Who Do You Most Want Dead?

[+Invocation]

Just now, Eris said:

I second this. We don't even know enough to dislike him as much as @Gasper does

That might be the issue in and of itself.

[IcaroRibeiro]

1) Moash, an annoying douche-bag that I hate since book 1

2)  Nale, Ishar and half of the Heralds 

3) Some Shin people leaders, I'm personally excited to see Szeth making them pay for their crimes

[The Feruchemist]

On 1/4/2019 at 0:02 PM, SLNC said:

Adolin tbh.

I’m glad someone shares this opinion. 

[Chiri-Chiri]

On 5/1/2019 at 6:22 PM, Ripheus23 said:

If so, we will have established that characters whose names begin with "M" and end in "sh" are always subject to a compadre::shill-for-evil::redeemed character arc.

Exactly, think in Mushu (Mulan), we all hate him when he broke the stone dragon but at the end, he achieved to help Mulan. Coincidence? I do not think so. 

 

12 hours ago, SwordNimiForPresident said:

Marsh was a good guy who fought back from the start. Moash is already way past the point of “I was secretly good all along”. He’s probably going to end up as Odium’s champion which means he also has to die at some point. I think his story will be an anti redemption one. Instead of someone who followed the wrong path coming back to the light, we will have a guy who was never really that great to begin with sinking deeper and deeper into evil.

 

TLDR: don’t put your Moash on my Marsh

I saw Marsh first!! He is mine!!  (Adolin too )

I'd be quite boring if you don't get any surprise, Do you like flat characters? People without personal growing or evolution at all? Because this is what you are asking for a character that until now only had make a few really really bad choises.

He felt regret when he saw Kaladin when he kill to Elkohrar, he missed bridge4's crew, he help to the pashmendi, he does't have a wicked core, he is simply quite lost, his thirst for revenge blinded his good judgment.

Szeth was the bad boy in the first book, but now he surprised us and we are hoping him to joing Dalinar. 

When I read I like to feel like a rollercoaster with surprises and unexpected twists of plot, If Moash finish like Odium's champion and the Kaladin's antagonist, It would be so predictible and boring. 

[Eris]

12 minutes ago, Chiri-Chiri said:

Exactly, think in Mushu (Mulan), we all hate him when he broke the stone dragon but at the end, he achieved to help Mulan. Coincidence? I do not think so. 

 

I saw Marsh first!! He is mine!!  (Adolin too )

I'd be quite boring if you don't get any surprise, Do you like flat characters? People without personal growing or evolution at all? Because this is what you are asking for a character that until now only had make a few really really bad choises.

He felt regret when he saw Kaladin when he kill to Elkohrar, he missed bridge4's crew, he help to the pashmendi, he does't have a wicked core, he is simply quite lost, his thirst for revenge blinded his good judgment.

Szeth was the bad boy in the first book, but now he surprised us and we are hoping him to joing Dalinar. 

When I read I like to feel like a rollercoaster with surprises and unexpected twists of plot, If Moash finish like Odium's champion and the Kaladin's antagonist, It would be so predictible and boring. 

I guess you're right. Having a character always being morally good or evil is uninteresting. I guess we are just so used to seeing how Kaladin acts and comparing it to Moash who is obviously his character foil. So it is enraging to see that Moash had ways out but chooses not to for revenge. I myself do not like him at all even if he got redeemed but I can see why people don't completely hate on him. 

[SwordNimiForPresident]

5 hours ago, Chiri-Chiri said:

RExactly, think in Mushu (Mulan), we all hate him when he broke the stone dragon but at the end, he achieved to help Mulan. Coincidence? I do not think so. 

 

I saw Marsh first!! He is mine!!  (Adolin too )

I'd be quite boring if you don't get any surprise, Do you like flat characters? People without personal growing or evolution at all? Because this is what you are asking for a character that until now only had make a few really really bad choises.

He felt regret when he saw Kaladin when he kill to Elkohrar, he missed bridge4's crew, he help to the pashmendi, he does't have a wicked core, he is simply quite lost, his thirst for revenge blinded his good judgment.

Szeth was the bad boy in the first book, but now he surprised us and we are hoping him to joing Dalinar. 

When I read I like to feel like a rollercoaster with surprises and unexpected twists of plot, If Moash finish like Odium's champion and the Kaladin's antagonist, It would be so predictible and boring. 

If every character is a redemption story then there’s no rollercoaster, it becomes predictable and expected. I think Moash will have many chances to choose the right path down the road and will always choose the wrong one instead.

Szeth was never the bad guy. He was simply obeying the law. The bad guys are the ones that made those laws and the ones who held his stone. We simply didn’t know that as the reader (though there are many clues). There’s no room for that in Moash’s story because we already have all the background info and his choices and actions are clearly his own.

I suspect that Moash started as a plot device to make Kaladin stumble in his progression and separate him from Dalinar when he’s at Narak, thereby facilitating his dramatic return. From there the character probably took on a life of its own as an antagonist. Some antagonists are meant to be hated, just look at Dilaf from Elantris.

[Chiri-Chiri]

4 hours ago, SwordNimiForPresident said:

If every character is a redemption story then there’s no rollercoaster, it becomes predictable and expected. I think Moash will have many chances to choose the right path down the road and will always choose the wrong one instead.

I agree with you in the first statement, but the rollercoaster comes with the redemption of the character that everyone thinks he has no opportunity to do it.
He has fallen so low that (almost) nobody expects it.

4 hours ago, SwordNimiForPresident said:

Szeth was never the bad guy. He was simply obeying the law. The bad guys are the ones that made those laws and the ones who held his stone. We simply didn’t know that as the reader (though there are many clues). There’s no room for that in Moash’s story because we already have all the background info and his choices and actions are clearly his own.

If a law or a religion says that everyone has to kill a newborn in Christmas, Would you do it? or would you try to stop whom would try to do it. 

Sometimes the bad guy is who doesn't do anything when he can, or who follow the rules knowing that he is doing horrible actions.

4 hours ago, SwordNimiForPresident said:

I suspect that Moash started as a plot device to make Kaladin stumble in his progression and separate him from Dalinar when he’s at Narak, thereby facilitating his dramatic return. From there the character probably took on a life of its own as an antagonist. Some antagonists are meant to be hated, just look at Dilaf from Elantris.

You're problably right, but the real antagonist is Odium, the people can chose to follow him or give him their backs, and in a 10 book's series it would be quite flat if the arc of a character doesn't grow from the third book. 
Who knows, maybe all of you are right, and Moash ends being the Odium's puppet (dont you remind this a bit of Szeth arc?, Szeth follow orders, Moash too)

 

Edited January 7, 2019 by Chiri-Chiri
Sorry for my english

[supersmith]

K this might be sad, but I totally think Teft should die, but only if he dies in some heroic incredible way, and saving a ton of people in the process. It also makes sense if you think about it. He's kinda Kaladins mentor character, like Obi Wan, or Dumbledore (who both die ). 

[CosmicSieve]

4 hours ago, SwordNimiForPresident said:

Szeth was never the bad guy. He was simply obeying the law. The bad guys are the ones that made those laws and the ones who held his stone. 

I have to disagree with this. Szeth was selectively upholding a law. But he is well outside of Shin. I just finished a reread of TWoK, and I found myself with no sympathy for him while reading his mass murder spree across the face of Roshar. He knows he is doing wrong, but chooses to do it anyway. He seems to feel that harming others is part of his punishment and all about him, which is so incredibly selfish.

I personally found his resurrection to be clunky, and wished he had stayed dead, despite my interest in his backstory. But that is a done deal. But I would like him to die-- though it is highly unlikely to happen before the end of book 5. Between Dalinar, Taravangian, Venli, and Szeth, this story is littered with Monsters As Saviors. I am having a hard time investing in yet another serial mass murderer who is supposedly integral to the survival of Roshar. I find the moral struggles of Jasnah, Kaladin, Shallan, and Adolin and even Moash to be far more relatable and interesting, but the story is confusing in that it asks me to care about those things while shrugging off the deaths of thousands for other characters.

 

6 minutes ago, supersmith said:

K this might be sad, but I totally think Teft should die, but only if he dies in some heroic incredible way, and saving a ton of people in the process. It also makes sense if you think about it. He's kinda Kaladins mentor character, like Obi Wan, or Dumbledore (who both die ). 

I don't want Teft to die, but I do see how that could further the story, so I agree that maybe he should. I kinda have the same feeling about Lirin.

[Warden of Storms]

Not moash he is just lost and broken, odium doesn't rlly deserve to die, he can't help being what he was. Ascending changes you.

 

I think I want Dalinar to pass, twist the plot, causing chaos, which could fuel odium.

[SwordNimiForPresident]

1 hour ago, CosmicSieve said:

I have to disagree with this. Szeth was selectively upholding a law. But he is well outside of Shin. I just finished a reread of TWoK, and I found myself with no sympathy for him while reading his mass murder spree across the face of Roshar. He knows he is doing wrong, but chooses to do it anyway. He seems to feel that harming others is part of his punishment and all about him, which is so incredibly selfish.

I personally found his resurrection to be clunky, and wished he had stayed dead, despite my interest in his backstory. But that is a done deal. But I would like him to die-- though it is highly unlikely to happen before the end of book 5. Between Dalinar, Taravangian, Venli, and Szeth, this story is littered with Monsters As Saviors. I am having a hard time investing in yet another serial mass murderer who is supposedly integral to the survival of Roshar. I find the moral struggles of Jasnah, Kaladin, Shallan, and Adolin and even Moash to be far more relatable and interesting, but the story is confusing in that it asks me to care about those things while shrugging off the deaths of thousands for other characters.

 

I don't want Teft to die, but I do see how that could further the story, so I agree that maybe he should. I kinda have the same feeling about Lirin.

From his point of veiw it was right. This is actually what drew Nale to him. Szeth would not violate his beliefs even if it destroyed him. His discovery that the Shamanate was wrong and that the Radiants had in fact returned shattered his belief and freed him from his oath.

[Guest]

18 hours ago, The Feruchemist said:

I’m glad someone shares this opinion. 

We are few, but we are there.

[Nathrangking]

2 hours ago, Warden of Storms said:

Not moash he is just lost and broken, odium doesn't rlly deserve to die, he can't help being what he was. Ascending changes you.

Yeah not him it is confirmed that Rayse was not ever good.

[Sedside]

Adolin dead, Sadeas resurrected. Sanderson, please!

[Inky]

4 hours ago, Sedside said:

Adolin dead, Sadeas resurrected. Sanderson, please!

The second one is unlikely, resurrection in the cosmere requires specific circumstances that Sadeas probably isn't in

[Sedside]

23 minutes ago, Inky said:

The second one is unlikely, resurrection in the cosmere requires specific circumstances that Sadeas probably isn't in

I know, it's just my new year wish

[RayW2]

I'm not a fan of happy endings, I like when characters sacrifice their lives during epic showdowns. I'd prefer such ending for Kaladin.

Also Shallan. Because I don't like her.

[insert_anagram_here]

46 minutes ago, RayW2 said:

I'm not a fan of happy endings, I like when characters sacrifice their lives during epic showdowns. I'd prefer such ending for Kaladin.

Also Shallan. Because I don't like her.

I wonder what Sanderson would think about that. Not much of a compliment really.

[The Feruchemist]

I wonder if Sanderson ever gets letters from fans asking him to kill off characters.

[Dalakaar]

2 minutes ago, The Feruchemist said:

I wonder if Sanderson ever gets letters from fans asking him to kill off characters.

lol

Now I have a conspiracy theory of high-profile authors holding silent auctions to give the axe to a character running through my head.

1,000 hardcovers for Shallan getting eaten by a chasmfiend, going once, going twice, SOLD!

[+Invocation]

On 1/7/2019 at 0:27 PM, Warden of Storms said:

odium doesn't rlly deserve to die, he can't help being what he was. Ascending changes you.

If you differ from the Shard, yes, but Rayse got exactly what he wanted.

Quote

Brandon Sanderson (paraphrased)

Odium wants to be the only Shard. Odium could pick up other Shards if he wants to, but, he doesn't want to. His Shard is a good match for his personality and he doesn't want to be influenced by another Shard.

source

 

[The Feruchemist]

28 minutes ago, Dalakaar said:

lol

Now I have a conspiracy theory of high-profile authors holding silent auctions to give the axe to a character running through my head.

1,000 hardcovers for Shallan getting eaten by a chasmfiend, going once, going twice, SOLD!

Or Adolin getting decapitated... in front of Shallan. I’d buy 1,000 hard covers for that one.

Edited January 8, 2019 by The Feruchemist

[RayW2]

10 hours ago, insert_anagram_here said:

I wonder what Sanderson would think about that. Not much of a compliment really.

And what's wrong with it? People here desire the most painful deaths for some characters, and even describe the process, but my pretty innocent comment is the worst?

[Greywatch]

Let's keep to the book characters, folks!

For me, I don't think I could come up with anyone, but I realized I was really relieved when Sadeas and Amaram went, so I guess, retroactively it would have been those two? I was just so stressed by them being around, not knowing what they were going to do?

So by that logic, I think I have to say Mraize - he worries me more than maybe anyone else right now. 

[Gasper]

On 1/6/2019 at 4:27 PM, Eris said:

I second this. We don't even know enough to dislike him as much as @Gasper does

Personally, I find Renarian irritating. I don't hate him, he is just annoying and that is why I want him gone. I actually hate the Heralds, they purposefully and with full knowledge sent their brother-in-arms back to face 4500 years of torture with out consulting him. Not to mention he was the only regular person in their little group before they became Heralds. They deserve what ever Jasnah and Odium have planed for them. A character I hate gives me someone to root against and someone to cheer for when the hated character is taken out. An annoying character does nothing but make me skip chapters and then have to go back and reread them later.