Chinkoln Posted August 15, 2020 Report Share Posted August 15, 2020 If you want 10th Heightening, just go on a killing spree. Use a Hemalurgic spike, store in blood between kills, and just gather enough breaths. Quote Questioner Can Hemalurgy steal other manifestations of Investiture? Brandon Sanderson Yes. If it is part of the soul, Hemalurgy can steal it. Firefight Chicago signing (Feb. 20, 2015) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halyo_Alex Posted August 15, 2020 Report Share Posted August 15, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Chinkoln said: If you want 10th Heightening, just go on a killing spree. Use a Hemalurgic spike, store in blood between kills, and just gather enough breaths. Sorry to break your spike there buddy but Breaths aren't hemalurgically attainable. Divine breaths, on the other hand, are "more physical" and so can be stolen with Hemalurgy. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/80/#e5282 and https://wob.coppermind.net/events/364/#e11389 Edited August 15, 2020 by Halyo_Alex somehow posted prematurely 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Khol Posted August 16, 2020 Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Halyo_Alex said: “more physical” I think you mean Spiritual Edited August 16, 2020 by Eternal Khol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanLemon Posted August 16, 2020 Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 Give your Breath to a Nicrosil Compounder. Infinite Breath 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted August 16, 2020 Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 2 hours ago, StanLemon said: Give your Breath to a Nicrosil Compounder. Infinite Breath Don't think that's the breath that Cadmium does. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halyo_Alex Posted August 16, 2020 Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Eternal Khol said: I think you mean Spiritual Yes, I made a typo. Thank you EDIT: anyway this whole idea is moot because you can't use the same single spike for multiple thefts of spiritweb, and even then, you couldn't possibly fit the... *checks notes* 50,000 Breaths needed for the 10th heightening inside one, or even a few spikes. You'd tear your own Spiritweb to shreds before you even got halfway there, easily. Besides, that means you have to actively murder 50,000 people, rather than gathering 50,000 breaths willingly, without murder. You horrible piece of scum. Edited August 16, 2020 by Halyo_Alex Clarity 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innovation Posted August 16, 2020 Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 Now, you could spike a few Returned to gain 3 (if you don’t want Shards to be able to control you) Divine Breaths. That would probably gain you an aura of about 6,000 breaths, though you can’t awaken with them. Figuring out where to spike a Returned and what binds points to place to spikes on will be tough, considering that no one seems to know much about Hemalurgy besides some Shards, who don’t seem to be inclined to share (for good reason). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chinkoln Posted August 16, 2020 Author Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 Well, now that I think about it if you were threatening to kill someone they would probably decide to give it to you willingly and be Drab, instead of being brutally killed by a spike. Plus, depending on the people you threaten, you might not have to kill/threaten 50,000 different people. If you were to find the right people, like Vivenna, who is inexperienced, you could get 600 right then and there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halyo_Alex Posted August 16, 2020 Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 8 minutes ago, Innovation said: Figuring out where to spike a Returned and what binds points to place to spikes on will be tough, considering that no one seems to know much about Hemalurgy besides some Shards, who don’t seem to be inclined to share (for good reason). Personal hypothesis is that tapping F-Nicrosil (Fortune) would give you an intuition on what points do what with the spike you've got if your Intent is to spike someone with it for a specific outcome. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innovation Posted August 16, 2020 Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 7 minutes ago, Halyo_Alex said: F-Nicrosil (Fortune) You mean F-Chromium right? I’m pretty sure F-Nicrosil stores Investiture. 8 minutes ago, Halyo_Alex said: Personal hypothesis is that tapping F-Nicrosil (Fortune) would give you an intuition on what points do what with the spike you've got if your Intent is to spike someone with it for a specific outcome. We don’t know much about fortune, but this certainly seems possible. Perhaps this could work with Aons and other Investitures on Sel. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halyo_Alex Posted August 16, 2020 Report Share Posted August 16, 2020 Just now, Innovation said: You mean F-Chromium right? I’m pretty sure F-Nicrosil stores Investiture. Yes you're right. God I keep making typos like that. Just now, Innovation said: We don’t know much about fortune, but this certainly seems possible. Perhaps this could work with Aons and other Investitures on Sel. Ooh, How to Discover A New Aon 101: Tap Chromium 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weltall Posted August 18, 2020 Report Share Posted August 18, 2020 We really don't know enough about Fortune and F-Chromium to be sure that would work, though it's certainly a possibility. We know Hoid has some way of knowing where he needs to be but he doesn't know why, it just leads him to locations and he hangs out until he figures out what he's supposed to do or gets bored and leaves. He's got a lot of experience to draw on and he still can't figure it out all the time. So it might be that F-Chromium can't do something like guide you towards the right spot to place a spike/draw lines to form a new Aon, or it might be that it can do that but it's not your destiny to do so because someone else will and soon enough that the future is largely deterministic and no amount of Fortune is going to shift that. But it's definitely a magic application I want to learn more about. xD As for the easiest (non-morally-bankrupt) way to get lots of Breath, have lots and lots of money and just buy the things. We know that Idris was able to afford enough Breaths to get Lemex to the Third Heightening so if you've got a substantial amount of money you can buy your way there eventually, you just need to do what Lemex did about a hundred times over. But hey, once you hit the Fifth Heightening you've got all the time in the world... Oh, and Brandon has implied that there's a way to harvest Breath from Nalthis itself. Possibly there's a way to grab them after someone has died but before their Breath gets recycled back to Endowment, or possibly given the reference to Mistborn you could somehow convert Endowment's godmetal into a bunch of Breaths if you had some and knew what to do. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiring Writer Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 On 8/15/2020 at 3:35 PM, Chinkoln said: If you want 10th Heightening, just go on a killing spree. Use a Hemalurgic spike, store in blood between kills, and just gather enough breaths. That is so dumb on so many levels (No offense). First off, you are going to kill 50,000 people? That would take forever, and that's assuming people don't start getting wise and try and hunt you down for several murders, possibly by people with Breaths. Second, every second that spike isn't in blood (which then brings up how the hell you're going to carry the spike with you for all these murders, but moving on) that spike will lose so much investiture, you will be lucky to have one Breath worth of investiture. And all this is a moot point because you can't even use a hemalurgic spike to steal Breaths! Yes, it's a form of investiture, but it can't do everything! But even then, the idea was dead from the start. It sounds like a good idea until you think for three seconds how the hell do I actually kill 50,000 people in real life with the exact same spike? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 6 hours ago, Aspiring Writer said: That is so dumb on so many levels (No offense). First off, you are going to kill 50,000 people? That would take forever, and that's assuming people don't start getting wise and try and hunt you down for several murders, possibly by people with Breaths. Second, every second that spike isn't in blood (which then brings up how the hell you're going to carry the spike with you for all these murders, but moving on) that spike will lose so much investiture, you will be lucky to have one Breath worth of investiture. And all this is a moot point because you can't even use a hemalurgic spike to steal Breaths! Yes, it's a form of investiture, but it can't do everything! But even then, the idea was dead from the start. It sounds like a good idea until you think for three seconds how the hell do I actually kill 50,000 people in real life with the exact same spike? Atium could steel breath. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aspiring Writer Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 4 hours ago, Frustration said: Atium could steel breath. On 8/15/2020 at 4:47 PM, Halyo_Alex said: Sorry to break your spike there buddy but Breaths aren't hemalurgically attainable. Divine breaths, on the other hand, are "more physical" and so can be stolen with Hemalurgy. https://wob.coppermind.net/events/80/#e5282 and https://wob.coppermind.net/events/364/#e11389 Sorry, dude, Breath can't be stolen with Hemalurgy. Doesn't matter what spike you use. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halyo_Alex Posted September 26, 2020 Report Share Posted September 26, 2020 Your only hope is to somehow slaughter enough Returned with an atium spike to get several Divine Breaths, enough to equal 50,000 regular Breaths. And somehow I doubt Endowment is going to approve of that. So maybe just don't. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innovation Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 1 hour ago, Halyo_Alex said: And somehow I doubt Endowment is going to approve of that. So maybe just don't. Don’t get me started on why we haven’t seen Shards just smite people... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eternal Khol Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, Innovation said: Don’t get me started on why we haven’t seen Shards just smite people... Because it doesnt make for a very interesting story for the shard to just go “you’re getting too strong. Boom your dead” ”oh, i don’t particularly like you. Boom your dead” “your trying to stop me. oh well... Boom your dead” XD Edited September 27, 2020 by Eternal Khol 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 1 hour ago, Innovation said: Don’t get me started on why we haven’t seen Shards just smite people... I've had that thought to Well from what we've seen Spoilers Cosmere Spoiler Elantris, Shard: Splintered White Sand, Shard: uninvolved Warbreaker, Shard: Chessmaster Mistborn: Shards: Both shards are incapable of doing anything big due simply to the others exsistance Stormlight Archive: Odium sure would like to but Cultivation would make him pay BIG time for it. So That's why. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Halyo_Alex Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) 19 hours ago, Innovation said: Don’t get me started on why we haven’t seen Shards just smite people... I think I've seen a WoB pertaining to this... Let's see... Oh. Yep. Quote RandyD Can a Shard just smite someone? Like, "Boom, you're dead," and they die? Brandon Sanderson So, Shards can do this, depending on where they are. For instance, Odium can't, but Endowment could. Skyward Seattle signing (Nov. 10, 2018) Well that's kinda terrifying but Frustration pointed out why Endowment wouldn't. Edit: wouldn't ordinarily* Edit 2: Found this WoB as well: Quote RandyD Can a Shard just--like, say someone is using their magic system--can they stop the power from them being able to use it? Brandon Sanderson No, that's a bit like stopping the laws of physics. So, while they can circumvent laws of physics and things like that, but if you wanted to stop someone from using magic, smiting them would be the efficient way of making that happen, if you are capable of it in the system. Skyward Seattle signing (Nov. 10, 2018) Huh, from the same questioner. Lol. Edited September 27, 2020 by Halyo_Alex Clarity + second WoB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ftl Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 Endowment would have no need to smite people, I think. Really, on any single-Shard system, the Shard would probably take a pretty hands-off approach to the people mostly because nothing the people do can really hurt the Shard. So we get smaller-scale stories (more "save the city or kingdom" than "save the planet") because it's just operating on a different level. People aren't opposing Shards here, so there's no Shards-smiting-people going on. (spoilers for which stories have just one Shard involved and so no inter-shard conflict) Spoiler Warbreaker, White Sand, the start of Mistborn Era 2 when we don't know about the forces opposing Harmony yet, Whereas on a multi-shard system, the people can be the "tiebreaker" in a fight between Shards, so we see epic save-the-world plots, but no shards-smiting-people because that's an inefficient use of shardic power in an inter-shard fight. (spoilers for which stories have multi-shard conflict) Spoiler Stormlight Archive, Mistborn Era 1, the later parts of Mistborn Era 2 when we run into the forces that oppose Harmony 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innovation Posted September 27, 2020 Report Share Posted September 27, 2020 (edited) I get that Endowment sends the Returned, but she seems to care a decent bit about her planet. Eliminating people who are trying to sow chaos and things can get a lot more stable. SA spoilers: Spoiler Cultivation could just mess around with Odium’s plans a bit. Kill off a few key people, silently and slowly, and Odium won’t be able to pinpoint her. Number one on her hit list should be Moash. Mistborn spoilers: Spoiler Ruin could cause earthquakes, storms, and volcanic eruptions. Smiting people probably wouldn’t be too hard for him. I totally understand why, for plot reasons, that Shards don’t smite people. But it is possible in most cases, and it is an easy solution to many problems. Edited September 27, 2020 by Innovation 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bondranx Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 (edited) I would imagine that the fact that shards typically see ‘mere humans’ as being so far beneath them that smiting them is pointless. The thought of “this being is trying to stop me, but realistically I am so far beyond their capability, what can they really do to me.” secret History spoiler: Spoiler Ruin for instance saw Vin as so far beneath him that it wasn’t worth it to just destroy her. Instead he mocked her and gloated that nothing she could do would stop the end. And realistically without the mists and taking up preservations power, he was right. Even though he likely could have just destroyed her, like he tried with Kelsier in Secret History after he used Preservation’s power. Edited October 7, 2020 by Bondranx 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frustration Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 13 minutes ago, Bondranx said: I would imagine that the fact that shards typically see ‘mere humans’ as being so far beneath them that smiting them is pointless. The thought of “this being is trying to stop me, but realistically I am so far beyond their capability, what can they really do to me.” Reveal hidden contents Ruin for instance saw Vin as so far beneath him that it wasn’t worth it to just destroy her. Instead he mocked her and gloated that nothing she could do would stop the end. And realistically without the mists and taking up preservations power, he was right. Even though he likely could have just destroyed her, like he tried with Kelsier in Secret History after he used Preservation’s power. Might want to say that it's a SH spoiler. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bondranx Posted October 7, 2020 Report Share Posted October 7, 2020 23 minutes ago, Frustration said: Might want to say that it's a SH spoiler. Thanks, didn’t occur to me the first time, fixed 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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