Technologies to be replaced with metallic arts in Era 3

[+Oltux72]

We had a thread about this, but it got derailed into the exact physics of allomancy and feruchemy again. So maybe we can try to agree on something. What are we sure could be replaced with metallic arts if you have them at an industrial scale?

• aerodynamic aircraft - that is extremely easy, Southern Scadrial has already done it. Aerodynamics will remain a minor part of science and engineering for machinery and ballistics, but that's it
• power plants - obviously allomantic pushes and pulls can power a generator. Yet feruchemy also allows that as it allows you to manipulate your weight and centripetal/centrifugal forces
• antibiotics, X-rays, medical ventilators, prostethics - why bother if feruchemical gold is plentiful?
• agriculture - that one would be a deep cut into society. But it is possible, once you have enough bendalloy. Would people want that, though? Is it possible that actual food will be for the rich and middle class in future Scadrial?
• scuba diving - just too obvious, albeit extremely specialised an application
• education - this is getting very speculative, but can copper feruchemy actually teach you something?

[Karger]

7 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

antibiotics, X-rays, medical ventilators, prostethics - why bother if feruchemical gold is plentiful?

Feruchemical gold has limits.  Medical study will still require work.  Additionally x-rays on earth were actually discovered by accident and I think a it would be a good idea to know how to set bones before healing them.

Gold is also not particularly good at getting rid of disease so antibiotics would still be useful.  Medical ventolators I partially agree on.  Cadmium seems like an easier solution.

7 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

agriculture - that one would be a deep cut into society. But it is possible, once you have enough bendalloy. Would people want that, though? Is it possible that actual food will be for the rich and middle class in future Scadrial?

They might supplement but people will still enjoy a good meal even if they don't need it.  Some agriculture like vineyards will remain intact and most other food will probably still be produced at some scale.  Food is something that a lot of people take very seriously.

7 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

education - this is getting very speculative, but can copper feruchemy actually teach you something?

I don't really see it as any different then a book.  Can books teach you?  Of course but we still need educators.  If you made a large unkeyed version you might be able to make some kind of coppermind internet though.

[Emerald_Mage]

13 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

education - this is getting very speculative, but can copper feruchemy actually teach you something?

Only if you don't put the knowledge back in the coppermind. So easier transference of information, but it will have to be learned the same number of times, 1+ per person. However, a fast learner could learn a topic then give the knowledge to another via an unkeyed/unsealed metalmind.

[NameIess]

11 minutes ago, Emerald_Mage said:

Only if you don't put the knowledge back in the coppermind. So easier transference of information, but it will have to be learned the same number of times, 1+ per person. However, a fast learner could learn a topic then give the knowledge to another via an unkeyed/unsealed metalmind.

Or a compounder.

[Emerald_Mage]

2 hours ago, Nameless said:

Or a compounder.

Possibly(?) According to the coppermind, we don't know what happens when you compound a coppermind.

One possibility is that it improves memory, but that is debatable.

[NameIess]

Just now, Emerald_Mage said:

Possibly(?) According to the coppermind, we don't know what happens when you compound a coppermind.

One possibility is that it improves memory, but that is debatable.

Brandon has said it isn't useless:

Quote

FireArcadia

Is there any use to being a copper Compounder, from a Feruchemical point of view? I think the same point would also apply to an aluminum Compounder.

Brandon Sanderson

Some combinations, like some abilities themselves, aren't really that useful. That said, being able to Compound copper...that could do some things. Aluminum, not so much.

17th Shard Forum Q&A (Sept. 25, 2012)

So I imagine that it would probably allow you to have an extremely powerful memory that never deteriorates. 

[Frustration]

I could see monorails being made much earlier due to Crashers/coinshots with ironminds.

[StarrFall]

Random thoughts on this topic that brought be back to the forum: Scadrial is a planet where the perpetual motion machine should be 100% achievable with minimal human effort and without any fuel at all, Allomantic or otherwise. (F)Iron Feruchemists could simply sit in a counter-balanced elevator and then fill and drain their metal minds all day long while turbines capture the energy from the rise and fall of the elevator/ballast.  Could be geared to gently rise with no weight (filling metalmind) and gently fall when the Feruchemist's natural weight is restored.  If the Feruchemist has enough stores from that method (and MASSIVE metalminds could be dropped in or the elevator itself could be solid iron, to provide maximum capacity), then could re-gear to speed up the cycle/generation rate by adding a bit more ballast and having the Ferucheminst use stored weight to power the downstroke and natural weight for a gentle ride up or filling the metal mind for a more adventurous ride up. 

Could even make the elevator into an office or shop or something with desk/chair metalminds to accommodate teams, as long as it is counterbalanced properly.  Generating free, if somewhat limited, electricity could be a byproduct many indoor jobs for any (F)Iron Feruchemist, and where being being grotesquely obese could actually be enormously beneficial in some ways.  If you wanted to go all "Rick and Morty" on it, you could even make "Gooble Box" stair machines for Feruchemists, lol!

Edited December 15, 2020 by StarrFall

[LordFlea]

Think of it in another way too. A zinc compounder making medallions and the research that mental speed could bring

[Stormtide_Leviathan]

I think it’s a very safe bet that any form of hrt for trans folk won’t use hormones like in our world but unkeyed goldminds, since we know they work this way

[Knight of Iron]

On 5/24/2020 at 11:49 AM, Karger said:

I don't really see it as any different then a book.  Can books teach you?  Of course but we still need educators.  If you made a large unkeyed version you might be able to make some kind of coppermind internet though.

As someone who was homeschooled and was hardly ever taught via an actual teacher (learning mostly through courses, curriculums, or programs), I'd hardly say we "need" educators.

Edited December 17, 2020 by Knight of Iron

[Karger]

4 hours ago, Knight of Iron said:

As someone who was homeschooled and was hardly ever taught via an actual teacher (learning mostly through courses, curriculums, or programs), I'd hardly say we "need" educators.

Somme still had to design the courses and programs you used not to mention give you the motivation to study.  You might not need a traditional classroom but teaching will always be important.

Edited December 17, 2020 by Karger

[Aspiring Writer]

On 5/24/2020 at 9:49 AM, Karger said:

Feruchemical gold has limits.  Medical study will still require work.  Additionally x-rays on earth were actually discovered by accident and I think a it would be a good idea to know how to set bones before healing them.

Gold is also not particularly good at getting rid of disease so antibiotics would still be useful.  Medical ventolators I partially agree on.  Cadmium seems like an easier solution.

I agree we would still want medical technology, and with gold, I think Scadrians would be able to advance far more quickly, as they can do experimental procedures without worrying too much about killing their patient. Assuming they don't decide to solely depend on it.

[Raven Wilder]

Here's a thought: no one at wild parties will do drugs, they'll just pay a Rioter a few bucks to make them all ecstatic.

[Stormtide_Leviathan]

51 minutes ago, Raven Wilder said:

Here's a thought: no one at wild parties will do drugs, they'll just pay a Rioter a few bucks to make them all ecstatic.

Why not both?

[Aspiring Writer]

1 hour ago, Stormtide_Leviathan said:

Why not both?

Let's... not think about how that would look. 

[Frustration]

On 5/24/2020 at 10:49 AM, Karger said:

Feruchemical gold has limits.  Medical study will still require work.  Additionally x-rays on earth were actually discovered by accident and I think a it would be a good idea to know how to set bones before healing them.

Gold is also not particularly good at getting rid of disease so antibiotics would still be useful.  Medical ventolators I partially agree on.  Cadmium seems like an easier solution.

Gold is basically Stormlight, and we see it set bones, It heals to the ideal body so I doubt medicine expands greatly once this becomes a thing.

[Aspiring Writer]

1 hour ago, Frustration said:

Gold is basically Stormlight, and we see it set bones, It heals to the ideal body so I doubt medicine expands greatly once this becomes a thing.

That or it expands even further, as now they can try out more dangerous and experimental medical procedures and not worry about giving them permanent damage with the gold mind. I think It will depend on the cost and availability of goldminds to determine which path they go on/

[Frustration]

1 minute ago, Aspiring Writer said:

That or it expands even further, as now they can try out more dangerous and experimental medical procedures and not worry about giving them permanent damage with the gold mind. I think It will depend on the cost and availability of goldminds to determine which path they go on/

Without a need they wouldn't develope it.

Necessity begets Frustration, Frustration begets development, without a need there isn't progression.

[Aspiring Writer]

1 minute ago, Frustration said:

Without a need they wouldn't develope it.

Necessity begets Frustration, Frustration begets development, without a need there isn't progression.

Agreed, which why I think it will depend on how easy and available gold healing is to everyone. If it isn't and/or very costly, I can see them trying to find better/cheaper alternatives. 

[The Titan God]

On 25/05/2020 at 1:21 PM, Emerald_Mage said:

Possibly(?) According to the coppermind, we don't know what happens when you compound a coppermind.

One possibility is that it improves memory, but that is debatable.

Or increases recollection of the event, greater than when filling the coppermind? Maybe you could then store the compounded memory in another coppermind, and still remember it hazely in your head?

 

Just my own speculation 

[The Titan God]

I also think there could be Feruchemical Parlors of sorts were Feruchemists can have a safe place to store their metalminds. 

[1AdolfoJose1]

I imagine that a heater and an air conditioner to both be replaced with a mechanical Brassmind.  

[The Unknown Ajah]

Fire fighting will be so much easier, just fill brass and walk into a burning building, your clothes would burn, but you would be immune.

[Halyo_Alex]

On 2/3/2021 at 11:34 PM, The Unknown Order said:

Fire fighting will be so much easier, just fill brass and walk into a burning building, your clothes would burn, but you would be immune.

Fire retardant clothing will be a must to discover, then. Whether by using ettmetal to mimic f-brass (risky, because reactivity) or just typical flameproof materials.