Gold Healing and Bones

[+Invocation]

Ok, so when bones heal, they fill in with denser bone, the same way muscles tear and rebuild. Does that happen with gold healing, or because most people don't think about that, the Spiritual Realm healing doesn't do that?

[+Oltux72]

53 minutes ago, Invocation said:

Ok, so when bones heal, they fill in with denser bone, the same way muscles tear and rebuild. Does that happen with gold healing, or because most people don't think about that, the Spiritual Realm healing doesn't do that?

Gold being a temporal metal, it seems to restore an earlier state, hence the bone ought not to be denser.

[Subvisual Haze]

5 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

Gold being a temporal metal, it seems to restore an earlier state, hence the bone ought not to be denser.

Perhaps not though, didn't one of the kandra remark that they wanted Wayne's bones when he died because the skeletons of gold Ferrings look unique?

[+Invocation]

14 minutes ago, Subvisual Haze said:

Perhaps not though, didn't one of the kandra remark that they wanted Wayne's bones when he died because the skeletons of gold Ferrings look unique?

Yeah, VenDell said something like that in Bands of Mourning. Well remembered, I didn't think about that.

[+Oltux72]

16 minutes ago, Subvisual Haze said:

Perhaps not though, didn't one of the kandra remark that they wanted Wayne's bones when he died because the skeletons of gold Ferrings look unique?

Unblemished and ideal perhaps, not necessarily scarred. All wear and tear is fixed.

[Calderis]

1 hour ago, Oltux72 said:

Gold being a temporal metal, it seems to restore an earlier state, hence the bone ought not to be denser.

Gold is a temporal metal in Allomancy, Feruchemy doesn't the same classifications, and Cosmere healing doesn't restore to a previous state, it matches you to your Spiritual Aspect. 

45 minutes ago, Oltux72 said:

Unblemished and ideal perhaps, not necessarily scarred. All wear and tear is fixed.

This is most likely untrue as well, what VenDell says is this. 

Quote

“Nice flower,” the kandra said. “Can I have your skeleton when you’re dead?”
“My…” Wayne felt at his head.
“You’re a Bloodmaker, correct? Can heal yourself? Bloodmaker bones tend to be particularly interesting, as your time spent weak and sickly creates oddities in your joints and bones that can be quite distinctive. I’d love to have your skeleton. If you don’t mind.”

The Cognitive can change the Spiritual, and Bloodmakers would spend so much time sickly when they are storing it could easily have effects on their Cognitive that would influence their Spiritual aspect, the same as we see other ailments/wounds become unhealable overtime in other works. 

[Yata]

How could someone deny a so polite request ?

[+Oltux72]

11 hours ago, Calderis said:

Gold is a temporal metal in Allomancy, Feruchemy doesn't the same classifications, and Cosmere healing doesn't restore to a previous state, it matches you to your Spiritual Aspect.

That I am afraid cannot be the whole answer, because the healing works on children. If it would work on an eternal template only how come it fits the age of your body? Also you can heal by Forging. That works by redoing your past. Should we really assume the same effect is done in two different ways?

[HSuperLee]

4 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

That I am afraid cannot be the whole answer, because the healing works on children. If it would work on an eternal template only how come it fits the age of your body? Also you can heal by Forging. That works by redoing your past. Should we really assume the same effect is done in two different ways?

Age is remembered by a person's spirit. It's why Rashek needed a constant supply of Atium to stay young. His soul knew he was supposed to be 1,000 years old, and thus he kept accumulating a Feruchemical equivalent of debt that he had to pay off through compounding. When a child heals, their soul knows how old they're supposed to be, and doesn't alter that.

Emperor's Soul spoilers, kinda:

Spoiler

As for the forging thing, I guess it depends on how different you perceive it to be from other healing methods. Stormlight and gold basically just provide the body with the investiture necessary to mold itself into matching a person's spirit, filtered through their perception of themself. Forgery is actively convincing the spirit, mind, and body that they are something they are not. We know forgery actually consumes very little investiture, opposed to the rather high amounts of gold and stormlight. So presumably, it uses a much more efficient method of healing, and I would say is different enough to be considered completely different.

But, I guess healing is healing. Would a splint vs a cast vs sewing bones directly together to help heal a break be considered different methods or just variations of the same method? I guess it depends on how you look at it.

Edited October 23, 2018 by HSuperLee
Covering spoilers

[Calderis]

6 hours ago, Oltux72 said:

That I am afraid cannot be the whole answer, because the healing works on children. If it would work on an eternal template only how come it fits the age of your body? Also you can heal by Forging. That works by redoing your past. Should we really assume the same effect is done in two different ways?

The spiritual is not eternal or immutable or perfect. At least not in the ways we typically use those words. Age is not only a part of your spiritweb, but because of that, age related illnesses also persist. 

But it is Spiritual. 

Quote

Logic_Nuke

Could decapitation kill a Gold Compounder? With a guillotine, for example?

Brandon Sanderson

Most forms of extreme cosmere healing don't care much what is done to the physical body, as the person's spiritual template is in power at the time.

source

Spoilered for length 

Spoiler

Iceblade44

So White Sand [than Elantris] is earlier... Then how the heck old is Kriss then? Will we ever get an answer as to why every worldhopper is flipin immortal?

Brandon Sanderson

There is some time-dialation going on. I'll explain it eventually; we're almost to the point where I can start talking about that. Suffice it to say that there's a mix of both actual slowing of the aging process and relative time going on, depending on the individual. Very few are actually immortal.

Faera

Implying that some are actually immortal?

Brandon Sanderson

Depends on which definition of immortal you mean.

Doesn't age, but can be killed by conventional means. (You've seen some of these in the cosmere, but I'll leave you to discuss who.)

Heals from wounds, but still ages. (Knights Radiant with Stormlight are like this.)

Reborn when killed. (The Heralds.)

Doesn't age and can heal, but dependent upon magic to stay this way, and so have distinct weakness to be exploited. (The Lord Ruler, among others.)

Hive beings who are constantly losing individual members, but maintaining a persistent personality spread across all of them, immortal in that as long as too much of the hive isn't wiped out, the personality can persist. (The sleepless.)

Bits of sapient magic, eternal and endless, though the personality can be "destroyed" in specific ways. (Seons. Spren. Nightblood. Cognitive Shadows, like a certain character from Scadrial.)

Shards (Really just a supercharged version of the previous category.)

And then, of course, there's Hoid. I'm not going to say which category, if any, he's in.

Some of these blend together--the Heralds, for example, are technically a variety of cognitive shadow. I'm not saying each of these categories above are distinct, intended to be the end-all definitions. They're off the cuff groupings I made to explain a point: immortality is a theme of the cosmere works--which, at their core, are experiments on what happens when men are given the power of deity.

Shagomir

Heals from wounds, but still ages.

Would Bloodmaker Ferrings exist in this category as well? If not, what about someone compounding Gold?

Brandon Sanderson

Yes, you are correct.

Shagomir

As a Bloodmaker ages what keeps them from healing the damage and carrying on as a very old, but very healthy person? Do they come to a point where they can't store enough health to stave off the aches, pains, diseases, and other things that come with old age?

This makes sense for traditional Feruchemy as it is end-neutral, so storing health becomes a zero sum game - eventually, you're going to get sick and you're not going to be able to overcome it with your natural healing ability no matter how much you manipulate it with a goldmind.

...Unless you've got a supply of Identity-less goldminds lying around. Would a Bloodmaker with a sufficient source of identity-less goldminds (or the ability to compound, thus bypassing the end-neutral part of Feruchemy) eventually just die from being too old?

Brandon Sanderson

Basically, yes. They can heal their body to match their spiritual ideal, but some things (like some genetic diseases, and age-related illnesses) are seen as part of the ideal. Depends on several factors.

source

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R'Shara [PENDING REVIEW]

Would stormlight healing, Progression, or Feruchemical gold healing count as some of the ways that a transgender person could change their body to match their identity?

Brandon Sanderson [PENDING REVIEW]

Yes. Those would work. In fact, that's kind of the main way that you would make that happen. Injections of Investiture making the body match the Spiritual and Cognitive.

source

 

Edited October 23, 2018 by Calderis

[RShara]

Maybe because the gold Ferring doesn't often bother to heal all the way down to the bone scarring level? They heal themselves functional, but don't often have enough saved u p to bother with making sure their bones are pristine.