King of Herdaz

Is Odium actually a good guy?...

15 posts in this topic

Posted (edited)

I'm not sure that this is confirmed, but I'm pretty sure that I heard on Shardcast that Adonalsium was Shattered because the Vessels and Hoid were afraid of/trying to prevent some danger or disaster from happening. So, crackpot theory: Is Odium actually a hero on a mission to ensure that the above mentioned disaster never comes to pass. And therefore he has committed himself to a goal of killing as many shards as he can in order to ensure that Adonalsium is never reconstructed. 

Edited by Etherealness
to make sure people realize that i'm not being entirely serious.
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I don’t know if that will be the case, but I believe many people assume Adonalsium is a kind God and Brandon hasn’t confirmed that. Here’s a WoB about it:

Eric

In Secret Historywe learn the 16 Shards that Shattered Adonalsium. Was that done [on behalf of the anti-Adonalsium force]?

Brandon Sanderson

You’re focusing too much on this idea of an anti-Adonalsium. It—the original question I believe that was asked me was “is there a force that is opposed to Adonalsium” and it left me a lot of wiggle room. In other words, the people who killed Adonalsium, you could say were a force, any person who opposed Adonalsium... What they were trying to get was a “devil” but to do that you must assume Adonalsium was a more Christian-style God, and I haven’t confirmed any of that.

Calamity Chicago signing (Feb. 22, 2016)
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According to the coppermind article for Odium, "Odium's ultimate goal is indeed terrible: he seeks to be the most powerful being in the cosmere. To this end, he kills other Vessels (namely AonaSkai[6]Uli Da[9], and Tanavast[10])." To me, this runs completely counter to your theory. Unfortunately, none of the WoBs that were linked explicitly state thus, but I believe its strongly implied by all the WoBs regarding Odium as well as the canonical text. So maybe there's a small chance your crackpot theory is correct, but if it is, a LOT of people who have been deep into the cosmere for a long time are totally wrong.

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His name is Odium.

Nuff said

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Posted (edited)

Odium explicitly wants to become the most powerful being in the Cosmere by killing all the other Shards. Brandon has said that he's using the promise the Vessels made to one another as an excuse to justify why he's gone after paired Shards but we know that his first target was Ambition, because he saw her as a potential rival. In other words, selfish motivations cloaked in excuses.

Quote

Odium just wants to be top dog. And your two ways to be top dog are to climb higher, or to lower everyone else. And he's like, we're gonna lower everyone else. Because I know, if I combine, it stops being me, is what his opinion is. I would no longer be the person I am. I would change into someone else. And then that person gets to rule, and I don't want that person to rule. I want to.

JordanCon 2018 (April 20, 2018)

Quote

Paladin Brewer

Out of all the Shards, why does Odium go for Devotion and Dominion?

Brandon Sanderson

He targets people with two kinds of ideas. Number one, he can argue they're breaking the rules they set out. And two, people he thinks are a good match for him, or a challenge, or a danger.

Oathbringer Houston signing (Nov. 18, 2017)
Quote

Brandon Sanderson

He went after Ambition first, but didn't find Ambition until after going after Devotion and Dominion. But Ambition was number one on his hit list.

Argent

Was it because of the Shard or because of the Vessel? Like did he hate the person?

Brandon Sanderson

In this case it was the Shard, primarily, that drove him--

Argent

Oh, he was maybe afraid the Shard would grow too powerful and take over--

Brandon Sanderson

He was afraid that this Shard that would rival him. And so he's like "This one is number one on the hit list. We're taking down Ambition."

Arcanum Unbounded Chicago signing (Dec. 6, 2016)

So yeah, I don't see Odium as secretly being the 'good guy' of this story. Rayse not being the biggest threat to the Cosmere on the other hand I'm basically expecting, but him turning out to be good all along, not so much.

Edited by Weltall
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Odium the Shard isn't really a good or bad guy (or even really a being at all).  The current Vessel, Rayse, was described by Hoid as "among the most loathsome, crafty, and dangerous individuals I had ever met."  

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That being said.  I have difficulty believing that Odium the shard could be held by anyone for long without bad things happening.

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It's possible to have hatred turned to positive things. Like hatred of injustice and such. It would require a strong will, of course, because extremism generally isn't very good.

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1 minute ago, RShara said:

It's possible to have hatred turned to positive things. Like hatred of injustice and such. It would require a strong will, of course, because extremism generally isn't very good.

Sure it is possible to use hatred effectively and for a good cause but without anything else you will eventually turn into the Darth Maul of shards.

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I saw this thread, and remembered this post in Sanderson memes: 

Aside from that, I think it’s safe to say that Odium isn’t a “good guy.” 

However, because he hasn’t just ended most of the life on Roshar, like happened with Ashyn, he might still have some good in him. 

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Posted (edited)

Odium being a kind god? Sounds like something Odium would try to convince you with, hmmmmmm <_<

Edited by Wander89
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We all thought the Lord Ruler was bad, too ;)

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30 minutes ago, Ripheus23 said:

We all thought the Lord Ruler was bad, too ;)

I still believe that, after a time, The Lord Ruler was inherently bad. His intentions at the start were revealed to not be as simple as good/evil but he then starts publicly executing folks and that's a big no no from me.

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I don't think Odium is a good guy, but I'm still holding out hope for him having a better motivation than sheer desire to be the top dog in the Cosmere. I think it'd be more interesting if he actually was sort of right about how harmful it is to break the terms of the promise they made to one another, and that they actually did have a good reason to get rid of Adonalsium.

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Posted (edited)

I think it's a lot to ask for a Shard to have a good reason for their actions. Every Shard is one single sentiment stretched into infinity. Preservation wanted to preserve humans because of that, Ruin wanted to destroy them, Endowment gives Breath for the same reason and Odium just loves to make people hate each other. He might have had good reasons for picking up the Shard way back, but as he is now - after 10,000 years of holding "God's own divine hatred" - I don't think we can expect him to act according to complex intentions anymore. That's not the way Shards work.

Edited by Elegy
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