Jump to content

Recommended Posts

It just crossed my mind that now I have to wait for Elkanah in order to post another RP post. Ah, well. If votes really are 5 jots then I can make this one worth that anyways :P. And one of my other posts was just RP, so it balances out in the end.

For my next vote, I will select Araris, who seems to be the only Noble who hasn't checked in yet and doesn't have a vote on them.

To fill out my post, I will speak on a pseudo-randomly chosen Topic of the Minute- gambling!

Since most of the gambling options have a similar expected value (except the 2:1, which is trash) and you can only win once in a row, you should probably bet on just one number in order to maximize your potential winnings over the long term. You'll likely only win once or twice throughout the game, so you want to maximize the payment when you do.

Since I've not quite reached the requisite threshold in order to qualify for tuition reduction, I might as well add that you might as well gamble when you're in Imre. Even at base odds, the payout expected value is even (except for the 2:1 - don't do that one), and as long as you don't put money you need for something else on the line, the worst that will happen is that you'll lose some spare change.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hemalurgic Headshot, does this look better? 

Okay, maybe it's just me, but looking at past games there are two ways that people try to remain out of suspicion. Or… that people think that others are trying to remain out of suspicion, I dunno I am kinda getting turned around in all of the politickings. Well anyway, the ways being, posting a lot of analysis, or not posting a whole lot. Posting just enough not to be targeted but not enough to be really into the conversation. Do these sound right to you more experienced players? 

Also, looking through the rules mommets seem pretty powerful, if they are made and especially dangerous if put on the Black Market. To those that have played this game before, are these powerful/useful? What are other tools that are useful? Also did the voting on all the nobles in previous games eventually spread out to commoners or did it mainly stay to the Nobles for the first 2 turns. It seems like commoners might be the best, you don’t get targeted, and you have enough money to get bye. 

 

Also Straw, thanks for the graphs! These are extremely helpful! Is there going to be more analysis for the different turns for past games the same that you did for this one.

 

Edited by Karnage
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Zillah said:

@Elbereth @little wilson I am looking at tuition reductions, and the numbers in the summary don't match the numbers in the full rules document. Which set should be used?

                                                                                                       

The full rules. That's what we're using. Not sure why the summary doesn't match.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A review of the rules reveal that I have made a slight error in my evaluation of the gambling mechanics. Previous cursory evaluation led me to believe that the expected value of each type of bet was about the same: further examination reveals that this is not, in fact, the case. The twenty to one and the five to one, with probabilities of one out of twenty and one out of five respectively both have an expected value equivalent to the money invested into the gamble. The fifteen to one and ten to one, however, with probabilities of three out of twenty and one out of five respectively both have an expected value equivalent to one and a half times the money invested. This makes it even more worthwhile to gamble your spare change- although the twenty to one may not be the best option after all. I would still advise you to choose the higher of the two more valuable options, for the same reason- winning more will only make you less able to gamble, so you should try to bag the highest payout you can while you’re still allowed in the establishment.

This might be only a small part of the game, but I hope that this explanation helps someone. :P

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, Karnage said:

looking through the rules mommets seem pretty powerful, if they are made and especially dangerous if put on the Black Market. To those that have played this game before, are these powerful/useful? What are other tools that are useful?

Well, I didn't play either of the past iterations of this game. However, Sympathy received a pretty significant rework for this iteration of the rules, as, if I remember correctly, not many players chose to go into sympathy in previous games as it had a much higher risk. 

The mommets do seem pretty powerful, though I suppose I should ask @little wilson @Elbereth Can anyone use a mommet, or must the person be trained in sympathy?

Edited by Furamirionind
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Despite her teeth chattering from the cold, Athdara was smiling brightly as she crossed the University grounds. She was finally here. Finally able to start studying Alchemy for real. But it wasn't just that. It was everything the University could offer. Alchemy was her true passion, but how could she pass up the chance to learn the other disciplines as well? She’d stay a student forever, if she could.

The building she was looking for loomed just ahead. She started to jog toward it, though not just to get out of the cold. Once inside, she shook and stomped to free herself of the snow that had collected on her jacket and boots. 

“Oh, it’s cold,” she said to no one in particular, mostly because no one was around. They’d likely already filed through the hallways to find their classrooms. 

As Athdara looked around, she saw a surprising lack of signs to help her find her way. It was no bother to her, though. She was plenty early and a little wandering never hurt anyone. 

Before long, she’d found her classroom and a seat inside. She turned to the person next to her, offering her hand with an introduction.

“Hello, I’m Athdara Tolmach. You can call me Athy. What’s your name?”

---

Finally checking in. Quick observation about the voting on nobles thing. There are only 9 of us, but 27 players total. Even if we do spread the votes out on the nobles, that's still a significant number of complaints if the only votes remain on nobles. Yes, I understand we can financially handle it better than others, but the tuition increase is balanced fairly well with simply posting.

1 vote = 1 complaint = +1 jot to tuition
Single post = -5 jots

So if every person were to accrue one vote, but still post just once (not even counting RP and discussion posts), they'd still have a -4 jots to tuition.

If we do keep all votes on nobles, that also increases the chances they will be brought on the Horns. Masters have 5 DP they give out to people with at least one complaint. @Elbereth @little wilson, do the NPC Masters give out all 5 DP every turn? If so, then there's potential for all 9 to be brought on the Horns right away, or if RNG hates someone enough, for someone to get expelled right away. However, if commoners and nobles all have a single vote, the chances of someone getting enough DP from RNG is much lower.

For that reason, I suggest some votes on commoners as well. I'll start with Straw (@Straw), since they've posted enough to make up for the +1 jot from the complaint.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

"I am not particularly choosy. Do you have a favorite?" The stranger asked. Instantly Kendel started in his head working through songs he'd learned years ago. Bach was too serious. Mozart would have been insulted to have his pieces played on this piano. Maybe something new? He had gotten decently far into a song during Arithemetics. He hadn't tried it out on a piano yet though. He didn't want to insult the man by playing something bad. Especially after he'd been so generous!

"I'm Maern, by the way." the student said, startling Kendel out of his indecision.

"Oh, how stupid of me!" Kendel exclaimed. "I'm Kendel. I'm glad to meet you." Inspiration struck "You must enjoy music. Are you familiar with the lay of Sir Savien Traliard?"

It was a particularly complicated piece, but after a lot of practice Kendel had been able to do it decently well. Although this piano would be a bit tough as it wasn't even originally written for a piano. He'd just have to transpose a few bits. High C was almost sharp enough that it sounded like another D, so he'd have to put it into a key that would not need that note. A few other tweaks and it wouldn't sound too bad.

@xinoehp512

Wow, I'm having trouble keeping up. Good job guys! I thought I'd be posting every other entry. Let's see if we can keep this activity up all game!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Karnage said:

Also Straw, thanks for the graphs! These are extremely helpful! Is there going to be more analysis for the different turns for past games the same that you did for this one.

I'm probably not going to do much analysis for other turns from LG33/LG18. After the first turn, things tend to diverge more, so analysis of past games is a bit less helpful. I might take a look at overall trends in past games, as those might be more applicable to this game.

1 hour ago, xinoehp512 said:

A review of the rules reveal that I have made a slight error in my evaluation of the gambling mechanics. Previous cursory evaluation led me to believe that the expected value of each type of bet was about the same: further examination reveals that this is not, in fact, the case. The twenty to one and the five to one, with probabilities of one out of twenty and one out of five respectively both have an expected value equivalent to the money invested into the gamble. The fifteen to one and ten to one, however, with probabilities of three out of twenty and one out of five respectively both have an expected value equivalent to one and a half times the money invested. This makes it even more worthwhile to gamble your spare change- although the twenty to one may not be the best option after all. I would still advise you to choose the higher of the two more valuable options, for the same reason- winning more will only make you less able to gamble, so you should try to bag the highest payout you can while you’re still allowed in the establishment.

This might be only a small part of the game, but I hope that this explanation helps someone. :P

If you have a bit of extra time, could you calculate the amount that Edema Ruh and Cealdish Commoners can expect to make from the loaded die? I think that might be why the two to one winning ratio is so bad for most players. If it was higher, Edema Ruh and Cealdish Commoners could get a lot more money with minimal risk.

Also, I'm sad that El and Wilson capped the amount you can bet. I wanted to see some Vintish Nobleman bet 50 talents on the 20:1 and end up with over 1000 talents. :P

Quote

Edema Ruh: with a bit over a 5.5 talent stipend, I havent worked out how to stay in the university yet. Personally I'll be moving to Mews as there is no way I can survive spending almost all my money on lodging. With Mews that leaves 4.67 talents meaning we need at least a 5.33 talent reduction to just attend the university a single term. There is essentially a free 1.95 reduction for posting, voting, impressing a master, and PMing. This means we only need a 3.38 reduction beyond that coming from RP and posts. This would total at 68 posts mixed between RP and analysis with each being at least 200 words. I'm not sure anyone short of Aman could do this, so I'm going to hazard a guess all Edema Ruh are either going to be taking time not going to the university, or are going to be relying heavily on the noblemen placing black market contracts... or on Devi.

@Furamirionind All of your rooms are half price, thanks to being Edema Ruh. This means that Mews will only cost five jots, instead of a full talent. RP posts also count for five jots rather than five drabs, so if you're willing to do some RP you don't have to make quite that many game related posts.

@Elandera Lopen has not been voted on yet, and I think it'd be best to have a vote on all the nobles before voting on any commoners such as myself. Also, if you're going to vote on a commoner right now, at least vote on someone who hasn't posted yet. That way they'll have more of a reason to post. [EDIT: Another reason to vote for the nobles is that some are staying at the Golden Pony and will have one vote subtracted from them automatically. Since I assume that the initial start for each social class is evenly split between the one or two possible locations, half the nobles should be able to take an extra vote.]

@Elbereth / @little wilson is there any chance you could give us a clearer picture of how the Eolian odds work (die used and the threshold to win pipes)? It'd be useful for people to know how useful practicing is.

Edited by Straw
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Karnage said:

Hemalurgic Headshot, does this look better? 

Okay, maybe it's just me, but looking at past games there are two ways that people try to remain out of suspicion. Or… that people think that others are trying to remain out of suspicion, I dunno I am kinda getting turned around in all of the politickings. Well anyway, the ways being, posting a lot of analysis, or not posting a whole lot. Posting just enough not to be targeted but not enough to be really into the conversation. Do these sound right to you more experienced players? 

Also, looking through the rules mommets seem pretty powerful, if they are made and especially dangerous if put on the Black Market. To those that have played this game before, are these powerful/useful? What are other tools that are useful? Also did the voting on all the nobles in previous games eventually spread out to commoners or did it mainly stay to the Nobles for the first 2 turns. It seems like commoners might be the best, you don’t get targeted, and you have enough money to get bye. 

Also Straw, thanks for the graphs! These are extremely helpful! Is there going to be more analysis for the different turns for past games the same that you did for this one.

An astute observation. You hit the nail on the head as the people who post the most get killed by eliminators and the people who post the least get lynched by the village as a general rule. Sometimes they swap, but a pretty safe way to stay alive is to post two or three times a cycle. I would like to change that meta slightly, but that is the way it is for now. Exceptions include if there is a protect role in the game. Then it's all out warfare on the people who post the least because a body guard is unlikely to help people who are not involved. 

I didn't get that impression from the mommets, but maybe you caught something I did not. A role block is decent, but the odds of the timing ever really becoming relevant seem quite small. Especially where only a third of us can become masters at a time. When I was reading LG 18 it looked like people were voting purely for role play reasons and that had little to do with even what class people were in. I didn't read LG 33 so they may have tried this egalitarian approach.

Edited by Elkanah
colour
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Elkanah said:

"I am not particularly choosy. Do you have a favorite?" The stranger asked. Instantly Kendel started in his head working through songs he'd learned years ago. Bach was too serious. Mozart would have been insulted to have his pieces played on this piano. Maybe something new? He had gotten decently far into a song during Arithemetics. He hadn't tried it out on a piano yet though. He didn't want to insult the man by playing something bad. Especially after he'd been so generous!

"I'm Maern, by the way." the student said, startling Kendel out of his indecision.

"Oh, how stupid of me!" Kendel exclaimed. "I'm Kendel. I'm glad to meet you." Inspiration struck "You must enjoy music. Are you familiar with the lay of Sir Savien Traliard?"

It was a particularly complicated piece, but after a lot of practice Kendel had been able to do it decently well. Although this piano would be a bit tough as it wasn't even originally written for a piano. He'd just have to transpose a few bits. High C was almost sharp enough that it sounded like another D, so he'd have to put it into a key that would not need that note. A few other tweaks and it wouldn't sound too bad.

@xinoehp512

Wow, I'm having trouble keeping up. Good job guys! I thought I'd be posting every other entry. Let's see if we can keep this activity up all game!

The student let out an exclamation at Maern's introduction and introduced himself. "You must enjoy music," he continued. "Are you familiar with the lay of Sir Savien Traliard?"

Maern's eyes widened in surprise. "Certainly," he said. "Although, to be honest, I wouldn't have believed it could be played on the piano." Curiosity bled into his voice. "Are you saying that you can?"

That would be a tune to hear, indeed- even if the piano was off-key. Definitely not something that he himself would ever dare to attempt. That was a task for a writer of music, a category to which he most certainly did not belong. He tried a little, but he'd never been able to capture the soul of the music in the same way a true composer would.

The Edema Ruh might be poor in riches, he thought to himself, but they are truly far richer than us in talent. Maybe there was a lesson to be learned there. (Although he was pretty dirt poor himself, and plenty of rich people were musicians, so the lesson probably wasn’t that talent and wealth were inversely proportional.) 

As the musician began to play, he shelved the thought for another time and settled back into his studying.

@Elkanah

-----

2 hours ago, Straw said:

If you have a bit of extra time, could you calculate the amount that Edema Ruh and Cealdish Commoners can expect to make from the loaded die? I think that might be why the two to one winning ratio is so bad for most players. If it was higher, Edema Ruh and Cealdish Commoners could get a lot more money with minimal risk.

 

Sure!

      1/20  1/12  1/6
20x:1  1    1.67  3.33
15x:2 1.5   2.5    5
10x:3 1.5   2.5    5
 5x:4  1    1.67  3.33
 2x:5 0.5   0.83  1.67

I actually forgot about the bonuses being the dice changes. Oops. But it doesn't really change my analysis all that much. It may be the twenty to one is worth it for a Cealdish commoner, but i honestly still think that the fifteen for one is better anyways- an expected value of five times what you gamble is nothing to be sniffed at. (I find it odd, however, that this is higher than the benefit for the Edema Ruh, given the trend to the opposite within the social rankings). If you happen to be a Cealdish commoner, it might even be worth wagering the maximum amount of one talent-especially if you can post enough to get enough spare change so that it doesn't sink your finances. If you want minimum risk, you could go for the 5/6 odds for a easy doubling of your money. Again, though, you don't gain as much value from this, because winning twice will only get you essentially banned from The Loaded Die- so you'll probably only get one or two talents anyways. If you plan to visit Imre more than once, you're bound to get lucky with a two or three out of six chance eventually- and, unlike real gambling, the expected gain is actually positive.

Edited by xinoehp512
Link to comment
Share on other sites

56 minutes ago, Straw said:

Lopen has not been voted on yet, and I think it'd be best to have a vote on all the nobles before voting on any commoners such as myself. Also, if you're going to vote on a commoner right now, at least vote on someone who hasn't posted yet. That way they'll have more of a reason to post.

But then I'd be directly contradicting every reason I listed for voting on a commoner. All votes on nobles means anywhere between 1 and 9 people automatically being brought on the Horns right away. If it's between 1 and 4, each has a chance of being expelled. That means if we only vote on only nobles, worst case scenario is four people are expelled. 

Do you really want four nobles with their income only able to work in Imre from the start? Can you imagine the kind of power they'd accrue when they don't have to split attention between the University studies and Imre?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

54 minutes ago, Elkanah said:

I didn't get that impression from the mommets, but maybe you caught something I did not. A role block is decent, but the odds of the timing ever really becoming relevant seem quite small. Especially where only a third of us can become masters at a time. 

The Master Sympathist can automatically kill an unprotected Skindancer who submitted the sabotage action every cycle, assuming one can craft a mommet and use it on the same cycle. The sympathist has a decent chance of going insane, and if multiple people crack per turn they might guess wrong about which one the Skindancers targeted, but it's still a very powerful ability.

57 minutes ago, Straw said:

[EDIT: Another reason to vote for the nobles is that some are staying at the Golden Pony and will have one vote subtracted from them automatically. Since I assume that the initial start for each social class is evenly split between the one or two possible locations, half the nobles should be able to take an extra vote.]

Only Aturan nobles have a chance for vote reduction by staying at the Golden Pony, and only half of those nobles will actually be there. Out of the nine total nobles, I would guess two or three of them will have vote reduction abilities. This also means that nobles can't announce that they're able to take an extra vote without roleclaiming, which means we'll probably have a lower vote total than originally shown. Commoners are about as likely as nobility to be staying at the Golden Pony, with Yllish having a ~50 percent chance of staying there for a total of probably 3 commoners who can shrug off votes. Still, if the goal is to gain the three jot tuition reduction without actually bringing anyone On The Horns, nobles are better suited to take the one jot tuition increase per complaint, and since a quarter. Since the jump from one to two complaints isn't incredibly high, one extra jot of tuition increase and one guaranteed DP, it's probably better to put two votes on everyone instead of one if the goal is to spread votes around.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Cadici was completely and utterly lost. He was transferring to this school, but due to the universities being in different universes, they significantly different schedules. He had actually finished a final not 10 minutes earlier before hopping into a portal to this new universe and this new university. ( I actually literally just finished my last final, so it may take me a minute to catch up) It appeared as if he missed all of the new student orientation, and would have to figure everything out on his own. He new this school was different than the one he came from, but originally he was going to study the mundane arts here too. Double Majoring in Biology and Sociology. Only after he arrived on campus did he learn of how interesting the arcane arts could be. Perhaps he should dabble in the arcane arts.

After pondering for a moment, he decided that since his major still hadn't technically been declared, he could  try out the new type of classes a bit. Now he just had to figure out who he could go up to and ask for directions to the College of Arcane Arts. Better just start asking around. 

"Do you know where I can see a director or counselor for the college of the arcane arts?" Cadici asked to the person nearest him.

--------------------

Hey guys. Just finished my last final, and still haven't really read the rules, except for skimming about a week and a half ago I'll try to make some more substantial post once I figure out what's going on.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

21 minutes ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

Still, if the goal is to gain the three jot tuition reduction without actually bringing anyone On The Horns, nobles are better suited to take the one jot tuition increase per complaint, and since a quarter.

Discipline Points don't just come from votes. 

Quote

The Horns is the disciplinary system of The University. Every turn, students will accrue Discipline Points (DP) through both the lynch and from the Masters. Each Master has a total of 5 DP per turn that they can give to students. While Masters are NPC-controlled, this distribution will be random, based on students who have had at least 1 complaint filed against them. If a player becomes Master, they have total control of their DP (they can place it on anyone, regardless of whether complaints have been filed).

...

If a student accrues 5 or more Discipline Points on them in any turn, they will be brought On the Horns and potentially face punishment. Students with 11 or more DP on them will risk expulsion from the University.

Each person with a single complaint has the potential to get any number of the 45 DP distributed every turn. Yes, financially, nobles can handle the complaints better. But a complaint is +1 jot, while a post is -5 jots. That's not even counting PMs, RP, and analysis. Almost everyone can handle a single vote, so long as they post. If everyone votes on a noble, that's 3 votes a piece. That means every noble gets one DP from votes, plus whatever is randomly distributed by the NPC Masters.

Edited by Elandera
Grammar
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hahaha I just realized that even if I wanted a loan I couldn't get one. Well storm you too, Devi! I didn't want your stinking loans. While I'm on the topic I may as well get some more tuition reduced by ranting about my thoughts on other things in Imre. I'll start with I never recommend debt. It's a poison that takes a lot of work to get out of your system. That said, it might be worth selling actions. What I mean by that is it might be worth taking an early payday at some point in the game by trading a future role block for half again what you would be earning that term. Sure someone might block you at some point, but our elevation levels and fields are a secret and they wouldn't see it coming. Basically you would be selling your own mommet on the black market and we're cutting Devi out of the deal all together. There is my two jabs on that topic.

As far as gambling, it is very interesting that it is set up that we should have a winning record. Those are some very solid odds so it might be worth throwing a little money down the pot for it. I probably will not because I am poor, but others could and it would not be the worst thing ever.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, xinoehp512 said:

Finally, a question. Is anyone else staying at The Windy Tower and- if you are- do you feel like doing some coordinated RP with me?

 

8 hours ago, Elkanah said:

I didn't write this song so it's not in RP Black and I'm not submitting it as RP. I made sure to get enough words for the tuition requirement without it. Also, I would love to interact with some of your characters. Let me know where I need to be in order to be a part of your stories and I will make it happen in a post or two if it takes some set up for why Kendel is headed there.

 

8 hours ago, StrikerEZ said:

I need to get as many tuition reductions as I possibly can. Anyone wanna help me come up with some ideas of what to RP so I can get those sweet, sweet tuition reductions?

 

Well, i have trouble keeping up with the thousand posts going around, but I'm willing to RP!

im in the windy towers, so if i somehow annoy you, tell me, it could be RP

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I forgot how much this game makes people talk. :P Lots of clarifications incoming. 

Also, note on how we'll be doing clarifications this game: This game is complicated enough that we will be much more proactive about clarifications than usual. There are several quotes below not directed at the GMs which I have corrected anyway, for instance. In addition, almost all clarifications asked in private will be reposted (in summarized form) to the thread. (The exception is questions about Naming.) So keep that in mind. 

On the player spreadsheets: there are 14 rows on the 'Player Actions' tab. The top 7 are meant to act as a key - the bottom 7 are the ones where you actually fill out your information. :) Black boxes indicate that that option is not available - for instance, all of you currently only have one action period open, so the other three are colored black.The 'Money' tab is primarily for your use - anything you put in there will not affect what you actually do, it's just a way to keep track of how much money you have and plan out your actions accordingly. 

PMs: Also, when making PMs, please include the names of all involved players in the title! That makes our job much easier. You may also want to label them 'Cycle 1' - for simplicity, we'll be asking you to create all new player-player PMs each cycle. 

On ranks vs elevations: if you have one elevation in Linguistics and the second in R&L, you get the first level upgrade for each and are a Re'lar. If you have two elevations in Linguistics, you are a Re'lar with the second level upgrade in Linguistics. If you have one elevation in Archives and the second in Alchemy, you can make Re'lar level Alchemy items, but only at their first level upgrade. So effectively you're rewarded for staying within one field. 

Cheating Death cannot be used to self-target. 

14 hours ago, DeTess said:

So, what I'm trying to say here is this: the vote doesn't kill, but can inconvenience someone a lot. If you are very suspicious of someone, by all means get them expelled, but remember that you're going to have to follow up with something else to finish the job.

Please note that the Students' win condition is to expel or kill all Skindancers. Skindancers can still sabotage once expelled (though they can only target other expelled students or students in Imre), but if all of them are expelled the students will automatically win the game. 

13 hours ago, DeTess said:

Are you certain about only one vote counting for reduction? @Elbereth, @little wilson?

Yes. The summary rules were off (they're fixed now) because the tuition inflations/reductions were changed fairly late: in previous games these have been an average of the two turns; they're now all calculated per turn. So you get 3 jots off this turn for a single complaint and you get another 3 jots off next turn if you file a complaint then. 

7 hours ago, TheMightyLopen said:

Here we go! Excited for whatever happens! Considering I played the first and helped GM the second iteration of this game, I feel like I should be a Master rules expert, but I'm finding I actually don't remember how quite a few things work precisely...but that's part of the fun IMO! :P Good luck to everyone!

Other advice - Put your actions in early! You can always change it later if you want! It's especially important to remember lodging orders, although it looks like being on the streets is slightly less dangerous now if you don't have a lot of money, which is a cool little balance change. One thing to help Edema is to put Black market contracts out for doing something simple, and then they can get an easy Talent or two like that. As far as actions go this Month, looks like we're limited to: EP spending, voting, and choosing to go to Imre. Next Month will be the time to put in Lodging. Although...GM's, can you put in Lodging orders for the next Term in the first Month of that Term? Or do you have to send the orders in during the second Month?

A number of things have changed since the previous edition, too. :P A short summary: Sympathy got a massive rework, Alchemy and Artificery have been buffed slightly too, the social classes have been balanced to be on more equal footing, a new lodging has been made available, Devi is nicer to you, and the Gambling Den exists. 

You can put orders in during the first Month - just use the second month dropdown to put them in early. (It's the one marked in red, you can't miss it.) 

6 hours ago, Elkanah said:

Do we know how good of a performance we need in order to get the talent pipes. It occurs to me that although trying for the talent pipes gets us a one talent discount on school for the following term, it also costs us one talent this turn so we end up spending it anyway. It is nice that it is almost free to try for the pipes though and I do appreciate that. You just have to go back to school the next semester regardless of whether you succeeded or not and I don't think that's too much to ask given you really have to go out of your way to stay in Imre two turns in an row.

Is anyone who has played the previous games willing to tell me how likely it is to get the pipes? I can't find it in the rules. All I was told is that it is not likely because it would devalue them if everyone just got them. Also you gain a boost of one half of a point to your base stat every time you practice. Is that calculable? If we are using a D20 to decide this as is the pattern for other elements of the game, I'm guessing we need to get our base stat plus our performance score to add up to 20 or higher. That seems reasonably doable, but not in any way easy. I'd then assume we are innately given ability on a scale from one to ten. One being the sound of nails on a chalk board and ten the ability to make angels swoon. Edema Ruh get an innate bonus in singing, but even with a base score of ten, you have a fifty-fifty chance of failing to earn the pipes. The low end might even be a five out of twenty so even the plebiest of us has a one in four shot of achieving the pipes, but then again it may be lower.

How the Eolian works: At the start of the game, we rolled a d10 and assigned a number to you. If you're certain social classes this number was then modified, and a submission added between 1 and 3 more. The skill level indication you received in your GM PM is telling you approximately your final base stat. Practicing adds another .5 per time to said stat. When you perform, we will roll another d10 and add it to that stat; if you get above a 15 you'll receive your Pipes. 

4 hours ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

So far as I can tell, having extra votes on you matters a lot less than how many people have votes. I assume, and somebody who's played this game before can confirm, that random distribution is by vote count, so if player A has two votes and player B has one vote, player A gets one discipline point plus an average of 30 DP from the Masters for automatic expulsion, while player B gets the other 15 DP from Masters for a 65% of expulsion.

This is incorrect. NPC-controlled Masters will distribute DP equally over players who have any number of votes, irrespective of how many votes they have. 

1 hour ago, Furamirionind said:

The mommets do seem pretty powerful, though I suppose I should ask @little wilson @Elbereth Can anyone use a mommet, or must the person be trained in sympathy?

Anyone can use a mommet. The level of the mommet is tied to the level of creation: so if you're given a Master-level mommet, you'll be able to kill the player attached to it. But you'll still have the +4 IP cost for using it. Devi's mommets do not have an IP cost. 

1 hour ago, Elandera said:

If we do keep all votes on nobles, that also increases the chances they will be brought on the Horns. Masters have 5 DP they give out to people with at least one complaint. @Elbereth @little wilson, do the NPC Masters give out all 5 DP every turn? If so, then there's potential for all 9 to be brought on the Horns right away, or if RNG hates someone enough, for someone to get expelled right away. However, if commoners and nobles all have a single vote, the chances of someone getting enough DP from RNG is much lower.

Yes. PC Masters can choose not to give DP if they wish, but all NPC Masters give all 5 DP each turn. 

1 hour ago, Straw said:

Also, I'm sad that El and Wilson capped the amount you can bet. I wanted to see some Vintish Nobleman bet 50 talents on the 20:1 and end up with over 1000 talents. :P

[EDIT: Another reason to vote for the nobles is that some are staying at the Golden Pony and will have one vote subtracted from them automatically. Since I assume that the initial start for each social class is evenly split between the one or two possible locations, half the nobles should be able to take an extra vote.]

@Elbereth / @little wilson is there any chance you could give us a clearer picture of how the Eolian odds work (die used and the threshold to win pipes)? It'd be useful for people to know how useful practicing is.

No. :P 

Note that this vote subtraction comes before DP assignment. If you have one vote on you and are staying at the Golden Pony, that vote will vanish and you will not be on the Masters' list of 'people with votes on them' to whom they'll be assigning DP. 

5 minutes ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

The Master Sympathist can automatically kill an unprotected Skindancer who submitted the sabotage action every cycle, assuming one can craft a mommet and use it on the same cycle. The sympathist has a decent chance of going insane, and if multiple people crack per turn they might guess wrong about which one the Skindancers targeted, but it's still a very powerful ability.

You cannot create a mommet and use it the same turn. Creating a mommet takes one turn, and it will be available for use on the next. But that is within one cycle. (Also, worth noting: the Skindancers have one sabotage per turn, not per cycle as per usual for LGs. But there is also a lynch every turn, so it effectively cancels out.)

2 minutes ago, Elkanah said:

Sure someone might block you at some point, but our elevation levels and fields are a secret and they wouldn't see it coming. 

Elevation levels are not a secret. Fields are. Writeups will say something like "Queensteph, PK, Aonar, and Venture Mistborn were elevated!" - unless the elevation is to Master, in which case the writeup will say something like "Elbereth is now the Master Rhetorician!" (so there Hael :P). 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

25 minutes ago, Elandera said:

Each person with a single complaint has the potential to get any number of the 45 DP distributed every turn. Yes, financially, nobles can handle the complaints better. But a complaint is +1 jot, while a post is -5 jots. That's not even counting PMs, RP, and analysis. Almost everyone can handle a single vote, so long as they post. If everyone votes on a noble, that's 3 votes a piece. That means every noble gets one DP from votes, plus whatever is randomly distributed by the NPC Masters.

Yes, that's why we have to spread out votes if the goal is to avoid randomly expelling anyone, and since there's enough DP to bring every noble On The Horns, the most net positive economical solution is to have votes on all the nobles and a few commoners. Since apparently the gap between one and two complaints is meaningless in terms of the Master's DP, any noble or commoner worth casting a vote on should have two votes. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Vote count:

Devotary(1): DeTess
Elandera(1): Elkanah
Lumgol(1): Zillah
Karnage(2): Straw, HH
HH(1): Karnage
Green Rover(1): Xino
Araris(1): Xino
Straw(1): Elandera
Coda(1): Lopen

Hopefully that's accurate. Anyways, even being Noble, I'll still go for some tuition reduction! Coda, no hard feelings. :P That's 9 players voted on currently. Might be worth throwing a couple more names on there unless we see someone worth prodding. I haven't noticed anything in particular that seemed sketchy yet though. Now for some RP!


Leo paced back and forth in his room, trying to decide which class to focus on. If he was being honest with himself, he knew he wasn't particularly adept at any one thing. Overall, he was just...average. He didn't mind, but it did make choosing a field of study somewhat difficult.

Ah well, I guess I'll just flip a coin! he thought to himself. He rummaged through his huge stacks of money bags until he found a coin he really liked. Perfect!

He flipped the coin over and over until he finally arrived at a conclusion...

"Nah, that seems entirely too dangerous for someone like me."

And so he chose a different coin and kept going at it for a good hour or two until it finally chose one he thought he could do.

"Next on the list is to meet the other students! Hmm, but what should I wear? You only get a first impression once after all!" he said to himself.

But by the time he had flipped a bunch of other coins to decide what to wear, he noticed it had gotten rather dark out, so he just decided to wait until the next day for any social interaction. The next day, however, he made his way to the University in his chosen outfit. It was surprisingly bland, being mostly grays and blacks, but the coins had decided, and he didn't like to go against chance or luck(unless it made him risk bodily or mental harm of course).

I wonder if there are any clubs here? he thought to himself as he entered the University grounds. If not, maybe I could start one! I'll have to look for other students who look like they have time on their hands.


So yeah, Leo is looking for anyone interested in starting up a club of some sorts. Any ideas are welcome!

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Elandera said:

Discipline Points don't just come from votes. 

Each person with a single complaint has the potential to get any number of the 45 DP distributed every turn. Yes, financially, nobles can handle the complaints better. But a complaint is +1 jot, while a post is -5 jots. That's not even counting PMs, RP, and analysis. Almost everyone can handle a single vote, so long as they post. If everyone votes on a noble, that's 3 votes a piece. That means every noble gets one DP from votes, plus whatever is randomly distributed by the NPC Masters.

You are right. @Elbereth @little wilson Do I still get the tuition reduction if I complain about myself? I remember reading it in one of the past games, but I don't remember what the answer was or where to find it.

New rant time. You made an interesting point before when you talked about expelling all the nobles. It might be a bad idea because then the nobles have an additional ten talents they aren't sinking into school and they could definitely take Imre and just run it... so why don't they justIdo that anyway? I guess Vintish nobles can only stay in the most expensive places, so they can't live in the Grey Man.

Hmm. They also lose their ten talents they would spend on school anyway if they are expelled. I'd like to retract my idea that nobles are just better off not wasting time in school. Stay in school kids.

Ooh a clarification ninja (the scariest of ninjas as they are clear)

41 minutes ago, Elbereth said:

Please note that the Students' win condition is to expel or kill all Skindancers. Skindancers can still sabotage once expelled (though they can only target other expelled students or students in Imre), but if all of them are expelled the students will automatically win the game

Soo is everyone else down just to expel everyone? no? drat.

I realize this is kind of self explanatory, but does the game end instantly when the last skindancer is expelled?

41 minutes ago, Elbereth said:

How the Eolian works: At the start of the game, we rolled a d10 and assigned a number to you. If you're certain social classes this number was then modified, and a submission added between 1 and 3 more. The skill level indication you received in your GM PM is telling you approximately your final base stat. Practicing adds another .5 per time to said stat. When you perform, we will roll another d10 and add it to that stat; if you get above a 15 you'll receive your Pipes. 

If we were playing horseshoes, I would have been close enough for points! Thank you for the clarification, this helps a great deal.

41 minutes ago, Elbereth said:

Anyone can use a mommet. The level of the mommet is tied to the level of creation: so if you're given a Master-level mommet, you'll be able to kill the player attached to it. But you'll still have the +4 IP cost for using it. Devi's mommets do not have an IP cost. 

Does Devi create master level mommets? because if that is the case, I will retract everything I have said about cheating Devi. I do not want a bunch of death mommets on my head.

41 minutes ago, Elbereth said:

Elevation levels are not a secret. Fields are. Writeups will say something like "Queensteph, PK, Aonar, and Venture Mistborn were elevated!" - unless the elevation is to Master, in which case the writeup will say something like "Elbereth is now the Master Rhetorician!" (so there Hael :P). 

Good clarification. I was referring to the fact that you just tell us that we were elevated and not Maill, Wilson and Wyrmhero were elevated to El'the et al. but, it doesn't take too much effort to go back and count how many times someone has been elevated.

 

Good clarity ninja. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Elkanah said:

You are right. @Elbereth @little wilson Do I still get the tuition reduction if I complain about myself? I remember reading it in one of the past games, but I don't remember what the answer was or where to find it.

Does Devi create master level mommets? because if that is the case, I will retract everything I have said about cheating Devi. I do not want a bunch of death mommets on my head.

No. :P  No cheating the system. 

Nooo. They're first level mommets, effectively. That'd be fun though. :P

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Lord’s recent meeting with yet another sniffing and arrogant noble had not bettered his view of them. And now that he thought of it, they were the most likely to be skindancers. Whose body would he steal if he were a skindancer? An unimportant Ruh? An average commoner? Or a rich noble who could perfectly act out of place and be deemed innovative. A rich noble who could make a mess and have money to fix everything. It was a rhetorical question. Perhaps he should study rhetorics later, he was already quite good at that! Anyway, he should focus on the matter at hand. He already had a pen on his hands, and not submitting a complaint was out of the question. The masters would lower is tuition, and despite having sufficient funds, he would put as small a strain on his family founds as he could.

But there was a problem. He didn’t know the name of any noble…

He looked around at the other students at the windy tower. One of them was playing an adapted version of the lay… the lay of some guy. ‘Hey, do you know the name of any nobles?’

One of them mentioned his noble friend Leo.

Well, as good as any.

 

One complaint on TheMightyLopen, Leo.

 

 

Edited by Lord_Silberfarben
Thanks Elbereth!
Link to comment
Share on other sites

49 minutes ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

Yes, that's why we have to spread out votes if the goal is to avoid randomly expelling anyone, and since there's enough DP to bring every noble On The Horns, the most net positive economical solution is to have votes on all the nobles and a few commoners. Since apparently the gap between one and two complaints is meaningless in terms of the Master's DP, any noble or commoner worth casting a vote on should have two votes. 

Sorry, I misunderstood your other post. I thought you were agreeing with Straw that we should only vote on nobles. :P

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, TheMightyLopen said:

Vote count:

Devotary(1): DeTess
Elandera(1): Elkanah
Lumgol(1): Zillah
Karnage(2): Straw, HH
HH(1): Karnage
Green Rover(1): Xino
Araris(1): Xino
Straw(1): Elandera
Coda(1): Lopen

Hopefully that's accurate. Anyways, even being Noble, I'll still go for some tuition reduction! Coda, no hard feelings. :P That's 9 players voted on currently. Might be worth throwing a couple more names on there unless we see someone worth prodding. I haven't noticed anything in particular that seemed sketchy yet though. Now for some RP!


Leo paced back and forth in his room, trying to decide which class to focus on. If he was being honest with himself, he knew he wasn't particularly adept at any one thing. Overall, he was just...average. He didn't mind, but it did make choosing a field of study somewhat difficult.

Ah well, I guess I'll just flip a coin! he thought to himself. He rummaged through his huge stacks of money bags until he found a coin he really liked. Perfect!

He flipped the coin over and over until he finally arrived at a conclusion...

"Nah, that seems entirely too dangerous for someone like me."

And so he chose a different coin and kept going at it for a good hour or two until it finally chose one he thought he could do.

"Next on the list is to meet the other students! Hmm, but what should I wear? You only get a first impression once after all!" he said to himself.

But by the time he had flipped a bunch of other coins to decide what to wear, he noticed it had gotten rather dark out, so he just decided to wait until the next day for any social interaction. The next day, however, he made his way to the University in his chosen outfit. It was surprisingly bland, being mostly grays and blacks, but the coins had decided, and he didn't like to go against chance or luck(unless it made him risk bodily or mental harm of course).

I wonder if there are any clubs here? he thought to himself as he entered the University grounds. If not, maybe I could start one! I'll have to look for other students who look like they have time on their hands.


So yeah, Leo is looking for anyone interested in starting up a club of some sorts. Any ideas are welcome!

 

Something I notice when looking at the vote count is that no one has used both of their votes except for me, which seems... interesting. Are people just used to casting one vote, I wonder? @DeTess @Elkanah @Zillah @Straw  @Hemalurgic Headshot @Karnage @Elandera @Lopen

Disciplinary points from the NPC Masters are nothing to be trifled with. 45 DPs will be awarded every cycle until PC Masters take over and spend less (if they so desire, which they might not). Anyone with two votes on them (uncancelled) gets 1DP; anyone with any votes at all will get an average of 45/players with votes. Right now that means an average of 5 per player- enough to bring them On the Horns, but not enough for there to even be a chance to expel them. That's without counting potential vote cancellations, however; that number could easily be only 5 if everyone still has only one vote on them. That makes an average of 9 DP per vote recipient. Not enough for an expulsion- (although someone could get unlucky). Still, I agree with Devotary that the most logical course of action is to spread the votes around on a few Commoners as well, or at least double up all the votes on Nobles. There's plenty of votes to go around, and lots of activity, so that shouldn't be too difficult to achieve.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...