synobal Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 I count five, Amaram and what ever his group is doing, the Envsigers who might of basically just been a weird suicide cult, the ghost bloods, The Voren Church and their weird group and the Skybreakers who are maybe kinda secret? Did I miss any? Also why is it you can't walk around on Roshar with out stumbling upon a secret society trying to kill people for the greater good? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigvsben Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 You forgot Mr. T and the Diagram! Also the 17th Shard, though I imagine their actions are of less immediate import to Roshar than the other groups. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cracknut Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Don't forget Diagram and the best part about it? they're all trying to save the world :D 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinintendo Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 I believe it was reported there are around 10 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synobal Posted March 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 You forgot Mr. T and the Diagram! Also the 17th Shard, though I imagine their actions are of less immediate import to Roshar than the other groups. Ya he was who I meant by the Vorin church, isn't he the religious leader of that church? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shardbearer Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Ya he was who I meant by the Vorin church, isn't he the religious leader of that church? No. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sphinx Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Another question regarding the secret societies is how many of them was Gavilar involved with? Both the Diagram and the Sons of Honour reference Gavilar, and Gavilar's visions. Which I'm amazed not to see a thread about on the forums, unless I missed it? And clearly Gavilar knew about the Ghostbloods as well. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numb Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 I think the Diagram happened after Gavilar's visions. He was the motivation behind Mr. T going to Nightwatcher I think. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synobal Posted March 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Another question regarding the secret societies is how many of them was Gavilar involved with? Both the Diagram and the Sons of Honour reference Gavilar, and Gavilar's visions. Which I'm amazed not to see a thread about on the forums, unless I missed it? And clearly Gavilar knew about the Ghostbloods as well. I've no idea, but I think the Diagram just knew of Gavilar, I think the Sons of Honor (they are the ones that want to bring back the voidbringers ya?) were the group he was a part of/head of and the Ghost bloods were just their opposite number. Honestly I think we might need some sort of cheat sheet, listing all known secret societies and who their members are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grinachu Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 1. the Sons of Honour, Restares, Amaram, Gavilar were known members. Sought to restore the Voidbringers in order to bring back the Heralds. 2. The Ghostbloods - agenda is unknown. Mraize, Thaidakker, and Veil are known members. 3. Skybreakers, led by Nalan'Elin, - agenda is to prevent the rise of the Knights Radiant in the hope of forestalling a new Desolation. Also warring against stone shamanate of Shinovar. 4. Envisagers - agenda is to restore the Knights Radiant by placing themselves in positions of physical peril. May all be dead. 5. Taravingian & the Diagrammists. Agenda to protect humanity from the coming storm. Willing to do anything necessary to do so. 6. Stone Shamanate. Made Szeth "truthless" for unclear motives. Protecting the Honorblades (presumably for 4500 years) but have shown no desire to assume responsibility for humanity. Opposed to the return of the Knights' Radiant. 7.17th Shard. Looking for Hoid/Wit. Agenda: to stop his interference in Roshar/ Rosharian system. Presumably sent by the "old Reptile"/Dragon on Yolen. 8. Wit: - Agenda: to return the Knights Radiant and destroy Odium. May be willing to destroy humanity/Alethkar on Roshar to do so. 9. Zahel.- Agenda- not clear. 11 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shinintendo Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 (edited) Why nobody think to take Dalinar visions into advice I can't understand... I think by now all the spies reported to the factions about his visions (fliers spread about the specifics) Some of them just want to kill him,some ignore him, nobody want to join forces with him, maybe Amaram wanted to at some point, but now not. Couldn't they at some point in time just send him a letter? or are they just delusional they can all they work by themselves with so little man power. Edited March 11, 2014 by shinintendo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numb Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 All of them have done some pretty nasty stuff. Dalinar isn't a man that works like that so making him aware of their existence doesn't sound like a good idea. In fact almost all of them break the very first Radiant oath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
synobal Posted March 11, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 (edited) 1. the Sons of Honour, Restares, Amaram, Gavilar were known members. Sought to restore the Voidbringers in order to bring back the Heralds. 2. The Ghostbloods - agenda is unknown. Mraize, Thaidakker, and Veil are known members. 3. Skybreakers, led by Nalan'Elin, - agenda is to prevent the rise of the Knights Radiant in the hope of forestalling a new Desolation. Also warring against stone shamanate of Shinovar. 4. Envisagers - agenda is to restore the Knights Radiant by placing themselves in positions of physical peril. May all be dead. 5. Taravingian & the Diagrammists. Agenda to protect humanity from the coming storm. Willing to do anything necessary to do so. 6. Stone Shamanate. Made Szeth "truthless" for unclear motives. Protecting the Honorblades (presumably for 4500 years) but have shown no desire to assume responsibility for humanity. Opposed to the return of the Knights' Radiant. 7.17th Shard. Looking for Hoid/Wit. Agenda: to stop his interference in Roshar/ Rosharian system. Presumably sent by the "old Reptile"/Dragon on Yolen. 8. Wit: - Agenda: to return the Knights Radiant and destroy Odium. May be willing to destroy humanity/Alethkar on Roshar to do so. 9. Zahel.- Agenda- not clear. What about Eshonai's sister? Her name escapes me at the moment but it seemed that her and her scholars might of been some sort of secret group with an agenda. Edited March 11, 2014 by synobal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grinachu Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 What about Eshonai's sister? Her name escapes me at the moment but it seemed that her and her scholars might of been some sort of secret group with an agenda. I think the agenda is not her scholars but in her sister. I think she has bonded with an Unmade spren or been influenced by Odium. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PudgyNinja Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 I think the agenda is not her scholars but in her sister. I think she has bonded with an Unmade spren or been influenced by Odium. If she had bonded with some strange spren, wouldn't her form have changed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ephemera Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 There is always another secret... society 14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marianmi Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 You are so totally wrong about Wit's agenda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numb Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 If she had bonded with some strange spren, wouldn't her form have changed? She could have been bonded with a spren that gave her lightweaving. Eshonai's personally changed drastically and she mentions how her sister seems exactly the same. Seems like a rather big hint that someone was/is amiss with her. She also knowingly brought back their "gods" which is against everything they believe in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grinachu Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 You are so totally wrong about Wit's agenda Please enlighten us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiamondMind Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 (edited) Please enlighten us Wit and Zahel (Vasher) definitely do not count as secret societies. As for Wit's agenda, all we know is that he wants to do something to stop Odium's power, presumably to stop him from Splintering any more Shards. Here's a revised list, with additions underlined: 1. the Sons of Honour: Restares, Amaram, Gavilar (maybe- he might have had the idea but not created the organization) were known members. Sought to restore the Voidbringers in order to bring back the Heralds and restore the supremacy of the Vorin church. 2. The Ghostbloods - agenda is unknown. Mraize, Thaidakar, and Veil are known members. They are opposed to the Sons of Honor. They might be able to align with the Knights Radiant. Might be Worldhoppers. 3. Skybreakers, led by Nalan, - agenda is to prevent the rise of the Knights Radiant in the hope of forestalling a new Desolation. Also warring against stone shamanate of Shinovar. (maybe, Nalan's intentions are unclear.) 4. Envisagers - agenda is to restore themselves as the Knights Radiant by placing themselves in positions of physical peril. May all be dead. 5. Taravingian & the Diagrammists. Agenda to protect a remnant of humanity from the coming storm. Willing to do anything necessary to do so. 6. Stone Shamanate. Made Szeth "truthless" for unclear motives because, at the very least, he predicted the return of the Knights Radiant. Protecting the Honorblades (presumably for 4500 years) but have shown no desire to assume responsibility for humanity. Opposed to the return of the Knights' Radiant. 7.17th Shard. Looking for Hoid/Wit. Agenda: to stop his interference in Roshar/ Rosharian system. We actually have no idea what they want with him. Presumably sent by "Friends" with the "old Reptile"/Dragon on from Yolen. Edited March 12, 2014 by DiamondMind 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crysanja Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 you can add the assessins to the Diagrammists. at least Graves spoke about the Diagram, but it might be a splinter group.(Danlan?, Moash?,Rill?)chapter 46+84 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seloun Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 ... 2. The Ghostbloods - agenda is unknown. Mraize, Thaidakar, and Veil are known members. They are opposed to the Sons of Honor. They might be able to align with the Knights Radiant. Might be Worldhoppers. This seems unlikely, if only because of the coachman scene in WoR. For some reason I get the feeling Lopen is more than he appears. Maybe it's the whole 'the Lopen' thing. He's got a lot of 'cousins' who act a lot like agents. I'll put out a crackpot theory that Lopen is head of one of the nine secret organizations (one whose name we don't know yet). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiamondMind Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 This seems unlikely, if only because of the coachman scene in WoR. For some reason I get the feeling Lopen is more than he appears. Maybe it's the whole 'the Lopen' thing. He's got a lot of 'cousins' who act a lot like agents. I'll put out a crackpot theory that Lopen is head of one of the nine secret organizations (one whose name we don't know yet). Unlikely, yes, but he did invite Shallan at the end of the book and said that their ideals aren't in conflict. He might just be trying to corrupt her. Lopen...it would be great, but we've seen inside his head. Maybe the Herdazian agents are the only actual good secret society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delightful Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 (edited) This seems unlikely, if only because of the coachman scene in WoR. For some reason I get the feeling Lopen is more than he appears. Maybe it's the whole 'the Lopen' thing. He's got a lot of 'cousins' who act a lot like agents. I'll put out a crackpot theory that Lopen is head of one of the nine secret organizations (one whose name we don't know yet). I started getting suspicious of Lopen when all his cousins kept turning up in bridge 4. I then realised we basically know nothing about his past except that he's a one armed herdazian. He's also unfailingly cheerful, never bitter about being a bridgeman or anything, ever. Add that to his perspective's Lopen, the Lopen and The Lopen..there's just something very slightly off about him. Edited March 12, 2014 by Delightful 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grinachu Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 Wit and Zahel (Vasher) definitely do not count as secret societies. As for Wit's agenda, all we know is that he wants to do something to stop Odium's power, presumably to stop him from Splintering any more Shards. Here's a revised list, with additions underlined: 1. the Sons of Honour: Restares, Amaram, Gavilar (maybe- he might have had the idea but not created the organization) were known members. Sought to restore the Voidbringers in order to bring back the Heralds and restore the supremacy of the Vorin church. 2. The Ghostbloods - agenda is unknown. Mraize, Thaidakar, and Veil are known members. They are opposed to the Sons of Honor. They might be able to align with the Knights Radiant. Might be Worldhoppers. 3. Skybreakers, led by Nalan, - agenda is to prevent the rise of the Knights Radiant in the hope of forestalling a new Desolation. Also warring against stone shamanate of Shinovar. (maybe, Nalan's intentions are unclear.) 4. Envisagers - agenda is to restore themselves as the Knights Radiant by placing themselves in positions of physical peril. May all be dead. 5. Taravingian & the Diagrammists. Agenda to protect a remnant of humanity from the coming storm. Willing to do anything necessary to do so. 6. Stone Shamanate. Made Szeth "truthless" for unclear motives because, at the very least, he predicted the return of the Knights Radiant. Protecting the Honorblades (presumably for 4500 years) but have shown no desire to assume responsibility for humanity. Opposed to the return of the Knights' Radiant. 7.17th Shard. Looking for Hoid/Wit. Agenda: to stop his interference in Roshar/ Rosharian system. We actually have no idea what they want with him. Presumably sent by "Friends" with the "old Reptile"/Dragon on from Yolen. I like your amendments, on the whole. 2. Actually they seem opposed to Amaram and his mission, not necessarily all the Sons of Honor. It seems surprising that all these societies haven't taken each other out as of yet or haven't destroyed each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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