On Champions

[Negative_Null]

So in Oathbreaker, we have the whole Odium's champion thing, and in addition, a lot of people refer to Vin as Preservation's champion, which is how she can draw on the mists. Do we know if the creation of a Champion is an actual realmatic thing (like changing Identity or forging Connection or whatever?) or just a phenomenon where the Shard chooses someone?

[Lucky MOPper]

I think the two are very different. Vin is Preservation's chosen to be its vessel. Dalinar is just someone Odium wants to turn, and believes would be very effective when invested. Odium has no intention of dying.

[Karger]

40 minutes ago, Negative_Null said:

. Do we know if the creation of a Champion is an actual realmatic thing (like changing Identity or forging Connection or whatever?) or just a phenomenon where the Shard chooses someone?

I mean everything is.  Even eating food has actual realmatics involved.  Excepting a role as a champion could certainly alter your sense of self enough to make a minor change to your identity and it might make more people or a shard think of you as theirs and that would change your connection.  However  I do not think we currently have any evidence for anything as major as an actual magical definition.

Edited March 5, 2020 by Karger

[Dunkum]

6 hours ago, Lucky MOPper said:

I think the two are very different. Vin is Preservation's chosen to be its vessel. Dalinar is just someone Odium wants to turn, and believes would be very effective when invested. Odium has no intention of dying.

Well, more than that though.  the way it is discussed in the book, it sounds like Odium's champion would have a specific role related to teh Oathpact

[ftl]

Interesting catch!

I don't think we have enough clues to know for sure, but it's an interesting idea.

[+Harrycrapper]

I think the whole champion thing has something to do with how Honor and Cultivation sealed Odium on Braize, the Intent of the shard of Honor, or The Oathpact. Preservation did something in particular to make Vin more Connected to him, I'm not sure that's been done with Dalinar in a deliberate way because obviously Honor is dead. Though by now, Dalinar is probably connected enough to Honor that he could pick up the Shard if it were not Shattered, similar to how Vin picked up Preservation. 

[Eternal Khol]

 

20 hours ago, Dunkum said:

Well, more than that though.  the way it is discussed in the book, it sounds like Odium's champion would have a specific role related to teh Oathpact

i think Odium picking a champion just has to do with the fact that Odium doesn't want to open himself to a strike from Cultivation

Stormfather states that "To fight directly might coax out forces that could hurt him, as he has been hurt before. Those scars do not heal. To pick a champion, then lose, will only cost him time. He has that in plenitude."

Edited March 7, 2020 by Eternal Khol