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KnightRadiant301

[OB] The 3rd Bondsmith or the 10th Unmade?

Question

I've always found it weird that there are only 9 Unmade.

I know Brandon mentioned that the 9 unmade that were similar to the orders of knights and the Bond smith was the exception. Could there be a reason for this? My theory so far has been that since, the bond smiths bond with three "god" spren the Stormfather, the Nightwatcher, and the "Sibling". And the stormfather is of Honor, the nightwatcher of Cultivation, than the sibling must be of Odium. Could the bondsmith be the replacement of the Unmade?

This bondsmith wouldn't necessarily be evil, but we've seen through Maleta that the KnightRadiants aren't all good and righteous. The bondsmith would see the other side of the conflict, this could explain some of the conflict within the Knights.

Is my theory reasonable? Do you guys have any better theories for this? If I'm right, who could the sibling be?

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Ya know I actually just put a thread forward on this. To summarize that discussion... We have WOB's that 1. there are not, in fact, 10 Unmade and 2. Braize works in nines the same way Roshar works in tens. Also, while there is nothing contradicting the theory, that may just be due to the lack of evidence one way or the other. All we have are a few reasonable-sounding deductions.

It's still, in my opinion, extremely likely that the three Bondsmiths have a representative from each Shard. This places an Odiumspren as by far the most likely candidate for Siblinghood; the Odiumspren in question still seems to call back to the Unmade since they are the most powerful Odiumspren we've seen by a longshot. Perhaps they are the enigmatic ninth Unmade, or perhaps when the Sibling became a Bondsmith spren, it forfeited its Unmade tag. Or, it could be that it was never un-made in the first place.

Personally, I still believe the theory to be reasonable, but what you and I both have to accept is that it's almost entirely speculation. Which I am fine with.

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If I recall, there are two relevant WoBs on this subject. One says that 9 is an important number on Braize, and the other says that the number of unmade (which is 9) is "fixed." But these two facts aren't necessarily responsible for one another. The number of unmade might only be "fixed" because Odium has lost the ability to create more. Maybe there were once ten, and he lost one, which became the Sibling. The WoBs are clear that there are nine, but they don't say there were always nine.

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8 hours ago, Remodel said:

I have always belived that Cusicesh is the third bondsmith spren. 

I never thought about Cusicesh as a spren of Odium but it makes sense. Perhaps that's why he still sleeps, hiding from Odium by sacrificeing sention until the time is right to bond a human again. Spren seem to gain some protection from Odium with the bond making them stronger. 

Here's a thread about Cusicesh, and some WoBs about him.

 

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I have always belived that Cusicesh is the third bondsmith spren. 

I never thought about Cusicesh as a spren of Odium but it makes sense. Perhaps that's why he still sleeps, hiding from Odium by sacrificeing sention until the time is right to bond a human again. Spren seem to gain some protection from Odium with the bond making them stronger. 

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@Caevita @Belzedar

One of you says there is WoB that there are nine Unmade, one says there is WoB that says there are not nine. Could you please find your relevant WoBs to support this please, since you are directly contradicting each other, and both say there are WoBs to back you up.

@KnightRadiant301

It is my belief that the Unmade are somehow related to the Heralds. Initially I thought they were created when a Herald breaks for the first time, but later came to wonder if the Unmade were somehow crafted from something the Heralds left behind when they signed the Oathpact. There is a link in my signature to the thread where it is discussed.

As for the Sibling, I don't think we've met the Sibling yet, but believe he/she/it has something to do with the earth, or stone, or crem.

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6 hours ago, Bort said:

One of you says there is WoB that there are nine Unmade, one says there is WoB that says there are not nine. Could you please find your relevant WoBs to support this please, since you are directly contradicting each other, and both say there are WoBs to back you up.

They're actually both in agreement.  Caevita said that there are not ten; Belzedar said that there are nine.  

 

On 3/16/2018 at 1:23 AM, Caevita said:

there are not, in fact, 10 Unmade

On 3/16/2018 at 9:10 AM, Belzedar said:

the number of unmade (which is 9) is "fixed."

 

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I've always taken the fact that Odium has 9 Unmade while Honor had his 10 Heralds to take that Odium is looking at endgame more than anything else. By creating less Splinters he will have access to more raw Investiture for when he finally got a shot to kill Honor and splinter the Shard.

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Is there any indication that Odium actually controls the odiumspren? It seems more likely it's a situation like Cultivation and the Nightwatcher, she can watch over the spren but can't control it. If Odium wants to intervene, he has to do so directly.

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12 hours ago, Beltway2A said:

Is there any indication that Odium actually controls the odiumspren? It seems more likely it's a situation like Cultivation and the Nightwatcher, she can watch over the spren but can't control it. If Odium wants to intervene, he has to do so directly.

Odium doesn't control them directly... But they are composed of his investiture and as such can be compelled to act. This is what Sja-anat says was done with her in corrupting the Oathgate. 

As to the main question in this thread, I don't think that the sibling is an Odiumspren, precisely because I think that to bind an Unmade is to become a Bondsmith. 

Quote

But as for the Bondsmiths, they had members only three, which number was not uncommon for them; nor did they seek to increase this by great bounds, for during the times of Madasa, only one of their order was in continual accompaniment of Urithiru and its thrones. Their spren was understood to be specific, and to persuade them to grow to the magnitude of the other orders was seen as seditious.
—From Words of Radiance, chapter 16, page 14

Why would growing their numbers be seditious? Because the only spren beyond the three that could result in more of them were tied to their enemy. 

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