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Silus - Shard of Flame

Awakening Can Make Returned...Sort Of

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By "royal breath" I simply meant her heritage passed down from Vo. We know there is something funky going on with the hair, and Denth, a returned, losses control of his hair when he dies. So its not exactly impossible.

So will Siri or Vivenna inherit?

I suspect the "secret" to the Returned having children has to do with giving up their divine breath so the child can live. Why this should translate into the descendants inheriting a portion of divine breath is beyond me. Why don't normal people healed by divine breath receive the same benefit? There's probably something more to it /shock

Actually, neither. Ridger presumably inherits, since Vivenna effectively abdicated.

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Was Ridger a son? I only remember there being 3 daughters and the wiki only lists them as well.

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Was Ridger a son? I only remember there being 3 daughters and the wiki only lists them as well.

Yes, Ridger was the second-born. He's not particularly important to the larger plot, but he gets referenced a few times in the early chapters.

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I remember that as well, but couldn't find it.

And its Royal Locks, not Royal Breath.

However I did find the following:

found it http://www.brandonsanderson.com/annotation/438/Warbreaker-Chapter-Fifty-Eight

Can Vivenna change her appearance more? She can indeed. She could actually stoke that fragment of a divine Breath inside of her and start glowing like a Returned. She can’t change her physical features to look like someone else, but she can change her age, her height (within reason), and her body shape (to an extent). It takes practice.

I assume it applies to Siri as well.

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Remember, before Ichor Alcohol, it took 50 breaths to create a lifeless. 50! Also remember Vasher's little lecture: how close the object is to a living form determines how much breath it takes to awaken, but not what it can do once it's been awoken. Thus if corpses would fall apart less quickly with Ichor alcohol, it takes less breath to awaken them, and once they've been Awoken, the properties may be very similar to the previous kind.

Ichor alcohol is not what caused the awakening to become more efficent, a new command is what made a lifeless take 1 breath instead of 50

"three hundred years ago, those who had the one-breath command could make their lifeless much more cheeply than those who didin't"

I think the Ichor Alcohol made the lifeless less likely to rot, as later Vasher says that the Ichor alcohol could become tainted and some of the lifeless would stop working.

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I wonder a few things:

1. After rereading the book I am still not sure if Vasher has pumped the squirrel corpse full of ichor beforehand, or his command actually made the blood into it.

2. I wonder if you can Awaken something already alive, like, for example your hand, giving it additional strength, etc. Also if you can pump breaths into something immaterial, like your own shadow :)

3. A sword is good, but it lacks mobility. Wonder how many breaths it would take to create a full Terminator, and give him a simple command, say , "Burninate!".

Also, didn't Brandon mention that a wealth of the Breaths held at the moment of death (by Arsteel) accounts for increased humanity of Clod?

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Okay here are some answers to the best of my knowledge.

1.Vasher pumped it full of ichor-alcohol beforehand. The Five Scholars wouldn't have had to invent it, if ichor-alcohol was a natural part of the process of creating Lifeless

2.I am am virtually sure its impossible to Awaken anything that's alive, and I'm sure you can't awaken you're own shadow. The whole process is bringing life to some material that is dead now, so there's no need to give life to something already alive, like you're hand. And if Vasher could have just Awakened his hands and feet to give him more strength and his shadow to protect him, then he wouldn't have bothered with the tasseled clothes and cloak.

3.Well if you want to Awaken something made of stone or metal you need the ninth Heightening, and if you want it to be sapient it takes 1000 breaths. I don't think making a stone or steel Terminator would be any harder then making Nightblood, the process is the same, the shape is the only thing that changes.

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you don't *need* ichor-alcohol to create a lifeless, it just makes them last longer, in this case he didn't really care as he was just using the squirrel to annoy people.

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I know that you don't need it, but in this case Vasher did use ichor-alcohol, probably to make it even more difficult to stop the squirrel.

“A Lifeless squirrel, Your Grace,” one of the men said. “The intruder

used it as a diversion.”

“Well made?” he asked.

They nodded. “Using modern Command words, if its actions were any

judge,” one said. “It even had ichor- alcohol instead of blood. Took us the

better part of the night to catch the thing!”

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Okay here are some answers to the best of my knowledge.

1.Vasher pumped it full of ichor-alcohol beforehand. The Five Scholars wouldn't have had to invent it, if ichor-alcohol was a natural part of the process of creating Lifeless

I am inclined to agree. It is just that my first impression was that they have invented commands that change physical structure of an object, creating a lifeless with one breath and blood turned to ichor-alcohol. I see that that is probably wrong.

2.I am am virtually sure its impossible to Awaken anything that's alive, and I'm sure you can't awaken you're own shadow. The whole process is bringing life to some material that is dead now, so there's no need to give life to something already alive, like you're hand. And if Vasher could have just Awakened his hands and feet to give him more strength and his shadow to protect him, then he wouldn't have bothered with the tasseled clothes and cloak.

Well, just because Vasher does not know how, doesn't mean it cannot be done. Also, what about parts of you that are dead? The upper layer of epidermis, hair, nails, calcified parts of the bones? Or liquid? Can you Awaken a pool of blood, drained from a person? I would think that... maybe.

3.Well if you want to Awaken something made of stone or metal you need the ninth Heightening, and if you want it to be sapient it takes 1000 breaths. I don't think making a stone or steel Terminator would be any harder then making Nightblood, the process is the same, the shape is the only thing that changes.

Well, Terminator will probably have several parts, so possibly more than 1000. Will it require more breath to make it active? Will Hallandor become a scorched, cursed wasteland, where those that dare thread are stripped of their Breath and incinerated? Maybe it is a good thing that so few people actually know the Awakening process for steel.

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As someone else reminded me recently, it is possible to use Awakening to affect other people directly. Vasher is able to alter people's memories, and that opens up all kinds of possibilities.

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Well, Terminator will probably have several parts, so possibly more than 1000. Will it require more breath to make it active? Will Hallandor become a scorched, cursed wasteland, where those that dare thread are stripped of their Breath and incinerated? Maybe it is a good thing that so few people actually know the Awakening process for steel.

I don't know that an Awakened Terminator would need several parts. Vasher can Awaken bones inside of stone, which seems to me like it would just make the statues crack when they move, but they're apparently holding together. I wish we'd seen the D'denir in action, do the statues have joints or what?

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I don't know that an Awakened Terminator would need several parts. Vasher can Awaken bones inside of stone, which seems to me like it would just make the statues crack when they move, but they're apparently holding together. I wish we'd seen the D'denir in action, do the statues have joints or what?

Hm, you are right. I even don't think there were joints, since jointed statues are weird, and wouldn't the joints get stuck after a hundred years. Makes one wonder if you can sew several body parts (from different people/animals) together and make a lifeless out of that, using one Breath, or do all bones have to belong to the same individual? If it is possible, then making a single-part Terminator is possible. But the process mentioned "forging Breaths into steel", so, well.. not sure how that would work.

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I bet you could sew body parts together and make a Lifeless. However, it would probably take multiple Breaths, because having so many unattached parts is the equivalent of an extremely damaged regular Lifeless. It would almost certainly work though. You could name him Gibletish, after Hoid!!! (WoK reference! pg 751. No spoilers here but if it's too out of place tell me and I'll put it in a spoiler tag)

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