Effects of combining magics from different worlds

[Nnatel]

Knowing that having an Allomantic and a Feruchemical power results in Resonance - does having powers from different worlds gives you the same 'upgrade'? Like a combination of Allomancy and Awakening? (Well, it mostly is talking about Hoid as I believe we haven't seen another person 'collecting' magics... )

[RShara]

I don't know if BioChroma will give you a Resonance, since it doesn't seem to interact with your spiritweb as much (it can't really be spiked out, for instance). But having one Scadrian ability and one...say, Rosharan surge, should work. But having too many powers together makes it so there's too much interference to get a Resonance. So Hoid wouldn't get one, since he has so many.

[Weltall]

Just being a mistborn already counts as having way too many powers to develop a Resonance and Hoid's become one so even if he had an exceptionally limited number of magics before that point and did have a Resonance, he wouldn't after using the lerasium. But yes, a Resonance effect between magic systems from different worlds should be possible as long as you don't have too many of them.

[John Flamesinger]

One of my first questions on this forum was "How Powerful is Hoid?" If I remember, most Sharders agreed that Hoid has not ingested the Lerasium he got from the well. It is theorized that he is saving the metal until he can alloy it with a godmetal and perhaps gain powers other than the metallic arts. Let me see if I can find the original question...

Edit: I found it. Click on this link.

Edited June 8, 2019 by John Flamesinger
Added Link. No, not the character. I've never played Zelda.

[Nnatel]

Hoid is probably sooo overpowered that he wasn't the main subject of my question. But as we are at him, (thanks for the link!) I am almost sure that at some point we see him putting something into his drink - and I believe it was a proof of him having Allomancy - although I like the idea of him keeping the piece of Lerasium for later. If I remember correctly, he also tried to gain Feruchemy (it was somewhere in the first Mistborn trilogy). 

 

But also thanks for all answers. I actually had no idea that being a Mistborn counts as too much power. I wonder if it is connected to the amount of Investiture (well, I don't see another explanation, to be honest). If yes, than being a Returned would also result in not having even a possibility to have a Resonance, am I correct? 

[RShara]

2 hours ago, John Flamesinger said:

One of my first questions on this forum was "How Powerful is Hoid?" If I remember, most Sharders agreed that Hoid has not ingested the Lerasium he got from the well. It is theorized that he is saving the metal until he can alloy it with a godmetal and perhaps gain powers other than the metallic arts. Let me see if I can find the original question...

Edit: I found it. Click on this link.

That was what a lot of people thought at the time, because Brandon wouldn't confirm that Hoid burned the lerasium. But he recently (in the last month or so) confirmed that Hoid did burn the lerasium, so that's laid to rest now.

Quote

Questioner

We know that Hoid took a bead of lerasium, but it never specifically says that he consumed it.

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, he did.

Questioner

Alright, so he is a Mistborn?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, I'll go ahead and canonize that.

Idaho Falls signing (Dec. 29, 2018)

 

[John Flamesinger]

I try to answer questions about the Cosmere, but it appears all of my information is outdated.

On 6/4/2019 at 4:53 PM, Nnatel said:

we haven't seen another person 'collecting' magics... )

This isn't canon, but one of my theories is that Khriss is collecting magics. 

Spoiler

At the end of White Sand 2, she asked to become a Sand Master.

That put aside, she's at least trying to collect information on magics, even if she doesn't want the Investiture herself.

[+Invocation]

21 minutes ago, John Flamesinger said:

I try to answer questions about the Cosmere, but it appears all of my information is outdated.

No biggie, it happens to all of us!

21 minutes ago, John Flamesinger said:

That put aside, she's at least trying to collect information on magics, even if she doesn't want the Investiture herself.

She is, technically, the most knowledgeable person in the cosmere about the various magics (ahead of even Hoid) and knows all 16 Intents.

Quote

ChocolateRob

There’s a character again that you've talked about in other signings-- That character has more information than Hoid about the cosmere. How does she have more information than Hoid?

Brandon Sanderson

Well, she is a very detail oriented person and takes the time to research very deeply into things. Where Hoid will often research enough as he needs to know to sound really smart and get what he wants. It is a matter of depth, if that makes sense.

ChocolateRob

Have we seen her?

Brandon Sanderson

Uhh, I don't know if you've seen her or not. I'm sure I slipped her in somewhere but I'm not sure... I think I may have, but I can't guarantee it.

Footnote: The character in question is Khriss, who at this point had not yet appeared in a published work.
Manchester signing (Aug. 6, 2014)

Quote

Questioner

Does Khriss know the intents of the sixteen Shards at the time of the essays?

Brandon Sanderson

At the time of the essays, Khriss would-- Yes, Khriss would know all sixteen intents.

Skyward Seattle signing (Nov. 10, 2018)

Quote

Questioner (paraphrased)

Is Hoid the most knowledgeable about what's going on in the cosmere?

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

No, Khriss is the most aware by a long shot. Nazh knows a lot as well. Hoid might know more than Nazh but he is pretty in the know as well so it's close.

Words of Radiance Houston signing (March 11, 2014)

 

Edited June 9, 2019 by Invocation

[Weltall]

On 6/4/2019 at 4:53 PM, Nnatel said:

Knowing that having an Allomantic and a Feruchemical power results in Resonance - does having powers from different worlds gives you the same 'upgrade'? Like a combination of Allomancy and Awakening? (Well, it mostly is talking about Hoid as I believe we haven't seen another person 'collecting' magics... )

Somehow I missed this earlier. We know that there is at least one other person running around the Cosmere collecting magics like Hoid is, but we don't know who or why. It's possible Brandon had Mraize in mind since we've seen that his trophy collection includes several things that we know or strongly suspect are linked to magic systems (ie, we know he has Invested sand from Taldain and we assume the 'hairpins' are hemalurgic spikes) but we also know he can't actually use some if not all of those magics, so he may not count as the collector Brandon talked about.

22 hours ago, Nnatel said:

But also thanks for all answers. I actually had no idea that being a Mistborn counts as too much power. I wonder if it is connected to the amount of Investiture (well, I don't see another explanation, to be honest). If yes, than being a Returned would also result in not having even a possibility to have a Resonance, am I correct? 

It seems to be related to how the powers interact with the Spiritweb. Each power is like a wave and when you only have a small number of powers the different waves create constructive interference (or something similar anyways) which is the Resonance. Too many powers and those small effects get drowned out. It seems to be more how many different 'waves' you've got going on in your Spiritweb rather than how powerful any given magic is, since we know a ferring or misting using the Bands of Mourning could develop a Resonance if they only used one power granted by the latter (between it and their original ability) even though the Bands are ridiculously Invested.

39 minutes ago, John Flamesinger said:

This isn't canon, but one of my theories is that Khriss is collecting magics. 

That put aside, she's at least trying to collect information on magics, even if she doesn't want the Investiture herself.

I don't think she's collecting them for herself. If she were trying to get magic directly, I imagine she'd go gaga over the Southerners and their medallions because those would let her experiment directly with the various combinations of Metallic Arts powers on her own, but instead she has to go pester Wax about the interaction of A-Steel and F-Iron. We also know that the Seventeenth Shard is totally okay with what Khriss is doing but they really don't like what Hoid's up to. One of the things the Seventeenth Shard believes is that the sixteen Shards were separated for a reason, they should stay separated and people shouldn't dabble in bringing them back together in any way. I think that if Khriss were actually collecting magics, the Seventeenth would put her in the same category as Hoid.

Edited June 9, 2019 by Weltall

[RShara]

Also, pretty sure Mraize is trying to collect all the magics, too. And has even succeeded in a few things that Hoid failed at.

[aneonfoxtribute]

On 6/5/2019 at 11:08 AM, Weltall said:

Just being a mistborn already counts as having way too many powers to develop a Resonance and Hoid's become one so even if he had an exceptionally limited number of magics before that point and did have a Resonance, he wouldn't after using the lerasium. But yes, a Resonance effect between magic systems from different worlds should be possible as long as you don't have too many of them.

What about Rashek? Wasn't he nigh-on immortal due to compounding Gold? Or is Resonance different from Compounding?

[Weltall]

1 hour ago, aneonfoxtribute said:

What about Rashek? Wasn't he nigh-on immortal due to compounding Gold? Or is Resonance different from Compounding?

They're entirely different. Compounding is making use of a particular loophole in two magic systems that allows you to cheat the rules of one of those systems. A Resonance is a specific effect resutling from you having two different magic systems. The specific Resonance that results from your combination doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the powers themselves and you don't necessarily have to be regularly using the magics to get the effects of a Resonance. For an example of the former, Windrunners get as their Resonance more Squires than other Radiants and theirs are more powerful, which doesn't have anything directly to do with their abilities to controll gravity or atmospheric pressure. For an example of the latter, Shallan's ability to take a Memory is the Lightweaver Resonance and she's able to do it throughout Way of Kings before she's consciously Surgebinding.

[aneonfoxtribute]

2 minutes ago, Weltall said:

They're entirely different. Compounding is making use of a particular loophole in two magic systems that allows you to cheat the rules of one of those systems. A Resonance is a specific effect resutling from you having two different magic systems. The specific Resonance that results from your combination doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the powers themselves and you don't necessarily have to be regularly using the magics to get the effects of a Resonance. For an example of the former, Windrunners get as their Resonance more Squires than other Radiants and theirs are more powerful, which doesn't have anything directly to do with their abilities to controll gravity or atmospheric pressure. For an example of the latter, Shallan's ability to take a Memory is the Lightweaver Resonance and she's able to do it throughout Way of Kings before she's consciously Surgebinding.

I see. Thank you, I didn't know that.

[Weltall]

1 minute ago, aneonfoxtribute said:

I see. Thank you, I didn't know that.

You're welcome. Just in case you haven't seen where Brandon has explained it, the way that Compounding works is that when you allomantically burn a metalmind that you've created, you get Preservation's Investiture flowing from the Spiritual Realm just like in allomancy normally, but the fact that the metal contains a feruchemical power tricks the Investiture into powering the feruchemical effect rather than the allomantic one like it normally would. This means you suddenly get a burst of 'free' power in excess of the amount you originally stored in the metal. Here's one example of Brandon explaining it.

[Wander89]

I imagine collecting all the magic systems as being akin to the Infinity Gauntlet!