Seonid

Long Game 43: Under the Banner of Adonalsium

1,386 posts in this topic

1 hour ago, TheYoungPyromancer said:

What do people think of my analysys?

It might be best to wait until the game has started first to discuss strategy, which will be in about three days. Players don't tend to check the signups thread that much, so your potential audience is a lot smaller. Besides, you don't know what alignment you'll get, so you don't want to say anything that could potentially hurt your side later :P Once the game starts, though, feel free to post as much strategy as you can come up with.

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I think the 17th Heard could technically be considered village due to their win con but it's probably best to take this as a faction game with all the conversions going around?

Sign me up as Stick!

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I thought about alignment and I posted it here so people would not assume I was one of the other two factions. Now I can reference this if necessary to prove my innocence.

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10 hours ago, Arraenae said:

It might be best to wait until the game has started first to discuss strategy, which will be in about three days. Players don't tend to check the signups thread that much, so your potential audience is a lot smaller. Besides, you don't know what alignment you'll get, so you don't want to say anything that could potentially hurt your side later :P Once the game starts, though, feel free to post as much strategy as you can come up with.

I'd say that Pre-game strats are the best! Getting ideas out now help decide the tone of the game, before we start playing.

@TheYoungPyromancer I'd say that we should treat this mostly as a faction game, as there are going to be a lot of factions by the end of this, I would assume. I'm thinking that we will have one of Odium, one of Ruin, (As those shards are unlikely to be passed), as well as Khriss and Hoid being factions as well. This also leaves the village.

As for freeing shards: I don't think it is entirely in the village's best interest to start off wanting to free shards. If most of the village/17th decides to no free shards then we will gain an advantage in the early stages of the game, and could get lucky and Kill off the Hoid and Khriss before the shards are released, and end up getting an early win.

Once the first shard is pulled out of containment, then I think it would be wise for the village to start going after them, in full force.

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True, but all factions will go after cultivation pretty quickly, since PMs, and, for the other factions, un-breaking shards, is VERY tempting,

I also think in this game especially we should pay attention to what has, in my mind, been a major mistake in past conversion games. Your goal is not for your faction to win. It is for you to win. This means setting no up techniques to for others to know if you were converted. If you did get converted, it makes it really hard to win. This means that you may WANT to be converted to have a higher chance of winning.

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3 minutes ago, TheYoungPyromancer said:

True, but all factions will go after cultivation pretty quickly, since PMs, and, for the other factions, un-breaking shards, is VERY tempting,

I also think in this game especially we should pay attention to what has, in my mind, been a major mistake in past conversion games. Your goal is not for your faction to win. It is for you to win. This means setting no up techniques to for others to know if you were converted. If you did get converted, it makes it really hard to win. This means that you may WANT to be converted to have a higher chance of winning.

I'd argue against that. Your goal should be playing for whatever faction you are currently a part of, if everyone were to play as if they were already part of the Chosen/Harmony then there is no chance that the 17th would win, as they would all already be playing as if they are not part of the 17th.

You may want to be converted, but, up until the moment that you are actually converted, I believe that you should play as if you were always going to be part of the faction you are currently a part of.

The other problem with playing as you want to get converted, is that you might play as if you are going to be converted, then never be converted and end up having just worked against yourself. As a player with a conversion, if there is a player already being useful to me and my faction, then I would rather just not convert them, and use them to further my goals without wasting a conversion on them.

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That is not what I was saying. I am not saying you should play as if you are going to be converted, I am saying you should act like you might. I will find an example of over-countering your chance of winning in a second.

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1 hour ago, TheYoungPyromancer said:

That is not what I was saying. I am not saying you should play as if you are going to be converted, I am saying you should act like you might. I will find an example of over-countering your chance of winning in a second.

There was a game a while back in which being converted would cost you your role, and several people had a way for them using their role to be verified. When one of them got converted, he got lynched the next cycle because that verification failed.

I see your point, btw. I'm often one of the people who looks for ways to use the rules to the factions advantage, but I understand why it's probably a bad thing to expect everyone to set-up an anti-conversion safeguard, and I might not do so myself either.

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On 3/10/2018 at 6:32 PM, MonsterMetroid said:

How does document access work in this game? what docs do exist? Can PM contents be copied into docs you have access to?

The following docs will exist: Adonalsium's Chosen, Standard of Harmony, Taldain, Braize, Roshar, Scadrial, Nalthis. Every cycle during which players worldhop to new worlds, a new doc will be created for the players on that world (if nobody on a given world worldhops away, the doc will remain, for my sanity's sake). For the two conversion factions, the doc will be treated as a normal Elim doc (yes, you can copy PMs). The rules governing Shardworld docs will be the same rules that govern PMs (no quoting other PMs you have, etc).

15 hours ago, TheYoungPyromancer said:

I will be signing up for my first game! I have read a good amount of previous games, so hopefully I will do okay.

Now, some strategy. I think it is in the interest of every single faction to free the shards. The village will statistically get the shard the most often, and if the village controls most of the shards, they will have a HUGE advantage. They will probably set up shard groups were they cycle around the shards to prevent corruption. As long as the village controlls one shard, Khriss and co can't win. The other two factions will go after the shards as well because they cannot win otherwise. Also, @Seonid, Have you actually come up with the powers of every single possible combination shard? Because I know that it will be my personal goal to discover as many as possible :P

EDIT: and my goal to see what happens if Ruin destroys all the planets. By the way, can Ruin even destroy Silverlight, as it isn't really a planet?

Welcome!! Glad to have you! Looks like your question already got answered, but yes, Ruin can blow up Silverlight.

14 hours ago, TheYoungPyromancer said:

I found a typo! I double-posted because it wouldn't let me edit in a quote.

Oops...

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I will sign up as Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III. I would like to be noticed by my full name please and thank you.

Edited by shanerockes
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55 minutes ago, shanerockes said:

I will sign up as Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III. I would like to be noticed by my full name please and thank you.

Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III must not have noticed that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III addressed Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III as 'I' (my apologies, humblest Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III) in Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III's introductory post, in which Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III let it be known that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III is to be known as Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III. Clearly, this is a travesty that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III can not overlook. :P

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I'm seriously thinking about making a return for this game, but I'm on the fence if I can invest the time. I also barely recognize anyone anymore! I guess t hat's what happens when i haven't played in almost 2 years...

Don't count me in yet, but let me see.

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28 minutes ago, Macen said:

I'm seriously thinking about making a return for this game, but I'm on the fence if I can invest the time. I also barely recognize anyone anymore! I guess t hat's what happens when i haven't played in almost 2 years...

Don't count me in yet, but let me see.

As much as I would like to play with some random person that I don't know... (it would actually be fun, don't read that as sarcastic :P) if you can't invest the time probably don't play. As the mods have been cracking down on inactivity recently.

That being said, if you do have the time, I'd love to play with you!

 

Edit:

@Young Bard

Quote

Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III must not have noticed that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III addressed Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III as 'I' (my apologies, humblest Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III) in Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III's introductory post, in which Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III let it be known that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III is to be known as Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III. Clearly, this is a travesty that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III can not overlook. :P

I also agree that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III, must have been at least slightly confused with Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III, as Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III obviously didn't notice that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III had just broken the rule that Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III had just set. I see this as being a problem for Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III who may get tired as constantly referring to Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III as Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III, no matter the situation.

Good luck, Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III, I wish Philepe De Pedro Von Leiderhuch Johnson III well.

Edited by Droughtbringer
Not double posts!
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1 hour ago, Macen said:

I'm seriously thinking about making a return for this game, but I'm on the fence if I can invest the time. I also barely recognize anyone anymore! I guess t hat's what happens when i haven't played in almost 2 years...

Don't count me in yet, but let me see.

I remember you! We even played a few games together back in the day.

If you think you'll have the time, we'd love to have you. If you don't think you'll have the time, feel free to sign up for the spec doc, where I'm sure there will be all manner of scintillating conversations.

 

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1 hour ago, Macen said:

I'm seriously thinking about making a return for this game, but I'm on the fence if I can invest the time. I also barely recognize anyone anymore! I guess t hat's what happens when i haven't played in almost 2 years...

Don't count me in yet, but let me see.

If you're not sure if you can make time for this LG, you could always consider joining MR28. :D

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I have heard much of the fabled shard games, and I would not wish to miss this one.

 

Sign me up as Everen. Everen is a Siah Aimian and resident of Silverlight. He wears a charcoal overcoat and a deep purple tie, and typically has a small black bird perched on his shoulder. He is partial to heartroot tea, and his shadow goes the wrong way.

Everen buys and sells some of the more abstract commodities. Most notably memories. He owns a set of copper needles that temporarily grant clients copper feruchemy. For the right price, he can help you forget something, or grant you skills and knowledge you do not wish to take the time to learn normally.

Everen is also (at least ostensibly) a member of the organization known as the 17th shard. He joined around the time the shards were being contained one-by-one, seeking to better understand the shards. He has basic access to Silverlight Laboratory and the ability to request grants for experiments involving shardic investiture, though he prefers to assist others in their own experiments.

 

The only reason I have not signed up earlier is because I needed to write a new character for this. Speaking of which, does anybody want to coordinate RP with Everen before the game starts? @Fifth Scholar @Steeldancer @Magestar @Hemalurgic Headshot @MonsterMetroid, off the top of my head all of you were making RP characters. Any chance any of you would be interested? :D

Edited by Drake Marshall
fixed spacing
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10 minutes ago, Drake Marshall said:

The only reason I have not signed up earlier is because I needed to write a new character for this. Speaking of which, does anybody want to coordinate RP with Everen before the game starts? @Fifth Scholar @Steeldancer @Magestar @Hemalurgic Headshot @MonsterMetroid, off the top of my head all of you were making RP characters. Any chance any of you would be interested? :D

Ah, tempting. And as a matter of fact, I would like to revise my character. Though Sareth is a promising sequel, I would prefer to leave him reserved for Roshar, that is, appearing in a physical form. However, for those who would have wished to see the Truthseeker have some screen time, do not fear, for his influence will not be absent from this game, not in the slightest.

No longer am I Sareth, but rather I am Jiamo, a Nalthian by birth, but an accomplished worldhopper in his own right. He prefers to dress according to his mood, and coordinates colors to match. His mismatched jewelry are adorned with varying gemstones, some of which glow. He is often caught up in his own mind, staring blankly off into space thinking who-knows-what.

And Drake, I think I'll take you up on your offer.

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3 hours ago, Macen said:

I'm seriously thinking about making a return for this game, but I'm on the fence if I can invest the time. I also barely recognize anyone anymore! I guess t hat's what happens when i haven't played in almost 2 years...

Don't count me in yet, but let me see.

Macen! You're on the shard again! How's life been?

I am also considering signing up, but i need to figure out the timing with next semester starting.

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5 hours ago, Seonid said:

The following docs will exist: Adonalsium's Chosen, Standard of Harmony, Taldain, Braize, Roshar, Scadrial, Nalthis.

What about Silverlight? Will it not have a doc? Oh, and Randuir, that was the game I was talking about. I did say I had read through a few games. That may be an understatement. I have been Kelsier-Ing the 17th shard for almost 6 months, subtly influencing the outcome of games.

Edited by TheYoungPyromancer
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1 hour ago, Hemalurgic Headshot said:

Ah, tempting. And as a matter of fact, I would like to revise my character. Though Sareth is a promising sequel, I would prefer to leave him reserved for Roshar, that is, appearing in a physical form. However, for those who would have wished to see the Truthseeker have some screen time, do not fear, for his influence will not be absent from this game, not in the slightest.

No longer am I Sareth, but rather I am Jiamo, a Nalthian by birth, but an accomplished worldhopper in his own right. He prefers to dress according to his mood, and coordinates colors to match. His mismatched jewelry are adorned with varying gemstones, some of which glow. He is often caught up in his own mind, staring blankly off into space thinking who-knows-what.

And Drake, I think I'll take you up on your offer.

Ah, lovely. Sareth was an enjoyable character, but it sounds like Sareth is still in the equation. Any particular thoughts or ideas for RP? :P

Is it generally allowed to send PMs before game to discuss RP?

EDIT: Also the offer still stands to everybody else for RP collaboration. A larger group may take effort to coordinate, but can make something more memorable perhaps.

Edited by Drake Marshall
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8 minutes ago, Drake Marshall said:

Is it generally allowed to send PMs before game to discuss RP?

Yes, definitely. Just don't discuss game-relevant stuff. 


Elaria lay on her back, staring up at the leafy foliage of one of Silverlight’s enormous indoor gardens and enjoying the silence. While the lab was objectively more useful in terms of resources, she made do with a simple notebook every once in a while in return for the chance to think somewhere more pleasant. 

They’d used to make fun of her for it, but she always had her best ideas for experiments out here. 

She yawned. At least, she had her best ideas for experiments when she didn’t fall asleep instead...


Signing up as Elaria, please. I expect I’ll focus more on RP than gameplay, in an effort to keep myself invested in the game more effectively, but we’ll see what happens. I look forward to playing with all of you.

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You know what, I’ll actually be Kelsier. @Drake Marshall, if you wish, I could attempt to role play, but I would probably be no good. I will take a stab at RP when I get back on a computer.

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22 hours ago, TheYoungPyromancer said:

I will be signing up for my first game! I have read a good amount of previous games, so hopefully I will do okay.

Now, some strategy. I think it is in the interest of every single faction to free the shards. The village will statistically get the shard the most often, and if the village controls most of the shards, they will have a HUGE advantage. They will probably set up shard groups were they cycle around the shards to prevent corruption. As long as the village controlls one shard, Khriss and co can't win. The other two factions will go after the shards as well because they cannot win otherwise. Also, @Seonid, Have you actually come up with the powers of every single possible combination shard? Because I know that it will be my personal goal to discover as many as possible :P

EDIT: and my goal to see what happens if Ruin destroys all the planets. By the way, can Ruin even destroy Silverlight, as it isn't really a planet?

While this is partly true, it's dangerous as a) Shard-passing groups are both difficult without PMs, B) make the chance of it coming into an elim's hands highly likely (and particularly of the rest of that group getting killed off), and c) people will be tempted to be converted by shards. Also, keep in mind that in order to win the 17th Shard needs every Shard back in containment. The more Shards that are uncontained, the harder that will be. 

Also, in the beginning, the eliminators won't have enough numbers to pull out Shards - if the villager were to abstain from taking any charges for a few cycles, that'd be a perfectly valid stratgety (though not one likely to occur). 

8 hours ago, TheYoungPyromancer said:

I thought about alignment and I posted it here so people would not assume I was one of the other two factions. Now I can reference this if necessary to prove my innocence.

Not really - you can reference it to prove that it isn't coming from a place where you're already evil, but having a baseline before the game actually makes it easier to hide as someone converted. So it makes your thought non-alignment indicative (ish - whether you bring it up again or not could be seen as indicating alignment in some way), but not saying anything about your innocence either. 

8 hours ago, Droughtbringer said:

Once the first shard is pulled out of containment, then I think it would be wise for the village to start going after them, in full force.

There's already one Shard out of containment at the beginning of the game, I believe. 

8 hours ago, TheYoungPyromancer said:

I also think in this game especially we should pay attention to what has, in my mind, been a major mistake in past conversion games. Your goal is not for your faction to win. It is for you to win. This means setting no up techniques to for others to know if you were converted. If you did get converted, it makes it really hard to win. This means that you may WANT to be converted to have a higher chance of winning.

This will vary based on the person. Often, but not always, playing to your current win condition is a more appropriate thing to do. Not everyone follows that rule, but in my opinion your goal is for you to achieve your win condition. If you work against said win condition because it's possible it could change, that's in a way betraying your win condition. As I see it, the game is supposed to work with each player playing to your win condition. 

Also, setting up techniques for others to know, in my opinion, makes the game more fun - we have had similar things happen in the past (with less absolute certainty of conversion involved), and in previous cases the person in question had to work harder to get around their own traps. I enjoy the idea of that challenge, personally. 

Basically, I wouldn't call that a major mistake. It's something that will vary based on the person, but is a perfectly legitimate style of play depending on your precise values about the game. 

Edited by Elbereth
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Good argument. Have an upvote! Where I live, I can hardly ever get anyone in a friendly debate, and I love friendly debates . I agree that it isn’t a major mistake. However, in one game that I recall, which randeur has mentioned, I think it went a little too far. I think that people may want to pass around shards more than you think. If Odium is obtained by someone, the win condition in previous games has been REALLY hard. 

On a different note, I really hope I get hoid. Seonid, please do not worry about my activity as I will play consistently. I do not want any doubts about my activity to prevent me from getting an important role. I really want to see as many shard combinations as possible.

Edit: oh, @Elbereth

Edited by TheYoungPyromancer
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