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Haven't seen a lot of speculation on truthwatcher abilities, but I was wondering what people thought 'real' truthwatchers would be able to do ?

Currently I reckon they can see the whole spectrum, instead of being able to manipulate it, as in, they can see x-rays and ultraviolet and things. And maybe hear through walls in some way ? More of a seeing interpretation of the wavey surge than an actively changing one.

I also think they would be able to see (in some way) through the other realms, maybe cognitively for telling truths ? Or spiritually for futuresight, but undecided on whether that's an odium thing or just a more secret truthwatcher thing.

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7 minutes ago, erarufus said:

Haven't seen a lot of speculation on truthwatcher abilities, but I was wondering what people thought 'real' truthwatchers would be able to do ?

Currently I reckon they can see the whole spectrum, instead of being able to manipulate it, as in, they can see x-rays and ultraviolet and things. And maybe hear through walls in some way ? More of a seeing interpretation of the wavey surge than an actively changing one.

I also think they would be able to see (in some way) through the other realms, maybe cognitively for telling truths ? Or spiritually for futuresight, but undecided on whether that's an odium thing or just a more secret truthwatcher thing.

I would think that they could see the "true" image of people. Perhaps their spiritual aspect? Lightweavers are about transforming both yourself and others, their surges are Lightweaving and Transformation, so the Truthwatchers, who have Lightweaving and regrowth, could be about helping people be their "true" or "perfected" self. They would be very good at seeing through lies, and could probably tell people's true character just by looking at them.

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I think that Turthwatchers had some ability to see things from far away. Distance viewing, basically, clairvoyance. So they could see what was really happening at various events and be able to tell the truth of it. They might have been able to see into the past as well.

For instance, Shallan was able to see Yalb and the rest of the Wind's Pleasure crew making it to land, and able to see Shalash breaking a statue of herself.

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I've wondered if the Truthwatchers had the ability to see the past. They had to have the power to see something, they have it in their name. This something sounds like it could have been something quite intimate: they see the truth, they apparently had an abundance of tact. Plus, it's thematically appropriate that their non Corrupted power be the reverse of their Corrupted power, and the opposite of futuresight is past sight.

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I'm in the same camp as RShara on this- clairvoyance is probably the Truthwatcher's main schtick. I feel like it should be possible for them to create illusions as well, but it's just a lot trickier for them than it is for Lightweavers. Like how Shallan's gotten really good at illusions but still can't consciously do the clairvoyance thing. 

Which would mean that the difference for Renarin is just that his visions show the future- getting visions at all would be a normal Truthwatcher thing. Possibly the visions are meant to be more controllable than Renarin's are, and Glys' corruption is mixing with Renarin's epilepsy in a bad way? That might just be his equivalent of the way Shallan has to draw things before she can make illusions of them, but I feel like they should have better control over their power by the third oath. 

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Im with @RShara and @Gilphon, I think there is a Cognitive and/or Spiritual perception aspect of Lightweaving that has been hinted at with Shallan, and which  expect traditional Truthwatchers specialize in more heavily.  One possibility is that Lightweavers get their Lightweaving skewed more heavily toward the Cognitive because of Soulcasting as their other Surge which is very much a Cognitive Realm thing, while the Truthwatchers lean more heavily into the Spiritual Realm because of their other Surge (Regrowth) being very much a Spiritual thing.  Renarin's version lets him see into the Future that has a long history of being associated with Odium/Void, both in Vorin culture and in the Nightform from the Song of Secrets. 

Separately and for wildly different reasons I doubt that they get much ability to see the Past, purely because the Truth of past events, and the eventual revelations of what that Truth is, has apparently been a longstanding cycle of discovery and fallout, so I dont think it makes as much sense for one of the Orders to specialize in Knowing the Truth of History.  In other cosmere examples of Temporal perception there's often been a shard distinction one looking Forward vs Back, so I think it would be fairly simple (from a narrative perspective) to restrict their perceptions to the Present sector of the Spiritual Realm Truth.    

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Posted (edited)

I'm with @Nameless.

Truthwatchers are expressions of Illumination and Progression, the fundamental forces of (Seeing, understanding) and (the movement of time.) They would be naturally better at understanding how people change and grow over time, and how different events and things can influence and affect people. I see them as one of the most Cultivation-oriented Orders, with a focus on selflessness and helping people improve and better/perfect themselves. Their resonance should also work along those lines, I think, being able to see and/or show the Spiritual aspects of others.

In general, the character archetype I see them following is that of the Teacher.

I think Spiritual/Cognitive long distance seeing, specifically, will stay out of Surgebinding as an active ability.

Edited by asmodeus
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5 minutes ago, asmodeus said:

I'm with @Nameless.

Truthwatchers are expressions of Illumination and Progression, the fundamental forces of (Seeing, understanding) and (the movement of time.) They would be naturally better at understanding how people change and grow over time, and how different events and things can influence and affect people. I see them as one of the most Cultivation-oriented Orders, with a focus on selflessness and helping people improve and better/perfect themselves. Their resonance should also work along those lines, I think, being able to see and/or show the Spiritual aspects of others.

In general, the character archetype I see them following is that of the Teacher.

I think Spiritual/Cognitive long distance seeing, specifically, will stay out of Surgebinding as an active ability.

I missed @Nameless's post somehow.  That makes a lot of sense to me as well, and I think is entirely compatible with how Im picturing the classic Order working. 

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Posted (edited)

Ivory indicates strongly in OB that Truthwatchers cannot normally see the future.  We know they have access to the surge of regrowth and can use it to heal people and themselves.  We do not know if they can grow plants like Lift does although it stands to reason that they can.  I do think they might be able to alter their own perceptions like a micro or telescope...

Wait a minute.  NEW THEORY.  What if the stormlight did not actually heal Renarin's eyes?  What if he is just altering his perceptions so that he does not need them anymore? 

Shallan's sketches of present events in WoR do indicate that Truthwatchers can see things that are far away without direct visual aids.

Spoiler

I touched on the responsibility and abilities of the TW here.

I also think they have some ability to see the past or see things "mathematically" if that makes sense.  To aid in scholarly research. 

Edited by Karger
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1 hour ago, Karger said:

I also think they have some ability to see the past or see things "mathematically" if that makes sense.  To aid in scholarly research. 

fortune? or some rudimentary form of it? It would stand to reason that since that's how Renarin sees into the future, that it's how Truthwatchers see normally

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Just now, DiePie said:

fortune? or some rudimentary form of it? It would stand to reason that since that's how Renarin sees into the future, that it's how Truthwatchers see normally

No.  More like... if they were looking at a falling rock they could see its acceleration.  I don't think they have that exactly but something that makes the world more comprehensible and or orderly seems like it should be part of their abilities.

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I agree with @Nameless too. I think it is an interesting power and we already have that scene between Adolin and Renarin where Renarin touched him and saw adolin’s ideal version and healed him. I Have always thought that Renarin was not only doing progression here. 
Also the ability to sense others truth, would be quite truthwatcher-y. 
Also the times when Shallan saw things from a distance could be an ability of illumination for that truthwatcher are more better at normally. 
Renarin sees the future due to bonding a corrupted spren but it’s converse and true ability of Truthwatchers could also be seeing things from a distance that happen at the present time and not necessarily the past events. 

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7 hours ago, Karger said:

No.  More like... if they were looking at a falling rock they could see its acceleration.  I don't think they have that exactly but something that makes the world more comprehensible and or orderly seems like it should be part of their abilities.

If they could see things like this, the maths and forces, should they be able to use that to predict where an object would go ? A sort of futuresight but not with fortune, more like the stormwardens ?

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What about the Truthwatcher cobbler? We see a clear example of the use of regrowth, but we also see him ask for the child's story. This is framed through his religion, but it also shows that he could determine whether the boy was being honest about his story. Right? I don't remember that part of the interlude very well.

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7 hours ago, erarufus said:

If they could see things like this, the maths and forces, should they be able to use that to predict where an object would go ? A sort of futuresight but not with fortune, more like the stormwardens ?

I suppose although it is not magical in nature.  A very intelligent ordinary person can do the same thing. 

2 hours ago, Q10fanatic said:

What about the Truthwatcher cobbler? We see a clear example of the use of regrowth, but we also see him ask for the child's story. This is framed through his religion, but it also shows that he could determine whether the boy was being honest about his story. Right? I don't remember that part of the interlude very well.

I don't think he had any ability to tell if the child was being honest beyond basic deduction and similar personal experiences. 

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