

 

Edited by GudThymes
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5 minutes ago, GudThymes said:

I've seen elsewhere on the shard that that epigraph was a typo and was supposed to be pewter and tin (I think). I don't think that Roshar has steel.

One of the core components to steel is carbon. On Earth we use coal or charcoal to create this and I don't think that there has been enough time on Roshar for an abundance of a carbon source to form.

All coal on Earth was created over a very specific time period and required very specific conditions that I don't think have existed on Roshar.

 

Unfortunately even if it is a typo, elsewhere we do have confirmation of steel. This line is from when Taravangian is showing Dalinar the Half-shards

Quote

Glad for the distraction, Dalinar took the shield, hefting it. “Half-shard?” he said, noting a steel box—with a gemstone inside—fastened to the inner surface.

Edited by StanLemon
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Just now, StanLemon said:

Unfortunately even if it is a typo, elsewhere we do have conformation of steel. This line is from when Taravangian is showing Dalinar the Half-shards

 

Hmmm. Good to know. I would assume it's soulcast then, given what I said above about creation of coal.

 

Honestly I'm not sure how coal exists anywhere in the cosmere given that it takes literally millions of years to form. But that's a digression.

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8 minutes ago, GudThymes said:

Hmmm. Good to know. I would assume it's soulcast then, given what I said above about creation of coal.

 

Honestly I'm not sure how coal exists anywhere in the cosmere given that it takes literally millions of years to form. But that's a digression.

Likely they used the same or similar methods that the we used for it. Smelting iron and mixing it with ash and charcoal. Not the most effective methods for producing quality steel but it is a step up from iron

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52 minutes ago, king of nowhere said:

maybe the new thing is rlain bonding a spren?

How would the Fused learn that withinin a few hours of it happening?

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10 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

How would the Fused learn that withinin a few hours of it happening?

well, they do have spanreeds. and i assume you can do stuff by looking in the cognitive realm, and we know the fused have conquered parts of that too

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1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

Yes. But risking a mistake and to be found glowing with Stormlight and without red eyes is just an unnecessary risk.

Totally worth it given all of the advantages.

1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

What would create such interference? The point of Venli's check is that Fused cannot hide in the CR.

As far as she knows.  However her method relies on direct observation.  What if a wall is in the way?

1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

By the spren? It looks like the spren in a fabrial are totally drawn into the PR. There is nothing to see for them.

Navani's PoV indicates this is untrue.

1 hour ago, Solant said:

Do we know if steel even has been discovered on Roshar? I can't recall ever seeing it mentioned.

It has been.  Blades are made of steel.

1 hour ago, king of nowhere said:

maybe the new thing is rlain bonding a spren?

Certainly a possiblity.

22 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

How would the Fused learn that withinin a few hours of it happening?

Big events might generate fortune Odium can pick up on.

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On 15/09/2020 at 3:01 PM, _edgedancer said:

but perhaps more specific because there are far more Fused than there are Heralds. 

Perhaps specific fused were so to speak the patron deities of their own descendants, it's possible that ancestor worship was a fair part of ancient singer culture. Or maybe it parallels views on the companions of Muhammad in Islam where descent from a particular fused is something people are obsessed with and massively important in society and particular fused are seen as completely divinely inspired and unable to have done any wrong. 

Edited by SpeakoftheDeval
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4 minutes ago, Karger said:

Totally worth it given all of the advantages.

Such as? For Stormlight she needs to charge gems.

4 minutes ago, Karger said:

As far as she knows.  However her method relies on direct observation.  What if a wall is in the way?

In the CR? It's a lake. And Venli detected Leshwi through a ceiling.

4 minutes ago, Karger said:

Navani's PoV indicates this is untrue.

For Soulcasters

 

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17 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

Such as? For Stormlight she needs to charge gems.

Yes but it would allow greater power use.

17 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

In the CR? It's a lake. And Venli detected Leshwi through a ceiling.

What about several buildings or several other people grouped together?  The close confines of a city make visual conformation extraordinarily difficult.

17 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

For Soulcasters

True but we know they will positively ID soulcasters from OB.

Edited by Karger
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6 hours ago, Lightspine said:

Leshwi doesn’t think she’ll get to fight Kaladin again, why is that? She can’t already know about his removal from the field.

I think that the phrasing here—with Leshwi replying to Venli’s attunement of Curiosity—is meant to imply that Lezian is the reason Leshwi thinks she won’t be able to fight Kaladin. Lezian is a creature of pride, and probably wants vengeance. I bet he’ll be seeking Kaladin out, and he doesn’t have the Heavenly One’s aversion to attacking non-combatants so Kal will be forced to fight him despite being off the battlefield.

I also want to know why Leshwi is interested in Syl, and says she didn’t show herself despite the fact that she fought against a Sylblade. Leshwi wants to see he in spren form? But she doesn’t ask her to show herself?

Maybe it used to be some sort of tradition for Honorspren to show themselves to the Heavenly Ones as a part of their respectful duel, one which is now lost?

Maybe a spy told them the kaladin situation

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@Lightspine yes, I think it's probably that she knows that Lezian will do whatever he has to do to attract and kill Kal now, so he won't be able to "play" with her in the skies, and will probably be killed. Her reaction here seems disappointed, but not too much so. She's obviously intrigued by him, but maybe even more so by his spren. I wonder if they know she is the "Ancient Daughter". I'm sure they must, given that the Fused probably captured and tortured the sailor Honorspren in Shadesmar. It may even be that one of the technological advances they are working on is a gem that works like the Fabrial science we are seeing that can attract and capture bonded Radiant spren when in the heat of battle?

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1 hour ago, Karger said:

Yes but it would allow greater power use.

What for? Nothing that Venli does is constrained by power. Her use of Cohesion is for testing and training. And should she find herself leading her people through the wilderness, it will not matter how fast she builds them a storm shelter, but that it be large enough. And for peeking into the CR, Voidlight does the job.

1 hour ago, Karger said:

What about several buildings or several other people grouped together?

You can be quite sure people in the city took their spanreeds into their storm cellars under ground. It did not work. Kholinar fell silent.

1 hour ago, Karger said:

 The close confines of a city make visual conformation extraordinarily difficult.

Again, a Fused looks very differently.

1 hour ago, Karger said:

True but we know they will positively ID soulcasters from OB.

Well, no. They identified an activated Soulcaster or fabrial. As long as they were switched off, there was no problem.

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1 minute ago, Oltux72 said:

You can be quite sure people in the city took their spanreeds into their storm cellars under ground. It did not work. Kholinar fell silent.

Exactly.

1 minute ago, Oltux72 said:

Again, a Fused looks very differently.

In the cognitive realm?

1 minute ago, Oltux72 said:

What for?

Training.  I am trying to find her limits.

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Brand remind me of Hemalurgy

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8 hours ago, Honorless said:

confirmation of Dalinar's "hunch" of nine types (called brands, apparently) of Fused

I like how Venli mentions Brands and then has a thought that she’s never seen a brand on the skin of a fused.

I think the brand isn't on their skin. Its on their soul

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14 minutes ago, Eternal Khol said:

I think the brand isn't on their skin. Its on their soul

Or perhaps this is what it feels like to become one.

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