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[OB]Is Navani becomming a Squire

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It is assumed that Sibling is a God Spren of bondsmiths.

There is also theory that he is a spren of Urithuru Megafabrial.

Navani is an artifabrian, what may bee a connection to the sibling?

She is obviously close to Dalinar and there was an entire chapter about her "keeping the kingdom together".

Do you think she could become Dalinar's squire, and then bond with Sibling?

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I don't think Bondsmiths have squires. After all, there's only ever been three of them at a time, so it's not like they need recruits like the Windrunners do. In fact, that's one of the main distinctions between different orders of Radiants: if and how they recruit. I don't expect there to be many Truthwatchers, either, as those are the two orders at the center of the double-eye diagram.

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Could the Sibling be the real old magic spren and cultivation just coopted it. After all, we have stormfather, Nightwatcher and I doubt the sibling would be odium superspren and it seems redundant to have a combined cultivation/honor superspren

Edited by Angsos
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Ditto to the Bondsmiths having no squires. In fact, due to their nature and the nature of the spren they bond it could be argued that the rest of the Knights Radient, the other 9 Orders would function as Bondsmith squires. That doesn't preclude the idea that Navani bonds the Sibling, although some readers may feel Kholin overload. It brings to mind a question though. How were ancient Bondsmiths picked? Were they just randomly selected or were they promoted from other Orders?

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however it was in the past, now will probably be different because Nale has spent the past 2 1/2 thousand years killing all memory or potential. Stormfather probably, I doubt he'll tell dalinar though. Someone should ask brandon if all potential bondsmiths have appeared onscreen, as it were, yet because he'd most likely RAFO will nightwatcher and the sibling be bonded or give an Aes Sedai answer

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2 hours ago, Rainier said:

I don't expect there to be many Truthwatchers, either, as those are the two orders at the center of the double-eye diagram.

The weird thing is, we've already seen three Truthwatchers - Renarin, Ym and Stump.  And all of those have bonded spren independently, without being a squire first.  I think the only other example so far of multiple Radiants independently bonding spren from the same Order would be Shallan and Elhokar (although Elhokar didn't even bond the spren so that doesn't really count). So since we've seen three of them, it would surprise me if Truthwatchers were one of the less common Orders, even though that does make sense if they're at the center of the diagram with the Bondsmith symbol.  

32 minutes ago, Bigmikey357 said:

That doesn't preclude the idea that Navani bonds the Sibling, although some readers may feel Kholin overload. 

Because so many Kholins have become Radiants already, I feel like you're supposed to assume that Navani will become the Sibling Bondsmith.  She is the obvious choice.  But I get the impression for some reason that Brandon will surprise us, by distracting us with Navani and then picking someone totally unexpected to bond the Sibling - I suggested on a different thread recently that it could be Ialai Sadeas, which is an idea I really like.  

Edited by Llarimar
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1 hour ago, Llarimar said:

The weird thing is, we've already seen three Truthwatchers - Renarin, Ym and Stump.  And all of those have bonded spren independently, without being a squire first.  I think the only other example so far of multiple Radiants independently bonding spren from the same Order would be Shallan and Elhokar (although Elhokar didn't even bond the spren so that doesn't really count). So since we've seen three of them, it would surprise me if Truthwatchers were one of

The in world Words of Radiance makes a significant point of the limited number of Bondsmiths. It makes no such note for Truthwatchers that we were shown. 

Quote

"Now, as the Truthwatchers were esoteric in nature, their order being formed entirely of those who never spoke or wrote of what they did, in this lies frustration for those who would see their exceeding secrecy from the outside; they were not naturally inclined to explanation; and in the case of Corberon’s disagreements, their silence was not a sign of an exceeding abundance of disdain, but rather an exceeding abundance of tact."

I think that the Bondsmiths are notably different here, in that each of the three bonds a unique spren. Truthwatchers have a specific spren type, and as such, even if they are less numerous, I think they would be much more in line with the other orders. 

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I like the theory that the bondsmith's equivalent of squires is pretty much other knights radiant.  In the sense that their powers, rather than giving abilities to ordinary people, instead supercharge other knights radiant

Edited by quadbox
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The thing with Navani as a Bondsmith is: what would it add to the story? Uniting? No, we already have a unification guy, in Dalinar. Building? I guess, but does she need to be a Bondsmith to do that?

The problem with having Navani as a Bondsmith, as I see it, is that it results in us having two Bondsmiths with the exact same agenda, the same last name, at the same place. The idea of someone like Mr T works so much better because he feels different from Dalinar in a lot of ways. Navani doesn’t. She feels more like an extension of Dalinar. I would vastly prefer someone who was different from him. Someone like Rlain (as another recent theory proposed), Taravangian etc. 

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I highly doubt that Navani will be a Bondsmith, or any other Radiant for that matter. She is kind of the Sokka of Team Kholin, has no powers but is brilliant in her own way (Fabrials). She is also the mom of the team and a supporting character. Also, the Kholin family has an extraordinary number of Radiants in it already. Five at last count, and if the theory that Jasnah and Kaladin end up together turns out, then that would be six radiants. Add Navani and that would be seven. That is just way too much power in the hands of one family. I do not see Brandon doing something like that.

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11 hours ago, Toaster Retribution said:

The problem with having Navani as a Bondsmith, as I see it, is that it results in us having two Bondsmiths with the exact same agenda, the same last name, at the same place. The idea of someone like Mr T works so much better because he feels different from Dalinar in a lot of ways. Navani doesn’t. She feels more like an extension of Dalinar. I would vastly prefer someone who was different from him. Someone like Rlain (as another recent theory proposed), Taravangian etc. 

What about Kadash, Dalinar's ardent friend?  That might be interesting.  Come to think of it, it would be interesting if Kadash became a Radiant in general, not specifically a Bondsmith.  

For some reason, I feel like all of the other Bondsmiths will be leaders, or at least people with a significant position of authority.  The Bondsmiths are such important, influential Radiants that I can't imagine someone insignificant like Kaladin or Shallan becoming one.  That is why suggestions like Taravangian, Ialai and Kadash (as a high-ranking member of the ardentia) make sense to me, and suggestions like Rlain or Rysn (as I've seen suggested before) do not, because they are relatively unimportant and have no political power.  However, if Rlain finds the lost Parshendi and becomes their leader (as suggested on another recent thread) that could place him in a position of authority to become a viable Bondsmith.  

Edited by Llarimar
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@Llarimar I agree, and Rlain is based on the idea that he does become a Parsh leader. I can’t see Rysn at all though. Where was she suggested?

Another potential Bondsmith could be Rock. He might end up king of the Horneaters and thus a leader. This would probably interfere with his path as a Windrunner though. I do think that Rock would be a better fit for Bondsmith than 

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9 hours ago, Toaster Retribution said:

@Llarimar I agree, and Rlain is based on the idea that he does become a Parsh leader. I can’t see Rysn at all though. Where was she suggested?

I don't think this is where I originally saw it suggested, but here is a whole thread that talks about Rysn becoming the Sibling Bondsmith.

Crackpot Theory: Rysn

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So... my thoughts:

  • If Navani becomes a Squire/Radiant, it should complement her Fabrial-Tech in some way.
  • I do not think she will become a Radiant, of any order.
  • I'm not opposed to her becoming a Squire, but I don't want her to be a Bondsmith Squire.

I imagine she's gonna stay as the non-powered Fabrial expert, but if she does become powered, my money's on Willshaper Squire.

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I think we are all getting worked up too much regarding the number of Kholin Radients. This is probably due to having all of the main protagonists having connection to the Kholin fam. But this should be the last time the Radient count is so low. Presumably one of the reasons for the 1 year time skip is to allow for the repopulation of the Radient ranks. Dalinar is a Bondsmith; he and his will always have outsize importance but the difference becomes less pronounced the more Radients there are. Navani becoming a Radient wouldn't particularly bother me but I might be in the minority.

Still makes me wonder how does one become a Bondsmith?  Dalinar's journey isn't very enlightening since his spren is unique. We pretty much know every other order and how they choose people, what the spren are attracted to in their people. You would think the other Bondsmiths were going to be important people because Dalinar is important and there is only 3 of them. But spren don't look at the world in the same way humanity does. Their definition of important almost certainly won't match a human definition. Also, anyone the Sibling or Nightwatcher chooses for their bondmate becomes one of the 3 most important people on Roshar by default. It could be some half blind peasant from Reshii that wakes the Sibling, says the Words and becomes the warden of Urithiru and would bring nothing else to the table and still be stupid important. The point is we don't know. We don't even know the identity of the Sibling. We don't know the choice criterion for either the Sibling or Nightwatcher. We know Galivar and Dalinar were candidates for Bondsmith, but was that just for Stormfather or could Dalinar have bonded either of the other 2? Was Galivar destined to become bonded to SF had he lived or was he earmarked for NW instead? I am very curious to find out more.

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1 hour ago, Bigmikey357 said:

Still makes me wonder how does one become a Bondsmith?  Dalinar's journey isn't very enlightening since his spren is unique

That's the issue with Bondsmiths, all of the three spren are unique. We have no way of gauging what the Spren will look for in a bond mate because they aren't the same spren. 

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There's also the question of whether each Bondsmith swears the same (Second to Fifth) Ideals as the other two.  I can't help but feel like the Nightwatcher and the Sibling have very different methods of leadership and cooperation, particularly the Nightwatcher as she is mostly of Cultivation (growth and development) and not Honor (unity and upholding promises).  It's part of why I think Navani could be another potential Bondsmith, but bonded to the Nightwatcher simply because Navani tends to "cultivate" talents and cooperation in others by encouraging them to work together to solve problems; she encourages people to grow in both interpersonal skills and their own abilities.  The best example of this would be the projects such as the levitating platforms during Words of Radiance.  Navani also has a great deal of experience in the give-and-take ("boons and curses") aspects of leadership as well, as seen when she's proposing how the coalition can work (the Azish with administration, Thaylens with trade, and so on).

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