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Thoughts on Yolish Lightweaving


Forest Nymphomaniac

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Apologies if this has been discussed before, but I hadn't seen any mention in my searches.

I had some thoughts while I was at work today regarding the Yolish lightweaving. To my knowledge, it predates the shattering, originating (obviously) on Yolen. The examples we've seen of Yolish lightweaving, indicate that it does not function perfectly as intended, even requiring aide from a Rosharan lightweaver to achieve the desired goal.

So, here's where my theory comes in. Perhaps Yolish Lightweaving does not function as intended, because the source of its investiture, Adolnasium, is shattered. Pairing their similar abilities with the shardic investiture of a Rosharan lightweaver bridges the gap in their investiture.

 

What do you guys think?

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I think that Hoid's lightweaving was working just fine, but it's just very different from Shallan's lightweaving. In the lightweaving shown in the sample chapters of Liar of Partinel, dust is thrown in the air, and an illusion forms around the dust, although it can move afterwards. This throwing-dust-in-the-air lightweaving would have been impractical for the massive illusion made of the Girl Who Looked Up. 

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22 minutes ago, ChickenLiberty said:

I think that Hoid's lightweaving was working just fine, but it's just very different from Shallan's lightweaving. In the lightweaving shown in the sample chapters of Liar of Partinel, dust is thrown in the air, and an illusion forms around the dust, although it can move afterwards. This throwing-dust-in-the-air lightweaving would have been impractical for the massive illusion made of the Girl Who Looked Up. 

While I agree even at full power, Yolish lightweaving seems to work on different mechanics... That's all non-Canon, and we have been told that his powers have diminished somehow. 

Quote

Stormlightning

Where you *inaudible* Hoid as a Lightweaver in Era 2?

Brandon Sanderson

Hoid was a Lightweaver in Dragonsteel.

Stormlightning

I mean a spren Lightweaver. Unless the timeline's still, really--

Brandon Sanderson

Meaning was I planning for him to become a Lightweaver?

Stormlightning

Before Era 2 since we thought Era 2 was going to be Era 3.

Brandon Sanderson

 Hoid has never quite stopped being a Lightweaver. He is very happy to be fully empowered with things.

Stormlightning

Does that mean he was not fully a Lightweaver?

Brandon Sanderson

You will find out someday. His magic was not fully functional, but he was Lightweaving in Way of Kings

Skyward release party (Nov. 6, 2018)

What exactly that all means is not clear yet. 

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18 hours ago, Forest Nymphomaniac said:

Maybe I'm misremembering and extrapolating with that Q&A but I thought he needed Shallans help at one point. It is next on my list for a re-read, its been awhile.

He did. He asked Shallan for help when he was telling the Girl Who Looked Up.

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4 hours ago, RShara said:

I think he did that because he wanted Shallan to participate, not because he needed her to.

That could be it, and seems likely.

However, with Sanderson's comment that his magic was not functioning properly, it could be that he did actually need a little assistance.

 

Regardless, this is all beyond the main question I had. I'm more curious what you guys think about the possibility Adolnasiums shattering affected Yolish lightweaving, perhaps being the reason Houd's magic wasn't working properly

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How do we know anything about Yolen , is it in any short stories . Yes I know Hoid does it , but beyond that and the brief reference Arcanum Unbound . I have seen nothing about Yolen and if there is a work out thier I would love to read it .

        Side note : I know Brandon wrote 10 books before he published Elantris his 6th book . Dragonsteel is written but unpublished. Soooo my question is , can we read any of Brandon unpublished works anywhere ? On his website , a email copy etc? 

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43 minutes ago, SzethIsBadAsHell said:

        Side note : I know Brandon wrote 10 books before he published Elantris his 6th book . Dragonsteel is written but unpublished. Soooo my question is , can we read any of Brandon unpublished works anywhere ? On his website , a email copy etc? 

The manuscript for Aether of Night can be gotten through the forums. Post a request in the following topic and you’ll be PMed a copy when an admin can get to it.

I’m not sure about the White Sand prose. I think it used to be in circulation through email, but has since been removed and can only be viewed if you go to BYU or request a copy through the library system BYU’s connected to. I’m not a 100% sure though. @RShara, can you confirm or correct me on what the situation is for White Sand?

Dragonsteel Prime I know for a fact only exists as a physical copy at BYU, since they keep copies of all their students Master’s theses and that was Brandon’s. So, you need to go there and request a copy, and I don’t think you can take it out of the library. 

Edit: Oh yeah, I forgot. I’m case you didn’t know, there are sample chapters from Dragonsteel Prime on Brandon’s website (with some redacted sentences). Here’s a link to the first chapter, and you can scroll through at the top to see the others. 

https://brandonsanderson.com/dragonsteel-prime-chapter-25-bridge-four-1/

 

Edited by ILuvHats
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5 hours ago, ILuvHats said:

The manuscript for Aether of Night can be gotten through the forums. Post a request in the following topic and you’ll be PMed a copy when an admin can get to it.

I’m not sure about the White Sand prose. I think it used to be in circulation through email, but has since been removed and can only be viewed if you go to BYU or request a copy through the library system BYU’s connected to. I’m not a 100% sure though. @RShara, can you confirm or correct me on what the situation is for White Sand?

Dragonsteel Prime I know for a fact only exists as a physical copy at BYU, since they keep copies of all their students Master’s theses and that was Brandon’s. So, you need to go there and request a copy, and I don’t think you can take it out of the library. 

Edit: Oh yeah, I forgot. I’m case you didn’t know, there are sample chapters from Dragonsteel Prime on Brandon’s website (with some redacted sentences). Here’s a link to the first chapter, and you can scroll through at the top to see the others. 

https://brandonsanderson.com/dragonsteel-prime-chapter-25-bridge-four-1/

 

White Sand Prose was never printed. It's usually available when you sign up for the Newsletter, but the recent one doesn't have the link. The one that's coming in a week or two should have it, though. Or you can contact the email address in the current email and ask for it.

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On 11/23/2019 at 5:09 PM, SzethIsBadAsHell said:

How do we know anything about Yolen , is it in any short stories . Yes I know Hoid does it , but beyond that and the brief reference Arcanum Unbound . I have seen nothing about Yolen and if there is a work out thier I would love to read it .

Aside from the canonical mention by Khriss in the Arcanum Unbounded essays and offhandedly in Mistborn Secret History and the Dragonsteel Prime excerpts mentioned, there used to be a publicly available draft for the first few chapters of The Liar of Partinel (including a second version of the first chapter) but the links got broken during backend work on Brandon's website and while they weren't supposed to be removed, one of the links hasn't been fixed yet. You can still find the revised single chapter here. While very much non-canonical as it exists, some material in the drafts has been confirmed to be at least roughly accurate due to Khriss' description of fainlife in Arcanum Unbounded. Brandon's mentioned that he'd completely rewrite the thing rather than try to revise what already exists, if and when he revisits it.

There's another bit of Yolen-related material out there, a short piece Brandon read at a signing called The Traveler.

Quote

        Side note : I know Brandon wrote 10 books before he published Elantris his 6th book . Dragonsteel is written but unpublished. Soooo my question is , can we read any of Brandon unpublished works anywhere ? On his website , a email copy etc? 

In addition to the full manuscripts of White Sand (Prose) and Aether of Night, you can find the prologue from Mistborn Prime and couple sample chapters from Final Empire Prime (Vin and Conqueror) which were merged and rewritten into what we have as Mistborn: The Final Empire. I believe Brandon used to give the manuscripts of these out to people who asked specifically but that he doesn't do it any more. You can also read the entirety of the (never finished) Mythwalker, aka Warbreaker Prime on the website, starting here. Some early chapters from Way of Kings Prime are also available and include scenes from the characters who became Szeth, Dalinar and Kaladin, starting here. Brandon has said that he intends to eventually make the whole manuscript available, once all the material that it would currently spoil has been covered in Stormlight Archive.

All the other books he wrote before being published have never been available in any form. We know that White Sand Prime and Lord Mastrell were rewritten into White Sand (Prose), we know basically nothing about Star's End, Knight Life and The Sixth Incarnation of Pandora (though the latter sounds like it could have been pretty neat) and we know a very tiny bit about his plans for other works related to Aether of Night thanks to Pagerunner's digging through TWG. I got Brandon to confirm at a signing that Syl originally came from there.

EDIT: Since this has gone into a long tangent on unpublished works, might as well add that Brandon mentioned last year that he plans to eventually release the original draft of Apocalypse Guard. As he put it, if it never got revised and published he'd just like it to be available and if it does get revised and published (he and Dan Wells are continuing to work on it) he'll still release the draft so we can compare the two versions as a teaching moment for fans and/or aspiring writers. Which is a really awesome thing for him to do, like all the Warbreaker drafts or what was written of Mythwalker.

Edited by Ookla the Nameless
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On 11/24/2019 at 0:01 PM, Weltall said:

Aside from the canonical mention by Khriss in the Arcanum Unbounded essays and offhandedly in Mistborn Secret History and the Dragonsteel Prime excerpts mentioned, there used to be a publicly available draft for the first few chapters of The Liar of Partinel (including a second version of the first chapter) but the links got broken during backend work on Brandon's website and while they weren't supposed to be removed, one of the links hasn't been fixed yet.

Actually, this was on the verified locations for unreleased stuff thread, and it works.

First six chapters of Liar: https://docslide.us/documents/liarpt12.html

Edited by ChickenLiberty
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On 11/21/2019 at 10:36 PM, ChickenLiberty said:

I think that Hoid's lightweaving was working just fine, but it's just very different from Shallan's lightweaving. In the lightweaving shown in the sample chapters of Liar of Partinel, dust is thrown in the air, and an illusion forms around the dust, although it can move afterwards. This throwing-dust-in-the-air lightweaving would have been impractical for the massive illusion made of the Girl Who Looked Up. 

I’m pretty sure he used this in Warbreaker. Though he downplayed the magic element. He also seems to have used it when telling Kaladin a story.

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12 minutes ago, Kingsdaughter613 said:

I’m pretty sure he used this in Warbreaker. Though he downplayed the magic element. He also seems to have used it when telling Kaladin a story.

Brandon's directly confirmed the former was an application of Yolish Lightweaving and more or less confirmed the latter as well, especially since he mentioned interactions plural with Kaladin.

Quote

Nightfire107

Does the sand storytelling Hoid uses in Warbreaker have anything to do with your future possible trilogy "White Sand" written about in a recent blog?

Brandon Sanderson

No, it does not. This is a storytelling method that Hoid developed on his own. It does have a relationship to The Liar of Partinel.

Tor.com Q&A with Brandon Sanderson (Jan. 10, 2011)
Quote

Questioner

I love the Hoid scavenger hunts that have been going on. What does he-- what powers does he have, what magic has used *inaudible*?

Brandon Sanderson

If you watch in these books, he has used on screen so far three of the different magics.

Questioner

And have we seen those three-- do we know what those three are?

Brandon Sanderson

You know at least two of them. Very deep clues-- very more obvious clues are in this book [WoR].

Questioner

And I haven't gotten to yet-- you can see where I am.

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah; watch where he and Kaladin have some interactions. If you watch carefully you will see something in what he mentions. You've already seen him and Shallan, that scene in one of her flashbacks.

Questioner

I was almost-- I was reading that scene like "that has to be..."

Brandon Sanderson

Yeah, in that scene he uses one if you watch.

Footnote: Hoid references having at least the Second Heightening (Awakening) to Kaladin in jail; he likely uses emotional Allomancy on Shallan. This transcriber can't think of a third, beyond Yolish Lightweaving in WoK
Words of Radiance San Francisco signing (March 6, 2014)

 

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32 minutes ago, Weltall said:

Brandon's directly confirmed the former was an application of Yolish Lightweaving and more or less confirmed the latter as well, especially since he mentioned interactions plural with Kaladin.

 

I don't know that the WoB is confirmation that he was using Yolish Lightweaving there. Just that it's a story method he developed in Liar. Which doesn't need to be magical. Considering what he does during the Warbreaker story--throwing bits of things up and letting them fall down again--I don't think it's Lightweaving. The only magical thing that happened was the black sand turning white, indicating it was charged up (on purpose, likely). And maybe the puffs of flame, though that could easily be slight of hand.

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10 minutes ago, RShara said:

I don't know that the WoB is confirmation that he was using Yolish Lightweaving there. Just that it's a story method he developed in Liar. Which doesn't need to be magical.

Given that he mentioned Liar specifically and the available excerpts show that he used handfuls of dust as a catalyst or focus for Lightweaving there while telling stories... I think it's more likely than not that he intended that to be magical.

Edited by Weltall
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Just now, Weltall said:

Given that he mentioned Liar specifically and the available excerpts show that he used handfuls of dust as a catalyst or focus for Lightweaving there...

But he doesn't use dust in most of the story. He uses bits of metal, bits of flower, some sand, and so forth. And the sand, and the dust, and the metal never does anything. It just....falls to the ground.

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