Is Renarin using the void of illumination or a combination of the surge and void of illumination?

[Ixthos]

We know Glys is corrupted, and this is affecting Renarin's abilities. We know that Renarin's version of future sight is somehow related to voidbinding. We also know that in the past another Truthwatcher admitted to having seen the future. We also know that Kaladin did something Syl didn't expect when he - presumably - used Adhesion to push back the storm.

So, Kaladin showed that the basic expected powers the spren think the knights should have - and that the knights do have - aren't necessarily what they were in the past (assuming Syl's previous knight just never used that ability), probably due to Honour being splintered and so excess power being available that is unregulated. So Truthwatchers might naturally be able to see the future in some way. However Renarin's version of future sight - which might be the same as the other Truthwatcher's powers - seems to involve voidbinding. Was this because this knight also bonded Glys, and Glys has been corrupted for a long time, or some other reason?

 

In essence, do you think Renarin's version of future sight is entirely based on binding the void of illumination, or is it a combination of the surge and void of illumination?

[ScavellTane]

I'm thinking Renarin is actually using the Old Magic variation of Illumination. Commanding Surges, I think, requires Light. His visions just come to him, its beyond his control.

If in ancient times Surges manifest without the direct/straight-forward control that surgebinding provides, it may explain the Desolations in a way.

[Quantus]

In the case of Kaladin, he just used "the Surge of Pressure" to affect air pressure directly, but it still operated in the same general way (a Physical air pressure effect). Given no other indication of corruption, though, I think it's just a semi-novel use of the Surge.  I say "semi" because the Stormfather himself is all about wind&weather manipulation, and he seems to more closely resemble the Wind/Honorspren specifically, so I would expect that his own abilities are going to be fundamentally similar to those associated Surges.  

In the case of Renarin's precognition, I think this is specifically a new/different Surge that is and always has been associated with Odium/The Void.  Points of note:

• There was at least one  Truthwatcher that could see the future in the time of the Gem Archive, but this was after the Last Desolation and just before the Recreance.  
• That Truthwatcher acted secretive, possibly ashamed, by the ability, indicating that the cultural stigma was already established.  
• There existed a Form of Power that granted Precognition, which is presumably why that Ability is associated with Odium's side.  
• The Voidbinding Chart shows each Radiant order with Void equivalent, but one half of the Glyphs are Inverted, which many (myself included) interpret as meaning these Voidbinding orders will have one normal and one 'inverted' Void-ish Surge

Add all that up, and I think that Odium had previously resisted Investing directly in Roshar for quite a long time, but eventually got Cornered into it.  This is why some Voidspren are Red shadows while others are White&Gold.  Prior to being so cornered he was able to create some of these Surges via corrupted lesser spren and Forms of Power, which Im guessing took less Investment on his part because it's a Bond that happens in the Physical Realm (Via the Gemheart) rather than a purely Spiritual one like the Nahel Bond.  Later on, after being stuck in the Desolation Cycle for long enough, he decided to more fully and properly Connect his Investiture to Roshar (closer to the way/scale that Honor and Cultivation had) and this has let him more fully hack himself (and his Void Surges) into the Nahel Bond workings of Rosharan magic.  

 

[Karger]

36 minutes ago, Ixthos said:

In essence, do you think Renarin's version of future sight is entirely based on binding the void of illumination, or is it a combination of the surge and void of illumination?

I believe that the prevailing theory is that Renarin is using the voidish version of illumination.  That being said everyone and their mother has their own theory and Brandon is helpfully RAFOing every question.  I personally do think he is using voidbinding.  That being said some other shenanigans are obviously going on just because this is Brandon.

[Calderis]

11 minutes ago, Quantus said:

The Voidbinding Chart shows each Radiant order with Void equivalent, but one half of the Glyphs are Inverted, which many (myself included) interpret as meaning these Voidbinding orders will have one normal and one 'inverted' Void-ish Surge

In contrast, I think the Surges on the voidbinding chart are one thing. They are the same glyphs changed to radial, rather than axial symmetry. Same surge, different expression. 

The "order" and surge glyphs on that chart are two separate things. There are no lines connecting the "orders" to the Surges. 

I do think that Renarin has standard Progression and the Voidbinding variant of Illumination, primarily because of his inability to make any even simple image. 

In his own words, "somethings wrong." 

[Ixthos]

@ScavellTane There might be some of that to it, but I think the confirmation that Renarin's powers are tied to the "voidbinding chart" in some way (and the confirmation that the chart is for voidbinding) makes that a little unlikely.

 

@Quantus Adhesion is pressure ;-) I'm convinced that Windrunners have a form of telekinesis using Adhesion to apply pressure and vacuum to manipulate objects via air currents, but they might have been locked out of fully exploring their powers due to Honour restraining them, as Nale implied. With Honour dead - or dying before the Recreance - that might have allowed some orders greater power before they realised what it was from.

I think that stigma might be because - as Honour requires acting a certain way regardless of where that would lead - the Knights are expected to keep their eyes on the present. I think that at least some form of future sight is still a property of the Truthwatchers, especially considering their order is strongly tied to Cultivation, which does imply a mind on the future, and so it is the tension between their bond to Honour's power and Cultivation's power.

I'm wondering how invested a shard is in a planet and how invested they are in a system - if Odium invested into Roshar the planet, that would imply he somehow is invested in two planets at the same time but still only has one "face" or nexus of his power to direct it. I think in some way Voidbinding is both Honour and Odium, but I'm wondering if it is more in Braize than Roshar.

 

@Karger Fair enough :-) though that would imply the Truthwatcher in the gem archive's recording likewise was voidbinding, unless both voidbinding and Truthwatcher surges can both be used to see the future.

 

@Calderis I see what you are saying and I wouldn't be surprised if you were right, but I think you and I are going to be disagreeing on the name of things those glyphs represent until it gets confirmed either way ;-) I'm convinced they represent voids, or each represents a level of the void (which might explain why there is no link between them and the "order equivalent" glyphs), with each void or level matching one surge. Even the names are diametrically opposed, with a void being an absence and a surge being an excess presence.

Something is definitely wrong with Renarin's use of illumination, but that doesn't necessarily mean he can't access it like a normal surge even if he can't currently do so - that seems to imply that Glys has lost something rather than gained something, though I do agree it is possible. I do find it interesting that many of the main characters seems to have some exception to the usual rules: Lift metabolising food for power, Renarin's powers changed by Glys's corruption, Dalinar bonding the Stormfather who merged with the last remnant of Honour's cognitive shadow, Taln and Ash's broken state and status as Heralds, Kaladin pushing back the storm, Venli being a Singer with her spren - at least currently - in her gemheart. I don't think that Renarin has been locked out of traditional Illumination, but we will have to see.

[Calderis]

I think that the "void" in voidbinding refers to the same void that we see in Moash. See this passage fron the Elia Stele. 

Quote

Beware the otherworlders. The traitors. Those with tongues of sweetness, but with minds that lust for blood. Do not take them in. Do not give them succor. Well were they named Voidbringers, for they brought the void. The empty pit that sucks in emotion. A new god. Their god.
—From the Eila Stele

I think the Void is just another means of accessing the Surgesvia a different system. 

And as far as Renarin is concerned, I don't think that he's the one experiencing the "Void." I think Glys is. 

Quote

He will not be resisted, Glys said. My sorrow, Renarin. I will give you my sorrow.

I think the "void" is emotion fueled, and Glys is the one fueling Renarin's visions. 

[Ixthos]

10 minutes ago, Calderis said:

I think that the "void" in voidbinding refers to the same void that we see in Moash. See this passage fron the Elia Stele. 

I think the Void is just another means of accessing the Surgesvia a different system. 

And as far as Renarin is concerned, I don't think that he's the one experiencing the "Void." I think Glys is. 

I think the "void" is emotion fueled, and Glys is the one fueling Renarin's visions. 

Of course, in Mistborn void is also used, and Odium isn't in sight :-) void can have multiple uses, and even if it is the same void it can still be what is bound, and the equivalent of the surges.

I definitely agree emotion is involved, though I think Odium is actually absorbing emotions from his followers to become more powerful. It might be that the emotions are stored up and then used, given by Odium when he wants to empower his minions.

[Quantus]

1 hour ago, Calderis said:

In contrast, I think the Surges on the voidbinding chart are one thing. They are the same glyphs changed to radial, rather than axial symmetry. Same surge, different expression. 

The "order" and surge glyphs on that chart are two separate things. There are no lines connecting the "orders" to the Surges. 

I do think that Renarin has standard Progression and the Voidbinding variant of Illumination, primarily because of his inability to make any even simple image. 

In his own words, "somethings wrong." 

No, You're right.  I was misremembering the charts and had gotten the Surge and the Order bubbles confused.  

 

 

[Pathfinder]

I still cling to my own theory that the Truthwatcher quote from the gemstone archive was a red herring to hide the great reveal that Renarin was not a "normal" truthwatcher. Basically the quote is saying the person figured something out, but the others would be upset if he pointed it out to everyone else. No magic involved. But I will have to wait till we see more of normal truthwatchers before my theory will either be vindicated or disproved. 

[KandraAllomancer]

1 hour ago, Pathfinder said:

I still cling to my own theory that the Truthwatcher quote from the gemstone archive was a red herring to hide the great reveal that Renarin was not a "normal" truthwatcher. Basically the quote is saying the person figured something out, but the others would be upset if he pointed it out to everyone else. No magic involved. But I will have to wait till we see more of normal truthwatchers before my theory will either be vindicated or disproved. 

The Voidbinding chart shows the red gem (color of corrupted Investiture) covering Bondsmiths and Truthwatchers. The only sapient spren corrupted by Odium we see are the Unmade and Glys. Future sight, Odium's signature move, seems to be a corrupted version of one of Truthwatcher Surges. I find it hard to believe it's a coincidence, there is something weird/special about the Truthwatcher spren

3 hours ago, Calderis said:

I think the "void" is emotion fueled, and Glys is the one fueling Renarin's visions. 

I really like this idea

4 hours ago, Calderis said:

The "order" and surge glyphs on that chart are two separate things. There are no lines connecting the "orders" to the Surges. 

I just looked at the Voidbinding chart here and there seem to be lines connecting "orders" and Surges. The only ones missing are the ones for Bondsmith and Truthwatcher equivalents

[Pathfinder]

26 minutes ago, KandraAllomancer said:

The Voidbinding chart shows the red gem (color of corrupted Investiture) covering Bondsmiths and Truthwatchers. The only sapient spren corrupted by Odium we see are the Unmade and Glys. Future sight, Odium's signature move, seems to be a corrupted version of one of Truthwatcher Surges. I find it hard to believe it's a coincidence, there is something weird/special about the Truthwatcher spren

That chart is the in world artistic rendition. Everyone wondered why there is a woman there, and why she has a covered safehand if this is the voidbringer chart and would be thought to be associated with the parsh. That is when brandon explained people in world chose to draw it that way, and the safe hand doesn't necessarily mean anything. The knights radiant chart has two larkin on it. We have not seen anything tie larkin directly to the radiants, nor the specific orders it is facing. So personally I do not feel because a red gemstone is centered, means truthwatchers on whole are corrupted. You can certainly reason that, but I do not think it is evidence that stands on its own. As I said I have my own personal theory I cling to till we see more from Stump. If Stump starts having visions of the future like Renarin does, then sure they can too. But I will operate as Renarin is unique as his spren has been (at least in appearance) verified to be different than normal truthwatcher spren. So till I see otherwise, I will operate on "normal" Truthwatchers not being able to see the future.

Edited November 12, 2019 by Pathfinder

[KandraAllomancer]

26 minutes ago, Pathfinder said:

The knights radiant chart has two larkin on it.

The larkins cover all of the background, while the red gem cover two specific "Orders" only. And they are the only ones lacking a connection to Surges (Voidbindings?)

28 minutes ago, Pathfinder said:

But I will operate as Renarin is unique as his spren has been (at least in appearance) verified to be different than normal truthwatcher spren. So till I see otherwise, I will operate on "normal" Truthwatchers not being able to see the future.

I don't disagree. Not all godspren are spren corrupted by Odium and not all Truthwatcher spren were corrupted by Sja-anat. The Voidbinding chart seems to highlight precisely these two types of spren though

[Pathfinder]

6 minutes ago, KandraAllomancer said:

The larkins cover all of the background, while the red gem cover two specific "Orders" only. And they are the only ones lacking a connection to Surges (Voidbindings?)

And the larkins only have their mouths over the bondsmith, and their claws holding the truthwatcher. Every other order is just overlaid. My point is I am not saying you are wrong to reason as you do. I am just saying by itself it isn't evidence enough to directly say truthwatcher spren must be corrupted. Otherwise why aren't the bondsmith spren as well? So for myself, the gemstone isn't enough. It could just be, to me, artistic license like the woman with the safe hand. 

6 minutes ago, KandraAllomancer said:

I don't disagree. Not all godspren are spren corrupted by Odium and not all Truthwatcher spren were corrupted by Sja-anat. The Voidbinding chart seems to highlight precisely these two types of spren though

That is your interpretation. Just like my own interpretation of the gemstone archive is that the truthwatcher is talking about something he figured out. I have used this example before:

Lets say hypothetically I see two friends expressing interest in each other. I know them separately, and know they would be horrible together. But I also know they would get defensive and upset if I said as much to them. Ultimately they get together, and it goes horribly like I knew it would. If I point that out, they would get upset at me for not having warned them. So I do not want them to know, could not say it, but I foresaw it. All without any magical means. 

So I think it was put there, to make people think "Hey! truthwatchers of old could see the future! Renarin must be normal!". That way when it was truly revealed, it still had impact. That is my own interpretation. I could be wrong. I am just waiting till we see more truthwatchers on screen to either confirm or deny that. Further I am waiting to see more of Renarin too, to learn how Glys got corrupted and what that means. 

[KandraAllomancer]

8 minutes ago, Pathfinder said:

Otherwise why aren't the bondsmith spren as well?

I think the Unmade would count as Odium's godspren - and they seem to have been corrupted ("made, then unmade")

10 minutes ago, Pathfinder said:

That is your interpretation. Just like my own interpretation of the gemstone archive is that the truthwatcher is talking about something he figured out.

I assume you're referring to the quote below:

Quote

Don't tell anyone. I can't say it. I must whisper. I foresaw this.

That still doesn't explain the other one:

Quote

I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers.

The whole situation doesn't seem to concern just one or even a few persons, but Truthwatchers in general. Not that all their spren must have been corrupted, but probably enough for some people to notice

[Pathfinder]

30 minutes ago, KandraAllomancer said:

I think the Unmade would count as Odium's godspren - and they seem to have been corrupted ("made, then unmade")

So are you saying you belive the Unmade are corrupted bondsmith spren?

Quote

I assume you're referring to the quote below:

That still doesn't explain the other one:

The whole situation doesn't seem to concern just one or even a few persons, but Truthwatchers in general. Not that all their spren must have been corrupted, but probably enough for some people to notice

So each line is denoted by a number. So second emerald, first emerald, etc. It has shown up in the book in the below order.

 

Spoiler

 

"I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers." (second)

 

"Something must be done about the remnants of Odium's forces. The parsh, as they are now called, continue their war with zeal, even without their masters from Damnation." (first)

 

"A coalition has been formed among scholar Radiants. Our goal is to deny the enemy their supply of Voidlight; this will prevent their continuing transformations, and give us an edge in combat." (second)

"Our revelation is fueled by the theory that the Unmade can perhaps be captured like ordinary spren. It would require a special prison. And Melishi."(third)

 

"Ba-Ado-Mishram has somehow Connected with the parsh people, as Odium once did. She provides Voidlight and facilitates forms of power. Our strike team is going to imprison her."(fourth)

 

"We are uncertain the effects this will have on the parsh. At the very least, it should deny them forms of power. Melishi is confident, but Naze-daughter-Kuzodo warns of unintended side effects." (fifth)

 

"Surely this will bring - at long last - the end to war that the Heralds promised us." (final)

 

"Don't tell anyone. I can't say it. I must whisper. I foresaw this." (a particularly small emerald)

 

 

We could potentially reason that the two second emeralds are from the same emerald, same subject. We could potentially reason emeralds one through the final are one full thought recorded over the course of multiple emeralds. The order would then be:

Spoiler

 

"Something must be done about the remnants of Odium's forces. The parsh, as they are now called, continue their war with zeal, even without their masters from Damnation. A coalition has been formed among scholar Radiants. Our goal is to deny the enemy their supply of Voidlight; this will prevent their continuing transformations, and give us an edge in combat. I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers. Our revelation is fueled by the theory that the Unmade can perhaps be captured like ordinary spren. It would require a special prison. And Melishi. Ba-Ado-Mishram has somehow Connected with the parsh people, as Odium once did. She provides Voidlight and facilitates forms of power. Our strike team is going to imprison her. We are uncertain the effects this will have on the parsh. At the very least, it should deny them forms of power. Melishi is confident, but Naze-daughter-Kuzodo warns of unintended side effects. Surely this will bring - at long last - the end to war that the Heralds promised us."

"Don't tell anyone. I can't say it. I must whisper. I foresaw this"

 

Or it could be (exchange the two second emeralds order):

Spoiler

 

"Something must be done about the remnants of Odium's forces. The parsh, as they are now called, continue their war with zeal, even without their masters from Damnation.  I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers. A coalition has been formed among scholar Radiants. Our goal is to deny the enemy their supply of Voidlight; this will prevent their continuing transformations, and give us an edge in combat. Our revelation is fueled by the theory that the Unmade can perhaps be captured like ordinary spren. It would require a special prison. And Melishi. Ba-Ado-Mishram has somehow Connected with the parsh people, as Odium once did. She provides Voidlight and facilitates forms of power. Our strike team is going to imprison her. We are uncertain the effects this will have on the parsh. At the very least, it should deny them forms of power. Melishi is confident, but Naze-daughter-Kuzodo warns of unintended side effects. Surely this will bring - at long last - the end to war that the Heralds promised us."

"Don't tell anyone. I can't say it. I must whisper. I foresaw this"

 

 

Or it could be (the second emerald is its own separate thing):

Spoiler

 

"Something must be done about the remnants of Odium's forces. The parsh, as they are now called, continue their war with zeal, even without their masters from Damnation. A coalition has been formed among scholar Radiants. Our goal is to deny the enemy their supply of Voidlight; this will prevent their continuing transformations, and give us an edge in combat. Our revelation is fueled by the theory that the Unmade can perhaps be captured like ordinary spren. It would require a special prison. And Melishi. Ba-Ado-Mishram has somehow Connected with the parsh people, as Odium once did. She provides Voidlight and facilitates forms of power. Our strike team is going to imprison her. We are uncertain the effects this will have on the parsh. At the very least, it should deny them forms of power. Melishi is confident, but Naze-daughter-Kuzodo warns of unintended side effects. Surely this will bring - at long last - the end to war that the Heralds promised us."

"I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers." 

"Don't tell anyone. I can't say it. I must whisper. I foresaw this"

 

 

Or what you are positing:

Spoiler

 

"Something must be done about the remnants of Odium's forces. The parsh, as they are now called, continue their war with zeal, even without their masters from Damnation. A coalition has been formed among scholar Radiants. Our goal is to deny the enemy their supply of Voidlight; this will prevent their continuing transformations, and give us an edge in combat. Our revelation is fueled by the theory that the Unmade can perhaps be captured like ordinary spren. It would require a special prison. And Melishi. Ba-Ado-Mishram has somehow Connected with the parsh people, as Odium once did. She provides Voidlight and facilitates forms of power. Our strike team is going to imprison her. We are uncertain the effects this will have on the parsh. At the very least, it should deny them forms of power. Melishi is confident, but Naze-daughter-Kuzodo warns of unintended side effects. Surely this will bring - at long last - the end to war that the Heralds promised us."

"I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers. Don't tell anyone. I can't say it. I must whisper. I foresaw this"

 

 

I personally think it is separate. Even if it is linked as you posit, to me it does not change it could be a truthwatcher concerned about what is happening with his order with the failing of Urithiru. Again no magic involved. Another member of the stonewards was concerned about the windrunners and skybreakers fighting while a willshaper felt they have all devolved into squabbling children. A skybreaker is even stating he or she thinks honor is changing, while an elsecaller is theorizing why the sibling is withdrawing. So it would not be a stretch that another member would be concerned regarding his or her order. All I was saying is for myself, I think truthwatchers normally do not see the future. That is my own personal theory I am holding onto till we learn more from Renarin. 

Edited November 12, 2019 by Pathfinder

[KandraAllomancer]

7 minutes ago, Pathfinder said:

So are you saying you belive the Unmade are corrupted bondsmith spren?

I think they were some kind of large spren that were unmade into Odium's equivalent of godspren. I don't see any other spren that could bond with Voidbinding's equivalent of Bondsmiths. Possibly, the nine-shadowed Champion would count as Odium's Bondsmith

9 minutes ago, Pathfinder said:

All I was saying is for myself, I think truthwatchers normally do not see the future.

I still absolutely agree. To clarify my position - I think that during some periods of increased activity (we know of False Desolation and True Desolation), Sja-anat specifically targets and corrupts some number of Truthwatcher spren. Why these particular spren, I have no idea

As for the quotes, "I worry about my fellow Truthwatchers." comes from other drawer (8-21) than the rest you mentioned (30-20). I see this as two independent accounts of something wrong happening to the Truthwatchers

[Honorless]

Truthwatchers do see something, it's in their name!

That WoB people use to connect Renarin to Voidbinding is much more open to interpretation. Brandon was asked about Renarin's visions, and he pointed to the chart. I don't think the connection would be as overt as him using one Void Surge and one normal Surge.

I've always wondered why Cultivation wouldn't give futuresight, she is supposed to be good at it. Futuresight sounds like something that could happen as an interaction of the Truthwatcher Surges, as Illumination of Progression.

I had never considered the Surge × Void wordplay... I'd connected Void as referring to the hole in the Spiritweb that allows Odium in. Intriguing idea though.

[Karger]

26 minutes ago, Honorless said:

I've always wondered why Cultivation wouldn't give futuresight, she is supposed to be good at it. Futuresight sounds like something that could happen as an interaction of the Truthwatcher Surges, as Illumination of Progression.

She might in her magic system but we have not seen that yet.  Radiants are aligned with Honor.

[Calderis]

46 minutes ago, Honorless said:

That WoB people use to connect Renarin to Voidbinding is much more open to interpretation. Brandon was asked about Renarin's visions, and he pointed to the chart. I don't think the connection would be as overt as him using one Void Surge and one normal Surge.

And I actually think it's far less convulsed or confused than people try to make it. Because of this WoB. 

Quote

Argent

Let's talk about Renarin, and Voidbinding. So, with that page we talked about, Renarin Voidbinds. I asked about visions, you pointed to Voidbinding chart, he Voidbinds. Is that using Stormlight to power abilities different from the Surgebindings we've seen?  

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. 

Argent

Is that what voidbinding is? 

Brandon Sanderson

No, but close. You're on the right track. We are gonna get into that, I'm not gonna tell you what the chart means, and things like that. But yeah, something really weird is happening there. 

Oathbringer Chicago signing (Nov. 21, 2017)

There are two separate questions here that confuse things. If it would have stopped after the first question, there wouldn't even be a debate. 

Quote

Argent

Let's talk about Renarin, and Voidbinding. So, with that page we talked about, Renarin Voidbinds. I asked about visions, you pointed to Voidbinding chart, he Voidbinds. Is that using Stormlight to power abilities different from the Surgebindings we've seen?  

Brandon Sanderson

Yes. 

Renarin is Voidbinding. 

The second question then makes it clear that the way in which he is doing it is not the normal manner. 

Quote

Argent

Is that what voidbinding is? 

Brandon Sanderson

No, but close. You're on the right track. We are gonna get into that, I'm not gonna tell you what the chart means, and things like that. But yeah, something really weird is happening there. 

In tandem, people argue that Renarin isn't voidbinding, but between the "what is up with Renarin" and pointing to the storming voidbinding chart, and the answer to the first of the two questions in this WoB, I think trying to say that he isn't doing so is... Willfully ignoring the evidence. 

[Honorless]

33 minutes ago, Calderis said:

In tandem, people argue that Renarin isn't voidbinding, but between the "what is up with Renarin" and pointing to the storming voidbinding chart, and the answer to the first of the two questions in this WoB, I think trying to say that he isn't doing so is... Willfully ignoring the evidence.

And how many times has Brandon simply replied "yes" to a long question basing itself on multiple postulations in an attempt to confirm certain theories which were RAFO'd before? 

The second part of that WoB actually says "something weird is happening there" and that what's happening isn't exactly Voidbinding.

Edited November 13, 2019 by Honorless

[Calderis]

10 minutes ago, Honorless said:

And how many times has Brandon simply replied "yes" to a long question basing itself on multiple postulations in an attempt to confirm certain theories which were RAFO'd before? 

What? I'd like some examples, because to my knowledge, that's in no way a common thing. He RAFO's or he doesn't. He doesn't just shrug off and ignore questions and end with implicit confirmations precisely because of stuff like this.

Yes he has RAFO'd the question on Renarin since. And in his own words, sometimes RAFO is because he doesn't want to kill discussion. In this case, we're having that discussion, and it only exists because the waters have been muddied. 

Which is a problem that he has intentionally created before. Look no further tha. "The Man who calls himself Taln." he created an issue via WoB that never existed in the story, and actually made the blade swap in the books make no sense. 

But people talked about it. A lot. 

Edited November 13, 2019 by Calderis

[Aon Tia]

But Calderis, it is not as clear as you are making it. 
When asked directly if Renarin was voidbinding, Brandon said no but close.. something weird is happening.. that suggests to me that it is not so clear.. 

[Calderis]

3 minutes ago, The traveller said:

But Calderis, it is not as clear as you are making it. 
When asked directly if Renarin was voidbinding, Brandon said no but close.. something weird is happening.. that suggests to me that it is not so clear.. 

I really don't think that I am. 

Because he did not say no to an explicit "is Renarin voidbinding" question. That's been consistently RAFO'd since that question. He said yes to Argent's first question. Which means that Renarin is doing something other than Surgebinding. 

So that would mean that when asked what's up with Renarin, Brandon directed Argent to a chart that's representative of a magic system that he isn't using, later confirmed that he is doing something other than Surgebinding... 

So if he's neither Surgebinding nor Voidbinding, then what? 

[Aon Tia]

May be he is doing something new entirely.. that has been said too in the books.. we are something new.. it may be some weird mix of the two systems.. 

There has to be a reason why odium can not see him.. He can see all other normal surgebinders, he would obviously see all voidbinders but if Renarin is something new entirely....