Gavilar is an Abuser

[GudThymes]

4 minutes ago, Watchcry said:

Of course I do. I'm not sure why you thought I didn't. I said it's normal for some people and cultures. That's a fact. I didn't realize I had to give my opinion.  My opinion is that it's wrong. Be careful not to judge people to be evil just because they don't give an opinion. That's dangerous. There's too much of that going on in the world. 

Look mate, I didn't mean to slight you or put words in your mouth or misrepresent you. But I find that "facts" without opinion or discussion is an opinion of itself. I interpreted your initial comment to be diminishing or dismissive of the ramifications of Gavilar's abusive behavior (which is why I wrote this thread).

 

I hear you on not judging people, and apologies if it came across that way. I am happy to continue that aspect of the conversation in DMs if you would like but I don't find it relevant to the topic or productive to the overall discussion on this thread.

[Karger]

On 8/9/2020 at 2:39 PM, Watchcry said:

I see this as something that was normal 100 years ago in some cultures (arabic, east asian to name a few). So Gavilar would have felt right at home.  Dalinar did degrade her sometimes imo, though. 

?  Abuse is probably the oldest crime in human history and is as disgustingly present in plenty of western cultures as it is in the ones you named over that time span.

[LightReader]

Dalinar did treat Evi badly at times and often neglected her. He wasn’t as bad as Gavilar though. What’s really important is that Dalinar is owning his mistakes and is genuinely repentant. We don’t know, and I highly doubt, that Gavilar would have ever done the same.

[Subvisual Haze]

I'd say it's a pretty accurate portrayal of two politicians stuck in a loveless marriage.  Especially so in monarchies marriages were primarily a political agreement to reinforce alliances and produce heirs, they smile together in public, and in private tend to regard each other with minimal affection and often outright contempt.

[scratek]

For how much research Brandon did to write about DID in Shallan's arc and depression in Kaladin's arc, I feel pretty certain that he did a good amount of research about abuse. I want to answer the question of why does Gavilar act that way by talking about the real life reasons for domestic abuse. For a bit of context, I work a lot with people who have been convicted of domestic assault. I would say about half of the clients that I work with have been incarcerated for either strangulating their partners, violating protection orders, or after being convicted of domestic assault on multiple occasions. 

I want to state one thing first - mental health issues and substance abuse do not cause domestic abuse. It can exacerbate it because people are more likely to make impulse decisions because of these factors, but it does not cause it in 99% of cases (yes, there are a few outliers, but we don't see any evidence of heavy enough substance use or severe enough mental health problems for Gavilar to be one of those outliers). I would also add that the extreme power differences between Navani and Gavilar. That's something that Gavilar points out to Navani in this chapter

Right now, the best model for understanding domestic abuse is the Duluth model. This model suggests that domestic abuse is all about the abuser maintaining power and control in the relationship. This model has produced both the Power and Control Wheel as well as the Equality Wheel. I can't link to either as I have not posted enough, but I recommend looking them up. Now, you can argue that it is flawed or that another model is better, but after working with many batterers, I feel that it describes the reasons behind domestic abuse well. The abuse in dv (or domestic violence situations) is often not about lashing out or the batterer misdirecting their anger, but it is used as a weapon to get their way and maintain power in the situation. For example, I have had situations where I will be having an calm conversation with someone and I will tell them to do something they don't like. In an instant, they will be screaming at me as a way to intimidate me into changing my mind. Most batterers have learned that the most reliable way to get control of a situation is through violence, which might be why people with histories of domestic violence are more likely to engage in violence against law enforcement and perpetrate mass shooting. This also fits with what we know about Gavilar. He took control and maintains control over his kingdom through acts of violence. In the end, there isn't really one event that can cause a person to become an abuser. It has more to do with an need for power and control and the willingness to use violence to fulfill that need. 

 

Edited August 29, 2020 by scratek
general grammar errors