Wander89

Game of Thrones (Spoilers for the latest episodes)

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With the new season started what's everyones' thoughts on episode 1 endgame? Are there any parts you wish to see and those that you are sad they skipped over?

 

Game of Thrones success gives me such a good outlook on upcoming shows such as Wheel of Time and Lord of the Rings that hopefully in the future we get something Sanderson related.

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I guess it's kinda nice that the characters are almost caught up to what the audience knows. 

Also, if I wanted to watch Neverending Story...

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I thought it was pretty good. Some parts seemed a little rushed. I guess that is to be expected since they have to close up all the plot lines in just 6 episodes. I thought the reveal to Sam about his father and brother should have been in this episode but save Sam's revel to Jon for the next episode. It seemed a little awkward him grieving then talking to Jon.  There was already a cliffhanger moment with Jamie and Bran. 

It is still amazing to me that the show has been on since 2011 and GRRM is still two books behind. 

 

 

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I agree, It's was a good introduction to the final season. It was expected to be rushed but I think that the lack of books in these two last seasons is obviously affecting to the quality of dialogue and plots in general.

Anyway, I enjoyed especially the dragon ride and the eye contact between Bran and Jaime.

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I get that they had to do an episode where the characters all came together and meshed. I understand that they are fast-tracking a lot, like the travelling and such but I hope that the scenes/story picks up more with the remaining episodes and we get some answers. I don't want more questions at this point, I want some solid proof that this is not going to do a LOST on me and leave me hanging!

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Posted (edited)

Well, they're taking their time to prepare the develovent of the end of the threat.

I'd have thought this chapter was a bit boring and quite slow, but the scenes between Brienne And Jaime :wub: worth the waste of time. Those moments were pure gold!!!:wub:

From my point of view the readers of SOIF aren't going to find all the answers of the plots until George finally writes Winds. The serie is going to develop the main plots and leave some holes, unfortunately It's imposible to wrap it all on 6 episodes. 

Edited by Chiri-Chiri
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I haven't watched. I want to tho

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Better than the first episode, but also setting up for next week's episode which has been highly anticipated. 

Hopefully, fan favorites like Tormund and Lyanna will perish in the next episode so they don't have to be shoehorned into episodes to appease the fans. 

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10 hours ago, TheOrlionThatComesBefore said:

Hopefully, fan favorites like Tormund and Lyanna will perish in the next episode so they don't have to be shoehorned into episodes to appease the fans. 

Tormund isn’t really shoehorned though. He is the leader and face of the Wildlings, and one of Jons lieutenants. He is a pretty valuable character.

Also, Theon is so dead. 

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Posted (edited)

Not only secondary characters, some of the main characters are going to die in the next episode, for example Bienne and Jaime were saying goodbye to each other :( and in a way to the fans too, mayhaps same with Theon and Sansa, Jorah and Dany, Arya (I'm not sure about her) .....

For practical reasons, I think that Tormund has more chances of staying alive than others "more important", because the death of a main character close a plot and therefore less minutes on the screen. Tormund can give a spark of humor when is needed to raise the spirits or simply to fill space. (And yes, I like him :P )

Edited by Chiri-Chiri
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The laws of lazy writing decree you kill the comic relief character because it is more impactful on the audience. Tormund is sooo dead.

Lyanna is dead because the same lazy laws decree that as a minor, fan favorite she is disposable and will "up the stakes".

Brienne is sooo dead. I don't know about Jaime.

Theon is definitely dead. 

Really, it might be easier to say who will live: Jon, Daenerys, Tyrion and, I'll say it, Bran.

Sansa is hard to say, but I think she will survive. 

Arya? I don't know. We might get a situation where we won't know if someone died or not until the end of the season when they show up again as wrights.

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I liked the second episode a lot more than the first. So many deaths are coming.

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So, the new episode...

Spoiler

First off, the deaths were great. Theon, Lyanna, Beric and Jorah all got pretty good endings (that flaming sword throw by Beric!) but they should not have had Arya kill the Nights King. That was not her story. It was Jons story. Sams story. Brans story. Storms, it belonged more to Edd and Beric than it did to Arya. And the Nights King didn’t get any reveals, any explanations, any complexity. He just died. The final five minutes was a huge failure for me.

 

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1 hour ago, Toaster Retribution said:

So, the new episode...

  Hide contents

First off, the deaths were great. Theon, Lyanna, Beric and Jorah all got pretty good endings (that flaming sword throw by Beric!) but they should not have had Arya kill the Nights King. That was not her story. It was Jons story. Sams story. Brans story. Storms, it belonged more to Edd and Beric than it did to Arya. And the Nights King didn’t get any reveals, any explanations, any complexity. He just died. The final five minutes was a huge failure for me.

 

I partialy agree with you, for me was a great failure from the begining. 

Spoiler

 

And of course, Ayra  shoudn't have done What It was meant to be done by Azor Ahai.

I still can't believe how easy  was the downfall of the others. 

 

 

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Spoiler

Very disappointing. The entire fight was messy, filled with mistakes that even I as an armchair general could spot and I don't have decades of experience in waging wars. (Seriously why the heck did they send the Dothraki riders out to charge by themselves? The obvious outcome should have been that they all die and then get immediately raised and sent right back at the defenders)
It was just a huge mess, no focus on people's stories in the fight, just a huge setpiece of a battle to show off a bunch of blood and gore. There was no explanation as to why anyone was doing what they were doing, no planning, no strategy. Just a bunch of random last minute saves by people popping in and out of existence to wherever was most convenient for them to be.

This was a huge mess for me, and all the more disappointing because it's happened so early in the season which means now the plot is going to shift to trying to fight Cersei which is going to be so monumentally boring for me. I feel like they did it because they wanted to get back to the shows roots and do some political intrigue but there's nothing left for them to do there, sides have been clearly drawn, no one could conceivably betray anyone else at this point without some serious handwavium going on. And more importantly if the Northerners had any sense at all they'd just send Arya to assassinate Cersei so the whole thing can end peacefully.

I'm in high-tension rant mode still. This episode frustrated me to no end.

 

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Well, that was disappointing. The parts I could see, anyway :rolleyes:

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So on the whole I thought that this episode was well acted, I was pleased with everyone’s performance especially all the deaths (I love you Theon :(). Some of the plotting choices were a little odd to me though. Like why on this good earth did they send in the Dothraki first?!? WHY?! Also, why send the army of the dead at all? The Night King could have swooped down and rained cold fire on Winterfell, cheerfully freezing everyone including Bran. Hooray the war is over. :P 

As much as I love Arya why on earth is she fulfilling the Azor Ahai prophecy? I mean well done girl you’re a crazy awesome fighter but...why? Also we never get enough info on this whole line of story imo. The Night King is so boring. Well I suppose I can go back to happily despising Cersei uninterrupted for the next 3 episodes. I am shocked that so few people died, I was expecting a serious threshing floor type experience. Not complaining though on that front.

 

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I agree on the startling lack of deaths, they were clearly getting completely overwhelmed so why did only like 5% of people die? I mean I love Sam as much as anybody but let's be real, there is no way he is still alive at the end of that fight.

 

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Did Sam end up fighting with Jamie at the end there? Honestly everyone was so covered in blood and it was shot so dark I couldn’t quite tell :P But yeah he absolutely should have been dead.

Also Lyanna Mormont as a wight will give me nightmares. Girl was already a force of nature alive. Glad she wasn’t in the army of the dead for long otherwise the world may have truly ended. 

 

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Yeah the lighting and the storm were also serious pains, made it impossible to see what was happening.

 

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I don't know what I think is worse, the part where it was one episode and their plan succeeded, or the way the whole battle was utter crap.

It was way to easy. 7 seasons of fighting then one episode like that? I have to admit, I kind of hope Arya picks up the stupid mask and becomes the next Nightking. (I know that's crap, but honestly, what is left? Fighting the army in the south? How can that be worse than the undead?)

Best part for me was the giant and crypt coming alive (no surprise here).

I don't know, maybe in a few days I'll see things differently, but right now I'm disappointed.

 

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Posted (edited)

Spoiler

 

Man the entire battle part was so dark I felt like i was just watching a bunch of blurry people. I was expecting several major characters to die so the entire time I am trying to pay attention to who died. Dolorous who I wouldn't really call a major character was the only one I can remember outside the walls that died in the initial battle. Speaking of that why didn't they all just stay inside Winterfell? Then the fog rolls in and it is even worst. Really disappointed in how that was filmed kinda ruined the first part of the battle for me. I mean I hate to armchair quarter back this but I would think that Jon and Danny would have softened  up the line before sending in the Dothraki. The basically just became fodder for the dead. 

It did get a little better for me once the battle moved to inside the walls. I liked Lyanna's defeat of the giant and Beric with the flaming sword throw. R.I.P. both of ya. The dragon scenes above the clouds were pretty cool even if I couldn't make it all out. It seemed weird Arya was so scarred of what started out is just a few wights when she is so frosty the rest of the time. I thought Theon going beast mode was cool and a fitting end to his redemption arc. Thought Jorah's death protecting Danny was touching. I am not sure what I think about Arya killing the Night King... I did not hate it but I did hate seeing Jon paralyzed in fear. I guess there had to be a way to defeat the Night King (especially since he has an endless supply of soldiers duh John Snow) but just seemed like years of build up over very quickly. Why didn't the Night King just ice javelin Bran? Nope had the slow walk then Arya jumps him like a flying squirrel. 

Oh well it is what it is. There were a few good parts but overall kind of anticlimactic. 

 

 

Edited by StormingTexan
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The slow walk slow sword draw thing really annoyed me at first too but then I realized its kind of his whole character, goes with the whole lethargy, death and winter theme of the night king. Everything he does is slow. He does the same thing with Jon outside the walls.

 

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Me and my friends discussed the last episode a lot the last days and we realized something regarding the tactis.

Actually it did make sense to put the Dothraki where they were.

Why? Because they aren't used to act as part of an army. They act as a horde, not as an army. Usually you'd expect your light cavalry at the sides, but if your light cavalry is a wild horde (no disrespect here), that is used to live on a plain and on back of a horse, then you have two possibilities.

Either you place them as tactics teach you, or you let them act as a separate unit, and that means place them in front of the army. Sacrifice them, to ensure the rest of your army can act as a army, and doesn't get distracted/ endangered by a unit that acts independently.

I don't know if that's the thoughts behind the scene, or if it was meant to show how strong the undead are or whatever. But an army is only strong as long as you have discipline and can trust everybody to maintain that as long as possible. If you look at it that way, the Dothraki were the wrong people to include in the structure.

 

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2 hours ago, Sorana said:
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Me and my friends discussed the last episode a lot the last days and we realized something regarding the tactis.

Actually it did make sense to put the Dothraki where they were.

Why? Because they aren't used to act as part of an army. They act as a horde, not as an army. Usually you'd expect your light cavalry at the sides, but if your light cavalry is a wild horde (no disrespect here), that is used to live on a plain and on back of a horse, then you have two possibilities.

Either you place them as tactics teach you, or you let them act as a separate unit, and that means place them in front of the army. Sacrifice them, to ensure the rest of your army can act as a army, and doesn't get distracted/ endangered by a unit that acts independently.

I don't know if that's the thoughts behind the scene, or if it was meant to show how strong the undead are or whatever. But an army is only strong as long as you have discipline and can trust everybody to maintain that as long as possible. If you look at it that way, the Dothraki were the wrong people to include in the structure.

 

Man all these spoiler tags are annoying but..

Spoiler

That makes sense but the glaring issue with the strategy is all the your dead comrades become your enemy as soon as Mr Night King does his awakening thing. You would be better off not having them fight at all really or using a lot of artillery (and dragons!) to soften up their lines first instead of charging head first. I get that Jon didn't want to use the dragons until Night King showed up but that decision basically meant the Dothraki were cannon fodder that then turn into combatants. 

 

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