WoR Chapter 84 code

[Eejit]

I still think the key is likely to be a H in the imperfect palindrome in the ketek.

[Pattern]

Since I seem to be off-shift, I try a summary.

 

11182510111271249151210101114102151171121011121713

44831110715142541434109161491493412122541010125

1271015191011123412551152512157551112341011129151

21061534

2^nd Ceiling Rotation, Pattern 15

is confirmed to be a code, the key is in the book. Translators will get an instruction to encode the translated text. Peter said „The code is solvable and you all have the information required.“

 

Ciphertext string consists of 154=2*7*11 numbers. Patterns (2x77, 11x14, 7x22 and transposed possible)

 

There are no blanks and the parsing of the code is still unclear

 

We do not know the encryption method. We have tried prefix codes and non-prefix splitting, attempting for substitution cipher.

 

Some attempt to match it to other Diagram epigraphs was made by AhoyMatey, without much success.

Krenn also did some matching to chapters counting words, based on a decomposition where a 10 followed by a 111 meant a line break.

 

Appearance of „111“ or "10111" is suspicous.

 

Frequency Analysis is consistent with the code being some kind of substitution cipher without smearing frequencies.

 

Since Vorin numerals are now known, there would have been no problem parsing the code given in Vorin numerals, since for example „1“ „1“ would look different than „11“.

Since every "0" is preceded by a "1", one could consider the code consisting of the numbers 1-10.

This would not be enough to encrypt an alphabet in a bijective manner.

 

2 epigraphs from part 5 resulted from an interweaved message. The two obtained messages however differ in lenght, which could be due to translation from Taravangian's invented language to Alethi or English.

This code could also be interweaved, so we would get two messages consisting of 77 digits each. Parsing is still a problem..

 

We do not know which alphabet has been coded to numbers. It could be Latin, Alethi, Thaylen (though less probable, since only known via Frostland map and possibly incomplete) or phonetical.

Most probable still is an English text, since other epigraphs use letters (c,x,q), which don't exist in Alethibet.

 

The key could be found anywhere in the book, but preferably in epigraphs concerning the Diagram or the fictional book „Words of Radiance“, Taravangian interlude, Ketek on Navani's notebook.

Part 5 epigraphs:

They will come you cannot stop their oaths look for those who survive when they should not that pattern will be your clue

-          From the Diagram, Coda of the Northwest Bottom Corner: paragraph 3

 

One danger in deploying such a potent weapon will be the potential encouragement of those exploring the Nahel bond.  Care must be taken to avoid placing these subjects in situtions of powerful stress unless you accept consequences of their potential Investiture.

-          From the Diagram, Floorboard 27: paragraph 6

 

AhbuttheywereleftbehindItisobviousfromthenatureofthebondButwherewherewhereSetoffObviousRealizationlikeapricity

TheyarewiththeShinWemustfindoneCanwemaketouseaTruthlessCanwecraftaweapon

-          From the Diagram, Floorboard 17: paragraph 2, every second letter starting with the first

 

Q: For what essential must we strive? A: The essential of preservation, to shelter a seeds of humanity through the coming storm

Q: What cost must we bear?  A: The cost is irrelevant.  Mankind must survive.  Our burden is that of the species, and all other considerations are but dust by comparison.

-          From the Diagram, Catechism of the Back of the Flowered Painting: paragraph 1

 

You must become king.  Of Everything.

-          From the Diagram, Tenets of Instruction, Back of the Footboard: paragraph 1

 

The Unmade are a deviation, a flair, a conundrum that may not be worth your time.  You cannot help but think of them.  They are fascinating.  Many are mindless.  Like the spren of human emotions, only much more nasty.  I do believe a few can think, however.

-          From the Diagram, Book of the 2^nd Desk Drawer: paragraph 14

 

There is one you will watch.  Though all of them have some relevance to precognition, Moelach is one of the most powerful in this regard.  His touch seeps into a soul as it breaks apart from the body, creating manifestations powered by the spark of death itself.  But no, this is a distraction.  Deviation.  Kingship.  We must discuss the nature of kingship.

-          From the Diagram, Book of the 2^nd Desk Drawer: paragraph 15

 

Obviously they are fools The Desolation needs no usher It can and will sit where it wishes and the signs are obvious that the spren anticipate it doing so soon The Ancient of Stones must finally begin to crack It is a wonder that upon his will rested the prosperity and peace of a world for over four millennia

-          From the Diagram, Book of the 2^nd Ceiling Rotation: pattern 1

 

11182510111271249151210101114102151171121011121713

44831110715142541434109161491493412122541010125

1271015191011123412551152512157551112341011129151

21061534

-          From the Diagram, Book of the 2^nd Ceiling Rotation: pattern 15

 

But who is the wanderer, the wild piece, the one who makes no sense?  I glimpse at his implications, and the world opens to me.  I shy back.  Impossible.  Is it?

-          From the Diagram, West Wall Psalm of Wonders: paragraph 8

(Notew by Adrotagia: Could this refer to Mraize?)

 

One is most certainly a traitor to the others

-          From the Diagram, Book of the 2^nd Desk Drawer: paragraph 27

 

Chaos in Alethkar is, of course, inevitable.  Watch carefully, and do not let power in the kingdom solidify.  The Blackthorn could become an ally or our greatest foe, depending on whether he takes the path of the warlord or not.  If he seems likely to sue for peace, assassinate him expeditiously.  The risk of competition is too great.

-          From the Diagram, Writings upon the Bedstand Lamp: paragraph 4

(Adrotagia’s 3^rd translation from the original hieroglyphics)

 

1173090605         1173090801         1173090901         1173091001

1173091004         1173100105         1173100205         1173100401

1173100603         1173100804

-          From the Diagram, North Wall Coda, Windowsill region: paragraph 2

(This appears to be a sequence of dates, but their relevance is as yet unknown)

 

TherehastobeananswerWhatistheanswerStopTheParshendiOneofthemYestheyarethemissingpiecePushfortheAlethito

destroythemoutrightbeforethisoneobtainstheirpowerItwillformabridge

-          From the Diagram, Floorboard 17: Paragraph 2, every second letter starting with the second

Words of Radiance epigraphs, sorted:

But as for Ishi’Elin, his was the part most important at their inception; he readily understood the implications of Surges being granted to men, and caused organization to be thrust upon them; as having too great power, he let it be known that he would destroy each and every one, unless  they agreed to be bound by precepts and laws.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 2, page 4

And thus were the disturbances in the Revv toparchy quieted, when, upon their ceasing to prosecute their civil dissensions, Nalan’Elin betook himself to finally accept the Skybreakers who had named him their master, when initially he had spurned their advances and, in his own interests, refused to countenance that which he deemed a pursuit of vanity and annoyance; this was the last of the Heralds to admit to such a patronage

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 5, page 17

As to the other orders that were inferior in this visiting of the realm of the spren, the Elsecallers were prodigiously benevolent, allowing others as auxiliary to their visits and interactions; though they did never relinquish their place as prime liaisons with the great ones of the spren; and the Lightweavers and Willshapers both also had an affinity to the same, though neither were the true masters of that realm

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 6, page 2

 And now, if there was an uncut gem among the Radiants, it was the Willshapers; for though enterprising, they were erratic, and Invia wrote of them, “capricious, frustrating, unreliable,” as taking it for granted that others would agree; this may have been an intolerant view, as often Invia expressed, for this order was said to be the most varied, inconsistent in temperament save for a general love of adventure, novelty or oddity.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 7, page 1

They also, when they had settled their ruling in the nature of each bond’s placement, called the name of it the Nahel bond, with regard to its effect upon the souls of those caught in its grip; in this description, each was related to the bonds that drive Roshar itself, ten Surges, named in turn and two for each order; in this light, it can be seen that each order would by necessity share one Surge with each of its neighbours.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 8, page 6

Now, as the Truthwatchers were esoteric in nature, their order being formed entirely of those who never spoke or wrote of what they did, in this lies frustration for those who would see their exceeding secrecy from the outside; they were not naturally included to explanation; and in the case of Corberon’s disagreements, their silence was not a sign of an exceeding abundance of disdain, but rather an exceeding abundance of tact.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 11, page 6

 

Malchin was stymied, for though he was inferior to none in the arts of war, he was not suitable for the Lightweavers; he wished for his oaths to be elementary and straightforward, and yet their spren were liberal, as to our comprehension, in definitions pertaining to this matter; the process included speaking truths as an approach to a threshold of self-awareness that Malchin could never attain.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 12, page 12

 

Now, as each order was thus matched to the nature and temperament of the Herald it named patron, there was none more archetypal of this than the Stonewards, who followed after Talenelat’elin, Stonesinew, Herald of War: they thought it a point of virtue to exemplify resolve, strength and dependability.  Alas, they took less care for imprudent practice of their stubbornness, even in the face of proven error.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 13, page 1

 

But as for the Bondsmiths, they had members only three, which number was not uncommon for them; nor did they seek to increase this by great bounds, for during the times of Madasa, only one of their order was in continual accompaniment to Urithiru and its thrones.  Their spren was understood to be specific, and to persuade them to grow to the magnitude of the other orders was seen as seditious.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 16, page 14

 

And when they were spoken of by the common folk, the Releasers claimed to be misjudged because of the dreadful nature of their power; and when they dealt with others, always were they firm in their claim that other epithets, notably “Dustbringers,” often heard in the common speech, were unacceptable substitutions, in particular for their similarity to the word “Voidbringers”.  They also did exercise anger in great prejudice regarding it, although to many who speak, there was little difference between these two assemblies

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 17, page 11

When Simol was informed of the arrival of the Edgedancer, a concealed consternation and terror, as is common in such cases, fell upon him; although they were not the most demanding of orders, their graceful, limber movements hid a deadliness that was, by this time, quite renowned; also, they were the most articulate and refined of the Radiants.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 20, page 12

 

Yet, were the orders not disheartened by so great a defeat, for the Lightweavers provided spiritual sustenance; they were enticed by those glorious creations to venture on a second assault.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 21, page 10

 

These Lightweavers, by no coincidence, included many who pursued the arts; namely: writers, artists, musicians, painters, sculptors.  Considering the order’s general temperament, the tales of their strange and varied mnemonic abilities may have been embellished.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 21, page 10

 

There came also sixteen of the order of the Windrunners, and with them a considerable number of squires, and finding in that place the Skybreakers dividing the innocent from the guilty, there ensued a great debate.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 28, page 3

 

The considerable abilities of the Skybreakers for making such amounted to an almost divine skill, for which no specific Surge or spren grants capacity, but however the order came to such an aptitude, the fact of it was real and acknowledged even by their rivals.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 28, page 3

So Melishi retired to his tent, and resolved to destroy the Voidbringers upon the next day, but that night did present a different stratagem, related to the unique abilities of the Bondsmiths; and being hurried, he could make no specific account of his process; it was related to the very nature of the Heralds and their divine duties, an attribute the Bondsmiths alone could address.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 30, page 18

In short, if any presume Kazilah to be innocent, you must look at the facts and deny them in their entirety; to say that the Radiants were destitute of integrity for this execution of one of their own, one who had obviously fraternized with the unwholesome elements, indicates the most slothful of reasoning; for the enemy’s baleful influence demanded vigilance on all occasions, of war and of peace

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 32, page 17 

Twenty-three cohorts followed behind, that came from the contributions of the King of Makabakam, for though the bond between man and spren was at times inexplicable, the ability for bonded spren to manifest in our world rather than their own grew stronger through the course of the oaths given.

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 35, page 9

Now, as the Windrunners were thus engaged, arose the event which has hitherto been referenced; namely, that discovery of some wicked thing of eminence, though whether it be some rogueries among the Radiants’ adherents or of some external origin, Avena would not suggest

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 6

 

That they responded immediately and with great consternation is undeniable, as these were primary among those who would forswear and abandon their oaths.  The term Recreance was not then applied, but has since become a popular title by which this event is named.

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 6

 

 This act of great villainy went beyond the impudence which had hitherto been ascribed to the orders; as the fighting was particularly intense at this time, many attributed this act to a sense of inherent betrayal; and after they withdrew, about two thousand made assault upon them, destroying much of the membership; but this was only nine of the ten, as one said they would not abandon their arms and flee, but instead entertained great subterfuge at the expense of the other nine

 

-          From Words of Radiance, chapter 38, page 20

 

In the epigraphs there is also Pattern 1, 2^nd Ceiling Rotation given. This should be related to Pattern 15. It is still unclear, why those passages are called „pattern“.

 

There have been suggestions to crack the code like Pattern did with Tyn's correspondence with the Ghostbloods. That was a dead end, since it was only an authentication method and only one example is given explicitly.

 

The code contains palindromes, quite long ones. Too long to be random:

 

111825

-101112-71249-151-2-10-101114-10-2-151-17112-101112-

1713448311107-151-4254-14341-09-161-49-1-49-341-212-254-10101-2512710

-151-9-101112-34-12-5511-52512157-5511-12-34-101112-9-151-

21061534

 

Holy Vorin names are Palindromes as are the names of the Silver Kingdoms.

Also, Keteks are palindromes consisting of words. Especially the not perfect symmetric middle of the long palindrome could be just a word in the middle of a Ketek.

Glyphs are also symmetric and have been encoded to a symmetric number string.

Harakeke has made enormous progress in decyphering glyphs.

 

It has been noted, that „h“ can stand for every other letter (like in „Nohadon“). So could the 7 in his code. Palindromes would get longer doing this.

 

Considering the details in the book (mirrored Alethi script on Shallan's drawing, shining through from the other side of paper), farfetched ideas shouldn't be abandoned without trying.

 

The key to the code could also be found in Navani's Ketek

 

Since Pattern's name is a string of numbers and he would need numbers to describe his state before bonding, the Code might have something to do with Cryptics. (Would be nice wordplay...encrypted epigraph containing information about the Cryptics)

 

Epigraph from Ch.86 „One is almost certainly a traitor to the others“ led to the suggestion to remove the 1s from the code. Unclear, whether it was tried in substitution cracker or not.

 

16 unique palindromes in the code could be Cosmere significant.

 

Codes could be related to calendar system – has to be tried explicitly.

 

@ Satsuoni: Since you have to copy this to your first post, I will leave out your links concerning deciphering tools.

Feel free to add them where you think they fit in best.

 

Additions: 

- We compared the code to date format and found that the code doesn't seem to consist of dates

- The dates in North Wall Coda, Windowsill region: paragraph 2 seem to be Highstorm dates

- Parsing suggestions using palindromes: here

- similar codes in another book and their cracking:here

(I try to modify the c-programs there to fit to our problem -but have to refresh my c knowledge first

if someone is fitter here's what I plan to do: Use a palindrome-respecting parsing | assign letters to numbers|

try rot-x-program and vigenere program with WoR related keys (KnightsRadiant, Everstorm, whatever...))

Edited March 11, 2014 by Pattern

[Rexus10]

Does anybody else think this has something to do with renarin, and maybe the truthwatchers? Just stuff from the book stand out to me as odd and left unexplained, specifically the scenes with him and shallan trying to find the entrance into urithiru.

From chapter 85

“I can see it,” Renarin answered feverishly, his voice echoing in the chamber. Ardents who had been studying”

“part of the murals looked up at him. “I can see the future itself. Why? Why, Almighty? Why have you cursed me so?” He screamed a pleading cry, then stood and cracked something against the wall. A rock? Where had he gotten it? He gripped the thing in a gauntleted hand and began to write.

Shocked, Shallan took a step toward him. A sequence of numbers?

All zeros.

“It’s come,” Renarin whispered. “It’s come, it’s come, it’s come. We’re dead. We’re dead. We’re dead. . . .”

She also mentions when she walked onto the portal platform how it was beautiful artwork depicting ten order of knights, people of different types, and it was carved from stone.

Maybe a connection between taravangian and renarin? Renarin can possibly see the future now, an ability of the voidbringers, one of the epigraphs mentions a traitor.

Oh and in chapter 4, Taker of Secrets, Navani and roshu talking about the glyphs written in stone!

“Ah,” said Rushu—a young female ardent with long eyelashes and buttonlike lips. “Look at the sloppy lines! The improper symmetry. Whoever did this is not practiced with drawing glyphs. They almost spelled death wrong—it looks more like ‘broken.’ And the meaning is vague. Death follows? Or is it ‘follow death’? Or Sixty-Two Days of Death and Following? Glyphs are imprecise.”

“Navani sighed, walking over to Dalinar and Adolin. “She is good at what she does,” Navani said softly, “but she’s a little oblivious sometimes. Anyway, she knows handwriting better than anyone. It’s one of her many areas of interest.”

Dalinar nodded, bottling his fears.

“Why would anyone do this?” Adolin asked, dropping the rock. “Is it some kind of obscure threat?”

The very next chapter (5) titled Ideals, the epigraph

“The sign on the wall proposed a greater danger, even, than its deadline. To foresee the future is of the Voidbringers.” - from the journal of Navani Kholin jeseses 1174

How all this ties into the code, I'm not sure, maybe nothing, but maybe someone smarter can find this information useful.

[Aminar]

I feel I should note that Taravingian says he translated it into Alethi Woman's script... That could be a clue...

[Pattern]

Well, Renarin writing all zeros is quite funny. If he used Vorin numerals, he just makes dots on the wall...

 

Ok, I have tried do build patterns from the code. I used Vorin numerals to see if there evolves a symmetry.

I cannot find one, it's definitely not a map of the Shatterd Plains. Perhaps someone else sees more...

Edited March 11, 2014 by Pattern

[Subvert]

Hey!

 

Having recently finished the book, I've been following this thread for a couple of days - now it's officially time to stop lurking

I find this puzzle incredibly interesting and have been playing around with a couple of theories (more on that in another post later).

 

More importantly, I've seen something like this code before here: http://fabiensanglard.net/Ghost_in_the_Wires/index.php

Edit: See Chapter 27 for a prime example. 

That is, by the way, also a very good book!

Anyway, here's my two cents: I reckon Mitnick's codes provide some good prompts for common types of ciphers (mandatory reading really).

 

Two other things of note are:

• Mr. T gauges his intelligence with mathematical problems (such as Fabrisan's Conundrum, which he solved)
• We know from the mention of a logarithmic scale (btw the pattern is written in a rotation; circles and the natural logarithm are intimately related i.e. Euler's identity) that their mathematics should be compatible with our type of mathematics
• I think that Mr. T would have followed a rational and pragmatic logic, meaning that he followed the simplest way, kind of like his policies aimed at increasing the average intelligence of the Kharbranthian populus. 

Can't wait to get this cracked!

Edited March 11, 2014 by Subvert

[RShara]

The part headings are also a ketek.  If you look at the chapter list, you can form the ketek

 

"Alight Winds' Approach Deadly Approach Winds Alight."  I did take out a The from that, otherwise it works perfectly. 

Also in his Acknowlegements, he states, "Finally, Elise Warren gave us some very nice notes relating to the psychology of a key character."

 

I don't know if either of these are helpful or not, but I thought I'd add them in just in case!

[fin]

They will come you cannot stop their oaths look for those who survive when they should not that pattern will be your clue

-          From the Diagram, Coda of the Northwest Bottom Corner: paragraph 3

 

I wonder if the above could be taken more literally. For example, this one appears in a chapter in which someone survives that should not:

 

1173090605         1173090801         1173090901         1173091001

1173091004         1173100105         1173100205         1173100401

1173100603         1173100804

-          From the Diagram, North Wall Coda, Windowsill region: paragraph 2

(This appears to be a sequence of dates, but their relevance is as yet unknown)

 

 

[PunSpren]

From what I understand, the insights into the psychology of a key Character refers to Renarin, Since he is a non neurotypical character, Elise has a form of Asbergers I belive

[Harakeke]

@Pattern: Excellent summary! You might also mention that we compared the Code to the numbers that make up the dates in the Ch. ?? epigraph and determined that the Code doesn't seem to be dates.

@ RShara: Good catch! That's the same Ketek that's on Navani's Notebook. The Way Of Kings part headings also form a ketek: Above Silence, The Illuminating Storms, Dying, Storm's Illumination, The Silence Above. This is the same Ketek that Mr. T's Silent Gatherers collected from a dying Herdazian in the Endnote: "Above silence, the illuminating storms -- dying storms -- illuminate the silence above."

So, there's our connection between Keteks and Mr. T.

The Endnote also gives us explicit instructions for how to write a ketek: "The ketek not only reads the same forward and backward (allowing for alteration of verb forms) but is also divisible into five distinct smaller sections, each of which makes a complete thought.

Which supports the various 5-line palindrome-based parsings Pattern and I have been playing with.

Pattern's parsing:

111825

-101112-71249-151-2-10-101114-10-2-151-17112-101112-

1713448311107-151-4254-14341-09-161-49-1-49-341-212-254-10101-2512710

-151-9-101112-34-12-5511-52512157-5511-12-34-101112-9-151-

21061534

My parsing:

118 25

10 11 12 71 24 9 151 2 10 101 114 10 2 151 17 112 10 11 121

71 34 48 31 110 71 51 42 54 14 34 109 16 14 91 49 34 121 22 54 10 10 12 51 27 10

151 9 10 11 12 34 12 55 11 52 51 21 57 55 11 12 34 10 11 12 9 15 12

106 15 34

Edited March 11, 2014 by Harakeke

[1nikhil9]

Even with it blunted—even knowing the man wasn’t going to really attack him—Kaladin felt an immediate moment of panic. A Shardblade. This one had a slender, sleek form with a large crossguard. The flat sides of the blade were etched with the ten fundamental glyphs. It was a handspan wide and easily six feet long, yet Zahel held it with one hand and didn’t seem off balance.

 

 

Do the numbers translate to the glyphs somehow? And there's also this part:

 

 

Parshendi! she realized. That’s what those glyphs mean. Parap-shenesh-idi. The three glyphs individually meant three separate things—but together, their sounds made the word “Parshendi.” That was why some of the writings seemed like gibberish. Amaram was using some glyphs phonetically. He underlined them when he did this, and that allowed him to write in glyphs things that never should have worked. The stormwardens really were turning glyphs into a full script.

 

Though doesn't seem likely Taravangian would want to write something that translates into something that isn't even a proper language.

Edited March 11, 2014 by 1nikhil9

[Harakeke]

The Ten Fundamental Glyphs are the big colored glyphs (Knight Radiant symbols) on the Surgebinding chart. They're tricky to make out, but I'm pretty sure the Truthwatchers glyph is pronounced "Vedeledev" (as in the Herald).

Good catch with Amaram's writing. Kluging glyphs together phonetically is exactly what you would do to create novel words if you didn't know how to write properly (i.e like a woman). It's interesting to note that Kaladin does know how to write glyphs properly (mentioned in WoK, I believe as part of his nerdy surgeon's training -- and evidenced by the Bridge 4 emblem he came up with.)

Edited March 11, 2014 by Harakeke

[Pattern]

The glyphs on Elhokars sword are tiny. I hope Harakeke can do something with them.

 

Edit: Yes he can ;-)

Edited March 11, 2014 by Pattern

[Subvert]

 

They will come you cannot stop their oaths look for those who survive when they should not that pattern will be your clue

-          From the Diagram, Coda of the Northwest Bottom Corner: paragraph 3

 

I wonder if the above could be taken more literally. For example, this one appears in a chapter in which someone survives that should not:

 

1173090605         1173090801         1173090901         1173091001

1173091004         1173100105         1173100205         1173100401

1173100603         1173100804

-          From the Diagram, North Wall Coda, Windowsill region: paragraph 2

(This appears to be a sequence of dates, but their relevance is as yet unknown)

 

 

 

 

I've tried the first epigraph you cited as a key, its interesting because it mentions both a "pattern" and a "clue"!

Here's the file, if you look at the grid right now it contains another phrase that I tried (which is a bit more random).

 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B-jbUcMIL__CUVZRUzA5bVNFUEU/edit?usp=sharing

 

For the first one, which I find more appealing personally, I left the (0,0) blank.

Because the epigraph contained exactly 99 characters and if split into pairs the code does not contain 00.

 

I have a feeling similar methods have been tried by others, but as far as I can tell not with that particular phrase.

Edited March 11, 2014 by Subvert

[Argent]

I am getting a good vibe from the ketek line of thought. But if we are going to the subtle interpretation route, then we should use not the epigraph as a clue, but "those who survive when they should not" - the Radiants in training. Kaladin and Shallan definitely. Dalinar and Renarin, probably. Lift, maybe.

[Krenn]

I still think the key is likely to be a H in the imperfect palindrome in the ketek.

 

I'm starting to think along these lines....

 

important words in this world are often palindromes. we suspect this coded message is very important.  therefore, there is a good chance that at least one word in this message will be a palindrome.

 

we also know that as far as the Alethi are concerned, the letter *h* is a wildcard letter, and can be used as a variable to make palindrome spelling work.

so, here's the challenge:  find the largest combinations in the code which could be spelling out a palindrome.

for example,  151-2-10-10-11-14-10-2-151 could be a palindrome, if either 10 or 14 represented an 'h'.

[shinintendo]

Will making a list of all palindrome name that appear in the books help you in any way xD?

[Krenn]

SA-specific word and ngram dictionaries, for those who want them...

 

what program are you using to read those files? i can't get my current code breaking software to read those as valid files.  simplest solution would be for me to just use the same software you do.

[Lomeon]

I'm pretty sure the Truthwatchers glyph is pronounced "Vedeledev" (as in the Herald).

That would be confusing because Vedeledev is the "patron Herald" of the Edgedancers (order 4), and Pailiah is the "patron Herald" of the Truthwatchers (order 5).

[Krenn]

Will making a list of all palindrome name that appear in the books help you in any way xD?

yes, that would be very helpful.

[Fabrial]

Someone got a plaintext copy of the book they could send me? Is that legal if I have the hard book?

 

If not, could someone run something this perl to find words that are palindromes?

if ( $str == reverse($str) ) {
print "PALINDROME!\n";
}

 

If I can get a plaintext copy of the book I could write some more complicated perl to parse out all the keteks.

[Ryshadium]

Hello, I have been a longtime lurker, and I basically finally made a username because of this thread.  I wish that I had something insightful to add, but mostly I wanted to express a deep sense of gratefulness to all of you that are trying to work this out.  It's incredibly impressive, and I wish there was something I could do to assist, but alas, I know nothing about code breaking.

 

I keep trying to see if a string of letters matches with a Rosharian word like Urithiru or one of the Heralds, but it seems that this is where you are all heading any way by getting a list of palindromes from the novel, so I am well behind your skills.

 

At any rate, thank you kindly for having such impressive abilities, and I will continue to closely follow your progress and hope to be able to offer some sort of help in some limited manner somehow.

[RShara]

Any chance that the mosaic of Stormseat has glyphs on it?  The brown tiles around some of the houses/buildings look suspiciously similar.

[Eejit]

 

The code contains palindromes, quite long ones. Too long to be random:

 

111825

-101112-71249-151-2-10-101114-10-2-151-17112-101112-

1713448311107-151-4254-14341-09-161-49-1-49-341-212-254-10101-2512710

-151-9-101112-34-12-5511-52512157-5511-12-34-101112-9-151-

21061534

 

Holy Vorin names are Palindromes as are the names of the Silver Kingdoms.

Also, Keteks are palindromes consisting of words. Especially the not perfect symmetric middle of the long palindrome could be just a word in the middle of a Ketek.

Glyphs are also symmetric and have been encoded to a symmetric number string.

Harakeke has made enormous progress in decyphering glyphs.

 

It has been noted, that „h“ can stand for every other letter (like in „Nohadon“). So could the 7 in his code. Palindromes would get longer doing this.

 

 

Yes, though the other option of course is that from  52512157  the initial 52 is the stand-in H rather than the 7.

 

Implications of a stand-in H:

 

-  It is a phonetic code rather than representing alethi glyphs which could not be represented in this way.

 

-  A single phoneme can be represented by either a singlet or doublet code (maybe even triplet?) as the 52 and the 7 would have to be interchangable as one unit.

 

- Words may be represented correctly phonetically but alphabetically incorrectly. For representations of how English can represent the same phoneme in many different ways see:

[Krenn]

Someone got a plaintext copy of the book they could send me? Is that legal if I have the hard book?

 

If not, could someone run something this perl to find words that are palindromes?

if ( $str == reverse($str) ) {
print "PALINDROME!\n";
}

If I can get a plaintext copy of the book I could write some more complicated perl to parse out all the keteks.

remember to account for wildcard "h" letters, as well.