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Just now, shanerockes said:

Well neither am I but you think so and I've said all that had happened so you do with it what you want. You've made a mistake voting for me. 

We'll see. If I'm wrong, then we lynch someone else. That's just how the game goes.

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13 hours ago, Roadwalker said:

Given that the endgame for the Elims is outnumbering the village (which I assume does not include the deepness. @Young Bard?)

This is true.

Also, people are speculating about Snip getting saved by a Doctor - that was just a screw-up on my part. Nothing of particular note (at least, that would be included in the write-up) happened to Snip last night. The writeup was meant for Shqueeves, who is very much dead. This is now being corrected.

EDIT: For the inevitable follow-up question - if a Doctor did save someone, there'd be a writeup, and a mention below the writeup - E.g. Joe was attacked, but survived!

Edited by Young Bard
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2 hours ago, Young Bard said:

This is true.

Also, people are speculating about Snip getting saved by a Doctor - that was just a screw-up on my part. Nothing of particular note (at least, that would be included in the write-up) happened to Snip last night. The writeup was meant for Shqueeves, who is very much dead. This is now being corrected.

EDIT: For the inevitable follow-up question - if a Doctor did save someone, there'd be a writeup, and a mention below the writeup - E.g. Joe was attacked, but survived!

Thanks for clearing that up. Apparently two separate sources claimed to Fifth I targeted Snip, when I didn’t. Or Fifth is lying. Anyone want to weigh in on that?

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2 hours ago, I think I am here. said:

Thanks for clearing that up. Apparently two separate sources claimed to Fifth I targeted Snip, when I didn’t. Or Fifth is lying. Anyone want to weigh in on that?

Or Fifth was phishing based on being given false information by a PM contact! I was informed by somebody (who I’m not outing yet, as I’d like to give them a chance to explain their actions) that Snip was attacked by the Deepness and protected, and I was hunting for the doctor in an effort to clear more villagers. As the attack on Snipexe clearly hasn’t happened, I’ll make a post later with my updated thoughts on the situation after somebody gets a highly accusatory PM. 

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10 hours ago, Ark1002 said:

Okay, that's just... sure, I'll take it. I'm not an elim, I've done nothing to help an elim, my votes have all been for elims. So, sure, blame me. You'll be wrong.

This seems like an overreaction to me on a vote shanerockes has explained, but I think it fits with how Ark plays anyway. I mean, why would you have to clarify that you’re not an elim, haven’t helped elims etc. when no one is accusing you of that? Shanerockes said his only reason was because you voted on him.

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20 minutes ago, Snipexe said:

So I don’t really support the Shane lynch. Why would an elim claim that 2 elims had contacted them. To me at least, that feels less like elim behavior, and more like 2 elims attempting a pocket by controlling the information Shane has and coordinating.

I’ve been considering this point myself. Shanerockes seems like far too easy of a lynch; if he was actually an elim, then I doubt he’d immediately claim CadCom as his source of information; it’d be more logical to affiliate himself with a dead villager. Conversely, I’ve been overcoming my scepticism of the Walin lynch. Points against him: 

1) Inactivity C2 directly coincides with the lack of Eliminator kill. As Elandera was unable to kill successfully because of the way Order of Actions works (to my understanding, lynch before elim kill), responsibility would have fallen to the other Elim to attempt a kill. Walin was completely inactive at the time, the only player in such a condition, and fits perfectly with the fact that no kill was attempted last cycle. 

2) Distancing with Elandera. Last cycle, hours before she was about to die, Elandera poked Walin for inactivity, not even really trying to defend herself. In my view, this served two purposes: to distance from him, and to ping him in the hopes that he would become active enough to submit a kill. 

3) Interactions this cycle. He seems to mostly be following my lead with the vote and sticking to the shadows, is trying to stay away from the lynch, and isn’t offering candidates of his own. These are all indicators of Elim-like voting behaviour. 

I realise it’s later in the cycle but I’d like input, especially from @shanerockes and @Ark1002, my other two suspects currently. 

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Just now, Fifth Scholar said:

I’ve been considering this point myself. Shanerockes seems like far too easy of a lynch; if he was actually an elim, then I doubt he’d immediately claim CadCom as his source of information; it’d be more logical to affiliate himself with a dead villager. Conversely, I’ve been overcoming my scepticism of the Walin lynch. Points against him: 

1) Inactivity C2 directly coincides with the lack of Eliminator kill. As Elandera was unable to kill successfully because of the way Order of Actions works (to my understanding, lynch before elim kill), responsibility would have fallen to the other Elim to attempt a kill. Walin was completely inactive at the time, the only player in such a condition, and fits perfectly with the fact that no kill was attempted last cycle. 

2) Distancing with Elandera. Last cycle, hours before she was about to die, Elandera poked Walin for inactivity, not even really trying to defend herself. In my view, this served two purposes: to distance from him, and to ping him in the hopes that he would become active enough to submit a kill. 

3) Interactions this cycle. He seems to mostly be following my lead with the vote and sticking to the shadows, is trying to stay away from the lynch, and isn’t offering candidates of his own. These are all indicators of Elim-like voting behaviour. 

I realise it’s later in the cycle but I’d like input, especially from @shanerockes and @Ark1002, my other two suspects currently. 

Why are you suspicious of me, particularly?

13 hours ago, I think I am here. said:

This seems like an overreaction to me on a vote shanerockes has explained, but I think it fits with how Ark plays anyway. I mean, why would you have to clarify that you’re not an elim, haven’t helped elims etc. when no one is accusing you of that? Shanerockes said his only reason was because you voted on him.

Overreaction is my middle name:P

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1 minute ago, Ark1002 said:

Why are you suspicious of me, particularly?

That’s an excellent question, actually. Mostly because your positioning on last cycle’s lynch was less...ideal...than that of Snip or Road? Also simply because I’ve been striking people off my suspect list who I trust for various reasons (roleclaims, votes, etc.), and you’re one of the few I can’t quite cross off yet? You’re definitely less high on the list than Walin or even Shane, though. 

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1 minute ago, Fifth Scholar said:

That’s an excellent question, actually. Mostly because your positioning on last cycle’s lynch was less...ideal...than that of Snip or Road? Also simply because I’ve been striking people off my suspect list who I trust for various reasons (roleclaims, votes, etc.), and you’re one of the few I can’t quite cross off yet? You’re definitely less high on the list than Walin or even Shane, though. 

Huh. Okay then.

This is the first SE game since the anonymous one that I've kept up! I'm proud of myself! I even evaluated someone!

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3 minutes ago, Fifth Scholar said:

1) Inactivity C2 directly coincides with the lack of Eliminator kill. As Elandera was unable to kill successfully because of the way Order of Actions works (to my understanding, lynch before elim kill), responsibility would have fallen to the other Elim to attempt a kill. Walin was completely inactive at the time, the only player in such a condition, and fits perfectly with the fact that no kill was attempted last cycle. 

2) Distancing with Elandera. Last cycle, hours before she was about to die, Elandera poked Walin for inactivity, not even really trying to defend herself. In my view, this served two purposes: to distance from him, and to ping him in the hopes that he would become active enough to submit a kill. 

3) Interactions this cycle. He seems to mostly be following my lead with the vote and sticking to the shadows, is trying to stay away from the lynch, and isn’t offering candidates of his own. These are all indicators of Elim-like voting behaviour. 

 

These points seem well justified. The Elandera pokevote on Walin also caught my eye, and it would make a lot of sense for her to be distancing as much as possible so that he could stay undercover. Plus, inactive elim Walin is a strategy I have seen him use before, and I’d rather not be caught out by it again.

Walin @Walin

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23 hours ago, shanerockes said:

They didn't claim a specific role, just that Droughtbringer was a tin feruchemist and obviously was wrong about it.

Did you PM Droughtbringer in an attempt to find out for yourself whether he was a tin Dark Terris Magicker?

8 minutes ago, Fifth Scholar said:

As Elandera was unable to kill successfully because of the way Order of Actions works (to my understanding, lynch before elim kill), responsibility would have fallen to the other Elim to attempt a kill.

21 hours ago, Young Bard said:

Kills (excepting the lynch) come last.

This isn't actually when Bard clarified this, but lynches do come after kills, so Elandera should still have been able to submit a kill. I'm not sure whether kills nullify someone's vote.

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4 minutes ago, Ark1002 said:

Huh. Okay then.

This is the first SE game since the anonymous one that I've kept up! I'm proud of myself! I even evaluated someone!

You did, yes. :P To be perfectly clear, there’s nothing wrong about your case against Shane, and he is my second-highest suspect for being an Eliminator. It just seems a little too perfect/implausible that he’d be in contact with only the other Elims if he was actually an Eliminator himself, as I feel he’d cover better than that. If I’m wrong and he actually is evil, I’ll give you  a shiny unsealed brass metalmind once this game is over. :P 

1 minute ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

This isn't actually when Bard clarified this, but lynches do come after kills, so Elandera should still have been able to submit a kill. I'm not sure whether kills nullify someone's vote.

I read Bard’s clarification as “kills, with the exception of the lynch which comes earlier, come last.”

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Just now, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

This isn't actually when Bard clarified this, but lynches do come after kills, so Elandera should still have been able to submit a kill. I'm not sure whether kills nullify someone's vote.

Doesn’t the quote you say mean the lynch comes before. Kills come last, except for the lynch. That implies that the lynch comes at an earlier time right? Or am I misunderstanding it.

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1 minute ago, Fifth Scholar said:

I read Bard’s clarification as “kills, with the exception of the lynch which comes earlier, come last.”

I read this as "kills come last, except for the lynch which is at the end". I've almost never seen a mechanic where kills could be prevented by lynching someone.

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1 hour ago, Devotary of Spontaneity said:

This isn't actually when Bard clarified this, but lynches do come after kills, so Elandera should still have been able to submit a kill. I'm not sure whether kills nullify someone's vote.

 

1 hour ago, Fifth Scholar said:

I read Bard’s clarification as “kills, with the exception of the lynch which comes earlier, come last.”

This was ambiguous wording on my part. Fifth is correct. The full order of actions is:

Desperate Packman
Redirects
Vote Manipulations
Lynch
PM Spying
Protection
Kills

Edited by Young Bard
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1 hour ago, Fifth Scholar said:

I’ve been considering this point myself. Shanerockes seems like far too easy of a lynch; if he was actually an elim, then I doubt he’d immediately claim CadCom as his source of information; it’d be more logical to affiliate himself with a dead villager. Conversely, I’ve been overcoming my scepticism of the Walin lynch. Points against him: 

1) Inactivity C2 directly coincides with the lack of Eliminator kill. As Elandera was unable to kill successfully because of the way Order of Actions works (to my understanding, lynch before elim kill), responsibility would have fallen to the other Elim to attempt a kill. Walin was completely inactive at the time, the only player in such a condition, and fits perfectly with the fact that no kill was attempted last cycle. 

2) Distancing with Elandera. Last cycle, hours before she was about to die, Elandera poked Walin for inactivity, not even really trying to defend herself. In my view, this served two purposes: to distance from him, and to ping him in the hopes that he would become active enough to submit a kill. 

3) Interactions this cycle. He seems to mostly be following my lead with the vote and sticking to the shadows, is trying to stay away from the lynch, and isn’t offering candidates of his own. These are all indicators of Elim-like voting behaviour. 

I realise it’s later in the cycle but I’d like input, especially from @shanerockes and @Ark1002, my other two suspects currently. 

shanerockes. walin. I would really like @Walin to chime in, though. Your points are rather convincing, but I would like to know if anyone has seen walin lurking...

Here are Walin's posts:

https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/83720-mr33-cycle-three-demonstrations/?do=findComment&comment=816542

https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/83720-mr33-cycle-three-demonstrations/?do=findComment&comment=816447

https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/83557-mr33-danger-in-the-terris-peaks/?do=findComment&comment=815083

https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/83557-mr33-danger-in-the-terris-peaks/?do=findComment&comment=814312

https://www.17thshard.com/forum/topic/83557-mr33-danger-in-the-terris-peaks/?do=findComment&comment=813817

Here is walin's overall activity(All posts, not just SE)(Mountain Standard Time): 

Tuesday Morning

Morning Afternoon x2

Friday Afternoon

Thursday Afternoon (Lots of time on the Shard)

Signup

 

 

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Oh boy. I can't really refute any of those points; I've been an inactive eliminator sticking to the shadows before, and my post history certainly corroborates me "pretending" to be an inactive villager, while actually being selectively active.

However, it's wrong. I just don't know what I'm doing most of the time, and when I'm inactive, it's not on purpose. The time that I was inactive and an eliminator, that was just me playing as an eliminator, but inactively; not being an inactive eliminator.

As for the voting with the bandwagon, I tend to do that. I'm not very good at analysis, and when I try it ends up being very flawed and counter-able. So instead of coming up with my own arguments, I tend to read the ones of others and follow their lead, voting on who they say is most suspicious. It's worked somewhat in the past, but everything I've been doing here has been done in the wrong way. I voted in the wrong cycles, forgot to post at the right (alibi-inducing) times, and now I'm gonna get lynched. Once I turn out to be a villager, I think you all should target Fifth or Roadwalker. They're the main analyzers, and when one dies we'll know if their arguments were based on flawed information or falsified information.

With that, I think I'm going to rest my case and finish Nawl's story.

--------------------------------

The mists were thick. Up in this shaded slot canyon, they weren't burned away by the sun, so they played here. Toying with one's mind, pretending to be natural but flowing like something alive. Nawl and the others were understandably nervous. The Deepness reached far into the mountain, and reminded the group daily that they were never free. Thankfully, no one had died during the day, and there hadn't been any attacks, but there were a few sightings of a misty figure off in the distance.

It was unsettling. How were they to survive when...this is what they fought. And each other, no less? If the group kept bickering, the Deepness probably wouldn't have to do anything. They'd just split up, or die, or get lost. And then the world would end. What then? Would the world be missed? Is there some justice system after death, sending them all to suffer in the Deepness for their failure?

Nawl couldn't let that happen. They would succeed, no matter how many traitors were left. Wait...he had an idea.

"Hey everyone, we didn't bury Fourth Letir or Declan very deep, did we? What if they had a list with them, a metalmind that told us who the other traitors were? What if they had secret meetings, and they had a schedule? I say before we keep going, we should check their belongings. It may grant us further information."

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57 minutes ago, Walin said:

Once I turn out to be a villager, I think you all should target Fifth or Roadwalker. They're the main analyzers, and when one dies we'll know if their arguments were based on flawed information or falsified information.

Fifth and Roadwalker have driven lynches on both dead elims. With the game likely ending this cycle or the next if both the elims and the Deepness submit kills, we don't have time to consider the slim possibility that one of them double-bussed their teammates.  Instead we'll have to address the more likely suspects. As you are one of those main suspects, Walin.

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