Zas678

theory: Galladon in WoK

161 posts in this topic

Braandon's said it's possible to get all the powers to work on other worlds but the way it was said implies that there may be difficulties doing that with some of them.

I thought that had to do with the users/people from other worlds-something along the lines of a particular spiritual DNA being necessary, rather than proximity/location. This is the quote I'm thinking of

"Some of the magic systems have been discovered on different planets, and some of them do work. A lot of them don't, but some of them do. It depends on your spiritual DNA, what people are able to do, and things like that. But, if you find a way to do illusion magic in one of my worlds it's going to work pretty much like Lightweaving, regardless of which planet you're on. If that makes sense. "

I read that as meaning that people from various planets can do certain types of magic because they were created by their gods to have those powers. So an Elantrian with the right magical spiritual DNA could go to Roshar and still keep his superpowers.

Edited by fyodor
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My gut still tells me Vasher. But I haven't found a description with him having dark skin.

Not to overcomplicate things, but can't Vasher look like...whatever he wants to look like? Doesn't that sort of rule him out as a recognizable character?

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Not to overcomplicate things, but can't Vasher look like...whatever he wants to look like? Doesn't that sort of rule him out as a recognizable character?

No he can't. He looks like whatever he thinks himself of. Who he thinks he is. An exaggerated example would be if he was feeling super confident, so as a natural result he found himself a tiny bit taller, and possibly not have stubble. But I don't think he can entirely choose what he looks like, because it's hard seeing youself as something that you're not. He can change between Returned self and non-Returned self because he is both- he knows that he's returned, and he remembers what he did when he was Returned. However, he doesn't think that he's entirely worthy of being a Returned. Due to self-worth issues, he also sees himself as a scraggly, stubbly normal person.

But he's not suddenly going to be able to change his nose, or his hair, or even his eyes. His sense of self is too strong (especially after several hundred years).

Now maybe if he was able to store Identity, that would open up a world of possibilities.

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I dunno I reckon he has a fair amount of self control when he needs it, if he really wanted to look diff I think he could pull it off!

But personally I don't think it's him, think its more likely to be ppl from sel, just saying!

Edited by Wispsy
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No he can't. He looks like whatever he thinks himself of. Who he thinks he is. An exaggerated example would be if he was feeling super confident, so as a natural result he found himself a tiny bit taller, and possibly not have stubble. But I don't think he can entirely choose what he looks like, because it's hard seeing youself as something that you're not. He can change between Returned self and non-Returned self because he is both- he knows that he's returned, and he remembers what he did when he was Returned. However, he doesn't think that he's entirely worthy of being a Returned. Due to self-worth issues, he also sees himself as a scraggly, stubbly normal person.

But he's not suddenly going to be able to change his nose, or his hair, or even his eyes. His sense of self is too strong (especially after several hundred years).

Now maybe if he was able to store Identity, that would open up a world of possibilities.

Brandon was once asked why Susebron didn't just grow his tongue back in order to get around his limitations. He said there are limits on how much the Returned can change themselves, and that they would be explained in a later book. Thus these statements you make seem to be generally correct, but I would also guess that there is a baseline of some sort that he can't deviate from "at will." However, it seems that hair color is something that can be changed at will. More study is needed.

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I would think that if any magic system would be thoroughly "land-locked" it would be the Aons in Elantris, based upon the Aon's inherent connection with the land.

However, I think Allomancers would be able to burn metals on other planets as, as it has been explained, the magic isn't in the metals but in the "spirit web". The metals are simply the focus for the power. However, I doubt the resources needed for Allomancy, perfectly proportioned alloys and metals in huge quantity, would be available on other planets.

Likewise, while Awakening may work on other planets, there are not huge populations of people with "Breath" as there is on Nalthis. Any Awakening would have to rely on their own number of breaths with no more. For this reason, any Returned (aside from Vasher, I suppose) would die by the end of the week.

Sounds like Lightweaving works pretty much everywhere. Which is good news for Hoid. Perhaps mere ambient light is the focus, readily available everywhere.

Edit: also I haven't read the whole thread so if I just said stupid, disproven things or things that have been said already, I apologize.

Edited by Yados
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Seems to me that if Brandon says "it should be a character you could figure out" that he would mean "should be a character who you know COULD look like this". Which could be Vasher. My personal belief on Returned appearance is they can change how they look, but it will always be different versions of themselves: "Me, if I were 7' and muscular. Me, if I lived on the streets for years. Me, as the bodyguard of some traveling scholars on an unfamiliar planet." Also, Blunt is the word for Vasher's personality if ever there was one.

Not that I'm entirely sold on Blunt being Vasher, but I'm not going to discount it.

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Here's the thing: the original post says:

Brandon said that the character's physical description is quite similar in Way of Kings and in the original source material.

Which means that the description between the two books should be the same. What we need to do is do a ctrl+f the other books with the way the two companions are described.

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Here's the thing: the original post says:

Which means that the description between the two books should be the same. What we need to do is do a ctrl+f the other books with the way the two companions are described.

The only one I can find that matches at all is Demoux.

Thinker:

The third man had light tan skin, like an Alethi. He didn’t seem quite right either, though. The eyes were the wrong shape, and his accent was certainly not Alethi. He spoke the Selay language worse than the other two, and usually stayed quiet. He seemed thoughtful, though. Ishikk called him Thinker.

Wonder how he earned that scar across his scalp

Demoux

The left side of his scalp missing a large patch of hair where a koloss blade had nearly taken his head.

Any of the returned could be of course but no description that I can find matches.

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The only one I can find that matches at all is Demoux.

Thinker:

Demoux

Any of the returned could be of course but no description that I can find matches.

I like this. Especially as I'm pretty sure that Scadrialians have light skin, due to the whole ash-blocking-the-sky thing.

Remember, Demoux is a Seer. I wonder if that helps get you access to Shadesmar...

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well it would mean he only needs one spike to become immortal, rather then two.....or maybe the Seventeenth Shard has immortality pills or something.

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Going back to a much earlier quote in the thread:

Also, I asked Brandon about this at the San Diego book signing, and got some more info on it. Someone else also asked a similar question, and together we learned that the language that Grumpy is speaking is Dula, and that "there's no reason a Dula couldn't be a member of the 17th Shard".

Remember - most Dula don't/can't become Elantrians. I don't think having magical powers/being immortal is a requirement for being part of the Seventeenth Shard.

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well seeing as the Mistborn series takes place several hundred years before WoK if Demoux didn't find some way to become immortal he'd be kind of dead.

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well seeing as the Mistborn series takes place several hundred years before WoK if Demoux didn't find some way to become immortal he'd be kind of dead.

Or a way of traveling through time, like Hoid does. (We still don't know how he does that)

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The only one I can find that matches at all is Demoux.

Thinker:

Demoux

Any of the returned could be of course but no description that I can find matches.

Innnteresting and good catch. I wonder exactly how that worked given the time elapse between the books.

Edited by fyodor
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Well to be fair either hoid or the seventeenth shard were there at the time too (ye we know hoid was but the seventeenth shard also seems rly old :P) from the ads arcanum (they wouldn't have been an option if they weren't around right!) so the seventeenth shard could have been recruiting at the time and saw potential in him!

Not saying it has to be him just saying its possible!

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Personally I really like the idea that the Thinker is Demoux. I liked him the second that he appeared in M:TFA. Unfortunately I see a couple problems. First I don't really remember Demoux being the kind of person who would be thoughtful. He was actually a bit rash, especially when he leaped to fight Bilg(?) in that duel. But I will concede that he could have changed over the centuries from Mistborn to Alloy of Law. Another problem is immortality. I forgot that he was a Seer, which puts him one step closer to immortality, but he would need the ability to store age. However Marsh has mysteriously obtained that ability too so I won't discount the possibility that Demoux did too. And the last is that he would have to leave behind his Terriswoman wife. That would make me sad, but I guess he could have joined up after she died. Hmm, I seem to have discounted all of my own qualms as I was typing them. Haha I guess I support Demoux for the Thinker then.

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Pretty sure. Peter's implied it in the following:

You should have asked the second half on record, because I'm positive he would not say there was more than one Elantrian in the interlude. I know exactly who the three people are.

So I suppose they might be a Selian, and just not an Elantrian. But who fits that criteria?

As to this:

Remember - most Dula don't/can't become Elantrians. I don't think having magical powers/being immortal is a requirement for being part of the Seventeenth Shard.

We first see Galladon (the Dula) in Elantris, because he, like Raoden, has become an Elantrian. Being a Dula doesn't mean that you can't be an Elantrian- it's less likely, but it's still possible.

The Demoux is a nice catch. I had forgotten that he had a scar. I'll have to see if I can't drag up some more descriptions on him.

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Confirmed at the signing tonight that Demoux is one of people here. See 17th Shard's (misspelled) tweets.

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I still have a question.

How in Damnation is Demoux still alive? And worldhopping? I am going to say lightweaving for now, since we know that can work almost everywhere. But still. Well played Brandon, well played.

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only thing I can think of is hemalurgy as he only needed one spike to pull off the atium-compounding thing, of course, then you have to wonder where he's getting the atium. And where he got the spike from. Or whatever trick Hoid uses to skip forward in time I guess.

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Well he joined the seventeenth shard it seems and they can clearly world hop and be immortal so there could be any number of ways we don't know of that they may have used to help him! That or sazed just didn't wanna see him die lol

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Well he joined the seventeenth shard it seems and they can clearly world hop and be immortal so there could be any number of ways we don't know of that they may have used to help him! That or sazed just didn't wanna see him die lol

17th shard has elantrian members. Two of the Aons are health and age. From what I understand this is what elantrians are functionally immortal. There is no reason they could not use these aons on others as well.

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if they have galladon and demoux then they are prob trying to do something good in the cosmere at least! xD adds credence to the ars arcanum being seventeenth shard too imo

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