Blazenella Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 That would explain all of the "natural" formations like Kholinars windblades. The cities were built around rock formations, and are ALL STORMING SYMETRICAL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ciridae Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 Wow yeah I could totally see Cohesion, maybe with the help of Illumination, having a hand in the creation of the Dawncities. I have a couple of questions/ideas about how Cohesion could be used. We speculate that some surges go in two directions, like if Lift can decrease friction could she increase it as well? If cohesion makes solids act like liquids temporarily, how does it affect other states of matter? Would it work the other way too? Can it make air act as a solid for example? I'm thinking forcefields, or trapping people in solid blocks of air here. On transportation, I'd love to know if it is telekinesis along with teleportation, but that might make it too powerful. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kenod Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 2 hours ago, Ciridae said: On transportation, I'd love to know if it is telekinesis along with teleportation, but that might make it too powerful. If transportation is capable of teleportation, depending on it's limits, it can already be fairly overpowered, especially if you don't have limits on destinations, aka, teleport a rock into their chests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Portz Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 17 hours ago, Aminar said: Hear me out on this. Orrrrr... after your initial plead I went and got me some popcorn ... now I am all disappointed ... Quote Willshapers are associated with building. Cymatics creates the shapes of the great cities in sand. Willshapers loosen up a material, making it liquid. Liquid that would be shaped by vibrations in the same ways and patterns. Willshapers build freaking cities. Of course I am kidding...nice idea! I already see the Willshapers loosen up the ground and then let the frequencies based on Roshars Rythms do all the work for the cymatics! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dlyol Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 My quibble with this Willshapers making Dawncities idea is that the other things we know of as 'Dawn-' which are the Dawnsingers and Dawnshards both predate humanities arrival on Roshar whereas the Radiants obviously don't. The Singers were already there and the Dawnshards were on Ashyn. In fact we see Kholinar complete in the time of Nohadon which was before the establishment of the Radiants (although not before human surgebinding). My longtime assumption is that the Dawncities were built by Singers as the connection between them, the Rythmns and the sound based nature of Cymatics seems too obvious to ignore. I am open, however, to the idea that given we know Surgebinding existed on Roshar before humans arrived, that the Singers used Cohesion in conjunction with the Rythmns to build the Dawncities 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 4 hours ago, Ookla the Foxed said: If transportation is capable of teleportation, depending on it's limits, it can already be fairly overpowered, especially if you don't have limits on destinations, aka, teleport a rock into their chests. You've just discovered the origin of gemhearts I think... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandra Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 (edited) On 18.12.2017 at 7:04 PM, The Invested Beard said: We shape wills obviously. I think it's quite funny, that if you put it the other way around: They shape to their will, it actually works with what some people said here Edited December 21, 2017 by Sandra Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aminar Posted December 21, 2017 Report Share Posted December 21, 2017 50 minutes ago, Dlyol said: My quibble with this Willshapers making Dawncities idea is that the other things we know of as 'Dawn-' which are the Dawnsingers and Dawnshards both predate humanities arrival on Roshar whereas the Radiants obviously don't. The Singers were already there and the Dawnshards were on Ashyn. In fact we see Kholinar complete in the time of Nohadon which was before the establishment of the Radiants (although not before human surgebinding). My longtime assumption is that the Dawncities were built by Singers as the connection between them, the Rythmns and the sound based nature of Cymatics seems too obvious to ignore. I am open, however, to the idea that given we know Surgebinding existed on Roshar before humans arrived, that the Singers used Cohesion in conjunction with the Rythmns to build the Dawncities That's a decent point. And I'm sure the Dawncities predate the radiants, but their size seems beyond would have been needed unless the first Desolation really broke a more advanced society. Especially given the oathgates and their connections to the cities/Urithiru. It feels like they were part of the creation of the Dawncities as massive Stormfortresses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoddessIMHO Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 9 hours ago, Sandra said: On 12/18/2017 at 10:04 AM, The Invested Beard said: We shape wills obviously. I think it's quite funny, that if you put it the other way around: They shape to their will, it actually works with what some people said here You are both joking but Will Shaping is exactly what Venli has been told to do with the Parshmen. She is convincing them to believe Odium's dogma. So her "extra" talent is persuasion. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Invested Beard Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 3 hours ago, GoddessIMHO said: You are both joking but Will Shaping is exactly what Venli has been told to do with the Parshmen. She is convincing them to believe Odium's dogma. So her "extra" talent is persuasion. Oh I'm right with you. I saw what she's been doing and thought, "So that's how it works." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dryone_2 Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 21 hours ago, GoddessIMHO said: You are both joking but Will Shaping is exactly what Venli has been told to do with the Parshmen. She is convincing them to believe Odium's dogma. So her "extra" talent is persuasion. So is Venli like using cohesion or transportation on the Parshmen? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMc6 Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 9 minutes ago, Dryone_2 said: So is Venli like using cohesion or transportation on the Parshmen? Not yet, but I imagine she will be able to as she advances as a Knight Radiant. Which brings up an interesting question. She is literally bonded to two spren; timbre a Willshaper spren, and an Envoy(?) voidspren. So will she be able to switch back and forth? Like a like light switch that changes her eyes from red, to normal, back to red? That's a little tongue-in-cheek but you get the point of the question. I think she is the only character in the series so far that has bonded two spren, correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dryone_2 Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 3 minutes ago, Brightlord Brooding Eyes said: Not yet, but I imagine she will be able to as she advances as a Knight Radiant. Which brings up an interesting question. She is literally bonded to two spren; timbre a Willshaper spren, and an Envoy(?) voidspren. So will she be able to switch back and forth? Like a like light switch that changes her eyes from red, to normal, back to red? That's a little tongue-in-cheek but you get the point of the question. I think she is the only character in the series so far that has bonded two spren, correct? My point is that she is only talking to the Parshmen, not using any surge (I imagine both surges to be unpleasant be used on you) I think she has a lesser Voidspren for the form and Timbre for the Nahel bond. And Listeners have two hearts, so maybe that's not a problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMc6 Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 23 minutes ago, Dryone_2 said: And Listeners have two hearts, so maybe that's not a problem. Do Listeners have two hearts? That is not my recollection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalbusker Posted December 22, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, Brightlord Brooding Eyes said: Do Listeners have two hearts? That is not my recollection. They've got a gemheart for Investiture and a meatheart for blood. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesMc6 Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 Just now, digitalbusker said: They've got a gemheart for Investiture and a meatheart for blood. Oh, yes of course they do. "Meatheart." I love that. I'm totally using that in a sentence very soon. Probably the next time on Facebook. Bravo. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dryone_2 Posted December 22, 2017 Report Share Posted December 22, 2017 5 minutes ago, Brightlord Brooding Eyes said: Do Listeners have two hearts? That is not my recollection. Can't pump blood (of any color) with a gem heart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoddessIMHO Posted December 23, 2017 Report Share Posted December 23, 2017 It seems like both of Venli's spren must be will shapers. Which seems like they must affect each other. Syl can speak to the Stormfather so shouldn't Venli's void spren be able to tell on her? Unless they are both still not very smart like Syl was at first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digitalbusker Posted December 23, 2017 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2017 I don't think we have evidence that the spren related to the Forms of Power are more self aware than the ones related to nimbleform, warform, etc. Just that they're Voidspren, i.e. carrying Odious investiture. That is to say: maybe Venli's Voidspren can't tell on her because it can't talk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Kelkamer Posted October 5, 2018 Report Share Posted October 5, 2018 On 12/20/2017 at 11:20 AM, Watchcry said: I'm now trying to wrap my mind around how their version of cohesion differs from that if the Stonewards. First, this is my new favorite thread haha Second, I think the main difference is Willshapers will be able to use the cohesion at a distance and on limited materials compared to Stonewards. A Willshaper could probably effect stone, water, earth, metal, etc. but a Stoneward, with the combination of tension surge, can shape anything. Stonewards just have to touch it but I think could maybe shape all sorts of brittle things like trees and maybe glass, etc. where those things would just snap if a Willshaper tried. My theory anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calderis Posted October 5, 2018 Report Share Posted October 5, 2018 1 hour ago, Kelkamer said: Second, I think the main difference is Willshapers will be able to use the cohesion at a distance and on limited materials compared to Stonewards. A Willshaper could probably effect stone, water, earth, metal, etc. but a Stoneward, with the combination of tension surge, can shape anything. Stonewards just have to touch it but I think could maybe shape all sorts of brittle things like trees and maybe glass, etc. where those things would just snap if a Willshaper tried. My theory anyway. The Stoneward who made the steps in Dalinar's vision seemed to be able to use the ability at range without an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Kelkamer Posted October 5, 2018 Report Share Posted October 5, 2018 He had to be touching the side of the mountain, then he could infuse (invest) parts of the mountain away from him, but he had to have his had on the stone to send the stormlight through to make the shapes. That was my take anyway, cause it mentions him laying his hand on the wall face in front of the ledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
+Oltux72 Posted October 6, 2018 Report Share Posted October 6, 2018 On 12/23/2017 at 5:03 AM, GoddessIMHO said: It seems like both of Venli's spren must be will shapers. She picked her spren up while she was still in Stormform. She even changed her form with her spren around. The spren seems pretty independent. It would be very interesting to see which form she would go to with only her Willshaper spren. Pretty dangerous experiment though. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmnsquirtle Posted October 6, 2018 Report Share Posted October 6, 2018 On 12/22/2017 at 3:18 PM, JamesMc6 said: Not yet, but I imagine she will be able to as she advances as a Knight Radiant. Which brings up an interesting question. She is literally bonded to two spren; timbre a Willshaper spren, and an Envoy(?) voidspren. So will she be able to switch back and forth? Like a like light switch that changes her eyes from red, to normal, back to red? That's a little tongue-in-cheek but you get the point of the question. I think she is the only character in the series so far that has bonded two spren, correct? Like @Dryone_2 said, the bonds are different. Having a spren in your gemheart and bonding one aren't even in the same magic system, though since they both dramatically affect your spirit web, I'm curious to see how that will turn out as she progresses as a radiant... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Invested Beard Posted October 11, 2018 Report Share Posted October 11, 2018 So thinking about this further, would this make willshapers the Rioters and Soothers of the Rosharan system as one of their ability sets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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