Jump to content

Navani's Critic?


Karger

Navani's Critic?  

146 members have voted

  1. 1. Who left the ruby?

    • Taravangain?
      1
    • Malata as a rouge agent?
      3
    • A sleepless
      53
    • A rouge sleepless?
      4
    • Odium's forces?
      1
    • Venli?
      4
    • A spren?
      22
    • The sibling?
      29
    • The GBs?
      1
    • Some other force of Odium's
      1
    • Other?
      13
    • Sja-anat
      14


Recommended Posts

Ooh, I bet it's the Shin / Stone Shamans. 

Just as the Shin regard the stone of Roshar as a holy thing that they should not step on or mine, they likely have a similar reverence for the spren of Roshar.  The Shin recognize that humanity are guests on the planet Roshar, and their cultural beliefs tend to keep them inside the original area set aside for humans.  Shinovar itself had no visible spren during Rysn's visit, and while the Shin barter for soulcast scrap metal, they do not seem interested in acquiring soulcasters fabrials of their own.  While they've allowed the existence outside of Shinovar of a small number of fabrials and soulcasters until now, Navani's research as well as sharing of her knowledge to multiple kingdoms has the potential to result in the enslavement of an enormous number of spren with potential dangerous ecological effects to Roshar. 

As for who planted the communication ruby inside Navani's travel pod: one of the Shin holding an honorblade with the Illumination surge would be an exceptional spy/infiltrator.

Edited by Subvisual Haze
soulcaster != fabrial
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think it is the Mink. This is the Willshaper Book, Willshapers seek freedom, and fabrials imprison spren. In addition, Willshapers are close to spren like the elsecallers of the past. The Mink could have placed it and his spren or another Reacher could have done the communicating.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am thinking on the lines of two possibilities:

Option 1: The Sleepless. I think this one most likely. They seemed to want to protect what they have in Aimia (including apparently a large cache of soulcasters) - perhaps to prevent them being used. The Sleepless always seemed like spren themselves with the way they are sort of just possessing a bunch of cremlings. Theory: Could it be that the soulcasters spren Navani observed are "the Sleeping ones" vs the Aimians are "the Sleepless" - they are the same just not captured and therefore still conscious, hence the Aimians hoarding soulcasters to protect their kin. Similarly, could the Aimians be aware of what happened with Ashyn and are trying to warn Navani not to create these spiritual realm fabrials as that would have similar disastrous effects?

Option 2: Cultivation herself. We know in Mistborn 

Spoiler

that Ruin could alter text that is not on metal

so I think Cultivation should be able to somehow manipulate a gem directly to write or to alter text from spanreed. Some spren call her Mother, she may really view them as her children and therefore be against Fabrials. Additionally she may not trust Honorspren now that Honor himself is not around and think they are misguided. She doesn't generally act this openly but does in exceptional world-changing cases (e.g. Dalinar) and maybe she saw something with her future-sight that indicated some pruning may be needed here. Again she would be aware of what happened on Ashyn and could be trying to avoid the same happening on Roshar.

Edited by Dreamwa1ker
typo
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Using a spanreed (powered by an enslaved spren) to communicate your opposition to the enslaving of spren is odd.  Why not just write a letter?  I suppose it explains the terseness of the language.

I think the person communicating this message is fulfilling some sort of honorable protocol.  Deliver a warning to cease and desist that you can verify was received and acknowledged by the target.  If they persist then you move on to direct action.  Which kind of reinforces my gut feeling that this is the Shin and they are about to finally enter the greater conflict.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The way the message uses the superlative, "You have caused more pain than any living person"  makes me think that the message isn't sincere.  Unless Navani has done something incredibly drastic in the last year that we don't know about yet, I don't think it's true.  I think the messenger is trying to instill doubt and fear to prevent Navani from further developments.  So my guess is someone from Odium's side.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Lidolas said:

Unless Navani has done something incredibly drastic in the last year that we don't know about yet, I don't think it's true. 

I have theory that any conjoiner/reverser pair of fabrials is in fact one fabrial, and have one spren splited in to halves, and this is painfull process. So if this is true, that ship powered by thousands of conjoiners, with need to replace them after trip with next thousands, will be very drastic for spren.

I also like theory about Shin.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ah, this is what I was thinking of regarding the Shin and hints that they disapprove of fabrials (WoK Rysn's interlude)

Quote

The world is changing outside, but the Shin seem determined to remain the same. I’ve tried to offer them fabrials, but they find them worthless. Or unholy. Or too holy to use.”

“Those are rather different things, master.”

“Yes,” he said. “But with the Shin, it’s often hard to distinguish among them.

Normally the Shin avoid venturing outside of Shinovar or imposing their cultural restrictions on others.  They might make an exception with regards to Urithiru though.  Navani using the holy city as her site of largescale fabrial experimentation / spren imprisonment might be a bridge too far for Shin honor.  If Shin of the past had no ethical concerns with visiting Urithiru, they might well be willing to attack/sabotage Urithiru today.

I also think it's important to note that previous era experimentation with fabrials was very primitive.  This is not necessarily an indication that modern Roshar is significantly more technologically advanced than the Silver Kingdoms at their heights (as Navani immediately assumes).  There might well be a good reasons (ethically, ecologically, or diplomatic) why humanity avoided advanced fabrial research before.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

OK, I have changed my mind upon finishing Oathbringer and reading its Ars Arcanum. Let me quote:

Quote

I am more and more convinced that the creation of these devices requires forced enslavement of transformative cognitive entities, known as "spren" to the local communities.

Pretty damning words in an academic work. Enslavement, not entrapment or capture.

These words are written by Khrissalla. That explains why the writing and the wording are odd. She is about as foreign as possible.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

OK, I have changed my mind upon finishing Oathbringer and reading its Ars Arcanum. Let me quote:

Pretty damning words in an academic work. Enslavement, not entrapment or capture.

These words are written by Khrissalla. That explains why the writing and the wording are odd. She is about as foreign as possible.

Oooh... I hadn't even considered that Khriss might interact so directly with a main character! Though it wouldn't be the first time...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Huh. Mostly, I woudn't expect Khriss to get involved in a violent conflict like this. She's a researcher, not a warrior, and these guys are in the middle of a Shardic fight against Odium, a fight which is spilling over to the Cognitive Realm which is Khriss's way in and out. This would be a time I'd expect Khriss to go "I'm staying the heck away and watching" rather than "I'm gonna go poke the bear".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, ftl said:

Huh. Mostly, I woudn't expect Khriss to get involved in a violent conflict like this. She's a researcher, not a warrior, and these guys are in the middle of a Shardic fight against Odium, a fight which is spilling over to the Cognitive Realm which is Khriss's way in and out. This would be a time I'd expect Khriss to go "I'm staying the heck away and watching" rather than "I'm gonna go poke the bear".

That is the point. It may seem to her like no longer an internal conflict of Roshar, when the Knights Radiant start enslaving creatures from another realm.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

23 hours ago, Blackwarder said:

I think the latter is about the upgrades of urithiro fabrials.

its hurting the sibling and she should stop.

Well, but who would be writing? If it were The Sibling itself, why not a simple message to and through the Stormfather?

The sets of entities

  • caring about The Sibling
  • being nice enough to send a warning
  • able to smuggle a gem stone into Navani's capsule
  • without communication channels working much easier

lacks overlap.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...