Republic of Alleycity

[kenod]

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That was basically what I said. The raised points aren't clear cut or fully proven, and even then it isn't a certainty that the senate would actually vote to remove Great Guild status.

 

[Silva]

Pry handed a stack of papers to the elderly lady.

"Freedom got in a fight today," she told her softly. "And given her sensitivities..." Pry trailed off, message clear.

She quietly made her way out of the room.

@Ark1002

[+Ark1002]

11 hours ago, Grey Knight said:

The space marine representative stood up and cleared his throat.

"In light of recent events," he said, his blood-red eyes grim, "wasting the Assembly's time seems inappropriate. Thus, I'll make this quick."

He pointed at the Keeper's representative. "The Black Crusade," he said, "formally accuses the Keepers guild of lying about their Great Guild status, sheltering hostile forces, and the obstruction of justice. We move that the Keepers immediately have their Great Guild status stripped away and be subject to investigation by the Republic for charges of corruption and heresy."

  Hide contents

Here's my points:

• Obstruction of Justice: delaying aid to WhiteRose church and obstructing the investigation of the Waiter
• Great Guild Status: Only two of the members other than Ark have been active since the guild's formation, and one has gone inactive. Despite this, Ark has used this Great Guild status to achieve personal goals and vote in the Assembly.
• Sheltering hostile forces: Admitting to sheltering known raiders and plunderers, who are currently besieging Fortress Eternal. Repeated refusal to allow military access to the mountains in order to exterminate the yeti menace.

Furthermore, the Keepers have exhibited the following suspicious behavior:

• A marked lack of reaction to the wholesale slaughter of children
• Sympathy being shown for the terrorists

@Lord Meeker @kenod @I think I am here. @Nohadon @Vargo Seldon @Darth Woodrack @MacThorstenson @Voidus @Ark1002

The old lady chuckled. "Obstruction of justice? How the hell did we do that?" She gestured with her cane at the reps. "The Diagramists didn't send help, neither did TUBA itself. TUBA, the 'just and kind' guild." She looked at him. "Even you didn't, during battle. You helped the mess, but nothing was actually saved." She gestured around. "Almost all of you have been warful. We have not, and even now, when our mountains are being invaded, we haven't. Gone. To. War." She smiled, stepping back. "And furthermore, what did we do to obstruct investigation of the Waiter? Nothing. We didn't even support the Ghostbloods, because there wasn't a vote. There wasn't even an investigation! The Waiter is dead!" 

She stepped back, breathing heavily. Tapping a bit of breath, and a trickle of strength, she grinned.

"We are negotiating, to keep an intelligent race alive, except for aggressors. The Black Crusade nuked a city, should we slaughter you?"

Again she tapped more breath, more strength. "You idiots showed less reaction than us! You stand there in metal armor, looking down on us, but you. Have. Nothing. Stupid children like you, accusing your betters, like a child rebelling against the teacher."

Now, she sighed. "And when did we show sympathy? We know the Ghostbloods didn't do it, we have a treaty with the Ghostbloods, so even so we have reason. You have nothing," she said with a growl, "And you accuse us."

@

[Grey Knight]

"I find your argument contradictory and filled with logical errors," the Space Marine said, his expression calm. 

"I will address your points in the order they were presented," he continued, stepping down to the center of the room. "The Keepers' response to the Whiterose massacre was, and I quote, "If this rogue faction is able to do all this, it's not the Ghostbloods fault. It's your incompetence," speaking, of course, to the DA representative. No further comment was made on the slaughter of women and children." He raised an eyebrow. "While telling, this ultimately proves nothing. Indeed, the Black Crusade did only involve itself after the event- by stationing a demi-company of hardened warriors and armor to guard the Church. I believe this is still more than the Keepers did."

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And I also wasn't active at the time of the event, and could thus only help out with the aftermath. Still, point to you, Ark.

"As to your point that you have never waged war," he continued, "Brother-Captain Trajan of the Iron Hands would like to disagree with you, seeing as your military just shot down two of his Thunderhawk gunships and murdered their crew." He looked pointedly at the old woman. "Said gunships were conducting an operation against the yetis who had attacked Fortress Eternal and killed hundreds of its citizens." He nodded towards the Diagramist representative. "Stormbreaker can confirm this. Their motive was vengeance for the fallen, and yet you still killed them."

"Furthermore," he said, "you seem to forget that the Exterminatus of the AlleyCity, seventeen years ago, was a desperate attempt to keep the DA's abominations from escaping the city. There were hundreds of thousands of them, madam. Would you have preferred to let them spill out into the countryside, letting them raid and murder freely? We might never have tracked them all down if that were the case. And," he said, raising his voice, "you, like so many others, forget the sacrifices that the Crusade made to evacuate what civilians were alive after the abominations were released. The Canton's shields protected the innocent while death rained from the sky, even as our Astartes bled to keep the corrupted warriors of Nurgle contained."

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All legitimate things that happened during the 7 Day War thread. 

"The point remains," the Salamander said. "You are accused of hypocrisy and corruption, and evidence suggests* that you fail to meet the status of a Great Guild. I propose a vote," he said, turning to face the assembly and spreading his arms, "that a new census be taken, in order to reflect the changes in Homeless population and disposition, and that guilds who fail to reach Great Guild status be stripped of their resources."

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*Out of character-ish, but could be explained by the fact that the Keepers are basically herdsmen with a military on the level of superpowers.

And no hard feelings, Ark- this is all in-character, not what I actually think. Though the "children" remark rankles a bit 

Credit goes to Kenod for the census idea. What do y'all think?

@kenod @I think I am here. @Nohadon @Vargo Seldon @Darth Woodrack @MacThorstenson @Voidus @Ark1002

Edited April 12, 2019 by Grey Knight

[Vargo Seldon]

1 hour ago, Ark1002 said:

The old lady chuckled. "Obstruction of justice? How the hell did we do that?" She gestured with her cane at the reps. "The Diagramists didn't send help, neither did TUBA itself. TUBA, the 'just and kind' guild." She looked at him. "Even you didn't, during battle. You helped the mess, but nothing was actually saved." She gestured around. "Almost all of you have been warful. We have not, and even now, when our mountains are being invaded, we haven't. Gone. To. War." She smiled, stepping back. "And furthermore, what did we do to obstruct investigation of the Waiter? Nothing. We didn't even support the Ghostbloods, because there wasn't a vote. There wasn't even an investigation! The Waiter is dead!" 

She stepped back, breathing heavily. Tapping a bit of breath, and a trickle of strength, she grinned.

"We are negotiating, to keep an intelligent race alive, except for aggressors. The Black Crusade nuked a city, should we slaughter you?"

Again she tapped more breath, more strength. "You idiots showed less reaction than us! You stand there in metal armor, looking down on us, but you. Have. Nothing. Stupid children like you, accusing your betters, like a child rebelling against the teacher."

Now, she sighed. "And when did we show sympathy? We know the Ghostbloods didn't do it, we have a treaty with the Ghostbloods, so even so we have reason. You have nothing," she said with a growl, "And you accuse us."

@

Keleth slowly stood up.  This would need to be handled delicately.  He addressed the marine, "The Keepers were allied with the Ghostbloods at the time of the attack.  They have cause for remaining neutral, if not backing the Ghostbloods."  He paused.  This would not help his case, if handled clumsily.  "If you may recall," he said, taking a deep breath, "I backed the Ghostbloods under Stormbreaker's orders.  This is because we were allied with the Ghostbloods.  Furthermore, Stormbreaker was away handling the Fortress Eternal siege, not close enough to the action to really identify with the Whiterose incident.  All he'd heard was that a so-called "rebel faction had attacked the Church of the Whiterose".  According to us, we were backing an ally in danger.  So, under the circumstances, I think both the Keepers and us were justified by not directly opposing the Ghostbloods."  He looked around at the assembled officials.  "But I address you now.  When my home and fortress was besieged, the only one who sent aid was the the Black Crusade.  Despite the aggressors living on the same land as the Keepers, they did nothing to contain their neighbors.  I'm not saying that they're responsible for the yetis, but I think it's safe to say that they could've at least sent a little aid.  They have an army of feruchemists.  Women and children were slaughtered in the initial attack.  Innocents who's whole lives were their trade or farm.  If it happened once it can happen again.  All Stormbreaker wants to do is protect his people from future attacks.  Not only will he win this fight, but he'll win all future fights with this campaign.  So I implore you, if you do not strip their Greath Guild status, at least make them stand aside for our armies."

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Also Voidus, can we vote on Vargo's laws?

@Voidus @Ark1002 @kenod @I think I am here. @Nohadon @Darth Woodrack @MacThorstenson 

[MacThorstenson]

29 minutes ago, Vargo Seldon said:

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Also Voidus, can we vote on Vargo's laws?

 

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Voidus is not going to be on the shard for the next little bit, IRL stuff is picking up.

 

[+Ark1002]

"You storming hypocrite. We have given you permission to kill your aggressors. And you go, and try to remove our ability to hold invading armies, out."

She turned to the Marine. "The majority of guilds didn't send help. Again, TUBA didn't send help, and they have allied themselves closely with the church."

"And those spacecrafts were, again, invading. This is our property, and you sent armed vehicles to attack."

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I don't care about OOC, I care about IC and you're ruining my storming guild. Screw you, this is worse than an insult to my face. I have invested so much, and you're trying to screw it up.

And the Keepers aren't Herdsmen, they are far more than that. It's a bunch of feruchemists, in an ancient ruins style mountain range, who prefer to keep simple in way of tech. Think Mokia from Alcatraz, if you need comparison.

And, Vargo, I said you could use a tribe, but more then that and you aren't following this, as there is no legitimate way, by all Yeti tribal culture. It has been specifically stated tribes won't work together. It was stretching it in the first place to have them leave!

@Vargo Seldon @Grey Knight

[Vargo Seldon]

1 hour ago, MacThorstenson said:

 

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That's fine.  

 

1 hour ago, Ark1002 said:

"You storming hypocrite. We have given you permission to kill your aggressors. And you go, and try to remove our ability to hold invading armies, out."

She turned to the Marine. "The majority of guilds didn't send help. Again, TUBA didn't send help, and they have allied themselves closely with the church."

"And those spacecrafts were, again, invading. This is our property, and you sent armed vehicles to attack."

@Vargo Seldon @Grey Knight

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Ark I'm not trying to ruin your guild.  Think about the Ghostbloods.  They attacked CotW blatantly and openly, and neither guild really suffered all that much.  IC it was devastating, but OOC they both stayed great guilds and neither lost any real power.  I just want a conflict to get my guild going again.  Trust me, when this is over, neither of us will be the worse for wear.  If you don't want you guild to get ruined, then don't RP it that way.  

If you're worried about IC then don't.  This is not a target against you specifically, it's the easiest method of conflict.  There may be war, true, but I won't inflict much damage against your villages, just your armies.  As a great guild, you're allowed to replenish your armies anyway.  

"Stormbreaker did not authorize that attack.  The Space marines were acting of their own volition in that instance, and were duly repaid," Keleth defended.  "The terms are generous, yes, but Stormbreaker is worried about the safety of your own people.  If you insist on refusing our defensive measures, than we will accept the terms.  But I urge you to accept."

@Ark1002

[Grey Knight]

10 hours ago, Ark1002 said:

I don't care about OOC, I care about IC and you're ruining my storming guild. Screw you, this is worse than an insult to my face. I have invested so much, and you're trying to screw it up.

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This, uh, seems to be getting out of hand. Maybe we should call in the mods to arbitrate?

And I didn't realize you cared so much about this, so my apologies if I'm being a jerk. I'd feel the same way if someone tried to take away the Black Crusade.

 

Edited April 12, 2019 by Grey Knight

[+Ark1002]

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I mean, my loyalties go

Keepers

GBs

Me

But yeah, sorry if that got a bit out of hand.

"We are more then willing to let you kill that single threat, but we've lived with the yeti for many more years then your guild has existed."

She looked around.

"We have plenty of defensive measures, should the Yeti decide to attack."

@Vargo Seldon

[MacThorstenson]

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It seems like the tensions have fallen now, but let's all remember to keep calm.

I will note that we probably will be doing a new census regardless of the outcome of this, because the census last time didn't really go all that well.

 

[kenod]

3 hours ago, MacThorstenson said:

It seems like the tensions have fallen now, but let's all remember to keep calm.

I will note that we probably will be doing a new census regardless of the outcome of this, because the census last time didn't really go all that well.

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Maybe it would be good to create a specific thread for it? It would make it easy for people to keep count or update their allegiance, and everyone can see guild status by just looking at the OP. We could also add the option to say you're a member of a guild but don't want to count towards it, so we can have a better overview of the (public) roster of the different guilds. This would be especially nice for guilds where the OP is inactive and the current leader can't update their list (Keepers) or guilds that don't seem to have a list in general (GB).

 

[MacThorstenson]

1 hour ago, kenod said:

 

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The way it’s going to work is we will ask all guild leaders to PM an AV mod, preferably me cuz I’m going to be the most active during this, with a list of all the People who are going to be counted as a member of their guild.

If someone’s name is listed twice we will talk to that person, or ask the guild leader to talk to that person to clarify the issue.

If your name doesn’t appear at all then we won’t bother you about it.

 

[Vargo Seldon]

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The census idea sounds fine.  I'm apologize Ark.  My guild hasn't been around all that long, so I guess I don't know what it's like to have a guild for a long time. 

 

[I think I am here.]

“Now listen here, rustheads!” Lusk yelled, standing up, to get the attention of the council. The Keepers and the Diagramists. Both allies of the Ghostbloods. And yet they were arguing. And both were talented in their chosen specialties, so Lusk would need both of them to come out of this unharmed.

Ah, the subtle art of diplomacy.

“You all have been fighting like children,” Lusk said, looking to the old lady. “Even you, believe it or not. You all stand here, discussing about guilds and forgetting the underlying facts. So let me, Council Member and Representative of the storming Ghostbloods, say what I have to. The only reason you haven’t gotten more from us today is because we’ve had children representing instead of someone who actually knows what they’re rusting doing.”

He cracked his knuckles.

“To the Black Crusade, I sincerely don’t dislike you. In fact, I think our goals align more often than you’d think. But forget about that, the points you’re bringing up now are - frankly - disappointing,” he looked to Keleth. “And you, you are an ally, and a good one at that, and I know how you feel about the Keepers. But you’re wrong.

“The Keepers are pacifists. That doesn’t mean that non-pacifists are bad, hell, I’ve killed more than my share of people and I’m not stopping any time soon. But the fact of the matter is that asking them to go against their values, go against the thing they’re founded on, or to take away their great guild status is not acceptable, by means. You know what? Storms, I’m not going to be polite, it’s downright criminal.

“As they’ve said, they’ve lived with the Yetis. They’ve lived with every single one of the threats on their shadows-cursed mountains and while I hate the cold, you can’t deny that violence isn’t needed to survive they live in.” He looked to the Black Crusade member. “Maybe if you’d taken a hint on how to interact with Yetis peacefully from the Keepers you wouldn’t have gotten your own members killed.”

He looked to the Diagramists. “I like your laws, but oppose the idea of a census, because the verdict is already clear as a Kandra, the Keepers are a great guild and will remain so,” he looked at the Black Crusade member. “And about your little ‘revenge’ mission, what in all hell were you thinking? The Yetis are an animal on Keeper territory, you can’t just walk in on somebody else’s land, I don’t care if those animals are causing issues, you take it with the nation who owns that land, you do not, and I repeat, do not waltz in on someone’s land, killing their animals and then have the gall to cry wolf when the government takes action?

“Revenge is good. I’ve taken my share of revenge, too. And I completely agree, maybe if Fortress Eternal had taken a little bit more time to figure out how to interact with the Yetis they lived next to they wouldn’t have attacked, and even if they did attack, I can respect your revenge mission. I really do. But when you fail, when you are killed for doing an illegal activity, you don’t coming crying to us now. Your revenge was respectable, but not legal, and so government actions by the Keepers can not be condemned for your failure.”

Lusk paused, his demeanour not enraged nor over-emotional, but perfectly intense. Just like when he’d been a young man all those years ago. The memory was nostalgic, to say the least. But then again, this had what caused him to climb the ranks to Council Member. To this.

@Ark1002

@Grey Knight

@Vargo Seldon

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Man, that was long  

 

Edited April 13, 2019 by I think I am here.

[+Ark1002]

The old lady clapped.

[+Sorana]

12 hours ago, MacThorstenson said:

The way it’s going to work is we will ask all guild leaders to PM an AV mod, preferably me cuz I’m going to be the most active during this, with a list of all the People who are going to be counted as a member of their guild.

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I'll pm you once I've got something. Give me some hours though.

 

[MacThorstenson]

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Thanks sorana!

During Lusk’s eloquent speech one of the DA scientists ran into the room with a newly created spike displayed prominently in his throat. 

Motioning to two other people, he steadied himself. The two assistants stood behind him steadying him. 

Then, on the count of three, he blew a raspberry so loud and powerful that the room shook. 

The sheer force of the raspberry blew him and his companions over backwards, slamming them into the back wall as if they had been hit with a semi. 

The volume of the raspberry caused him and his companions to go deaf, but it was alright. They were deaf in the name of SCIENCE!

Upon the completion of the raspberry to end all raspberries, the DA contingent burst into applause and cheers, for science had been advanced by leaps and bounds today. In addition, several members of the public were looking pretty impressed by the raspberry. 

[I think I am here.]

A fly buzzed through the air, and it slapped the rasberry man, before dying as it had a laughably short lifespan.

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Bravo. Encore!

 

[Voidus]

While holding both ears and slightly deafened by the raspberry, one of the DA lawyers set a deed of ownership down before the precursors who were trying to take away his colleagues.

In it, it was pointed out that since the DA technically owned the entire Alleyverse, they were not in violation of any laws as the city never officially obtained this building from them and thus it wasn't a city-owned building.

The DA denizens all smiled in gloating victory as this clarification was made.
 

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Only going to be on really quickly but just wanted to post this while I was here, this is one of the reasons the DA was not concerned about the passing of the previous law.
I'll edit in a new poll, just going to be a simple 'aye' or 'nay' vote, can others let people know exactly what they're voting on if anyone asks?

 

[+Ark1002]

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So, Mac, I have a complaint about the logic about this upcoming census.

Yes, that can change the allocated resources allowed a guild, but unless the government itself votes to perform a new census, which it hasn't, new guilds wouldn't get a spot in the Republic, and old ones wouldn't lose it.

@MacThorstenson

[Grey Knight]

The Space Marine inclined his head respectfully towards Lusk, but said nothing. He quietly turned around and walked up to his Guild box, disappearing into the shadows.

@I think I am here.

[Vargo Seldon]

On 4/13/2019 at 5:51 AM, Voidus said:

While holding both ears and slightly deafened by the raspberry, one of the DA lawyers set a deed of ownership down before the precursors who were trying to take away his colleagues.

In it, it was pointed out that since the DA technically owned the entire Alleyverse, they were not in violation of any laws as the city never officially obtained this building from them and thus it wasn't a city-owned building.

The DA denizens all smiled in gloating victory as this clarification was made.
 

 

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Actually using the effects of hemalurgy in the building is not technically illegal, just the art of practicing it.  So this clause is Unnecessary.

 

On 4/12/2019 at 11:14 PM, I think I am here. said:

“Now listen here, rustheads!” Lusk yelled, standing up, to get the attention of the council. The Keepers and the Diagramists. Both allies of the Ghostbloods. And yet they were arguing. And both were talented in their chosen specialties, so Lusk would need both of them to come out of this unharmed.

Ah, the subtle art of diplomacy.

“You all have been fighting like children,” Lusk said, looking to the old lady. “Even you, believe it or not. You all stand here, discussing about guilds and forgetting the underlying facts. So let me, Council Member and Representative of the storming Ghostbloods, say what I have to. The only reason you haven’t gotten more from us today is because we’ve had children representing instead of someone who actually knows what they’re rusting doing.”

He cracked his knuckles.

“To the Black Crusade, I sincerely don’t dislike you. In fact, I think our goals align more often than you’d think. But forget about that, the points you’re bringing up now are - frankly - disappointing,” he looked to Keleth. “And you, you are an ally, and a good one at that, and I know how you feel about the Keepers. But you’re wrong.

“The Keepers are pacifists. That doesn’t mean that non-pacifists are bad, hell, I’ve killed more than my share of people and I’m not stopping any time soon. But the fact of the matter is that asking them to go against their values, go against the thing they’re founded on, or to take away their great guild status is not acceptable, by means. You know what? Storms, I’m not going to be polite, it’s downright criminal.

“As they’ve said, they’ve lived with the Yetis. They’ve lived with every single one of the threats on their shadows-cursed mountains and while I hate the cold, you can’t deny that violence isn’t needed to survive they live in.” He looked to the Black Crusade member. “Maybe if you’d taken a hint on how to interact with Yetis peacefully from the Keepers you wouldn’t have gotten your own members killed.”

He looked to the Diagramists. “I like your laws, but oppose the idea of a census, because the verdict is already clear as a Kandra, the Keepers are a great guild and will remain so,” he looked at the Black Crusade member. “And about your little ‘revenge’ mission, what in all hell were you thinking? The Yetis are an animal on Keeper territory, you can’t just walk in on somebody else’s land, I don’t care if those animals are causing issues, you take it with the nation who owns that land, you do not, and I repeat, do not waltz in on someone’s land, killing their animals and then have the gall to cry wolf when the government takes action?

“Revenge is good. I’ve taken my share of revenge, too. And I completely agree, maybe if Fortress Eternal had taken a little bit more time to figure out how to interact with the Yetis they lived next to they wouldn’t have attacked, and even if they did attack, I can respect your revenge mission. I really do. But when you fail, when you are killed for doing an illegal activity, you don’t coming crying to us now. Your revenge was respectable, but not legal, and so government actions by the Keepers can not be condemned for your failure.”

Lusk paused, his demeanour not enraged nor over-emotional, but perfectly intense. Just like when he’d been a young man all those years ago. The memory was nostalgic, to say the least. But then again, this had what caused him to climb the ranks to Council Member. To this.

@Ark1002

@Grey Knight

@Vargo Seldon

 

Keleth raised his voice.  "It appears good sir, that you've made a bit of a mistake.  It was us, the Diagramists, who were attacked.  The Black Crusade did come to out aid, but I believe most of your points should be addressed to me."  He went on, "However, this specification doesn't really matter as all of your points still apply.  You mistake our motives.  Coming to the government wasn't a means of crying for help through legal means.  The government was just a tool to get what we wanted, to put it simply."

He stood up slowly, and faced the Ghostblood representative, "You could say that our revenge wasn't legal, but you could also point out that it wasn't necessarily illegal either.  The set of laws that I've proposed would make an unjustified war illegal, but since they haven't been voted on, it isn't.  In fact, no laws have technically been voted on except for those regarding hemalurgy, so nothing is really illegal.  All it comes down to right now is the opinions of the representatives." 

He turned back to the Keeper lady and said, "Stormbreaker has decided to accept your terms, under certain circumstances."  

@Ark1002

@I think I am here.

[+Ark1002]

The old lady nodded.

[MacThorstenson]

18 hours ago, Vargo Seldon said:

Actually using the effects of hemalurgy in the building is not technically illegal, just the art of practicing it.  So this clause is Unnecessary.

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The clause was said in response to when you had the precursors drag the denizens out of the room earlier, not the raspberry blowing  

 

 

On 4/13/2019 at 9:38 AM, Ark1002 said:

@MacThorstenson

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Maybe I’m just misremembering this, but I thought that there was some sort of stipulation when the government was made that the reps could be changed? If there wasn’t, then oh well. You are right that representation wouldn’t change unless a vote got put forward for it.